# Ever face the Scenerio?



## qpoint (Apr 5, 2009)

I'm no big gun guru. Just decided it's time to go down the path of the additional safety for SD purposes. Think I'll like shooting at the range for a little R&R too.

But, we all prepare ourselves for that which we hope we never have to confront--- but has anyone ever been in a SD scenerio in your home? An Invasion, Intruder, Burgler, etc.? 

What was your scenerio and how did you handle it? Were you even in the position to lay hold to your weapon?


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## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

This topic has come up a lot in the past. I think that most of us here have not, thankfully, been in a situation that required us to fire. A few have had to draw their guns and way more than a few (myself included) have felt the need to grab the gun, but not draw or fire. From my experience, most people that have been actually been involved in a shooting are very leery of giving out information or details about it over public internet forums. Of the forums I frequent, I can only think of one, maybe two, guys that talk about a SD incident. But, you never know, someone may come forward. :watching:


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## qpoint (Apr 5, 2009)

I'm can definately see how that would prove difficult to discuss and/or bare other reasons for not metioning on a public forum. I withdraw my question and simply celebrate not having been in such a situation for all of us who havn't and respect all who have overcome such scenerios.


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## babs (Nov 30, 2007)

Playing devil's advocate.. I'm betting the larger the list of folks carrying grows in certain areas, if word spreads the way it should that folks are indeed carrying or at least ramping up home protection, the less they'll need it. An armed society is a polite society.

I would say knowing what I know about the increases in CC's out there, just passing any old guy in the street, I'd be inclined to think yeah this or that person just might be carrying. If a potential-perp has that same attitude, good chance he might reconsider testing it.


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## qpoint (Apr 5, 2009)

Babs --- youve definiately made point! Never thought of thing's quite that way but absolutely right.

Hey---- I don't even wanna hardly blow my horn at someone else's car who might be holding a conversation with someone standing in the middle of the street in front of me; or at someone who doesn't realize the light is now green and no longer red. Guess you can say change in time has increased my patience and level of awareness. "I can wait!"

_All because "thing's have changed"._

Thanks for your reply.


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## babs (Nov 30, 2007)

Folks can become a bit more discretionary. yeah.. I can see it. A lot less apt to blow a head gasket.. More apt to keep ones civility and wits about them. .. All good things I think.. Maybe it'll sink in to the young folks out there. :mrgreen:


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## jump15vc (Feb 24, 2009)

not yet but when i do ill be ready, thats for certain


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## Ptarmigan (Jul 4, 2008)

PM on its way, jump15vc.


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## Oldman (Apr 16, 2009)

*Yes*

I will freely admit to being in home invasion situations on three times since 1969. Once was when my now deceased mother had cooked supper and my wife and I had came by to visit but due to a long day of travel, we spent the night. About 1am, we were awakened to a back door being broken into. I did a simple take down and had the 20 yr old perp in custody by the time officers were on the scene. No firearms were pulled or used but I did have my carry weapn within reach. I will also say the awakening from a sound sleep during the night did not allow me time to even consider a weapon since I was unsure exactly what caused the initial noise.

The second time was when my wife and I were in a motel in Anniston, AL. A drunken gentleman broke in the door on his third attempt and I had my wife on the far side of the bed with me as I held the man at gunpoint after issuing verbal commands for hm to halt futher advancement. By the time he stopped, the police were there due to his trying to get into other rooms before entering ours. I did not even have to press charges. The officers on the scene were prompt, courteous, and professional.

The last time was actually when an alarm went off in a neighbors house. I went out my door, armed and ready, to see what was going on. The neighbor was hollering and a young boy of 17 ran out her patio door. I gave chase and caught him as he ran into a fenced back yard. Again, police were on the scene in minutes. The boy had mental problems and was hospitalized.

All the above being said, in my profession, I get the results of a lot of studies about guns, crime, law and such. These studies suggest that those carrying concealed are generally those that will not need or ever use their weapon in seld defense. Crime tends to lend it's self to being in areas that are more prone to housing those that would not pass a CCW muster due to criminal records and other things. Few middle class homes are targets of home invasion.

I carry because I go into rough areas to gather evidence for court trials that will put someone away or cause grief to some. Most of those I deal with are felons or have drug histories. My own home has alarm systems and the house has several firearms locked in safes. There are some loaded weapons in ready reach but fortunately I have never needed them while at home.

Now for a personal opinion, having a firearm ready is a good thing but using it in a self defense situation is a bad thing. If you use it, look for several future events. One is your homeowners insurance company will likely cancel you. If you shoot someone breaking in, even though they were the criminal, your insurance will likely pay thousands to them or their suvivors for damage. Many insurance companies are now asking if you have guns in the home. I have to list mine, with serial numbers, type and such on my policy and pay extra for the coverage on firearms.

