# New addition... it goes bang.



## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Last week, I decided to order a pistol that I have been thinking of getting for the better part of this year. So Wednesday, I went over the edge and placed the order; a Glock 21SF (yes, that's in .45ACP). I also made sure that it was going to be the new model (not the one with the picatinny rail and ambi-magazine catch). Picked it up on Saturday and ordered a 3.5 connector, 6 pound trigger spring, and grip plug for it on Sunday. Nice gun. Next stop, the range to see how it fairs. And then a holster (probably a Comp-Tac belt but am open to ideas). Almost forgot. The factory sights will be going away in favor of a set of Trijicon night sights (GL04) probably this week. A detail strip and good polishing job on the internal contacting metal parts and it should be good to go.

Anyone here have one of these pistols along with thoughts/comments/opinions?


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

I had an earlier 21SF, with the normal Glock rail, but the ambi mag catch. 

It shot very well with several different types/brands of ammo, and was perfectly reliable. I didn't like the mag release; under the load of a full or partially-empty mag, it was impossible to eject the mag without pressing upward on the base. I was always waiting for the mag button to break, as has happened with many of the ambi-mag-catch 21SF Glocks.

I tried to like it, I really did. But I couldn't. It was just a tiny bit too large for may hand, and the larger frame was "messing up" my already-long-programmed grip for my smaller (9mm/.40) Glocks. I made it go away, and turned it into another Glock that I liked much better.

Sound like you will have yours set-up just the way you want, and as long as you aren't too locked-in on the feel of the smaller framed Glocks (like I was), you'll probably enjoy it.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

I carried either one of two third generation G-21's for seven and a half years. (I'll, probably, start carrying them regularly again, too.) Very accurate Glocks! A lot of people complain about the wide backstrap; but, I find a G-21 to be ridiculously easy to shoot, both, straight and fast. I, also, only rarely got, 'made' while carrying a G-21. (Because I know, 'How' to move with and dress around a gun.) 

My biggest complaint? The weight! A fully loaded G-21 and two spare magazines (or one large Arredondo) is a lot of weight to carry around on your belt all day long - Plus: knife, cell phone, key ring, and an occasional tac light, along with a stuffed wallet in my back pocket. (No, I'm not rich. It's mostly documents of one sort, or another.) :mrgreen: 



PS: I've been told that Glock GmbH/Inc. no longer produces G-21's with the Picatinny rail and ambi magazine release. (Glock was chasing a possible U.S. military contract at the time. The contract finally went, 'South'; and, when many of these fakakta G-21's, also, didn't work (well) they ended up going, 'South' too. Correct?)


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Glock Doctor said:


> I carried either one of two third generation G-21's for seven and a half years. (I'll, probably, start carrying them regularly again, too.) Very accurate Glocks! A lot of people complain about the wide backstrap; but, I find a G-21 to be ridiculously easy to shoot, both, straight and fast. I, also, only rarely got, 'made' while carrying a G-21. (Because I know, 'How' to move with and dress around a gun.)
> 
> My biggest complaint? The weight! A fully loaded G-21 and two spare magazines (or one large Arredondo) is a lot of weight to carry around on your belt all day long - Plus: knife, cell phone, key ring, and an occasional tac light, along with a stuffed wallet in my back pocket. (No, I'm not rich. It's mostly documents of one sort, or another.) :mrgreen:
> 
> PS: I've been told that Glock GmbH/Inc. no longer produces G-21's with the Picatinny rail and ambi magazine release. (Glock was chasing a possible U.S. military contract at the time. The contract finally went, 'South'; and, when many of these fakakta G-21's, also, didn't work (well) they ended up going, 'South' too. Correct?)


Mine's the SF version. I'm not sure why they changed to the "standard" glock frame over what they had been producing for the 21AF with the rail under the front of the frame and the ambi-magazine catch but I'm happy they did. I much prefer the smoother appearance and practicality of it the way it is now.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

DJ Niner said:


> *I had an earlier 21SF, with the normal Glock rail, but the ambi mag catch.
> *
> It shot very well with several different types/brands of ammo, and was perfectly reliable. I didn't like the mag release; under the load of a full or partially-empty mag, it was impossible to eject the mag without pressing upward on the base. I was always waiting for the mag button to break, as has happened with many of the ambi-mag-catch 21SF Glocks.
> 
> ...


