# A phoenix Police officer was killed



## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

yesterday by an illegal alien. The suspect (later killed by police while holding a hostage) was an illegal immigrant. He had been previously deported and had outstanding warrants for felony assault.

I am so angry!!! WHERE THE HELL IS MY FU&%*&G WALL???!!!

If McCain were as concerned with the safety of Arizona citizens as he is with garnering the vote of the Hispanic population, this man might still be alive. This mans death is on his hands. He is washing his hands of his responsibility to his constituents just as Pilot washed his hand over Christ.
:smt076:smt076:smt076:smt076


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## Baldy (Jun 21, 2006)

How sad.


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## Lucky13 (Sep 1, 2007)

No disrespect to the fallen officer. But, why and how does illegal immigrant always equal criminal, and, why does it always equal Hispanic in the public eye. I am a firm believer that entry into ANY country should be done legally. That being said there are plenty of US Citizens that also commit crimes and plenty of illegal immigrants from other countries that commit crimes. One of the largest Salvadoran gangs, MS-13, is responsible for a large percentage of murders and other violent crimes in Southern California. Salvadorans are South American, not Hispanic, and, many of them entered the country legally. If you believe building a wall is going to keep illegal immigrants with criminal tendencies out of this country then you might as well agree with those that say more stringent gun laws will keep guns out of the hands of criminals. The problem of illegal immigration exists because of the poor conditions in the countries of origin for these aliens/criminals, Armenia, Somolia, the former Soviet Union, Central and South America, etc.. All of these places have provided us with their fair share of the criminal element. OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.

BTW, why can you get Galco Holsters on other websites besides Galco's for less money and even when Galco has the particular model out of stock?


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## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

Lucky13 said:


> No disrespect to the fallen officer. But, why and how does illegal immigrant always equal criminal, and, why does it always equal Hispanic in the public eye. I am a firm believer that entry into ANY country should be done legally. That being said there are plenty of US Citizens that also commit crimes and plenty of illegal immigrants from other countries that commit crimes. One of the largest Salvadoran gangs, MS-13, is responsible for a large percentage of murders and other violent crimes in Southern California. Salvadorans are South American, not Hispanic, and, many of them entered the country legally. If you believe building a wall is going to keep illegal immigrants with criminal tendencies out of this country then you might as well agree with those that say more stringent gun laws will keep guns out of the hands of criminals. The problem of illegal immigration exists because of the poor conditions in the countries of origin for these aliens/criminals, Armenia, Somolia, the former Soviet Union, Central and South America, etc.. All of these places have provided us with their fair share of the criminal element. OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.
> ?


I want a wall to make it more difficult to get here from there. There is no question that it will stem the flow of illegals from entering. It has nothing to do with keeping criminals out. 
This waste of a human soul (may he rot in hell) was previously deported. If we make it harder to get here perhaps he would have killed his countrymen, and not mine.


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## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

Lucky13 said:


> BTW, why can you get Galco Holsters on other websites besides Galco's for less money and even when Galco has the particular model out of stock?


It is not uncommon to find Galco product through some web sites or local dealers at a discounted price. We only sell at retail because we do not wish to compete directly with our stocking dealers, who are free to set their own prices. The advantage to ordering factory direct is the ability to call ahead and check stock availability. 
Retailers buy stock in advance and stock their store according to what sells best in their area. As they maintain their stock seperatly from ours they will on occasion have something that we dont. 
While we will not price match nor sell at a discount, on request we will try to help you find a retailer near you.


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## Lucky13 (Sep 1, 2007)

"If we make it harder to get here perhaps he would have killed his countrymen, and not mine."

Good point. And thanks for the reply on the Galco question.


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## tgrogan (Sep 4, 2007)

Lucky13,

Though I agree with the point you are making about immigrants, I can't help but correct a couple of your comments:



Lucky13 said:


> Salvadorans are South American, not Hispanic, and, many of them entered the country legally.


Salvadorans are from El Salvador, which is in Central America and is very close to the Mexican Border.

Salvadorans are Hispanic, because of the influence of colonization by Hispania, which is now what we know as Spain and Portugal. Hispania was the name given to the Iberian Penisula by the Roman Empire. Hispanics also come from some countries of South America.

Hispanic does not equal Mexican however.

OK, so now I'm off MY Soap Box. Once again, I would like to iterate that I do agree with your general points you brought up.


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

Lucky13 said:


> No disrespect to the fallen officer. But, why and how does illegal immigrant always equal criminal,


Do you see what you just wrote? Anyone who entered the country illegally - as in _illegal immigrant_ - is by definition a criminal! He/she has already broken the law!



> and, why does it always equal Hispanic in the public eye.


I was on the National Guard's southwest border mission for five months before I deployed to Afghanistan. One of my jobs was reviewing apprehension reports for the Yuma sector of operations, which encompasses western Arizona and southern California. The _overwhelming_ majority, I mean well into the 99th percentile, of people apprehended were of Hispanic descent. So while there are a comparative few from other countries, I don't think assuming an illegal alien caught in Arizona, California, New Mexico or Texas is Hispanic is irrational.