Next, in the event of using a firearm where someone was hit, you may well spend several hours in custody being questions and a District Attorney will decide if charges will be brought against you. Past that, you can expect a lawyer fee of about $5000 to start.

Then there are other things I learned in working with crime and accident scenes over the years that work against the honest citizen but this may not be the place to post them.

I still believe in gun ownership and the right to own them by HONEST, LAW ABIDING citizens.


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## rccola712 (Aug 26, 2008)

qpoint said:


> Hey---- I don't even wanna hardly blow my horn at someone else's car who might be holding a conversation with someone standing in the middle of the street in front of me; or at someone who doesn't realize the light is now green and no longer red. Guess you can say change in time has increased my patience and level of awareness. "I can wait!"


thats why i wish there was a 'nice sounding' horn that just says, fyi, the lights green, not THE LIGHTS GREEN YOU DUMB ___, or something along those lines :mrgreen:


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

> Few middle class homes are targets of home invasion.


Must be that wholesome city living that keeps them in their home areas. There have been more and more stories about some lone strung out pill head or sometimes small groups of them doing home invasions to get prescriptions or something to seal to get the money to get them. So the middle or upper class areas often become targets for these crimes. If it's lower class homes getting robbed it's usually older people that are targets being they usually have the meds that they are looking for anyway. 
My wife's grand mother and grandfather was one of those targets once. She actually told me once she put a 30-30 round into a 410 shotgun and fired it at one once.. I have no idea how that worked bu they say the recoil blew her against the wall. she was firing into a building that used to be housing for hired help around the farm but was not storage where she kept all kinds of things. She told the cops she git one of them in the right cheek (the..lower one). They found a guy in the ER with a wound to his right cheek (The..lower one) and arrested him for the B&E. I asked her why in Gods name she would try to use such a round in her old shotgun. She said she grabbed it by accident thinking she had one of the rounds she kept sitting on her husbands gun rack and was too upset to look at what she put in. All she knew was it went in. When it fired and she went up against the opposite wall was when she knew something was wrong. I wouldn't believe that story from anyone but her. he's quite an interesting woman. She wont lie to save her life though. She still keeps that old 410 single shot next to her where she site on the couch. I still wonder just how that would work and why that old weapon isn't in pieces.

Sure makes an interesting story though.


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## Oldman (Apr 16, 2009)

DevilsJohnson said:


> Must be that wholesome city living that keeps them in their home areas.


I always suggest people get a list of crimes from their local police department by district. There is one employee that is paid to maintain the crime reporting by address in each department.

My city is divided into 18 different police districts. Any crime is entered into the records as to address, type and time of crime as well as other factors. When comparing the districts, a person can tell where the crimes are taking place. For example, my area has not had a home burglary in three years. Another area about 10 miles from me had 331 in the last quarter of 2008. The median income in my area is $141,000 per year and the other district has a median income of less than $12,000.

People with a good income are not out committing crimes such as home invasions. This is not to say they are not ripping off some corporation in a legal way.

Crime does not pay well so it takes a lot of it to be beneficial to the criminal. They usually cannot afford an attorney so they are provided one for free (pro bono).

As we all know, drugs and gangs contribute to the crime rate in a major fashion. Gangs tend to remain in the their home turf and that is usually in the lower class neighborhoods and increase the crime rate for that neighborhood. Many home burglaries are committed by people that know the occupant.


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## Cool Whip (May 21, 2008)

I live in a small town in Southwest AZ. An hours drive from the border with Mexico. What used to be a quiet small town with almost no crime, has once again become the wild west. Vehicles loaded with drugs and illegal aliens are being stopped at least once per night. Most of the time the drivers bail. We also have a Indian reservation in our town. What used to be fights on the rez every weekend, have lately turned into shootings. Mexican drug traffickers transport their drugs over reservation land and use members of the tribe as mules. And thats not even factoring in the Meth problem that has hit our small town also. Have I been in a SD situation with a gun? Not yet. People who used to ask me, "Why do you always carry a gun?" now ask me questions on how to get one.


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

I've had to draw my gun before. I normally don't talk about it too much. I have talked about it on this forum before. Why/when do I talk about it? Usually when someone is all Gung Ho about how cool they'd be under pressure. When they sound like they'd "get off" on having to draw their gun. When they almost sound like they're looking for a reason to have to draw their gun.

Well, I tell the story so they might gather a hint of what really happens. I quite literally pissed my pants after having been put in the back of a patrol car after the incident was over. I lost pretty much all control over my body... shaking, crying, pissed myself, back locked up, scared to near death.

Why would I tell people about that part? Because it's not cool. Having to draw your weapon is not cool. 