Didn't know they made a 21SF like that. I have smaller hands and the grip is about as large as I would want. I also have a gen4 G22 and that grip feels quite a bit better to me overall. My primary carry gun is one of my gen3 G23's configured to my specs (much like what I wrote about in the opening post + the smooth faced trigger from the full sized G22). If this 21SF doesn't work out to my liking, I'll trade it for a gen4 21. Time will tell.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

Here ya go -


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

what's the purpose of the grip plug for the glocks ?
Is the open cavity for a special purpose ?


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

pic said:


> what's the purpose of the grip plug for the glocks ?
> Is the open cavity for a special purpose ?


You know, I was never certain why Glock left that cavity open to the elements. I imagine I may have read it in one of my Glock books but don't recall. The purpose of the grip plug is two (maybe three) fold. To "finish" off the base , of the grip, to help keep foreign debris from getting into the internals to a minimum, and some say act as an aid in fast magazine replacements.

The fact that there is a hole in the bottom of the backstrap would seem to indicate an option for a lanyard.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

Over the years I've participated in, at least, a dozen of these threads - All without any definitive conclusion having ever been reached. 

Personally, I am convinced of two things: (1) More dirt gets into a Glock with an open frame hole than could ever - EVER - be held inside by using a plug. (2) The principal reason, 'Why' new Glock pistols always come with an open frame is (a.) Gaston's personality, and (b.) $$$$$. I base these conclusions on eleven years of carrying and using Glock pistols as well as the umpteen thousand internet posts I have read about Gaston Glock, and Glock, GmbH/Inc. 

Does a frame plug really speed up reloading? Well, some manufacturers of, 'hump-backed plugs' say so; but, again personally, I very much doubt it. Constant practice, an extended index finger, and proprioceptive muscle memory are what actually speed up magazine changes. A good pistolero is able to change magazines without even looking at the pistol. He will simply drop one magazine, and slam in another. No plug is going to change the physical mechanics of, 'wacking' a fresh magazine home. 

(OK, on a, 'bad day' I admit that I'll use my peripheral vision as I bring pistol and magazine together; BUT, when I'm hot I'll simply bring my hands together as quickly as I'm able. Again, no plug is going to speed this coupling process up. 'Why'? Because it's all in your hands and habitual muscle reflexes.) 



Two Other Things: Has anyone ever noticed how ridiculously easy it is to clean out that cavity underneath the backstrap? Whether or not there's a plug in place simply doesn't matter. In goes the Q-Tip, and out comes the dirt - Which, in my Glock pistols, has always been absolutely minimal (even after a 500 round day at the range)! 

As for the lanyard hole? Yes, I do believe a lanyard hole is part of the original military design. (The same thing goes for the U.S. military's 1911-A1, and 92-A1 pistols.) Are lanyard holes necessary on civilian pistols? No, not until the bad guys start lobbing hand grenades and mortar rounds they aren't. If Glock frames didn't have a, 'lanyard hole' most of us would have already found some other way to secure frame plugs in our Glocks. (Like on Glock's semi-compact pistol frames where compression fitting and silicone sealant is used, instead.)


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Okay.... Now I am starting to have second thoughts about my purchase. I am drawn to the gen4 G21 primarily for the rough texture on the grip. I have done a "rough" measurement and see no difference between the pull lengths of the gen4 G21 and the gen3 G21SF. I just came back from a gun shop where I checked this along with the feel of the gen4. For some reason, the full sized gen4's do feel better to me than the full sized gen3's. And it is due to that rough texture on the grip. My gen4 G22 feels great. But with the compacts (G19 and G23 specifically), I do like the gen3 feel.

This is nuts. I am seriously considering swapping my new G21SF for a gen4 G21. Am I crazy or have other people here gone down the same road?


