# Ripped-off on a S&W 629



## Flight_Medic (Aug 22, 2016)

Purchased a S&W Model 629 .44 Magnum off Gunbroker that was listed in "excellent condition" with no mention of ANYTHING wrong. My FFL received a DAMAGED model 629 (see photos). The side plate is bent (right over where the trigger pin should be), pry marks on the edge of the plate and scratches around the screw holes (apparently from too large a screwdriver). I paid over $1200 for this revolver and it looks like DOGSHIT!! The best part is, the seller is claiming there is "nothing wrong with the revolver" and refusing to give me a refund without a "letter from S&W documenting the damage". The photos on his auction do not highlight this flaw, it simply looks like a shadow from lighting.

I refused to accept the weapon and it remains at my FFL dealer, but I have no idea how to proceed with trying to get my money back. I called S&W, and they told me that, because this weapon is out of warranty, it will take the Performance Center approximately 10 to 12 weeks to get an estimate. By that time I wont even be able to leave negative feedback for the seller anymore!! Not sure how to handle this. Any advice is greatly appreciated.



















By comparison, this is their photo from the auction. Magically, there is no bend showing...










So anyone looking for an "_excellent condition [revolver] with minimal signs of use_" should AVOID Gunbroker seller "*gomoose02*" and B&B Guns in Grand Fork, ND.

I may not get my money back, but maybe I can save someone here from getting taken for a $1200 ride.


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## wirenut (Dec 16, 2015)

Sorry about your recent purchase, I hope gunbroker makes it right.
This is why I will never buy anything off of an auction site.
I'm sure there are some reputable sellers, but for me money will never change hands unless the product is in hand.
Good Luck !!


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## MoMan (Dec 27, 2010)

Did you pay with a CC? If so, then you should have some protection.


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## win231 (Aug 5, 2015)

As stated, if you paid with a CC, simply file a charge dispute. And, it's never a good idea to buy that way.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

File a complaint with GunBroker. Get a statement in writing from your FFL. 

I used to deal with GunBroker a lot years ago, both buying and selling. GB will make it right.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

That really sucks! It's quite obvious that somebody was screwing around with that gun and tried to either force the side plate on or off. Or that the hammer block was not seated properly inside the slot of the side plate and they tried to tighten down the screws anyway. All it takes to get the side plate off is to remove the grips and side plate screws and tap the side of the grip frame and it will pop right out. It doesn't take any force to re-install it either. I hate to say this but if that is a new gun at $1,200 you paid way too much for it as they usually go for under $900 new.

To make matters worse it doesn't even sound like a new gun otherwise they wouldn't have to advertise it as being in "excellent condition with minimal signs of use". Being that it is a used gun I doubt that S&W would even cover the damages as they would have no idea who caused them? It's highly unlikely it left the factory that way.

But that's besides the point. The fact that you noticed it before taking possession of it your FFL should send it back and the seller should make good on it. Unless of course you bought the firearm "as is" sight unseen. That's the whole problem of buying anything at an auction or from a photograph.

Myself? I would try and fix it first and avoid all of the aggravation that you may encounter dealing with these people. From looking at the photo's it looks like a fairly easy fix.

Depending on how badly bent the side plate is you may be able to straighten it out yourself in a vise, being careful not to damage the trigger and hammer bearing surfaces. They look like little raised washers that are integral of the side plate casting itself. But first I would remove the side plate and the hammer block. Then reinstall the side plate, tightening down all of the screws. That alone may straighten it out. Then you can file down the high spot and finish it off with wet or dry sandpaper starting with 220 grit and working your way up to maybe 600 grit or whatever matches the rest of the gun. 

Just make sure that you sand in the same direction as the rest of the gun so it matches and always sand on a flat surface. That will also take care of the scratches around the screw holes. You may have to remove and install the side plate several times in between sanding's until you've sanded it down enough where it's flush with the frame. Don't worry as you will not be removing too much metal by hand sanding. Especially if you start with 220 grit.

Consider yourself lucky that the gun is made of stainless steel otherwise you'd have to get it re-finished after you fixed the side plate issue.


