# So the Mrs. feels we're under gunned - really???



## MaxResponse (Jan 27, 2014)

All,
So my wife says to me a few days ago, "Do you feel we have armed ourselves well enough in the event of an attempted home invasion?" With my response, I asked her why the doubt when we have three loaded pistols within feet of our reach, we have a response plan in place, Gorilla door braces on all three exterior door that open into the house, a safe room of sorts that contains extra ammo and escape route to exit the house. I thought we had all the bases covered.
It seems that over the last two-three months, two separate home invasions within five miles of us have spooked her. One situation had the home owner murdered and another saw a husband and wife shot. I brushed it off as they weren't prepped for that situation but it has really weighed on my wife a great deal. My solution is shown below. Can you add to it or make recommendations? Thanks for helping calm her down a little! M.R.

Current plan
1.) loaded 9mm handgun in living room - 16 rds.
2.) loaded .38 6 rds. beside the bed in MBDRM.
3.) loaded .45acp in kitchen - 7 rds.
4.) *considering* 12 gauge semi-auto with low recoil rounds but I'm not sure the wife will enjoy practicing with it.


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

You got the fire power down easy, I'd have ample light on the outside of the house, detectors, ground light's, etc.... and be very cognizant about what's around you when coming and going. More importantly is that you both know how to use what you've got proficiently, if you don't already and keep those windows and doors locked and speed dial to 911. P.S. I may consider moving one of the other pistols to the bedroom at night and/or a 12 gauge to keep the .38 company . If they are already in your house you may not be able to get to the living room or kitchen, but the .38 might do ya.


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## Smitty79 (Oct 19, 2012)

Do you have extra magazines by your posted firearms? How about a big dog?


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## Scott9mm (Jul 2, 2012)

I think you have enough guns. But what about the rest of your plan? How many people in the house and what are their ages? What is the layout of your house? Where are the possible entry points? Where is your safe room? What are your escape routes? What is a realistic police response time and how will you coordinate with first responders? Does everyone in the house know and understand the plan? Firearms are an important and difficult part of home defense, but they are seldom the most important part.

There are too many factors to cover here and there is excellent published guidance available. Here's one good source: NRA Guide to the Basics of Personal Protection in the Home: National Rifle Association: 9780935998993: Amazon.com: Books


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## Gruesome (Apr 30, 2013)

Pfft! That's nothing! Lets see if I can remember all the loaded guns my dad kept in the family home... 
S&W model 10 - Family room, In the cushions of the sofa
Colt Detective Special - foyer, in a small set of drawers
Browning Hi Power - master bedroom, his sock drawer
Walther PPK/S - Kitchen/breakfast able area - up on the decorative plate rail behind a plate
S&W model...dang, don't remember. Semi auto from the 70's/80's - in the garage.
A different Browning Hi Power - Basement
Colt 1911 - Office, desk drawer
Walther PP - Living room, in the liquor cabinet
I don' know, but I suspect...
a revolver in the master bathroom

The only rooms WITHOUT a gun were the dining room (mom put her foot down) and the 'public' bathroom

Now, that was when the family lived there. After I moved out and mom left him, they were lying out in the open all over the place. And he wondered why I never brought my toddler over to his house...


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

May I ask in which part of Virginia do you reside?


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## MaxResponse (Jan 27, 2014)

Thanks denner,
The 9mm pistol goes into the bedroom with us at night so we have the .38 and 9mm with us. Smitty79 - check on the big dog. He barks at every thing too. Extra mags check but not kept loaded since I rotate through them. SouthernBoy - south central Va. 

The 12 ga. in the bedroom would be what I call a stand-off weapon of last resort. The way the bedroom is laid out, we have a clear shot at the bedroom door from a position with great protection. I just don't want to buy a shotgun just to be buying another gun. Plus, we'll have to practice and I feel after she pulls the trigger two or three times, she'll not want to use it. Then again, several years ago, she shot two .44 mag pistols I owned with ease. Looking back, one of those might come in handy right about now. Ha!


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## hammer1 (Oct 7, 2013)

Outside lights, lesser determined individuals want nothing to do with a house thats lighted up without a dark approach. I have a old police 870 thats loaded in the bedroom. I intend to turn the staircase into kindling and splinters, along with the individual(s), on said staircase. My 108 pound chesapeake bay retriever, also, doesnt play around.


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## MaxResponse (Jan 27, 2014)

hammer1 said:


> Outside lights, lesser determined individuals want nothing to do with a house thats lighted up without a dark approach. I have a old police 870 thats loaded in the bedroom. I intend to turn the staircase into kindling and splinters, along with the individual(s), on said staircase. My 108 pound chesapeake bay retriever, also, doesnt play around.


