# P99 Quality?



## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

First post here, new to the board, great site you guys have!


I'm intrested in a P99 AS (9mm). I hadn't really even paid attention to the Walther until I heard about the AS trigger. I'm a very happy USP owner and am looking for a 9mm for cheaper fun shooting. My only gripe with the USP is that I'd like a quicker trigger reset, an from what I've been reading the AS may be the ticket for me. I haven't fired one yet, or even felt the trigger, but I'll be doing that soon.

Right now I've been doing a lot of internet research. From what I've seen about every owner seems really happy with thiers. Searched through seven pages here with no mention of reliability problems or poor quality (except for one with .40 mag problems). The internet is great for isolated problems getting blown way out of porportion until somthing has a bad reputation, but I'm not seeing any problems.

Here's where I'm confused. A local gun shop owner has a real bad opinion on the Walther. I've also heard a few people at the range with a bad opinion on Walther....so far none of them actual Walther owners. I also haven't heard any specifics as to why I shouldn't buy it, usually just broad comments. I can't really give to much credit to these opinions, but I have to ask why? Do you guys have any clue as to what could send that impression out? I'm not familiar with the history of Walther, so is there somthing in the past that has given this gun a bad rap with some?

It's obvious around here the Walther is held in high regard, so I thought I'd ask you guys for some insight.

And a second question from an almost buyer, is there any difference in the S&W anymore? I've read about the German markings but is any of that still relevant or is a new Smith the same as a new Walther? The local gun shop says he can get the Smith cheaper, an if they're the same.....

Thanks in advance for the help guys. Hold my hand a little....no, twist my arm an help my rationalize what I really want to do.:mrgreen:


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## Spenser (Nov 6, 2006)

Ship has a pretty good idea of the differences between the Smith and the Walther. He owns both. I think the resale on the Walther will be better.

As a former P99 owner, I have to say that I like the gun quite a bit. It fits the hand well. The only problem I ever had with the thing was the first 50 rounds it jammed a bit. After that, no problems at all.

I did have an issue with the rear sight losing its spring pin and falling off. A squirt of lock-tite would have prevented that, and it's a good idea for sights, period. I can't really fault the gun for that one.

The re-set on the AS trigger is pretty neat. I think it beats the Glock re-set. 

It's awfully accurate.

I think some dislike Walthers because of the PPK, which some feel is a jam-o-matic. I haven't found that to be the case, but most I've come across that hate Walthers do so because of the PPK series.

You'll be perfectly ecstatic with your P99.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Here is a good thread that shows how others get pushed away from the Walther by store people:

http://www.waltherforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=4099

As for the gun itself - it is my all time fav. Never a problem w/ it. People that don't like it just have their own agenda, or say it because someone else told them something neg, and they just keep repeating it.

The P99s are made in germany, but have S&W stamped on the slide because US law states that the importer must be listed on the gun. In this case, Walther doesn't have a shop set up here in the states - they let S&W do the importing for them

They also let S&W make a clone. Walther makes the frame, and S&W makes the top part on this clone. I have a SW99 - its basically a clone of the P99 A/S. They discontinued making the SW99 at the end of 2005, but U can still find new ones on shelves occassionally. Now, they only make the SW990L - which is their version of the P99 QA.

I personally don't like the QA trigger. 90% of P99 fans love the gun because of the A/S trigger.

I did buy a SW99 in 2005 because I couldn't find a fullsize A/S at the time. The S&W version is a great gun. I just also wanted the Walther because I thought it looked kewler, and it was the original. But, I like both guns equally well. And, the S&W version won't let ya down either


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## uncut (May 6, 2006)

I have to say one thing...
I more and more hear people at HKpro make positive comments on the P99...
IMHO it is the most underrated gun at this time....
Keep in mind the P99 should not be compared to the USP but to the P2000
The USP was built for the military and not the police ... and only here in the US is the USP or USPc used in the law enforcement.....
The P99 has the same high quality standards as any H&K... they are all getting put up for police trials in Germany and have to pass the same "torture tests"...
As you mentioned there has been issues with the 10 round .40S&W mag.. that has been addressed and also it is not a problem on the 12 rounders...
It was the polymer on the 10 round mags that gave away.....
parts/mags are just as expensive than for H&K's...
I would stick with the 9mm/AS trigger if you are looking for a short rest....