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Glock Doctor said:


> Over the years I've participated in, at least, a dozen of these threads - All without any definitive conclusion having ever been reached.
> 
> Personally, I am convinced of two things: (1) More dirt gets into a Glock with an open frame hole than could ever - EVER - be held inside by using a plug. (2) The principal reason, 'Why' new Glock pistols always come with an open frame is (a.) Gaston's personality, and (b.) $$$$$. I base these conclusions on eleven years of carrying and using Glock pistols as well as the umpteen thousand internet posts I have read about Gaston Glock, and Glock, GmbH/Inc.
> 
> ...


I never bought into the grip plug being an aid to quick magazine replacement, either. I train with the gun in front of me just under my line of sight to the threat when I do tactical or full reloads from empty. Regarding the plug, I do think it finishes the gun nicely and does seem to help with the debris. They're cheap so nothing lost there.

The beauty of guns and people is everyone has their personal wants, needs, and requirements. This is why some folks like to modify their guns while others argue for leaving them like they came from the factory. My take is simple with this one.

Your property, your decision.


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## rustygun (Apr 8, 2013)

I love my Glock 21 gen 4. The only thing I changed was the sights I put on glock steel sights.[http://www.handgunforum.net/attachm...0193-new-addition-goes-bang-008.jpgATTACH]560[/ATTACH]


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

rustygun said:


> I love my Glock 21 gen 4. The only thing I changed was the sights I put on glock steel sights.
> View attachment 560


Yep. All of my carry and potential carry Glocks have Trijicon night sights. The OEM Glock sights don't allow enough light to show around the front sight through the rear notch.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

SouthernBoy said:


> Okay.... Now I am starting to have second thoughts about my purchase. I am drawn to the gen4 G21 primarily for the rough texture on the grip. I have done a "rough" measurement and see no difference between the pull lengths of the gen4 G21 and the gen3 G21SF. I just came back from a gun shop where I checked this along with the feel of the gen4. For some reason, the full sized gen4's do feel better to me than the full sized gen3's. And it is due to that rough texture on the grip. My gen4 G22 feels great. But with the compacts (G19 and G23 specifically), I do like the gen3 feel.
> 
> This is nuts. I am seriously considering swapping my new G21SF for a gen4 G21. Am I crazy or have other people here gone down the same road?


It's not crazy if it makes sense to you. Especially when you are grabbing/shooting a large gripped pistol, if you get noticeably better traction with the Gen4, then I'd get the Gen4.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

I put the grip cavity plugs in all my carry or competition Glocks. 

If you do the reload correctly, it doesn't make any difference at all.

But, if you botch a high-speed reload in a certain way (mag too far to the rear of the grip), the plug will help prevent the rim of the top round from snagging on the rear of the magwell. Yes, I've done it, both with and without the plug in place, and that's why all mine have plugs.

I also like the fact that it keeps blowing dust/debris/water/snow out of the cavity when I'm woodswalking/hiking/hunting.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

DJ Niner said:


> It's not crazy if it makes sense to you. Especially when you are grabbing/shooting a large gripped pistol, if you get noticeably better traction with the Gen4, then I'd get the Gen4.


Thanks, Niner. I appreciate the vote of confidence.

While I can't explain the difference in the feel that the gen4 G21 has over the gen4 G21SF, I know the rough texture is a big part of this. However, I believe the actual shape (contour) of the backstrap on the gen4 is slightly different than that of the gen3 and that, coupled with the texture and the fact that these two guns seem to have the same pull length, appears to make the gen4 G21 better for my hands; which are somewhat on the small side. I'm going to go by a different gun shop this morning to compare the two and try to come to some sort of a decision. There are a few other factors involved in this which I have not outlined, but we'll see how it comes out.

This is unusual for me since I tend to do quite a bit of research before I buy a gun. Granted, I have made some spot purchases in the past but those have all panned out in my favor. With this one, I never found a G21SF at any gun stores in my area to handle so one of them offered to get one in for me. I suppose that was my mistake... should have waited for a major gun show and gone there where I could have handled both at the same table. But what is done is done and there's no sense in holding on to something because you are afraid to admit you erred. I have made no mods on the G21SF yet so it is virgin.

