# help to identify this weapon...



## irishamericanlad (Mar 30, 2009)

Hey guys, short story. in my off time i make Armor costumes and real world Swords, so i went to a friends house and saw they had an old gun safe laying out in their back yard. so i asked about it, as i have several weapons to include my duty equipment that needs secured sometime. anyway she told me about 15 year ago her husband broke off the key and decided to take it out in the yard and leave it. anywho, i found there was still weapons inside, WTF? so i asked what was inside, she said a few handguns and a shot gun. i went and looked at the safe, it was a normal locking system that when unlocked the hinge locks would disengage. so they asked me to pop the lock and i did, and found 3 beautifuly ruined hand guns, a police issued 357 revolver, an original Webley mark 6 and an unknown brand 5 shot rimfire. they were rusted and pitted and little bugs living inside.. i was soooo disgusted. i tore apart the webley and cleaned it up back into where the action works. any way they said i can keep the 357 and the webley but they want the 5 shot back if i can get the action to work... anyway, what is it and is there a manual i can look at to tear it apart? also i have spent a few days cleaning this up so it was in a lot worse shape than it is now... ooops um no markings, or serial numbers anywhere


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

Grips appear to be hand-made/home-made replacements.

Flat firing pin on hammer indicates a rimfire cartridge.

The shape and length of the frame in the area behind the hammer and above the grips is somewhat unique.

Are the chambers bigger than a .22 rimfire round? Maybe .32 caliber (around .30" actual)?

Looks to be a Defender-type copy/clone. If it was made by one of the bigger-name companies of the mid-to-late 1800s, there would have been some markings, probably on the top of the frame above the cylinder. This is the closest thing I could find online:

https://www.gunrunnerauctions.com/listings/details/index.cfm?itemnum=916359526

Any guns of this type/era would be black-powder only; DO NOT try to shoot it with ANY modern ammo, even .22 Shorts or CBs.


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## bruce333 (Sep 1, 2006)

As DJ said, should be markings on the top strap, also look under the grips on the frame. Defender is just one of the names it could have been sold under. It appears a 5 shot would have been .32 caliber.

http://jtjersey.com/Ranger/ranger.htm

Scroll down about 3/4 of the page: http://www.neaca.com/Antique Arms and Armor.html

http://www.ocyoung.com/American_firearms.htm


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## jimmy (Feb 3, 2009)

Wow..DJ and Bruce, you guys are great..When i first atarted reading the thread by irishamericanlad and looking at the picture of the handgun, I was thinking that boy this thing is very hard to identify..Then as I scrolled down I was surprised to how close you guys were able to identify similar guns..I have to salute the "EXPERTS".

-Jimmy


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## Bob Wright (May 10, 2006)

My guess is that its one of the guns made around the late Ninteenth or early Twentieth Century by Hopkins and Allen. Iver Johnson, Hopkins and Allen, and Marlin all made good, inexpensive revolvers for household protection or trap line use. These were marketed by various hardware chains, Bluegrass or Belknap being the ones coming to mind.

I'd try Gunparts Corporation for parts to restore it, though ammunition would likely not be available.

This incidentally, come under the "Pull Pin" class of revolvers in that catalog.

Bob Wright


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## irishamericanlad (Mar 30, 2009)

thanks guys i appreciate it, and just for your information, the reason the family locked them up is they went and bought 22 shells and stuffed them inside the breach and tried to fire it, then was scared when they backfired on the shooter. im not looking to redo this into a shooing weapon, i really just want to get the action to work again.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

Bob Wright said:


> My guess is that its one of the guns made around the late Ninteenth or early Twentieth Century by Hopkins and Allen. Iver Johnson, Hopkins and Allen, and Marlin all made good, inexpensive revolvers for household protection or trap line use. These were marketed by various hardware chains, Bluegrass or Belknap being the ones coming to mind.
> 
> I'd try Gunparts Corporation for parts to restore it, though ammunition would likely not be available.
> 
> ...


"Pull Pin" class; makes perfect sense, but I've never heard that term used before. I'll tuck that little nugget away for future reference...

Thanks, Bob! :smt023


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## Bob Wright (May 10, 2006)

DJ Niner said:


> "Pull Pin" class; makes perfect sense, but I've never heard that term used before. I'll tuck that little nugget away for future reference...
> 
> Thanks, Bob! :smt023


On the front of the frame, just below the cylinder pin, is a trigger-like spring loaded lever. Pressing in on this released the cylinder pin for removal.

Bob Wright


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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Can you post a pic of the left side? that would help detirmine more.


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