# Help deciding on a gun/caliber... (Long Post)



## RAL (Oct 11, 2014)

Hello. I joined this forum just a little while ago after seeing how awesome the community is with helping n00bs like me out...

I'm looking to buy my very first handgun and I needed a little help deciding. Now, I'm not COMPLETELY new to [semi-automatic] guns. I've gone shooting twice and I've been studying the hell out of how they work, how to maintain them; but mainly, gun safety. Every time I hold a gun, I'm VERY conscious of where I'm pointing it, I always rack the slide a few times with the magazine out to be sure the chamber is clear, I always keep the slide locked when I set it down, etc.

ANYWAY, I've been looking at a few of them. The reason I'm looking to buy is both for target shooting AND self-defense. There have been a LOT of break-ins in my area as of late. Three of them ended up with the occupants hurt.

The first gun I was looking at was a Ruger SR1911. I know... Probably a bad first gun with it being single-action and everything. The only thing that pretty much eliminates this as an option is because .45 caliber ammo is a bit too expensive to go target shooting. BUT, I think it would DEFINITELY do the job with one shot if someone were really intent on hurting me or my family.

The second gun I was considering was a Gen 4 Glock 22. The .40 caliber seems like a good middle ground. A box of 50 rounds for .40 caliber is only $5 more than a box of 9mm.

The third choice would be a Gen 4 Glock 17. The thing I worry about with a 9mm round is the fact that I've read about it bouncing off windshields, people taking multiple shots and not going down, etc. The main advantage to it would obviously be the price.

Those are the guns I'm considering right now. My other concern is that I've heard Glock is one of the most reliable guns you could possibly buy. But the fact that it's made out of polymer (plastic, right?) is almost completely eliminating it as an option for me. I worry about it snapping in half or melting in the sun or something. Are Glocks really durable enough to trust with your life?

Thanks to anybody that can help and I'm REALLY sorry for the long post!


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## TurboHonda (Aug 4, 2012)

Welcome to the forum. I love your questions. You've got something for everyone to pounce on.  Guns that melt. Bullets that bounce. You'll enjoy it here. Seriously, welcome to the forum. If you can wait a few days for that purchase, I think your time will be well spent. Lots of experience and opinions here.


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## BackyardCowboy (Aug 27, 2014)

There are other threads around the forum that will explain that bullet size alone is not enough, it's a combination of that and shot placement. (where you hit your target/vital area).
A 22cal in the eye will probably be quite discouraging, but hit them anywhere else, probably won't do much. (and you're shooting at a moving target)
Glocks won't melt in the sun, if they did, they wouldn't be able to handle firing bullets. 
Others have said, find a range near you that rents guns and fire as many different guns as you are able. What feels good in your hand (grip, trigger, aiming) What can you hold the steadiest to fire on target. If the gun will only be kept in your house/apt then a large capacity magazine type gun can be fine. If your spouse needs to be able to fire it, then need one with a grip that both can fit in their hands. If the gun w/ a large cap magazine is too heavy, then consider one with a smaller mag, or that comes with two different cap magazines. (some come with a 10 round and a 19 round for example).
I haven't shot a lot of different ones, so I'll let others who have make suggestions to you.


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## BackyardCowboy (Aug 27, 2014)

As far as 'bouncing bullets' hitting windshields, It's more engineering and ballistics. A windshield is at an angle to the approaching bullet, it's not straight on (perpendicular). Windshields are reinforced tempered glass with a layer of plastic between two different panes of the special glass to keep it from shattering into tiny shards of glass and to try to keep the occupants inside the vehicle if they hit the windshield. (30 years in EMS here, they still try to go out thru the windshield in crashes = wear your seatbelts, dangit)
Where the bullet is striking at an angle, a lot of it's energy is pushed into a change of direction by the angle of the glass, reducing it's forward momentum. repeated shots striking the same spot will probably get thru after the initial hit, but may still have their trajectory affected..


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

First off, welcome aboard... we're pleased to have you with us.

