# Got AR fever



## Shipwreck

I am really enjoying my PS90, and really want an AR now. ALMOST tempted to sell my USPc and Glock 34 to buy one. But, I don't know if I can do that. 

As much as I love my P99s, I also like some variety. That would just leave me with my 2 P99s, SW99 (P99 clone) and a Keltec 32) . Not sure what to do....

RRA has a nice model for $1010 (MSRP) with a quad rail. But, it has no rear sight. And, I am not sure how I would like the front post sight being in the way w/ an optic. Flip sights end up adding about $200 or more to the gun. Which leads me back to that S&W tactical AR with everything I already want on it...

Don't know if I wanna loose the 2 handguns, however...


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## Revolver

I don't know which model you're referring to but I'm guessing it's a 16" carbine. Probably the CAR A4. You could take a look at Bushmaster's new "O.R.C"(optics ready carbine) as it has a considerably lower MSRP than S&W's M&P15T and then spend that extra money on what you want to add.
http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/weapons/bcwvmf16m4orc.asp
Or you could go with the S&W M&15T and get it all in the package.

As for selling the pistols, only you can answer that one. I personally think you should round out your stable. Replace those two plastic bottom feeders with another long arm. 
Your P99's fill the same niche after all. But that's entirely your call. If you think you'll regret it then maybe you should wait.

The good thing about the AR15 is that magazines and ammunition are both more abundant and considerably cheaper than those for your FN. The AR15 is also more accurate and powerful. It's a good-handling, light recoiling rifle. It's a good rifle to hone your rifle skills with.


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## Wandering Man

Don't loose the handguns. 

Be patient, and wait. 

:watching: Popcornsmilie :watching: Popcornsmilie 

When you buy the AR, you'll want to add all those little extras extras, like night sites and bullets. Then you'll want to go out and shoot it. You'll spend all your time and money on the new gun. 

Next thing you know, you'll be bankrupt, divorced, and your son will be 21, wondering what happened to his dad? And even worse, we'll all be wandering around the forum, wondering where did Shipwreck go?

Someone will finally dig you out of dumpster, clutching your AR in one hand and the remains of your ratty old P99 in the other. You'll be rambling on and on about how you shouldn't have sold the USPc and the Glock. :smt022 :smt022 

The AR isn't going away. But life with family and forum might. 

Wait, save, buy when you can afford it. :smt1099 

WM


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## Revolver

Night sights? That's what the larger aperture is for.:mrgreen: 

I take it I must be the only AR15 owner who takes the minimalist. All I need are magazines and ammunition.:smt023


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## rfawcs

Don't sell the handguns; you'll regret it later. Put 20, 30, 40 bucks a payday away -whatever you can afford- and wait until you have enough saved up.

Whichever brand you decide on, get the basic flat-top receiver model. I would spring for a two-stage trigger if you want when you buy it, but -all- other do-dads (even the trigger) can be added later.

You can put whatever sight/optic you want on it, even a removable carry handle. Don't worry about the front sight post; almost all red-dots will co-witness and with a telescopic sight the front sight will blur out. When shooting at paper targets, you'll probably be surprised at accurate you can be with plain ol' iron sights.

That's my 2 cents, anyway.


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## Shipwreck

Well, it is true - I'd want another Eotech, and a front grip  - I'm not sure... I may wait... Hmmm....

I could live w/ selling the USPc, but don't really wanna sell the Glock. And, even with 6 mags, I'd need more $ to buy an AR.


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## scooter

This is all I'll say about this thread............... http://www.handgunforum.net/showthread.php?p=56801#post56801:smt022 :smt022


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## Shipwreck

scooter said:


> This is all I'll say about this thread............... http://www.handgunforum.net/showthread.php?p=56801#post56801:smt022 :smt022


:smt082 :smt082 :smt082 :smt082 :smt082


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## -gunut-

I say you get an AK. Cheaper to buy and feed and much more fun to shoot! :nutkick:


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## Revolver

scooter said:


> This is all I'll say about this thread............... http://www.handgunforum.net/showthread.php?p=56801#post56801:smt022 :smt022


The most expensive thing involving my AR15's was putting the ammunition through them. And they're mostly reloads. But I'm not like you two. I actually prefer the stock set-up. That's the great thing about them. So many options.