I think adding exterior lights may be key to eliminating "dark" pathways for intruders to lurk in the shadows. When I opened this thread and reread the replies, I waited for sunset and then went outside to see how the house looks from the street. It looks like we're advertising, "Come on in, we're not home so take what you want." I'll fix this issue this coming weekend for sure. Thanks for the idea.

Any more thoughts of a shotgun with bird shot or low recoil home defense loads? A guy at work asked if I would consider a carbine. 9mm, 40 or 45acp? Thoughts?


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

I'm not a fan of using a long gun for home defense inside of the home. My reasons are mostly wrapped around the fact that it generally takes two hands and because of its size, a perp who surprises you may have a greater chance of getting it out of your hands. However with a good active plan in place, a shotgun loaded with smaller pellets would be a formidable defensive weapon in the home. So it's a toss up with this one.

As for a pistol cartridge carbine, pretty much the same considerations for me as for the shotgun. One rather handy little carbine is the Kel-Tec Sub 2000. It's a folding "rifle" and makes a pretty decent little firearm for your purposes.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

MaxResponse said:


> Any more thoughts of a shotgun with bird shot or low recoil home defense loads? A guy at work asked if I would consider a carbine. 9mm, 40 or 45acp? Thoughts?


imo, birdshot is for birds. Get either 00 buck or rifled slugs. 00 buck won't penetrate two layers of sheetrock (as reported by other posters), so there is some containment to the load. Rifled slugs will go through walls, doors, pretty much anything in your house so more attention to shot placement would be necessary which, in a home invasion, might not be the first thing on your mind. Personally, I have slugs. They make a pretty good sized hole at close range. But, my go to would still be a 9mm or larger pistol in my nightstand drawer. I'd use the shotgun if I knew they were coming and had the time to get in a defensive position with it, with a 9 or 45 as backup.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Removed by poster due to duplication.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

RK3369 said:


> imo, birdshot is for birds. Get either 00 buck or rifled slugs. 00 buck won't penetrate two layers of sheetrock (as reported by other posters), so there is some containment to the load. Rifled slugs will go through walls, doors, pretty much anything in your house so more attention to shot placement would be necessary which, in a home invasion, might not be the first thing on your mind. Personally, I have slugs. They make a pretty good sized hole at close range. But, my go to would still be a 9mm or larger pistol in my nightstand drawer. I'd use the shotgun if I knew they were coming and had the time to get in a defensive position with it, with a 9 or 45 as backup.


My preference for a good defensive shotgun load is #4 buck. I do have some 00 buck in Federal law enforcement loads but I prefer the #4 buck in my Winchester 1300 Defender. For the close confines of a home, a good bird shot load is still going to be pretty devastating. Lots of pellets hitting lots of parts of the body. Can you imagine a head shot with something like this?

For home defense, I still prefer a handgun for many reasons. However, if the SHTF and things really started going down hill, I'd have a number of choices out and ready and a shotgun would certainly be one of those choices.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

Because we've been attacked, twice now, while we were at home, this is a subject to which I've given a whole lot of thought.*** One of the things I will not do is to spot, 'go-to guns' around the house. I see no point in arming someone who comes in through one end of the house while we're at another; and, when you live in a large ranch you've got to think of things like this. Where I go while I'm at home is where my EDC pistol goes too.

There are a lot of guns in this house. All, but two, of them are kept locked in the safe when they're not being used. My spouse is not just my wife; she's, also, been trained to back me up if we're ever attacked again. Anyone breaking in, here, would inevitably have to face two household defenders, not just one.

Because we've already had experience with this, we know what to expect. While I think it silly not to keep extra magazines loaded, (It ain't going to harm them.) neither do I keep more than 30, or so, rounds on hand in order to, 'repel all boarders'. It's been my experience that home invasions, both, begin and end very quickly - Especially after shots have been fired.

Unfortunately, there are more than a few teenage drug addicts in our neighborhood; (along with a few dealers) and one of the main things I worry about is having to come home and face one of my own guns! (Which is another reason, 'Why' my EDC's travel with me.) We've learned to maintain good relations with our immediate neighbors and have as much faith in them watching our place as they do in us watching theirs.

Because of things like: cattle rustlers, (Yes, cattle rustlers!) property and equipment thieves, and meth lab waste-dumpers, several of the neighbors and myself go out on random security patrols during the night. So far, every couple of years somebody ends up getting caught doing something entirely dirty and illegal. Back in 2008 I, damned near, got myself shot by one of the meth lab dumpers. Personally - and although they're often inconvenient - I like these late night security checks. After awhile the word gets out that you're not a, 'soft target', and things start to get a little easier.

(It's a great life; isn't it! Sometimes while I'm walking around the farm at night I'll look up at the stars and wonder to myself about whatever happened to Christianity?)