> That being said there are plenty of US Citizens that also commit crimes


Agreed. We already have a crime problem. Why add to it by throwing in illegal immigrants who commit crimes?



> and plenty of illegal immigrants from other countries that commit crimes. One of the largest Salvadoran gangs, MS-13, is responsible for a large percentage of murders and other violent crimes in Southern California.


How do you think most of these non-Mexicans from Central and South America get into the US? By taking a Carnival Cruise? They come in through Mexico, and would thus be restrained by better border security!



> If you believe building a wall is going to keep illegal immigrants with criminal tendencies out of this country then you might as well agree with those that say more stringent gun laws will keep guns out of the hands of criminals.


I have been there on the border. I have seen the entry methods used by the illegals. I can tell you that a fence and/or wall WILL help in some areas, particularly the built-up areas. Have you ever seen a swarm of a hundred illegals charge across the border and overwhelm the five Border Patrol Agents on the US side? I have, and it's not pretty. A good physical barrier would prevent these types of incursions, along with many others.

Here in Afghanistan, we put up walls and fences around our bases and FOBs. We do it because it _prevents_ unauthorized people from walking into our areas, and (gasp!) it works! Why do you think a fence wouldn't stop many illegal aliens from entering the US?

A gun law is just something written on a piece of paper. It isn't a physical barrier. You are comparing apples and oranges.



> The problem of illegal immigration exists because of the poor conditions in the countries of origin for these aliens/criminals, Armenia, Somolia, the former Soviet Union, Central and South America, etc.. All of these places have provided us with their fair share of the criminal element. OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.


None of the countries you mention provide as many criminals as the countries Mexico and south. Perhaps it is just that the numbers of illegals from the south are so much higher, but let's not pretend that Somalian or Armenian street gangs are a problem on the level of MS-13, for God's sake. That's just political correctness taken to a blinding extreme.


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## TOF (Sep 7, 2006)

The people you all are referring to are not Illegal Aliens they are Invaders and should be treated as such in my opinion. In addition, they are aided and abetted by the Government of Mexico that should also be treated accordingly.

Now I will get off of my soap box.


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## js (Jun 29, 2006)

We had a "illegal" immigrant piece of sh*t kill a 17 year old girl last year, stabbed her 23 times. He is now on the run somewhere in the US or he has fled back to Mexico. That's just one story... They are many more like it. We also now have a major problem with latino based gangs and our crime rates are soring.... and this is going on in my city.

My solution is simple... 

Build a fence/wall or whatever and deploy snipers on the border...

I'm sick and tired of my hard earned tax money paying for these leeches. If you want to live in my country, then go through the proper channels and you will be welcomed with open arms. Sneak across the border and break the law and put a drain on the rest of us, then we have a problem... And I'm speaking for 95% of Americans.

By the way, 11 million illegal mexicans = An illegal invasion and illegal occupation, period. We actually should be deporting hundreds if not thousands a day, but our government has failed us to the point of no return. There is a reason why approval ratings for the President and Congress are at historic lows...and it's not just because of Iraq. Congress approval rating: 11%, the President 29%. Illegal immigration is playing a big role in the low ratings. It's going to be a major factor in who I decide to vote for in 2008.
That being said...

"End the illegal occupation, deport a mexican" :buttkick:


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## JimmySays (Jun 8, 2007)

Mine fields would be easier to seed and maintain than a fence. If we mined the border from Tijuana to Brownsville we could replenish from the air and if these invaders have to wade through corpses to get here it might just give them the pause needed to set a foot down on a mine.
May seem harsh to some, but I live and work in Houston and these leeches have taken over areas of the city and are trying to turn the U.S. into Mexico North. They are dug in like ticks on a dog and we will need flamethrowers to eradicate them.
You can't tell them anything or threaten them. They will get a lawyer and sue. This is the first thing liberal scum teach these people. It will probably come down to the famous line from We were Soldiers. "Kill all they send, until they lose there taste for war", or invasion U.S.A. in this case.
This next election may put us on an irreversable downward spiral into socialism and third world sh*thole status.
I need to get off my soapbox now. I may need that soap later.


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## denfoote (May 7, 2006)

Lucky13 said:


> No disrespect to the fallen officer. But, why and how does illegal immigrant always equal criminal, and, why does it always equal Hispanic in the public eye. I am a firm believer that entry into ANY country should be done legally. That being said there are plenty of US Citizens that also commit crimes and plenty of illegal immigrants from other countries that commit crimes. One of the largest Salvadoran gangs, MS-13, is responsible for a large percentage of murders and other violent crimes in Southern California. Salvadorans are South American, not Hispanic, and, many of them entered the country legally. If you believe building a wall is going to keep illegal immigrants with criminal tendencies out of this country then you might as well agree with those that say more stringent gun laws will keep guns out of the hands of criminals. The problem of illegal immigration exists because of the poor conditions in the countries of origin for these aliens/criminals, Armenia, Somolia, the former Soviet Union, Central and South America, etc.. All of these places have provided us with their fair share of the criminal element. OK, I'll get off my soapbox now.
> 
> BTW, why can you get Galco Holsters on other websites besides Galco's for less money and even when Galco has the particular model out of stock?