More projects for the distant future though:

M16A2 clone with a proper profile barrel. Not those insanely nose-heavy manufacturing-shortcut HBAR's that every 20" AR has these days.

AR-10 with a quality 3-9x and Harris bipod.

Build an AR pistol. I'd have mine with an A1 upper, free-floated barrel and a Hogue overmolded rubber grip.

And don't forget those C-Beta magazines. One of these days I need to get my hands on one.

Actually, maybe Scooter is right. Stay away for now.


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## Revolver

Shipwreck said:


> Well, it is true - I'd want another Eotech, and a front grip  - I'm not sure... I may wait... Hmmm....
> 
> I could live w/ selling the USPc, but don't really wanna sell the Glock. And, even with 6 mags, I'd need more $ to buy an AR.


You could buy a lower or upper for now. That's certainly an option.


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## Revolver

-gunut- said:


> I say you get an AK. Cheaper to buy and feed and much more fun to shoot! :nutkick:


Kalashnikovs are very fun to shoot and are very good value. An AR can be just as cheap to feed with the same brand ammunition(Wolf). Contrary to what some may say, AR15 extractors aren't that weak. It's a matter of taste. If you can you should get both but given the choices I go with the AR15.


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## js

Revolver said:


> The good thing about the AR15 is that magazines and ammunition are both more abundant and considerably cheaper than those for your FN. The AR15 is also more accurate and powerful. It's a good-handling, light recoiling rifle. It's a good rifle to hone your rifle skills with.


:smt023

I put about 200rds through mine yesterday. I also let a buddy of mine shoot it as well, he had never shot an AR before. After about 3rds, he was smiling from ear to ear and I had almost pull it away from him to get it back...

You can also build it, go ahead and buy a receiver...or a complete lower. Then get an upper and configure it the way you want it.

You better hurry... Don't forget who's in charge now... Remember! They don't like AR15's!

I just ordered another RRA receiver yesterday for my next build.


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## DJ Niner

Sell your Glock? :smt107 
Are you out of your MIND?!? 

:mrgreen: 

Sell the UPSc(rap) (or whatever it is ) and use that money to get either an AR upper or lower; then save your pennies for the other half. If you have a gun closet/junk drawer/footlocker/whatever, then I'd look through it and see if you have anything you haven't used in quite a while that you could sell to hurry the saving along. Scopes, mags/holsters/accessories for guns that you no longer own, reloading gear, whatever.


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## Shipwreck

I've decided to save my pennies and hold off on that target 22. I'll wait and see what I have by the end of the year, and then decide what to sell.

As for the Glock - I love my P99s more. But I do want some variety in my guns. The main thing stopping me from selling the Glock is that its the only gun I have w/ 17 round mags, and I have 6 of them (some haven't even been used but 1x).

It is possible that I will buy it in 2 parts, we'll see. I really like that S&W version, and buying all the pieces separate in that configuration will cost about the same. We'll see.


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## Todd

I've got the fever too. As much as I like handguns, I've decided to get by with what I've got and go for an AR as the next purchase. I want an RRA AR, so the plan is to save up and buy a complete lower, then save up and buy a complete upper. Then save up again for an Aimpoint or Eotech, front grip, and all the other goodies. While that is going on, I'll stock up on 30 round mags and ammo when I see good prices on them. 

It will take a while, but I won't sell anything (I sold a bunch of guns when I first moved out of my house when I was 19 to fund the move and have always regretted it) and the wife won't kill me for spending a huge wad of cash all at once. Little purchases are easier to get under the radar.


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## bangbang

Shipwreck said:


> It is possible that I will buy it in 2 parts, we'll see. I really like that S&W version, and buying all the pieces separate in that configuration will cost about the same. We'll see.


Don't buy it in parts...money in the bank is better than half a gun.