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

wirenut said:


> Sorry about your recent purchase, I hope gunbroker makes it right.
> This is why I will never buy anything off of an auction site.
> I'm sure there are some reputable sellers, but for me money will never change hands unless the product is in hand.
> Good Luck !!


I am exactly the same way.


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## Flight_Medic (Aug 22, 2016)

**UPDATE**

CS Rep from S&W took pity on my and expedited the process (she was AWESOME), and their Performance Center confirmed the revolver is in need of repair and issued me estimate for parts and labor. According to S&W, the side plate needs to be replaced and fitted and the frame refinished to match new plate. Also the Trigger Pin and Locking Block Coiled Pin need to be replaced. I forwarded this documentation to the seller who replied *"One of our Managers will be in touch with S&W right away. We will find out an ETA for repairs. "* B&B Guns ("gomoose02") clearly has NO intention of refunding my money.

So, since I did NOT agree to purchase a damaged OR a factory refurbished revolver, I an not authorizing repair, and I am going to have to contact the Attorney General of ND and report them for Deceptive Business Practices and Internet Fraud.

*PLEASE avoid this Gunbroker seller, and feel free to spread the word to friends. *


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## t4terrific (Oct 24, 2015)

Flight_Medic said:


> **UPDATE**
> 
> CS Rep from S&W took pity on my and expedited the process (she was AWESOME), and their Performance Center confirmed the revolver is in need of repair and issued me estimate for parts and labor. According to S&W, the side plate needs to be replaced and fitted and the frame refinished to match new plate. Also the Trigger Pin and Locking Block Coiled Pin need to be replaced. I forwarded this documentation to the seller who replied *"One of our Managers will be in touch with S&W right away. We will find out an ETA for repairs. "* B&B Guns ("gomoose02") clearly has NO intention of refunding my money.
> 
> ...


..., and you will get nothing, the seller will give nothing, BBB will do nothing, and you'll have to try to get S&W to offer to fix it again so you'll have a decent -1 (the most undesirable pre-lock 629) to sell for about $700.

On the other hand, you could thank S&W for their offer, accept it, wait for your overpriced revolver, and try to learn from your mistake.

Make better decisions with your investments, money, and time.


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## Flight_Medic (Aug 22, 2016)

"t4terrific said:


> <snip> (the most undesirable pre-lock 629) </snip>


I have a feeling if someone crossed you with a prostitute, they'd get a "fucking" know-it-all.

Whether or not you think I overpaid for this revolver, or the model-1 isn't up to your standards for the 629, is inconsequential. The fact is, this seller knowingly misrepresented a damaged firearm as "excellent". I paid what I was willing to pay, that was not a mistake. Trusting a GB seller to be honest was my mistake.


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## TheReaper (Nov 14, 2008)

Flight_Medic said:


> [QUOTE="t4terrific, post: 690041, member: 35667 <snip> (the most undesirable pre-lock 629) </snip>


I have a feeling if someone crossed you with a prostitute, they'd get a "fucking" know-it-all.

Whether or not you think I overpaid for this revolver, or the model-1 isn't up to your standards for the 629, is inconsequential. The fact is, this seller knowing misrepresented a damaged firearm as "excellent". I paid what I was willing to pay, that was not a mistake. *Trusting a GB seller to be honest was my mistake.*[/QUOTE]

Learn from your mistake, get it fixed by S&W.


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## Flight_Medic (Aug 22, 2016)

TheReaper said:


> Learn from your mistake, get it fixed by S&W.


Yep, guess that's all I can do at this point...and also warn my fellow gun enthusiasts about a disreputable seller so they can avoid the same mistake. I will post pics and a range report of the repaired revolver when its all said and done.


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## t4terrific (Oct 24, 2015)

Flight_Medic said:


> [QUOTE="t4terrific, post: 690041, member: 35667 (the most undesirable pre-lock 629)


I have a feeling if someone crossed you with a prostitute, they'd get a "fucking" know-it-all.