I mentioned in a previous paragraph that there were a few other factors of concern. One is the magazine catch. It is hell to release with one thumb. I have never seen this on a Glock. Most always I don't use it, preferring instead the sling shot method. But for strong hand weak hand drills, you have to use the catch. I have not closely examined the catch or slide lock indent to see where the problem lies at this point. Another thing is the RSA. When you remove the slide, it is already loose from the barrel. Clearly this is hitting something as you move the slide forward on the frame... probably the slide lock hits the end of the RSA that sits in the barrel lug.

Anyway, I'm still bummed out about all of this. I know I'll loose some money but in the scheme of things, that's not that important. What _is_ important is being satisfied with your decision and your purchase. And that I am not at the present time.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

DJ Niner said:


> I put the grip cavity plugs in all my carry or competition Glocks.
> 
> If you do the reload correctly, it doesn't make any difference at all.
> 
> ...


All but one of my Glocks have the grip plug installed, not counting this new G21SF. The one that is missing it is my gen4 G22, however I ordered one several days ago for that gun.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

SouthernBoy said:


> Okay.... Now I am starting to have second thoughts about my purchase. I am drawn to the gen4 G21 primarily for the rough texture on the grip. I have done a "rough" measurement and see no difference between the pull lengths of the gen4 G21 and the gen3 G21SF. I just came back from a gun shop where I checked this along with the feel of the gen4. For some reason, the full sized gen4's do feel better to me than the full sized gen3's. And it is due to that rough texture on the grip. My gen4 G22 feels great. But with the compacts (G19 and G23 specifically), I do like the gen3 feel.
> 
> This is nuts. I am seriously considering swapping my new G21SF for a gen4 G21. Am I crazy or have other people here gone down the same road?


Have you shot the new glock yet?
I agree that if you are not happy, get the Glock you want. 
Little bit of extra money. No big deal. Buy until your happy. The money will soon be forgotten, but you will have the gun you want for years to come. good luck


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

The gen 4 frame of the large frame flocks, without the additional back straps, is the size of the gen 3 SF. That is the design. This was explained at Glock Armorer's class two years ago


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

A thought, there are many who prefer the gen 3, but have a Gen 4. Gun fors often have "trade for" ads posted....


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

pic said:


> Have you shot the new glock yet?
> I agree that if you are not happy, get the Glock you want.
> Little bit of extra money. No big deal. Buy until your happy. The money will soon be forgotten, but you will have the gun you want for years to come. good luck


No I haven't. But with me, a great deal of what I need to know about a firearm is answered just by handling it. If it doesn't fit right, if you have to fidget or mess with it to get a good hold, then something's not right about it and I will never been entirely pleased with it. You are correct in the fact that the costs will soon be forgotten if you are pleased and satisfied with your decision.



niadhf said:


> The gen 4 frame of the large frame flocks, without the additional back straps, is the size of the gen 3 SF. That is the design. This was explained at Glock Armorer's class two years ago


I heard that and judging from what I have seen, I believe it to be so. In fact, the gen4 G21's I have handled actually felt a slight bit slimmer and shorted in the grip and pull length. This could be totally my imagination or perception.



niadhf said:


> A thought, there are many who prefer the gen 3, but have a Gen 4. Gun fors often have "trade for" ads posted....


The gun shop I will be going to this morning is one of the best in my area and offers consignment sales for people. The owner is a straight up man. I tend to be pretty particular in my choices so as for gen3's vs gen4's, I handle this on a case by case basis. I mentioned earlier that I like my gen3 compacts (G19 and G23's), but prefer the gen4 in the full size versions. I really like the way my gen4 G22 feels in my hands.

Gentlemen, thanks so much for your input and encouragement with this. I know it's not the end of the world, but decisions like this can be agonizing to take.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

niadhf said:


> The gen 4 frame of the large frame flocks, without the additional back straps, is the size of the gen 3 SF. That is the design. This was explained at Glock Armorer's class two years ago


Yup! :smt023



SouthernBoy said:


> Okay.... Now I am starting to have second thoughts about my purchase. I am drawn to the gen4 G21 primarily for the rough texture on the grip. I have done a "rough" measurement and see no difference between the pull lengths of the gen4 G21 and the gen3 G21SF. I just came back from a gun shop where I checked this along with the feel of the gen4. *For some reason, the full sized gen4's do feel better to me than the full sized gen3's*. And it is due to that rough texture on the grip. My gen4 G22 feels great. But with the compacts (G19 and G23 specifically), I do like the gen3 feel.
> 
> This is nuts. I am seriously considering swapping my new G21SF for a gen4 G21. Am I crazy or have other people here gone down the same road?