I will say this... having carried a weapon nearly everyday for about 15 years, it's taught me more about NOT having to draw my weapon by being aware, by paying attention to my surroundings, by not getting complacent. I'd bet that talking about those types of senarios might get better results. 

Avoid confrontation if possible, don't get caught in a bad part of town after dark if you can absolutely help it, plan for the worst and hope for the best.


Zhur


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## lostsoul (Sep 30, 2008)

One learns quickly that the less said,the better. Even the 911 call is questionable in the after math !
Should one actually make that call or should one just vanish quietly into the night.That phone call is a confession of sorts,what actually should we really do ?This should be interesting. To do the right thing can be very wrong sometimes.!
Hmmmmmmmmm.....??????????


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## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

lostsoul said:


> One learns quickly that the less said,the better. Even the 911 call is questionable in the after math !
> Should one actually make that call or should one just vanish quietly into the night.That phone call is a confession of sorts,what actually should we really do ?This should be interesting. To do the right thing can be very wrong sometimes.!
> Hmmmmmmmmm.....??????????


I sincerely hope you are not even remotely suggesting to not call 911 if you are involved in a shooting. :watching:


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

lostsoul said:


> One learns quickly that the less said,the better. Even the 911 call is questionable in the after math !
> Should one actually make that call or should one just vanish quietly into the night.That phone call is a confession of sorts,what actually should we really do ?This should be interesting. To do the right thing can be very wrong sometimes.!
> Hmmmmmmmmm.....??????????


Your bullets in a dead body are a confession of sorts. 
Your brass with your grubby thumb prints on them are a confession of sorts.
The traffic camara with a video of what happened is a confession of sorts.

But, walking away without calling 911 is a CONVICTION of a particular sort... the guilty kind.

Confessions aren't always bad, if you are confessing the truth and you were in the right to begin with. Is is smart to keep your statements to a bare minimum... you bet. Is it smart to think long and hard before you speak... you bet. Is it smart to "vanish quietly into the night"... only if you like short walks in the (prison) yard, rough hands and have a severe distaste for your freedom.

Zhur


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## lostsoul (Sep 30, 2008)

Life in it's self can be strange and un-fair at times.I'm not saying what I would do ,just poseing an interesting scenerio.And sirs,just because it was a "just " shooting does not mean you will come out unscathed.Now,I know what we all should do but is it really the right thing to do in all scenerios?

Hmmmmmm......?

And still,I'm not saying what I would do,I plea the 5th !

Is that 911 call always the best thing to do.


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## jdeere9750 (Nov 28, 2008)

lostsoul said:


> Life in it's self can be strange and un-fair at times.I'm not saying what I would do ,just poseing an interesting scenerio.And sirs,just because it was a "just " shooting does not mean you will come out unscathed.Now,I know what we all should do but is it really the right thing to do in all scenerios?
> 
> Hmmmmmm......?
> 
> ...


You gotta be kidding me!!! That's not even an "interesting scenario" in my book.


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

You have to make the call. If it's left to anyone else then you are the person being called about. you are the shooter that goes into the night.

You make the call. Check out this link and click on the video titled "After a Real Shooting"

I couldn't say it any better than this guy.

Direct Link to video


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## lostsoul (Sep 30, 2008)

jdeere9750 said:


> You gotta be kidding me!!! That's not even an "interesting scenario" in my book.


Let us discuss this interesting scenerio.

You have a beautiful wife,three kids,two girls,5 and 9 years old,also a son, 15 years old. Gang activity is getting bad everywhere,don't even need to look for trouble,it seems to find you.You're comeing home from work,preoccupied by the days events. You pass the usual turn off on the way home and end up in the wrong place at the wrong time and see something you were not ment to see. In this twist of fate,they also see you. Can't get to the phone just yet ,too busy trying to get the hell out of there.
You think you're safe and got away clean but,as you near your home,someone is following you. You're not going home,you don't want this person to know where your family is.As you lead them away,you find yourself turning down a dead-end coldisack,new construction,real fricken bummer!
You have a ccw and a .45 on you but the last thing you want to do is shoot someone.You are blocked in,and these psychos are getting out of the car.You know they're gangstas by there garb!You are thrown into a life and death scenerio like it or not.
You love your family,dearly,it's why you do the things you do,hard work,pistol training,many years of practice.This situation doesn't end hear.It's a major gang banger,there will be reprecussions.

What do you do,you shoot one or two,do you make that call, let everyone know who you are.
What do you do while you are incarsarated,what does your family do.

The only thing ,you didn't call. You don't want to put people you care about in danger.Nobody saw anything.Does it end hear ? What do you do ?


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## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

This thread is dangerously close to crossing the line. Before it moves that final inch ....


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