Instead of buying it in parts over time, buy it in parts, but all at once. Why buy the lower half now, and the upper half 4 months later. Just wait, and buy bother halves at the same time...

By buying the lower half right away, you sorta "lock" yourself in...

If that is what you want...then go for it...I personally do not like to be "locked" in. Now buying the gun all at once...that could be considered an impulse buy...and I fully support those.


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## Shipwreck

-gunut- said:


> I say you get an AK. Cheaper to buy and feed and much more fun to shoot! :nutkick:


I've tried an AK and am not a big fan. I prefer an AR.

Here are 2 pics I found with sights in the eotech window. I don't really like this. I definetly want the front and back folding sights.

THis is a guy's AR from another site - This is w/ just the front sight showing and the rear folded down.










And this is with the rear up AND the eotech:


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## scooter

Shipwreck said:


> I've tried an AK and am not a big fan. I prefer an AR.
> 
> Here are 2 pics I found with sights in the eotech window. I don't really like this. I definetly want the front and back folding sights.
> 
> THis is a guy's AR from another site - This is w/ just the front sight showing and the rear folded down.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And this is with the rear up AND the eotech:


Called CO-witnessing the sights, a military thing mostly but its not bad when you get used to it.


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## Shipwreck

scooter said:


> Called CO-witnessing the sights, a military thing mostly but its not bad when you get used to it.


Yea, I know what it is. But, with folding sights, I can still use the sights when I want - I just don't want them in the way when I am using the eotech. If the eotech failed, then I could bring them back up.


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## scooter

Shipwreck said:


> Yea, I know what it is. But, with folding sights, I can still use the sights when I want - I just don't want them in the way when I am using the eotech. If the eotech failed, then I could bring them back up.


I keep mine seperate too, I have the flat top upper but put the Bushnell on the carry handle and can still use the peeps under it without interference, Ya just gotta do whats right for you :mrgreen:


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## Revolver

But the folding sights aren't as durable. I really don't see how the front sight gets in the way at all. Looks to me like it provides a better sight picture. What equipment is necessary to make the Eotech co-witness? I assume it's one of those mounts that run from the carrying handle and hang over the handguards.


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## SuckLead

I never got into the AR type weapons, but I actually found myself making googly eyes at this one yesterday. Not really an AR I guess, but it is a neat little thing!


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## -gunut-

Shipwreck said:


> I really like that S&W version


If I were you I would skip on the S$W. You should take a look at DPMS rifles. They are extremely good quality rifles at about the lowest price around. My Sgt. has an issued Colt M4 and just got one of the DPMS. He says he was surprised how nice it was. Quality easily = to that of his Colt. They offer many variations to suite the shooter.

http://www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/


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## js

Revolver said:


> But the folding sights aren't as durable. I really don't see how the front sight gets in the way at all. Looks to me like it provides a better sight picture. What equipment is necessary to make the Eotech co-witness? I assume it's one of those mounts that run from the carrying handle and hang over the handguards.


Rock River Arms makes a mount called the *EOTech* *Dominator* *2* *Mount, *which is what I have on my AR. The Dominator 2 Mount includes the rear sight and makes for perfect co-witness when adding the EOTech, which is what I want.

He's a picture of mine with the EOTech Dominator 2 Mount already mounted on the top receiver rail. All I need now is the EOTech to go on it. Also, The mount is elevated just high enough where it puts the EOTech dot right on top of the front site post, which again...is where I want it.


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## DJ Niner

Some of the best reasons to go to an non-magnifying optical sight are to get your target and aiming point in the same visual/focal plane, eliminate parallax, and simplify the sight picture (dot on target, shoot). If you allow your iron sights to clutter-up the optical sight picture, you're giving up some of these advantages for a single (and highly unlikely) reason; if your optical sight fails, you can immediately transition to the irons. In my opinion, that's not a good enough reason to clog up your more versatile primary sighting device.

However, if you utilize a special mounting base to raise the EOTech slightly above the normal sighting plane, you get a less cluttered primary sight picture, and the irons lurking in the lower one-third or one-fourth of the EOTech's window; a trade-off that makes more sense in my mind. The irons are there if you need'em, but are not constantly blocking large chunks of the target and its immediate area 24/7 UNTIL you need them.