On the Model 21: The Gen4 frame is about 1/16th of an inch shorter in the length of trigger pull than a standard 3rd generation frame. One of the reasons I, personally, would never choose a Gen4 is because I strongly prefer to use Wolff Gunsprings' steel recoil guide rods in order to dampen recoil and reduce frame vibration. If you look, closely, at the pictures I posted you'll see where I've had my frames stippled underneath my thumb and around the web of my hand. Whether it's done consciously, or not, THIS is one of the two most important frame areas a savvy shooter controls his pistol from!

I'm older; my hands are sensitive to recoil; and a comfortable grip on a pistol's frame is very important to me. How the frame's side panels are textured really shouldn't matter. It's how the pistol feels from front-to-back, and how it feels along the web of your hand and under your thumb that's really important.

I still run a pistol (rather well) by primarily holding it along both of the frame's front and backstraps. Secondarily, I apply additional control by using the web of my gun hand and my thumb in order to direct the force of recoil away from *the tips of the fingers on my grasping gun hand*. I've found that there's one point ('the magic spot') :mrgreen: on every semi-auto's backstrap that will control most of the gun and hold the muzzle where you want it to be as the pistol discharges - This has NOTHING to do with the frame's side panels!

For whatever it's worth ALL of my Glocks are fitted with Hogue, 'Handall' rubber sleeves. I love 'um, and wouldn't own a Glock without a Hogue, 'Handall' on it; but, again, the hand pressure is, primarily, from front-to-back.

Amazon.com: Hogue Rubber Grip Handall Full Size Grip Sleeve: Sports & Outdoors










Hope this helps. :smt002


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Glock Doctor;

How a handgun sits and feels in your hand is absolutely critical in how you will run that gun and how accurate your fire will be. I am also getting up there in age (less than three months to 68). I am not sensitive to recoil but I do have medium-small hands and my fingers are not what you would call long by any stretch. So the way a gun sits in my hand, especially right from pickup or draw, is critical to my success and my liking that gun.

I have tried rubberized grip wraps in the past and don't care for them. The reason is they tend to grab shirts or jacket linings and that could be disastrous in an extreme encounter. So all of my carry guns have material on their grips that is not prone to that.

Everyone has their own little quirks about this or that and guns are no different. I do value everything you have posted here and welcome continued thoughts.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

SouthernBoy said:


> Glock Doctor, .......
> Everyone has their own little quirks about this or that and guns are no different. I do value everything you have posted here and welcome continued thoughts.


OK, one last reply and I'm done for the day: If your hand is medium-sized and your fingers not too long then you're going to have a tough time taking up the front end trigger slack on a G-21. (Your best shooting is going to be from the reset position.)

I have the same problem. When the trigger is in the full forward position the trigger's face extends just past my distal joint; and I have to stretch my finger and initially grab the trigger with the outer edge of the pad. (Not an ideal way to grab a trigger; but, as my Marine Corps uncles taught me to, I have learned to adapt to the gun rather than the other way around.)

What grip to use on a Glock has been, something of, an odyssey for me. It's safe to say that I've tried them all. In the beginning I covered Glock's slippery side panels with homemade skateboard tape. I used this stuff for a couple of years until: (1) I ruined the inside liner on my M-65 field jacket by rubbing it almost bare; and (2) I realized that I was gaining next-to-nothing by covering the sides of Glock's grip panels. Like this -

http://imageshack.us/a/img109/6361/wle2.jpg

I've got you by 2 and a half years; but I've lived a very physical life; and I'm presently carrying all of the cumulative, 'wear and tear' around with me. There's a lot of things I don't, and never will, know; but how to fight and how to use a gun (or a knife) are not among them. That is, I suppose, 'Why' I gravitate towards these forums - Which I will admit are never quite what they should be; but, then again and as I've learned, neither are many of today's people.

