# K9 question, based on K40



## BAC (May 25, 2007)

Shot the K40 at the local range recently, and noticed an unusual (surprising) amount of muzzle flip. The gun was fairly jumping to get out of my hands, and while I considered it was perhaps _that eager_ to attack the target, it seemed more to me like poor recoil management either on my part or the gun's. I emailed Kahr about it, and they said simply that the .40 S&W generates far greater chamber pressure than either the (for example) 9mm or .45 (both of which I shot that day out of smaller guns than the K40 and controlled much easier than the K40), and is known to have greater muzzle flip.

With that stated, how familiar is anyone here with the K9? I figured in all stainless steel like the K40, but using a smaller bullet, it should be easily able to handle the recoil. Recoil-management is prety important for me, because this handgun purchase I one to fill the CCW position; I can't depend on a weapon that is hard to control.

Thoughts?

-B


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

.40 is pretty snappy in a smaller pistol. With proper technique, the K9 is VERY easy to shoot fast and well. Just before I sold mine, I took a female friend shooting with it. She's maybe 5'3" and slim, with commensurately small hands. She shot it well and exhibited good recoil control - her pairs were quite fast. Unfortunately, I did not have my shot timer with me.

I had absolutely no problems controlling the K9. I shoot from Modern Isosceles and use The Grip.


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## BAC (May 25, 2007)

How is the tigger on the K9 for follow-ups? I know the K40 has a lot of creep before it finally goes off (the trigger is almost at the very rear of where it _can_ travel), and that's part of my turn-off with the .40 weapon because it makes me adjust my grip as the trigger is pulled.

-B


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

BAC said:


> How is the tigger on the K9 for follow-ups? I know the K40 has a lot of creep before it finally goes off (the trigger is almost at the very rear of where it _can_ travel), and that's part of my turn-off with the .40 weapon because it makes me adjust my grip as the trigger is pulled.


The trigger on the K9 is exactly the same as on the K40. While it is very smooth, it is also looooooooooooooooong, which is actually the main reason I prefer the Glock. My split times are faster with the Glock, because the trigger reset is so much shorter.

I, too, have to compromise my grip with the Kahr. The polymer framed Kahrs are almost unworkable for me. It's only a slight compromise on the metal Kahrs, but that also makes me prefer the Glock.

If you really dislike the K40 trigger, I'd say pass on the K9 and keep looking.


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## BAC (May 25, 2007)

That's a damn shame, since I haven't held a gun that fit my hand better than the Kahr (confession: experience limited to Beretta, Glock, Kahr, and Ruger).

I know I wouldn't get the polymer Kahrs, though; heard too many questionable things about quality, and virtually nothing negative about the quality of the all-steel ones (the K40 had a sort of "comforting weight" to it, so I wouldn't mind it during concealed carry). Metal gun for me, if it's Kahr.

Is there nothing a gunsmith could do about the trigger? I know Glock has overtravel stops (which shorten the already-short trigger travel), and so far I haven't found anything like that for Kahr, but I imagine there's _something_ a gunsmith _somewhere_ can do...

-B


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

BAC said:


> That's a damn shame, since I haven't held a gun that fit my hand better than the Kahr (confession: experience limited to Beretta, Glock, Kahr, and Ruger).
> 
> I know I wouldn't get the polymer Kahrs, though; heard too many questionable things about quality, and virtually nothing negative about the quality of the all-steel ones (the K40 had a sort of "comforting weight" to it, so I wouldn't mind it during concealed carry). Metal gun for me, if it's Kahr.
> 
> ...


I've heard of 'smiths who will smooth the Kahr trigger, but never heard of an overtravel stop. Which does not mean it can't happen. Have you tried a Kahr with the "Elite" trigger? It's supposedly shorter and lighter.


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## Dave James (May 15, 2007)

Kahr them selfs has some one doing trigger work, you mite give customer service a ring,, Also the "Cylinder&Slide" guys are working on them.

THE only 40cal Kahr I like is the T-40, for me its just enough bigger, control is smoother, it still jumps a tad, just not as bad as the pocket rockets Mk-40 and such


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## BAC (May 25, 2007)

I dropped a message by Kahr not overly long ago, and here's what they had to say about trigger modification:



Dottie Harold said:


> In terms of the trigger, it does have substantial travel and we cannot modify it. We also have an alternative trigger which meets NYPD standards and has a 12lb pull. It comes as standard on either the K9093AC (stainless) or K9094AC (black). The Elite K9 (K9098) comes with our standard trigger. The NYPD trigger can be fitted to any other model as an after market option for $60 including parts, labor, and shipping.


They offer a stiffer pull, but not a shorter one. Guess it's come down to a gunsmith for nice talk.

An overtravel stop I've heard of only mentioned in two guns: Glocks and 1911's. I _believe_ the idea is that once the trigger is pulled far enough back that the weapon discharges, there is an immediate block of further trigger pull by the overtravel stop (which is a physical object within the trigger mechanism that prevents further trigger travel). If my suspicion is right, then there's not much that can do either, since I want the trigger to travel less before it discharges, not after.

Kahr triggers are very smooth, even though I prefer two-stage triggers, but I really need it to have less creep instead of a heavier pull or less travel after the weapon discharges. Glock and Beretta Couger triggers have spoiled me.

-B


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## stormbringerr (May 22, 2007)

*40 cal*



> .40 S&W generates far greater chamber pressure than either the (for example) 9mm or .45


.... this is true


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## stormbringerr (May 22, 2007)

*trigger*

i think trigger overtravel can be cut way down in springfield xds


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

*K9 and K40 Kahr's*

I have owned eleven Kahr's and currently own six. Last November, I bought a K9 Elite '03 to compliment my K40 Elite '98 purchased almost 10 years ago. Both of these pieces have been perfection. The triggers are superb and rather short in their travel. When Kahr first introduced the "Elite" series, one of the things they did was to reduce trigger travel my 1/8", and they did this on the release side of the trigger. In other words, the 3/8" travel occurred up front rather than towards the back end of the release. This has made for a very good DAO trigger and much better in the area of followup shots.

Both my K9 Elite and my K40 Elite are premium firearms and excellent carry arms. Accurate and quick to battery. My K40 handles recoil beautifully and allows for quick double taps. These are two items which will remain in my collection.


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