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## Shipwreck

Well, I have seen that eotech mount. And, I understand that some people like to co-witness the sights. But, from my current experience with my PS90 and my eotech at 50 yards, I like seeing the entire target thru the window. I don't want the bottom portion blocked by the front sight.

We'll have to see. There is a RRA AR with a flat top and quad rail for $1010 MSRP. There appears to be no rear sight at all on it. It may come down to what I can afford. I may end up having to buy that one and then altering the front sight later. We'll see. But, I'd prefer front and rear folding sights like the ones on that S&W tactical AR.


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## Shipwreck

I think I'll wait and see how things go, but I might buy that RRA Car with the quad rail, and just change out the frontsight w/ gas block later. It would cost about the same as a riser for the eotech.

I'll probably end up selling the USPc to pay for it.

That will be cheaper than the S&W, and the S&W has a 7lb trigger - the RRA trigger should be better than that.

We'll see if I still have the fever in a couple of months...


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## Shipwreck

Wouldn't I be able to remove the front sight post and then buy a flat gas block to take its place. There would be no front sight, but it should work, right? Then, later on I can but some rail mounted folding sights when I have the $.

I saw some gas blocks for $35 or so.

Is this right?


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## rfawcs

Shipwreck - check this out

http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/weapons/bcwvmf16m4orc.asp


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## A_J

Shipwreck said:


> Wouldn't I be able to remove the front sight post and then buy a flat gas block to take its place. There would be no front sight, but it should work, right? Then, later on I can but some rail mounted folding sights when I have the $.
> 
> I saw some gas blocks for $35 or so.
> 
> Is this right?


There are a few methods of re-doing the front gas block..

First, and lowest-buck, is to cut the one on there and grind it down, then re-blue. Not the prettiest, but not that big of a deal if you have the gas block underneath a handguard as it can't really be seen. This can also be done without removing the gas block at all if you're careful. Of course, with this method you won't be able to mount any fold-down sights to it. This is what I did on mine, as it just needed to be low enough to clear my extended rail.

Second is to get an aftermarket clamp-on, or set-screw gas block. This will require removing the flashhider first, and then un-pinning the existing gas block to remove it. The caveat here is that both parts can be on extremely tight from the factory - and if you don't have a proper vise with a barrel clamping fixture it can be near impossible. My Bushmaster's flashhider, with it's crushwasher, was so tight I ended up having to Dremel the crushwasher away and munged up the stock flashhider too, but I didn't care as I was replacing it with a Vortex. (BTW, when looking for front fold-down sights to attach to a gas block, be aware that there are sights set for that height, and sights meant to go on top of a quad rail, which is typically higher than the mounting rail on a gas block, therefore the sight is shorter.. do your research before hitting "Order".)

Third is to get an aftermarket gas block that is a pin-on type. You don't see as many of these for a reason - you have to re-drill indexing holes for the pins, and if they're just a hair off from the pin holes that are already there, you're pretty much screwed as you're not going to be able to drill new holes. Best used on a brand new barrel blank, and best left to the competent gunsmith.

I'd recommend #2, and if you don't have the tools to do it cleanly, just find a smith to do it - it shouldn't cost much. My friends smith charges $10 -$20 for a gas block swap..


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## Shipwreck

rfawcs said:


> Shipwreck - check this out
> 
> http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/weapons/bcwvmf16m4orc.asp


That's kewl, but I wanted 1 w/ a quad rail already on it. RRA has 1 that is simliar to that S&W.

As for those other steps... That's confusing to a guy who never owned an AR before. I think I'll just have to either buy the S&W or live with that front sight in the way on the RRA


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## DJ Niner

A_J said:


> ...
> 
> First, and lowest-buck, is to cut the one on there and grind it down, then re-blue. Not the prettiest, but not that big of a deal if you have the gas block underneath a handguard as it can't really be seen. This can also be done without removing the gas block at all if you're careful. Of course, with this method you won't be able to mount any fold-down sights to it.
> 
> ...