*edit.... All P99 are German made... like Shipwreck said S&W is only the importer ... that said there was about 5000 early model P99 in .40S&W that had a S&W slide and barrel but I doubt that it even would make a difference....


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## 10mm Sonny (Jan 5, 2007)

Highside said:


> Here's where I'm confused. A local gun shop owner has a real bad opinion on the Walther. I've also heard a few people at the range with a bad opinion on Walther....so far none of them actual Walther owners. I also haven't heard any specifics as to why I shouldn't buy it, usually just broad comments. I can't really give to much credit to these opinions, but I have to ask why?


Reminds me of the time I drove my Corvette through Boulder Colorado last summer. (I swear, there is nothing but Subarus in that hippie infested town nowdays.) So I stop at a gas station, and while I'm filling up, this girl (who got out of a Subaru) starts yelling at me for destroying her enviorment with my *****-ego gas guzzler. She's just ranting at me and I'm looking around to see if I'm on Candid Camera or something. The I finally interupt her and say "32."
She stops, ans says "What?"
"More or less than 32."
"What?"
"Does your Subaru get more or less than 32 miles per gallon? Because that's what my Corvette averages on the highway."
That got her to shup up.

Moral of my story... People that critcize something usually don't have the facts.


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## Baldy (Jun 21, 2006)

Well if I am thinking of getting a gun I know nothing about I am going to talk to a lot of people who own one. If they are having a problem they'll tell you in a heart beat. Most will give you the plus or minus of the gun. Good luck.


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## jenglish (Dec 29, 2006)

Walther is of the highest quality and as Uncut said, it is one of the most under rated guns of all time. I have carried the P99 for the past five years in my work without a single problem in reliability or function. I have had one stoppage ever and that was on the fault of the ammunition (the mouth of the round casing was very flared out). I and others in my protection team think so highly of the P99 that this last month, all ten of our team members converted to the P99.

Most of the time, when shop owner put down the P99 in favor of another brand or model it simply is that they are trying to push what they stock. That and most shop employees no less then they are willing to admit to, using rumor and misinformation as fact.

The P99 is a very high quality and reliable pistol, and I count on it every day to protect my life and others. I would highly recommend it.


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

*Thanks Guys*

Until someone gives me some concrete evidence that all of you guys are in on a big scam from Walther I think I'm convinced :mrgreen:

Shipwreck- great link, really sums up some of my experiences so far.

Uncut- I lurk over at HKpro sometimes an after reading your post I went over an did a search for the P99. Now HKpro is a great resource, but almost every gun comparison will have at least someone animate about why HK offers somthing better than a comparable Sig, Glock or whatever (which are fine firearms if they suit you). Again I didn't find any negatives towards the P99. I think my impression is building as much by what I DON'T hear as what I do.

10MM- You get 32 mpg? Heck I've owned motorcycles that don't get that!:mrgreen: Humorous story, but a great point and I think very relevant here. I'd like to hear what some of the people with negative thoughts on the Walther base it on....and I still haven't heard anything real.

Like many of you have said, I'm starting to think the P99 is one of the best kept secrets in handguns. It seems to have so many of the positives I like about my HK, but improved trigger. I didn't even know until researching this that anyone one else had a mag release like the HK, I fell in love with that from day one, first time I picked up the gun it just seemed natural to use my trigger finger to drop the mag. I just don't see a down side yet.

So logically my mind is made up. Next step I need to find one I can look at an put in my hand, and feel the trigger. If it passes those tests I'm sold.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Highside said:


> So logically my mind is made up. Next step I need to find one I can look at an put in my hand, and feel the trigger. If it passes those tests I'm sold.


Come to Texas - U can try mine :supz: :supz: :supz: :supz: :supz:


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

Shipwreck said:


> Come to Texas - U can try mine :supz: :supz: :supz: :supz: :supz:


I suppose I should fill out my profile, I live in Kalifornia, otherwise I'd be all over an offer like that.:smt023

I love trading guns at the local ranges an trying new stuff, just haven't seen the P99 yet!