Whether or not you think I overpaid for this revolver, or the model-1 isn't up to your standards for the 629, is inconsequential. The fact is, this seller knowingly misrepresented a damaged firearm as "excellent". I paid what I was willing to pay, that was not a mistake. Trusting a GB seller to be honest was my mistake.[/QUOTE]

I did notice that they still have an A+ rating with the BBB, with no complaints.

Did you forget to follow through?


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## MoMan (Dec 27, 2010)

So GunBroker wouldn't help you with this? Have you tried contacting GB directly? There should be something they can do, due to the fact this appears to be a fraudulent listing.
You must not have paid with a CC, so there is no avenue that way.


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## Flight_Medic (Aug 22, 2016)

t4terrific said:


> I did notice that they still have an A+ rating with the BBB, with no complaints.
> 
> Did you forget to follow through?


Did not forget, just awaiting the final disposition. Revolver is still in the possession of S&W, and my CC company must allow 30 days for seller to respond to my fraud claim. I never transferred (FFL)ownership of the gun into my name, so as long as they take THEIR gun back and I get a refund on my CC I'm done with it. If I somehow get stuck with this "overpriced" revolver, THEN I will be filing with the BBB and the AG of ND for "Deceptive Business Practice" against B&B Guns.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

Man, 1st the Les Baer now this. Remind me to never take you shopping.


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## gwpercle (Jun 8, 2018)

Because of experiences like the OP's , I only buy firearms from local dealers.... and only after putting my eyes and hands on the gun first .
After shooting , if any problems are revealed the dealer will correct it.
He enjoys my repeat business , I'm a loyal customer and he takes care of me because I'll be back .
I can honestly say in the last 50 years I've never been beaten up in a transaction.
There's a lot to be said for not buying firearms off the net .
Gary


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## Flight_Medic (Aug 22, 2016)

VAMarine said:


> Man, 1st the Les Baer now this. Remind me to never take you shopping.


Well played, sir...well played. But the LB problems were rectified (hopefully this will be as well).

And, in my defense, I'm running about 93% success rate for online purchases...only 2 out of the 30 handguns I bought within the last 5 years have had issues. However, I'm running ZERO percent for online pre-owned purchases, as this is the first USED gun I've ever bought sight-unseen.

You always take a chance purchasing online...even brand new from reputable dealers like Buds or Grab-A-Gun.


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## TheReaper (Nov 14, 2008)

I've had really good luck with Grab-A-Gun and plan on a black gun purchase from them this week.


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## flight medic (Aug 11, 2018)

TheReaper said:


> I've had really good luck with Grab-A-Gun and plan on a black gun purchase from them this week.


Yeah, they're a solid gun store...and (technically) my LGS should I need one. Located about 10 min up the road. Havent seen any other retailer able to beat their prices on the lower-end production stuff.


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## 54rambler (Oct 15, 2018)

Gunbroker has a customer support site. With the photos you have, and the information from S&W, I would assume you would have a pretty good case. 
Give a negative review to the seller. He seems to have deserved it.


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## 54rambler (Oct 15, 2018)

Gunbroker has a customer support site. With the photos you have, and the information from S&W, I would assume you would have a pretty good case. 
Give a negative review to the seller. He seems to have deserved it.


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## Mowgli Terry (Sep 19, 2019)

You did good to deal with Smith&Wesson. As a result you have a warranty. It may be a good idea to discuss Bubba work on the inside of the revolver. There's nobody locally that I'd trust to do more than change the grips. 

My FFL had sold thousands of dollars worth of my gear on GB. I has some thought about selling some more gun.s He declined saying most of the stuff on GB is junk. He no longer uses GB. I'll ask him about this tomorrow and report back on his experience. Also the BBB is as useful as a crocheted condom.


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## BigHead (Jul 5, 2015)

Sorry to hear it.


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## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

Coming in late on this older thread, but I'd like to know the how this all turned out. The only "not in my hand" gun purchases I make are either cheap guns (I recently bought a used Beretta 81 for $200.00) or a brand new gun (I got a SCCY in .380 from Bud's Guns). If something goes south with a used gun purchase (never from an individual) oh well, I may be out a few dollars, and if I get a problematic new gun I can easily return it to the dealer of mfg....