Second, congratulations and good for you for taking the time and effort to learn about handguns and ammunition; at least you have a decent beginning and some groundwork on which you can build.

Your best bet is to do as BackyardCowboy suggested. Rent some guns and shoot them. But before you do this, try to attend a major gun show where you can handle a variety of pistols to see which ones fit your hands the best. Make a list of the ones you like. Then visit a range(s) where you can rent guns and shoot the ones on your list. Do this until you have narrowed down your candidate list to just a couple of guns and then take your final decision.

As for the .45ACP being able to put a BG down with one shot... maybe and maybe not. Yes it is more powerful than a 9mm (thinking defensive rounds here) and makes a larger hole. But the effectiveness it is going to have on a human being is largely a factor of where it is hit. So do keep that in mind. Still the .45 is quite effective in getting the job done.

Glocks don't melt in the sun or on your person. And the frame is not going to snap in half. I carry several of my Glocks (not at the same time) and have put thousands of rounds through a number of them with virtually no problems. In all of my shooting with Glocks over the past 18 years, I have had two failures (one feeding and one ejecting), one of which was my fault, which means just one failure in 18 years with, I don't know, perhaps 15 to 18 Glocks? Yes, they are extremely reliable.

There are a host of other fine pistols from which to choose as well. And you're off to a great start so keep at it. As for caliber in your choice of guns, The G22 and G17 would make fine pistols. For carry, consider their little brother counterparts in the G23 and G19. Also, take a look at the Smith and Wesson M&P series. Sig Sauer has some fine offerings as well. Just a host of great candidates out there so take your time and stay focused.

Oh and if you go with Glock, there is much you can do with the trigger and sights to make it better fit your specific requirements (this holds true for the M&P and others as well).

Good luck in your search.


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## rustygun (Apr 8, 2013)

Glocks are reliable. Glocks and designs just like them are used by a lot of people. Just the bottom half of the gun is POLYMER. Shooting through a windshield for SELF-DEFENSE, Hmmmm?


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## Smitty79 (Oct 19, 2012)

Take a good self defense firearms class that includes live fire. Go to a gun show and handle everything. Then, as several people have said, rent and shoot some guns. With few exceptions, I would recommend 9mm as a first gun to anyone. A Glock 17 would be my choice of the guns you list. I own 9mms, a 40 and several 45's. My self defense guns are all 9s. One of the greats of defensive shooting said "Placement is Power". I shoot 9s better than the other calibers and the data shows that, with modern ammo, there isn't much difference in stopping power.

If I was going to give you a list of other guns I that fit your criteria that I think you should try, it would be:

CZ75 or SP-01 These are almost the same. Differences are mainly cosmetic (get a CZ85 if you are left handed)
CZ P-09
M&P 9
Glock 17
Glock 19 (Smaller than a 17. If you think you might concealed carry, this is great option)
Glock 34
Ruger SR9 (Low on my list because of "lawyer features" like a useless safety, magazine disconnect, loaded chamber indicator) Shoot well and have great ergonimics
Sig Sauer 226 (I don't like Sigs. But that's personal preference. Many consider this the best defensive gun made)
XDM 9 I've shot one of these. Nice ergonomics. Accurate. I'm not a big fan of the grip safety Springfield seems to put on everything.

Other guns I haven't shot that rate well
CZ P-01 or CZ75 compact Smaller version of SP-01 of CZ75. Better adapted to carry
FNS-9
Walther and H&K make well reviewed guns but I've not handled them much.
Some people like the Berretta 92 series. I've handled them but never shot one. I don't like the slide mounted safety.

If cost is a big issue, make sure you consider sights in the package. Out of the box, Glock sights are terrible. If the gun is for defensive uses and may be used when things go "bump in the night", night sights are very useful. A good set of night sites for a Glock will cost over $100. LEO return guns with night sights are inexpensive and make a good first gun option. I've not bought one. But I've never read anything bad about LEO return Glocks or M&P's.


I've been shooting a lot of pistol for the last couple years. I find the CZ75/SP-01 the easiest to shoot well. The ergonomics are fantastic. All steel construction soaks up recoil. But they are also heavy for all day carry. Many say that getting a good belt mitigates that. 