Bushmaster does make a fold-down front sight that goes around and over a milled (or hacksawed/ground down/cold blued  ) front sight frame, clamping to the barrel. It's intended for add-on use on their V-Match flattop rifles/carbines, and was also used on their Modular Carbine. I had one for several years that came on a 25th Anniversary Modular Carbine, and had no problems with it at all. Info and mounted photo at link:

http://www.bushmaster.com/shopping/bmas/yhm-9360k.asp


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## Shipwreck

Yes, I've seen sights for that. How hard is it to change the regular post out to this?


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## A_J

Shipwreck said:


> As for those other steps... That's confusing to a guy who never owned an AR before. I think I'll just have to either buy the S&W or live with that front sight in the way on the RRA


If you're anything like me it'll make a lot more sense once you have it in your hands and can see how it all goes together. Point is, if you go RRA, you won't have to live with it, there's options (like the above BM gas block with integral sight) and it's not that big of a deal to swap them if you do your research.


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## Shipwreck

Well, I'm kinda going back and forth on it now... I can't afford anything this minute, so it doesn't matter...

But, my PS90 does everything I want. It is majorly tricked out with everything I want. And, it's pretty much my dream rifle. I'm just wondering if I needa worry about getting another rifle.

In reality, the ammo for an AR isn't that much cheaper. And, for me tos et one up like I want w/ another eotech is major bucks. 

I will get another chance to shoot an AR soon from someone I know. Guess I'll decide then.

I may just concentrate on getting 1 more mag and just stocking up some extra 5.7 ammo....

I'm losing my mind


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## Todd

Shipwreck said:


> I'm losing my mind


I thought you already lost it. :mrgreen:


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## scooter

Todd said:


> I thought you already lost it. :mrgreen:


Can ya lose sumthin ya aint never had????:mrgreen:


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## Wandering Man

Its starting already ... :smt118 

WM


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## DJ Niner

Shipwreck said:


> Yes, I've seen sights for that. How hard is it to change the regular post out to this?


 Actually, it is not designed to replace your current front sight frame; it's for guns with a milled or otherwise cut-down sight frame that need a front sight option. It fits around what's left of the original front sight frame's base, and over the gas tube. That way, if your gun is functioning correctly right now, you don't have to futz with a part of the gas system (front sight frame/base), which could compromise the gun's reliability, by changing-out the front sight frame for another one (which involves making sure it's straight so the gas port lines up correctly, it's secure enough not to move if bumped, etc.).

Cut off the top of your old front sight frame, grind the top of the remaining gas-system-part-of-it smooth, contour it any way you'd like, cold blue the cut/ground area to prevent rust, then add this sight to get the fold-down ability.

Bushmaster DOES offer a replacement fold down front sight and gas system, if that's what you want. It's offered with or without bayonet lug, IIRC.


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## Shipwreck

OK, thanks. I have seen several replacement sights - just didn't know how hard it was to remove and replace. thanks.


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## Shipwreck

Well, I am selling the Glock 34 and will be saving for a RRA, I think. 

I shot the G34 a few times today, and I am justs o hooked on my P99 that I don't like the Glock trigger.

I'm keeping the HK too. While I do shoot the G34 a bit better than the USPc (the USPc also has a shorter barrel and sight radius), I like the trigger on the USPc more. And, I don't wanna sell both.


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## Charlie

:watching: :watching: :watching:


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## Wandering Man

I'll see your



Charlie said:


> :watching: :watching: :watching:


and raise you a

Popcornsmilie Popcornsmilie Popcornsmilie Popcornsmilie

WM


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## Shipwreck

Funny guys 

I looked at a RRA at the local shop. Holding it still isn't as ergonomic at the PS90, so the PS90 will still be my fav rifle I think. But still, I want another :mrgreen: 

I have a deal pending for the Glock, mags and the Glocklight alltogether.

It will probably be Sept before I can buy the RRA, however. I still needa save...


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## scooter

Good luck, shoot the AR enough and ya might just change your mind about which one is 1st choice.....


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