Five out of the last seven officers that have been killed in the line of duty on the PPD have been murdered by illegal aliens.

Thanks to the liberal scum Democrat mayor, Phoenix is a sanctuary city!!

I'm not sure if you live in the area, but the problem is real, the illegals are dangerous members of MS13, and the cops have their hands shackled behind their backs!!!

I used to live in Phoenix. I know. The Mexican gang problem is one reason whyI moved to Buckeye, a town about 30 miles away. But the gangs have filtered out here!!! Those illegals are everywhere.


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## SigZagger (Aug 16, 2006)

Regarding a "wall", maybe we should look at the "Berlin wall" when it was used in East/West Berlin, Germany. I think it worked, not many east Berliners escaped to freedom. Of course, if it is not defended, what's the point? My take on the illegal immigrants fleeing Mexico to the US is this: since the US government is mandated to protect our borders, it might be a good idea for our grandkids to speak spanish; they'll need it 25 years from now. It's a political hot potato, and votes count for more than lives to any member of American government. I hope I'm wrong, but I bet I'm not. Besides, Mr. Barham has been there, done that...and according to an eye witness, a wall would be beneficial along with tight security measures implicated and enforced. Unfortunately, I'll bet again, the US goverment will overrule any kind of protection for its citizens. Wouldn't it be nice if the front line officers (Border Patrol) were in charge? :anim_lol:


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## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

SigZagger said:


> Regarding a "wall", maybe we should look at the "Berlin wall" when it was used in East/West Berlin, Germany. I think it worked, not many east Berliners escaped to freedom.


it realy isnt a fair comparison. The Berlin wall was built by an oppresive government to keep its people from freedom. It was a wall to keep people in. We need a wall to keep another countrys problems from comming here. A better example would be the great wall of China. It was built to keep invaders out.


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

SigZagger said:


> Wouldn't it be nice if the front line officers (Border Patrol) were in charge? :anim_lol:


It's funny. The president likes to go on and on about how strategy and deployments in Iraq will be decided by "the commanders on the ground." Yet the same administration hamstrings the Border Patrol commanders, who can make very few strategic decisions "on the ground," and have little control over how many agents they command. Instead, policy and strength is decided by a bunch of politicians ensconced in Washington DC and far removed from the realities of the border states.

The Border Patrol Agents are literally the finest group of men and women I have ever served beside - bar none. They are intelligent, skilled, dedicated, and very much want to bring the border under control. If only our government would give them the tools they need to make it happen!


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## SigZagger (Aug 16, 2006)

Mike Barham said:


> Instead, policy and strength is decided by a bunch of politicians ensconced in Washington DC and far removed from the realities of the border states.


That can certainly be said regarding the war policies of America, as well. Hmmm...Korea and Vietnam! I wish some commanding general would stand up and tell Washington to STFU and leave the fighting to the fighters, not the suits in an air conditioned office. Sorry, I've drifted away from the original post.


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## Guest (Sep 20, 2007)

I can't disagree with critism at any level of the federal govt on this issue. They have looked the other way for years in hopes of garnering the votes of the fastest growing ethnic group in the country. Last year they passed a bill to construct 700 miles of fence. No one thinks it is a perfect solution but I don't know many that don't think it's a good start. The last report I heard is that two miles were completed. At that rate it will never be completed and I think that is just the ruse that the politicians wanted.

Next will be amnesty that will be cloaked in some bill and called something else. I have heard figures from 12 to 20 million in the country illegally. I think the way to deal with them is to offer them the opportunity to register with the feds provided they haven't been convicted of a crime. Once registered they become employable. They then should have 5 years in which they have to be employed, not on welfare, not be convicted of a crime and learn english. If after 5 years they are still eligible then they can begin the citizenship process. Those that refuse to register should be rounded up and deported with no opportunity to legally re-enter the country. If during the five years those that registered don't qualify then they should be deported as well. This program shouldn't be even considered until the borders are first secured.

Another path to citizenship could be the military. If you are willing to defend the country then you are welcome as I see it.


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## Alaskan_Viking (Jun 13, 2006)

Well, we don't have very many Mexicans up here so I don't have myself one of them nice big soap boxes to stand on, but I will say this: I'd take our chiefly Mexican, hard working, Catholic illegals over the lazy, angry, legal Moslem immigrants in Europe.


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

Alaskan_Viking said:


> Well, we don't have very many Mexicans up here so I don't have myself one of them nice big soap boxes to stand on, but I will say this: I'd take our chiefly Mexican, hard working, Catholic illegals over the lazy, angry, legal Moslem immigrants in Europe.


Alaska is pretty far from Mexico, so those must be some dedicated illegals. The lazy, angry ones stay in the border states and get on welfare and/or commit crimes.


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## JimmySays (Jun 8, 2007)

Mike Barham said:


> Alaska is pretty far from Mexico, so those must be some dedicated illegals. The lazy, angry ones stay in the border states and get on welfare and/or commit crimes.


 I will second the border state opinion from Mike. Once they get here and get a dose of the ACLU they aren't worth sh*t. We have over 400,000 illegals in Houston alone. Something has got to give.


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