You state that you don't want to buy a 1911 as a first gun. I agree with that. I own a nice 1911 and unless you've grown up with one and really shoot it well, any full size single stack gun is a range toy, not a serious defensive pistol. That's not to say that someone with lots of 1911 experience shouldn't use one as their defensive firearm, it's just not the first place to put your time into. I feel the same way about revolvers. For some people they are the way to go. For someone who has little experience, a double stack 9mm is probably the best first gun. If you have very small hands or live in a state that doesn't believe in the 2nd Amendment (ie they have ridiculous magazine capacity limits), a single stack 9mm might be a good option.

In addition to some good professional training, I feel that getting into action shoot made me a better shooter and would help if I ever got into a self defense situation. USPSA, IDPA, 3 gun and Steel Challenge all give you experience shooting accurately at speed with some adrenaline flowing. Early on, I had the Range Officers saying "Breath Mike Breath" over my shoulder. I am now very comfortable with gun handling in a hurry. If you decide you do want to shoot these kind of competitions, the M&P 9 Pro comes out of the box with decent sights.


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## TurboHonda (Aug 4, 2012)

RAL,

If target shooting and HOME defense are primary reasons, then I assume that carrying and/or concealing is not an issue. If pride of ownership, when not shooting, is a factor; I wouldn't be to quick to dismiss a quality 1911 or revolver. There's something about knowing and "seeing" how things work that appeal to some people. Good luck in your search.


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## NGIB (Jun 28, 2008)

To become "decent" shooting a pistol requires a lot of practice and many rounds downrange. You can't buy a pistol and a box of ammo and consider yourself protected by any means. Ammo price is a large factor and while $4 a box seems like not much - multiply that $4 by 100 boxes.

Any modern caliber will serve as an adequate defense round if you do your part with shot placement. Go to a range that rents guns and shoot a bunch of them - you will find what works best for you. I do not have a favorite really as I like a lot of stuff so the door is open...


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## Tremors (Mar 18, 2012)

Can't ever go wrong with a Glock. Just point and shoot. A .22 can kill someone with shoot placement. So, pick a round you can handle or can afford to shoot regularly. Good luck.


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## hillman (Jul 27, 2014)

Grand Power P1. One for you, one for your wife (easy-change back straps for custom fit). Shoots like a dream.


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## Smitty79 (Oct 19, 2012)

hillman said:


> Grand Power P1. One for you, one for your wife (easy-change back straps for custom fit). Shoots like a dream.


I wouldn't buy one of these as an only gun. Not much history or aftermarket support. That said, based on reviews, I would consider one of these to add to my safe collection in heartbeat. I would probably be happy carrying it. I would want something else on hand when something broke and getting parts was hard.. Guns like this need company. For a first gun, go mainstream. Once you have a few, you can try something like a Grand Power.


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## TurboHonda (Aug 4, 2012)

Smitty79 said:


> I wouldn't buy one of these as an only gun. Not much history or aftermarket support. That said, based on reviews, I would consider one of these to add to my safe collection in heartbeat. I would probably be happy carrying it. I would want something else on hand when something broke and getting parts was hard.. Guns like this need company. For a first gun, go mainstream. Once you have a few, you can try something like a Grand Power.


I read a review of the Grand Power. No de-cocker. That would be a deal breaker for me.


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## hillman (Jul 27, 2014)

TurboHonda said:


> I read a review of the Grand Power. No de-cocker. That would be a deal breaker for me.


It has SA capability; that's a deal maker for me.


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## Cait43 (Apr 4, 2013)

If you’re planning on buying your first handgun, you should try to put your hands on as many handguns as possible and shoot as many as possible. Everyone has different hand shapes, sizes and find different types of sights and calibers easier to use. The best first gun is the one that you can shoot most accurately. Once you find that, then you can start fine tuning your decision based on weight, concealability, caliber, etc.

There are gun shops that rent handguns to try before buying..... Hopefully there are some in your area......


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