Thank you for the compliment. I, also, enjoy reading what you have to say and will continue to look for your replies.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Glock Doctor said:


> OK, one last reply and I'm done for the day: If your hand is medium-sized and your fingers not too long then you're going to have a tough time taking up the front end trigger slack on a G-21. (Your best shooting is going to be from the reset position.)
> 
> I have the same problem. When the trigger is in the full forward position the trigger's face extends just past my distal joint; and I have to stretch my finger and initially grab the trigger with the outer edge of the pad. (Not an ideal way to grab a trigger; but, as my Marine Corps uncles taught me to, I have learned to adapt to the gun rather than the other way around.)
> 
> ...


Thank you, sir.

The gen4 G21 fits my hand very well. I can easily reach the trigger in my normal fashion. Of course, the proof is going to be the range and how it stacks up there. I have also changed my hold (very little) and stance (quite a bit) when shooting handguns.... and some long guns for that matter. Just goes to show we are never too old to learn new things. When someone scoffs at that, I know I'm probably looking at and/or listening to a fool.

As for websites, some are good and some are.... well, less than civil. Those are the ones I don't care for. This one's a good one. Lots of good people here with lots of knowledge to offer.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

This is a very nice , informative forum.
I can't begin to name names of all the informative expertise individuals .
Mr. Glock Doctor included.
Thanks for putting down your anchor and sharing, here at the forum.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Well I went to two gun shops this morning and the second one was the I went to yesterday afternoon which I mentioned in post #10. They still had the gen4 G21 I handled yesterday and it has a very good out of the box trigger for a gen4. Was able to compare my G21SF directly against the gen4 G21 and the feel of the latter is definitely better for me. So I bought it. The owner and I discussed selling my G21SF on consignment and his take is low so this evening I went back and set that up.

So it's done. And I am happy. Today my 3.5 Glock connector and 6 pound trigger spring came in the mail so I will probably install those tomorrow morning. Whether or not I do a polishing job remains to be seen... the stock trigger is really pretty decent. Nice break with no mush and no serious travel after the break.


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

SouthernBoy said:


> Glock Doctor;
> 
> How a handgun sits and feels in your hand is absolutely critical in how you will run that gun and how accurate your fire will be. I am also getting up there in age (less than three months to 68). I am not sensitive to recoil but I do have medium-small hands and my fingers are not what you would call long by any stretch. So the way a gun sits in my hand, especially right from pickup or draw, is critical to my success and my liking that gun.
> 
> ...


Yep. Small handguns, handball JR size I will use over grips on. But what I DO like on Gen 3 flocks is A-grips. And comfortable, mon-granny to carry.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

This morning I spent around an hour trying some different configurations with the trigger on my new gen4 G21. Out of the box, this G21 has the best trigger of any factory stock gen4 Glock I have handled. The best trigger feel, best and most crisp break, and least amount of over travel. But good things can always be improved upon.... well usually, so here goes.

I tried four different configurations: OEM trigger spring and dot connnector (as shipped), factory trigger spring with Glock 3.5 connector, 6 pound spring (GlockParts.com uses Wolf springs) with Glock 3.5 connector, and 6 pound spring with dot connector. Overall the best feeling configuration, which surprised me, was the factory trigger spring and the Glock 3.5 connector. I wasn't expecting that. The drop in trigger pull weight from completely stock was 15 ounces to one pound. The trigger is now coming in at between 5 pounds 7 ounces and 5 pounds 8 ounces. But frankly, it feels lighter than that.

I am betting the Wolf trigger spring is not nearly as strong as the 6 pound trigger springs that GlockParts used to ship. Either that or wolf springs are lighter. I say this because in my other Glocks where I have made these mods, the 6 pound trigger spring makes a noticeable difference. And with gen4 versions there are other factors which make it noticeable as well.

This weekend I'll polish all of the internal contacting metal parts and see how it winds up. Chances are the weight probably won't drop more than maybe 3 ounces, but it will make a really good Glock carry trigger even better. This gun is a keeper.

