# Home defense



## Dynamik1 (Dec 23, 2007)

Bro-in-law and sis-in-law have reportedly been looking at long-guns in a sporting goods store for a home defense weapon. That makes me a little nervous because neither one of them have firearms experience - my opinions - 1.) long gun can be too unwieldy in close quarters 2.) easily disarmed 3.) if 12ga - the 105# lady firing is going to be lucky to get off one shot, let alone a reasonable follow-up. 

I am recommending that they get something in a 9mm or .40s&w that can be stored in a biometric microvault. This is a platform I feel more confident they would practice with, become proficient with and store safely with children around. Thoughts?


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## fattie801 (Dec 11, 2009)

as a hunter i have quite a few guns from small to large gauge rifles and various sized shot guns i am with you. a long gun is not the best idea for close quarters even if it was a tactagle gun. with a kid around i would not have a long gun around that will be harder to keep locked away or hidden and still have access for self defense a small side are would be much easier to lock up safely in an area that can be easily accessed and definatly easier to handle for both of them. im with you a small side arm would be the best option for over all safety in a self defense situation or with a child around.


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## twomode (Jun 7, 2009)

Just an opinion, more than a few experienced members here recommend a 12 or 20 guage shotgun best for home defense. Less chance of a missed shot ending up 2 houses away, better chance of hitting the target than a single round. There are many ways to park a shotgun safely while having it readily available. They're not going to be tactically clearing room by room for the most part so close quarters maneuvering isn't as much an issue as most might think. More than one training venue states in an HD situation the best you can hope for is 50% of your best day training.

The real issue is their level of experience. I hope just buying a weapon at the local big box is not the extent of their home defense preparation!


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## Dynamik1 (Dec 23, 2007)

twomode said:


> I hope just buying a weapon at the local big box is not the extent of their home defense preparation!


That's dead-on! And the primary reason I recommended a handgun. In their neighborhood firearm discharge is not allowed so all practice would have to take place at a range and I think they would be more apt to practice regularly with a handgun at one of the indoor ranges in the area.


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

twomode said:


> Just an opinion, more than a few experienced members here recommend a 12 or 20 guage shotgun best for home defense. Less chance of a missed shot ending up 2 houses away, better chance of hitting the target than a single round. There are many ways to park a shotgun safely while having it readily available. They're not going to be tactically clearing room by room for the most part so close quarters maneuvering isn't as much an issue as most might think. More than one training venue states in an HD situation the best you can hope for is 50% of your best day training.
> 
> The real issue is their level of experience. I hope just buying a weapon at the local big box is not the extent of their home defense preparation!


A shotgun is NOT an answer for a lack of aiming. Hollywood has bastardized shotguns to the point where people think they will take out a hallway full of bad guys. Most 18" shotguns loaded with 00 or 4buck will only spread about 3 to 4 inches, yes INCHES at 12-15 feet from the muzzle. Most rooms in most homes are only about 12-15 feet across. Please don't feel comfortable that you'll hit what you're shooting at just because it's a shotgun. That's the kind of stuff that gets people killed because they think "I don't need to practice, I've got a shotgun".


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## Redwolf (Nov 29, 2008)

But hearing a shotgun rack will tell you-you just screwed up. also kids in the house yea I'd stick with the shotgun with bird shot. 9mm or 40 with go through walls a lot easyer the birdshot.


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## dosborn (Apr 17, 2009)

Redwolf said:


> But hearing a shotgun rack will tell you-you just screwed up. also kids in the house yea I'd stick with the shotgun with bird shot. 9mm or 40 with go through walls a lot easyer the birdshot.


Do you keep birdshot in your HD shotgun?


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

Might wanna check the old Box-o-truth site for the birdshot myth.


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## twomode (Jun 7, 2009)

zhurdan, what is your suggestion for Dynamik1? If you read my post more clearly it wasn't a demand that Dynamik do only what I say, just something to think about. As for your comment about people being killed due to a lack of training and belief in a super weapon, read the last sentence again. I think you'll see we're both on the same page.


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

twomode said:


> zhurdan, what is your suggestion for Dynamik1? If you read my post more clearly it wasn't a demand that Dynamik do only what I say, just something to think about. As for your comment about people being killed due to a lack of training and belief in a super weapon, read the last sentence again. I think you'll see we're both on the same page.