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## nrd515525 (Feb 12, 2007)

Other than one time when the seller messed up and sold me the wrong item, too long to go into here, but he made it all right, I've never had a problem with a gun bought on GB, etc. Every gun has at least been as good as it appeared in the pics and a couple were much better. A hint to the seller, clean your guns before you take the pics, that "pitted barrel" might just be some lead and gunk. I scored one of my all time best deals once when the seller saw what he thought was "rust" all over the gun. I had never seen a gun rust in the odd pattern it had, so I gambled, and hit the jackpot, the gun was LOADED with jeweler's rouge! The previous owner, who pawned the gun to the store I bought it from, had attempted to do some half assed internal smoothing job, and when he fired it, the rouge went all over the front of the gun. A lot of CLP and Gunscrubber, and it was about 99%, and shot flawlessly. The best part was about 4 years later, I needed money for taxes, so I sold it, and there was a bidding war that got me double what I had paid for it. 

But ALWAYS pay with a CC the 3% upcharge most GB and online sellers charge is no big amount. I've paid both by CC's and USPS money orders and if something does go wrong, the CC bank can be a help. Right now, I'm in dispute with a cellphone carrier due to getting a phone that basically was unable to get service inside my apartment. I had seven days to request return and the form to request return didn't work, so on the seventh day, I called them, and they refused to accept it, saying it was too late, even though it wasn't past 7 days, so the bank got involved and I got my money back. So far, the cellphone carrier hasn't contacted me about sending the useless phone back.


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## Stargater53 (Dec 10, 2018)

If the seller is willing to pay for the repairs, I'd go that route. If he is _not_ willing to anty up, I'd return it. GunBroker isn't a repository for sick and damaged guns. If you damage a gun and you want to get rid of it, it's not right to just offer it up for sale. It's entirely likely that the seller damaged the gun and said, "Oh, sh#!...I'll simply sell it and it'll be someone else's problem."

I can't tell you how many times I've read posts where people talk about getting a defective gun, then just passing it on by selling it. That's why I insist on having a turn option. Years ago, in western Kentucky, a fellow wanted to sell me a Ruger Security-Six. When I got the chance to examine the gun, it was a mess. It was clearly something that could not have left the factory. I surmised that the owner had taken two Ruger Security-Sixes and combined the parts so that one was perfect, and the other not so. By a lot.

The forcing cone measurement measured .013 and the double action was horrendous. When I showed the seller these issues, he became enraged. It could not have left the factory in that condition. Ruger does have many parts that can be interchanged, but cylinders and ratchets require fitting, and when you have a cylinder that binds, has an excessive forcing cone -- something is amiss.

Needless to say, I passed on the deal. I'm also very careful of online gun purchases.

--


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

I’ve bought many guns over the last 4 or 5 years through GB. That being said, I wouldn’t pay more than maybe $300 or so for a good one in my opinion. Never would pay more than that because although I wouldn’t want to but could stand a $300 mistake and live with it, I couldn’t accept a $1200 misrepresentation. If I were going to spend that kind of money, i’d Want to personally inspect it and maybe have a gunsmith check it over. Just sayin, if you approach buying on GB from the perspective of going to the casino, how much would you be willing to risk for the chance on a good outcome? Set your limit and don’t go over. Guns are being made every day and you can find another one just as good another day.


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## nrd515525 (Feb 12, 2007)

Any final resolution on this?


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## nrd515525 (Feb 12, 2007)

I guess I'm the luckiest guy around, I've bought over 2 dozen used guns on GB and other sites, and not one had any issues. One of the last ones was coincidentally, a 629-1 Only thing other than a couple of marks on it are a few nicks on the bottom of the grips. Not a big deal and I saw them in the pics of the auction.


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## Mowgli Terry (Sep 19, 2019)

Just Consider-history not advice: I got several guns that were really rotten deals-twenty years ago. How to make a bad deal go good. For me it was keeping the gun. Should we change places it would it be worth while to have Performance Center do additional work over repairs on the gun. Around 2040 you may consider that gun the buy of a lifetime. I remember paying $300.00 dollars, way too much, for 6" a Smith 526 no dash . Way Less hostile about that deal today.


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