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## jason0007 (Nov 21, 2006)

i think there is tremendous bias against foreign-made pistols by gun shop owners in america....i mean how can you go wrong with a german made pistol like a walther...the germans make great inventions and products (ie bmw)..they pay attention to every minute details in their products that american guns seem to lack..in my opinion. Even when i bought my beretta 92fs from a local gun shop...the guy told me the ITALIAN made gun was much better than the american made one.. go figure..and he's american. So i got the ITALIAN BERETTA ..for both my px4 and 92fs. 

but in reality, i think the reason most gun dealers try to sway you from a walther is because they don't seem to know much about it for various reasons..maybe in part due to walther's lack of advertisement and name popularity in america or just that they are NOT selling walther guns as opposed to the glocks and sigs..(by the way another GERMAN made pistol..hmmmmm....)

personally, i have no bias agains american or foreign made guns..like i said..i own italian berettas, german walther p99 AS, and even a glock 19..
they all have their strengths and weaknesses on some level..but i get a lot of good impressions from the beretta and walther...the glock i tend to shoot low so far..not enough practice yet..

if you buy a walther....i just did ...p99as...you will not go wrong.... i love it already.


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## uncut (May 6, 2006)

FWIW
there is some guy over at the Glocktalk forum that here and there pops up with the same old story about the P99 being a crappy gun.... (I think the claims that the P99 went full auto on him...)
and then there is that funky picture of a P99 .40S&W having the frame broke... might want to google for this one,....or somebody might remeber where this one came from....
It was posted on the Waltherforums.com and the overall impression by everybody was that it wasn't a kaboom but somebody broke the frame intentionally....


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## aurora (Jan 21, 2007)

I have a new p99c QA that is outstanding. I bought it a few weeks ago and put 400 rounds thru it flawlessly. The only complaint I have is it appears there is very slight wear on the barrel, when the action is closed you can see where it has been rubbed faintly by the slide. I thought that maybe was a little too soon to show wear like that on a new gun. Other than that I really enjoy this gun. You will be happy with its performance.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

aurora said:


> I have a new p99c QA that is outstanding. I bought it a few weeks ago and put 400 rounds thru it flawlessly. The only complaint I have is it appears there is very slight wear on the barrel, when the action is closed you can see where it has been rubbed faintly by the slide. I thought that maybe was a little too soon to show wear like that on a new gun. Other than that I really enjoy this gun. You will be happy with its performance.


ALL semi autos get that wear. The barrel rubs the slide in certain areas. Glock, HK, etc. They are all gonna do that.

The tennifer is actually into the metal - so, U are still protected. That's just cosmetic.

Everyone here knows I am super anal retentive about the finish of my guns. I take extra care about stratching the slide and frame. There is NOTHING U can do about that on the barrel except not using the thing...


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## jason0007 (Nov 21, 2006)

so how would u go about covering up a scratch or a part of the slide or frame where the paint has worn off??


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

jason0007 said:


> so how would u go about covering up a scratch or a part of the slide or frame where the paint has worn off??


Refinishing - I hard chromed my P99 slides. U can get them duracoated for less... I do not think Walther reblackens the tennifer slides like Glock does for $45.

NP3, Black T and Rouguard anre other options...


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

These guns are hard to find around here.

After calling a couple of gun shops to see if they had one in stock to check out it became clear that this was going to take some effort. Seems California is in short supply right now, because of our ten round limit on mags the supply of new guns can sometimes be far different than for the rest of the free states. You'd think they could just swap mags but for some reason it's not that easy (I even contacted Buds an some other internet gun stores an they wouldn't do it). I called over 20 shops within 100 miles and all anyone had was the QA, and after checking each told me there were none available at the distributer with no ETA on availability, and apparently has been that way for some time.

It's rough in CA sometimes, I also get jealous on the low prices everyone out of state talks about. I often see guns OVER retail/list, an a good deal is often only $20-$40 under.

So I finally call a shop I forgot about an hour away from me. They had a P99 AS in stock.....I even asked twice to make sure it was an AS and not a QA. So I think I'll check it out this Saturday. Then I think more an more, what if it's gone by then......I had such a hard time locating just this one. So I did the only logical thing and drove down to see it after work today, in commute traffic, add 2 hours time.