Two... sorry, it wasn't meant to be directed at everything you said, but at the notion that a shotgun doesn't need to be aimed. I should have cut and snipped the point I was getting at. Specifically this part...



> better chance of hitting the target than a single round.


Sure, it gives a bit more area than a regular old bullet, but they still have to be in a very narrow aiming cone to hit the target.

I agree that no weapon will supplant training.

As for a recommendation to Dynamik... long guns are perfectly fine as people should NOT clear their home, IMO, but barricade and cover the entryway to where they've barricaded and get on the phone. Shooting a couple of boxes of ammo at the range is nothing like trying to clear a home, even if they feel they have the advantage of familiarity. A good shotgun in a life jacket style gun rack/holder/wall mount (if you have kids around) can be accessed, and deployed rather quickly and is far easier for someone to manipulate and use to good effect than a pistol. As with any defensive situation... start with a plan. We've discussed that on this site before. Handguns just require a lot more skill to use at a square range, let alone when someones amped up because someone kicked in their living room door.

A couple of things to start with...
1. Keep your cell phone in the bedroom as land lines can be cut (unlikely, but still...)
2. If you've got a remote entry deali-whopper on your car keys, keep your car keys on the nightstand (it makes a great attention grabber when you hit the panic button and police will know exactly where the trouble is when they get there)
3. DO NOT make any more sound than necessary(aside from noise that is away from your position), it just gives away your position aka advantage (racking a shotgun isn't going to stop someone hell bent on breaking in because if it's a home invasion when someone is likely to be home, they aren't there to steal your television)
4. Get some professional training with your firearm, it's worth every penny.
5. Most importantly, as I said earlier... HAVE A PLAN! Everyone that lives in your home needs to know it up, down and backwards, even if there part is to get low and stay there.

And yeah, Two... we're pretty much on the same page. :mrgreen:


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## Redwolf (Nov 29, 2008)

Well no I don't keep birdshot in my shotgun its a single shot, so no I don't use it for HD. As far as making noise well that depends on what type of person is braking into your house. which you wont know unless your that kind of person. and trust me you would know if you was that type. that leaves us with two types the one braking in or the one that might want to do harm. ether of those will do something differnt when they hear a shotgun racking and go off reguardless of what type of rds you have in it. They are looking for a easy target and death wont be at the top of thier list. Then here in NC, I want them to come to me, as we can only shoot them outside here with no issues. any thing inside gets tricky. "HAVE A PLAN" is key allways. I know birdshot will not shoot through as many walls as a 9mm. but as allways its just my 2 cents.


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

Redwolf said:


> Well no I don't keep birdshot in my shotgun its a single shot, so no I don't use it for HD. As far as making noise well that depends on what type of person is braking into your house. which you wont know unless your that kind of person. and trust me you would know if you was that type. that leaves us with two types the one braking in or the one that might want to do harm. ether of those will do something differnt when they hear a shotgun racking and go off reguardless of what type of rds you have in it. They are looking for a easy target and death wont be at the top of thier list. Then here in NC, I want them to come to me, as we can only shoot them outside here with no issues. any thing inside gets tricky. "HAVE A PLAN" is key allways. I know birdshot will not shoot through as many walls as a 9mm. but as allways its just my 2 cents.


I disagree. There's only one kind. The only type of person that's going to break into my home is the kind that gets shot!

Like I said earlier... if the bad guy is breaking in when they know you're likely to be home (at night), they aren't there to steal your TV.

Not to mention... after all this talk about shooting thru walls... if they're armed, and a criminal, AND decided to break into your home... and they hear where you might be with a shotgun... they'll probably just open up on you thru the wall, or your kids wall, or... well, that picture is painted I'd say.


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## sliponby (Nov 16, 2009)

Lot of different ideas and opinions, which is good, IMO. I'm always open to other methods and platforms that I might not have considered. 

I have both handgun w/nightsights & CT and Rem. 870 that I put a mag extension on (7 rd.) with 00Buck at my disposal. Always keep a working flashlight next to handgun. You never know which will be the best tactical choice depending on the situation. I also have a MINI 30 with a 10 shot mag. at the ready, cause you never know...

People with small children have issues to deal with that I don't. My son is 13 and has been safety trained with firearms since he was 5. He has his own rifle, shotgun, and is soon to get his 1st pistol (.22cal). Good luck!
:smt1099


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