Oh and in a week or so, I'll replace the sights with a set of Trijicon night sights, model GL04. I have these sights (GL01 for the compacts and G22) on five of my other Glocks and they really work great for me. They are low profile and snag free and the front blade allows more light around it for the rear notch. Better sight alignment and hold. And at night the lamps are just bright enough to allow your to get on your target.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

I've got 6# Wolff trigger (return) springs in both of my 3rd generation G-21's. I use Wolff 6# striker springs, too. I'm using both an early production Lone Wolf, '3.5#' connector; and a, '3.5#' factory connector. The internal parts are all mirror-polished; and the trigger pulls range from 4.9 to 5.2#'s when measured from the middle of the trigger's face. I'm using permanently-fixed, LWD, trigger stops, too; and my triggers come to a, 'dead stop' after releasing the striker, and just before going into reset. (As another instructor found out, last night, my G-21's are both very smooth, very quick pistols!)

I, also, have it on good authority from Dave Koebensky at Wolff Gunsprings that it's not a good idea to go heavier than 6# on the trigger (return) spring. There is a subtle relationship among the: recoil, trigger, and striker springs on a Glock. (They, all, pull against each other.) Going too heavy on the trigger spring can significantly reduce the battery lockup strength on what is already a very loosely locking pistol.

LWD's, 'Glock Ultimate Trigger Stop' (GUTS), 
http://imageshack.us/a/img18/2291/60ts.jpg

Permanently epoxied stop setscrew (viewed from side), 
http://imageshack.us/a/img13/2810/he61.jpg 
http://imageshack.us/a/img812/5160/o5ko.jpg

Permanently epoxied stop setscrew (viewed from rear),

http://imageshack.us/a/img440/8616/jwr2.jpg


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Glock Doctor said:


> I've got 6# Wolff trigger (return) springs in both of my 3rd generation G-21's. I use Wolff 6# striker springs, too. I'm using both an early production Lone Wolf, '3.5#' connector; and a, '3.5#' factory connector. The internal parts are all mirror-polished; and the trigger pulls range from 4.9 to 5.2#'s when measured from the middle of the trigger's face. I'm using permanently-fixed, LWD, trigger stops, too; and my triggers come to a, 'dead stop' after releasing the striker, and just before going into reset. (As another instructor found out, last night, my G-21's are both very smooth, very quick pistols!)
> 
> *I, also, have it on good authority from Dave Koebensky at Wolff Gunsprings that it's not a good idea to go heavier than 6# on the trigger (return) spring. There is a subtle relationship among the: recoil, trigger, and striker springs on a Glock. (They, all, pull against each other.) Going too heavy on the trigger spring can significantly reduce the battery lockup strength on what is already a very loosely locking pistol. *
> 
> ...


This is especially true with gen4 Glocks as I have seen already. I bought a gen4 G22 earlier this year and love it. When I was doing some of my usual mods, as I mentioned above, I found that the combination of the 6 pound trigger spring and the Glock 3.5 connector caused the trigger to hang for a second or two after reset if you eased your finger forward. This kept the trigger safety from engaging as well. What I did to eliminate this was to do another polishing job (I like to take this to a mirror like finish on the internals). Specifically what caused this was the little bump, or protrusion, on the outside of the trigger bar safety block cam.

This little protrusion, or bump, rides against the inside of the right slide rail, which is the rail that depresses the connector. This causes some added friction and resistance to the trigger and combined with the 6 pound trigger spring and the lighter connector, creates enough resistance to effect the return of the trigger to its fully forward position. I did not see this with my new gen4 G21 the other day when I was testing various trigger configurations.

As for striker springs, I never touch those. A gunsmith changed mine once in my primary carry gen3 G23, when I didn't know that much about tuning them myself. He put in a Wolf 4 pound striker spring and some other mods, which I don't quite recall, to get to a 3 1/2 pound trigger. I didn't like that one bit on a carry gun and specifically told him not to alter the striker spring. I had it changed that same day by a Glock armorer to the stock striker spring.

My primary carry Glock and a few of my other main Glocks subject to carry have really good triggers for my purposes. They all come in at right around 5 pounds, with two of them (my two gen3 G23's) hitting just under 5 pounds. That's good for a carry gun for me and fits my needs just fine.

I mentioned in a recent post that my new gen4 G21 feels lighter than what it measures and it does. Can't explain it at all and I suspect when I detail strip it for polishing today, it will really smooth out and feel great.


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