Finally was able to hold one an check out the trigger. Seemed a bit on the small side, not bad, just smaller than I'm used to. It was an '06 frame. Of course I could always put the larger backstrap on. Next the trigger, after dry firing an trying it in all three modes I'm impressed. The DA seemed smoother than my well worn USP (of course that's pretty heavy by comparison) The long single action was intresting, I don't think I'd use it in this mode much, but a nice option to try out and see. The short SA was a fine pull, but most importantly (to me) the trigger reset did seem better than what I'm used to in other DA/SA guns.

So once again I did the only logical thing an bought it :mrgreen: 

Around here we have to wait ten days for a gun purchase so they can make sure I'm not crazy, at least not on paper. I pick it up a week from monday, so it'll be probably two weeks until I shoot it, an I'll be sure to report back.

It was a bit of an impulse buy, but you guys helped give me the confidence in what I did. Besides impulsive can be fun when it comes to buying guns :mrgreen:


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Good luck - if U can't get one locally - U may have to buy from Bud's Guns - 2 or 3 people here bought P99s that way this month.

The trigger smooths out after 500 rounds or so. So, if ya like it now - wait until later.


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## jason0007 (Nov 21, 2006)

i know the feeling you have...right before deciding to purchase a new gun...
lots of time, my impatience get the best of me i do things like buying it more expensive than i should..

btw ..in cali u are allowed to buy only 1 gun per month i believe........sucks huh..


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

jason0007 said:


> lots of time, my impatience get the best of me i do things like buying it more expensive than i should..
> 
> .


 I wouldn't worry about that to much. I mean really, quite often the difference between a good deal and paying to much is the same as what you might pay for ammo on a good days shooting. So in the big picture does it really matter, if you're happy with what you got?

Of course I use this same logic to buy about whatever I want.:mrgreen:

That's one of the main reasons I bought a 9mm. I'm more of a .45 guy ( and magnum revolvers) but I can have fun shooting 9mm just as much and in bulk I can buy almost twice the ammo for the same money. That's where it gets expensive for me, the ammo not the gun.

Yeah we got some stupid rules, but the one a month doesn't bother me to much as I can't afford more than one gun a month anyway. Although I have been known to make another purchase right after 30 days.


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## A_J (May 22, 2006)

Highside - 

I too went from a USP to a P99, I have found the P99 easier to shoot well (for me at least) and more ergonomic. Don't get me wrong, I love HKs, but the P99 just works better for me. It just took me getting used to not having a manual safety.

I suspect that much of what you may hear at the gunshop is based on P22's - those have indeed had some QC issues, and around here at least, the P22s seem to sell waaay more than P99s.

My two P99s (std AS, and AS Compact) have had zero issues :mrgreen:


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## Cobra64 (Jan 20, 2007)

Highside said:


> First post here, new to the board, great site you guys have!
> 
> I'm intrested in a P99 AS (9mm). I hadn't really even paid attention to the Walther until I heard about the AS trigger. I'm a very happy USP owner and am looking for a 9mm for cheaper fun shooting. My only gripe with the USP is that I'd like a quicker trigger reset, an from what I've been reading the AS may be the ticket for me. I haven't fired one yet, or even felt the trigger, but I'll be doing that soon.
> 
> ...


What you heard was probably due to the reputation of the PPK and PPK/S being jamm-o-matics. The P99 is a great gun.


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## dood (Jan 15, 2007)

Hey, Highside is in Tracy....Tracy's PD uses our police software....Highside should move. :smt082


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## mw1311 (Feb 7, 2007)

did you get it yet?


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

mw1311 said:


> did you get it yet?


Yep.

Due to our waiting period I wasn't able to pick it up until last Monday, and my first chance to shoot it will be tommorow (Saturday). I've had plenty of time to practice with the trigger an get a feel for it, it's already getting smoother. This gun is the easiest I've owned to take down as well, so besides it's initial cleaning I can't help but peek inside now an then :mrgreen:

I usually go to the mountains to shoot, as I don't have to worry about any rapid fire range rules and I can really put a gun through it's paces, but weather looks ugly so it'll be a trip to one of the local ranges instead. On the bright side ammo will last longer.


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## uncut (May 6, 2006)

Good deal....
welcome to the P99 ownership....
range isn't bad, you can find out how accurate your P99 is


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

*First Range Report*

The mountains were not going to happen today, so I went to a nice outdoor range with covered shooting.

Went through 700 rounds of 9mm (an 100 .45 for comparison) so I think I got a good enough feel for a first impression. First off, no failures of any kind, so that's a good start. By the end of the day the trigger was smoother an I was tired.:mrgreen:

From the first few shots the gun grouped well for me. It's easy to say the gun shoots better than I do. I shot at 15 yards for most of the day and my groups look as good as I ever shoot. My average groups were around 4"-5", if I shot faster they opened up some and if I went for bullseye I could get shots within 2" but always a few out of 10 rounds that opened up the group, that was my inconsistency....not the gun, and I knew it. I was shooting consistently high so I changed the front sight and that brought it in.

One of the main selling points of this gun for me is the trigger reset, which is awesome. Shooting it side by side with my USP it now seemed the .45 reset was a mile long. No rapid fire allowed at the range, but I did manage to sneak in a few doubletaps when it was busy, and am VERY happy with the speed of follow up shots. About the only auto I shoot better with is a good 1911, but as far as DA/SA autos go this gun is by far my new favorite. Even more than my (gasp) HK USP.

Ergos seemed great for me with the standard backstrap, and recoil is plenty manageable.

Like usual while at the range I did some gun swapping. I read all these stories on here of converting Glock guys an I saw it firsthand today. Two glock enthusiasts tried the AS trigger for the first time today and both had a priceless look on thier face immediately, followed by a "Nicccccce". Even a 1911 guy said it was the best plastic he's shot yet.....I took that as a compliment.

So I'm a believer. This gun IS the best kept secret in the firearms world. Hopefully the weather will allow me to get in the mountains next weekend so I can really play hard. I fully expect good things.


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## jenglish (Dec 29, 2006)

Welcome to the club! Now you know first hand what we are talking about . . . :smt023


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

*Second Range Trip*

I didn't have time to spend a whole day shooting today, but I couldn't wait another week to shoot my new toy again, so I did a quick trip to a different range today.

Shot a bit over 300 rounds and I purposely didin't clean the gun from yesterday to see if it would fail. No failures. That makes the first 1000 rounds trouble free with no cleaning, shooting WWB which is not exactly the cleanest ammo.

Being more familiar with the gun now and starting relaxed the groups were a bit better today, still not match quality but I'm happy with it for my skill level with autos. I shot it at 7 yards for the first time an couldn't have been happier. I had a number of 5 shot groups with all the shots touching each other, the best just under an inch, measuring centerline it would have been a 5/8s group, plenty happy with that. I also played with the double action at 7 yards shooting fast. They don't allow drawing at the range, but pulling the gun up for a quick sight picture an fire the results were plenty adequate for anything I'd need double action for.

I found myself pushing the 1 shot per second rule quite a bit, even got talked to once :smt083 oops! but I don't buy autos for shooting slow, I have revolvers fror that :mrgreen: I can't wait to shoot this thing in the woods!!!


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

:smt023 :smt023 :smt023 :smt023 :smt023 :smt023 

U da man :smt023


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## uncut (May 6, 2006)

Good lord, do I love my range...
they can't tell you how fast you can shoot your semi, if next line over is a guy with a auto Tommy gun


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## Highside (Jan 20, 2007)

uncut said:


> Good lord, do I love my range...
> they can't tell you how fast you can shoot your semi, if next line over is a guy with a auto Tommy gun


That sounds like my kinda place!

The indoor ranges might be different, but I prefer to be outside and none of the outdoor ranges around here allow rapid fire. Generally 1 shot per second is max allowed. Seems to be the norm. You can shoot rapid fire in competitions, but how are ya supposed to practice?? To be fair, I understand they have to dumb it down to the lowest common denominator for liability reasons, I'm still amazed at how many bullet holes I can see in the shelter above the benches from guns goinf off during recoil otr somthing even more stupid. Lots of yahoos use the range to.

Luckily I can be in the Sierras in a bit over an hour where I can do whatever I want, within the law of course. Since I'm a bit of a mountain man anyway that's where I enjoy shooting the most. I'll have to do a P99 Mountain report soon! :smt023


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## mw1311 (Feb 7, 2007)

Highside said:


> I'll have to do a P99 Mountain report soon! :smt023


A+ :supz:


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## uncut (May 6, 2006)

This is @ my indoor range.....


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## Guest (Feb 12, 2007)

I hate indoor places that limit shooting speed. I normally prefer outdoors anyways, unless poor weather occurs.


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