*** Actually, we've been attacked three times, here, at the house. It's just that we weren't at home when our oil tank was very quietly drained dry this past Winter.


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## boatdoc173 (Mar 15, 2014)

*reverse situation*

MY wife finally saw the light--these home invasions are getting to be too frequent to be ignored. The Cheshire CT case was way too much for either of us to just ignore. we have (all 9mm) a beretta 92fs, a CZ 75b, and 2 springfield xd 4"ers in places they would be the most use if needed. I think we need at least 1-2 more to be sure we have access to a 9mm if invaded and have to move around the house for safety.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

Like Glock Doctor all of my guns not in use, as in on my person or deliberately hidden about my home, are locked up in my safe. I have a few strategic locations that are not obvious where I keep a few for access should the need arise. And when I am out and about one of my carry guns, most always my primary, is on my person.

Our current home is a two-story colonial and its layout on the first floor is of an open architecture for the foyer, family room, kitchen, and dinette. This works to our advantage. We have a plan in place which was exercised in August 2009. Our former house was a rambler which, of course, was a single story home. Different plan and set of circumstances for that one especially since our current home is 2 1/2 times larger.

A solid plan is always your best friend. And this doesn't stop at what you will do should a breakin take place. It includes everything from lighting to phones to strategies to positions to take to you name it. Leave out nothing you can think of because you want every advantage on your side. I would also include one other thing that is very important.

Know your state's laws as they relate to your use of deadly force during a breakin. NEVER assume anything with this and NEVER take internet or gun shop advice as gospel. The classic example of, "if you shoot them outside just pull them inside" is about as crazy a piece of information that you can get. Know the laws and have the number of a good attorney who has experience in these matters.


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## Scott9mm (Jul 2, 2012)

A shotgun is useful mainly if you are hunkered down in your safe room, covering the door and waiting for the cops. Moving through your house with a long gun is fraught with peril, as previously mentioned. 

I made the mistake of getting a 20 Ga shotgun thinking it would be easier for my wife to use. IMO, 20 Ga has plenty of firepower but ammo availability and variety in 20 Ga is limited. Also, low-recoil 12 Ga ammo kicks less than 20 Ga magnum loads. So I think 12 Ga is a better choice. 

Salting loaded guns around the house has value assuming you don't carry one on your body at all times (except sleeping and bathing) but they need to be really well hidden (is that even possible) or in a pistol safe; otherwise you are likely to be facing one of tour own guns or reporting it stolen. 

When it's safe and practical, escape is almost always better than armed confrontation; but it may not be safe (e.g. escape route blocked) or practical (e.g. handicapped persons in the home). The real #1 rule of a gunfight is "don't get shot."

Home security is like cancer: Prevention is better than treatment. So exterior lighting, trimmed outside plantings, quality locks securing doors and windows, good neighbors, and neighborhood vigilance are the things that pay off. In both local B&E cases here (one a home invasion) the victim's residence was NOT visible to their neighbors. Most burglars just don't want to get caught. They seek soft targets but they may also just kill you so you can't ID them.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Glock Doctor said:


> Because we've been attacked, twice now, while we were at home, this is a subject to which I've given a whole lot of thought.*** One of the things I will not do is to spot, 'go-to guns' around the house. I see no point in arming someone who comes in through one end of the house while we're at another; and, when you live in a large ranch you've got to think of things like this. Where I go while I'm at home is where my EDC pistol goes too.
> 
> There are a lot of guns in this house. All, but two, of them are kept locked in the safe when they're not being used. My spouse is not just my wife; she's, also, been trained to back me up if we're ever attacked again. Anyone breaking in, here, would inevitably have to face two household defenders, not just one.
> 
> ...


Having to come home and face one of your own guns, very good point. Spotting guns around the house seems risky.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

If the wife thinks your in need of another firearm, go buy another, lol.
It's usually the other way around
*" we don't need another gun in this house* "
I say go for it, enjoy.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

There's so much more to a secure home than just having firearms in it, scattered around here and there. 

If I was in the mood and hadn't covered this over and over, I'd elaborate. 

I guess I just had to say that and get it off my chest. :smt083


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## MaxResponse (Jan 27, 2014)

boatdoc173 said:


> MY wife finally saw the light--these home invasions are getting to be too frequent to be ignored. The Cheshire CT case was way too much for either of us to just ignore. we have (all 9mm) a beretta 92fs, a CZ 75b, and 2 springfield xd 4"ers in places they would be the most use if needed. I think we need at least 1-2 more to be sure we have access to a 9mm if invaded and have to move around the house for safety.


That is the thing that caused my wife more concern. Home invasions in our area has risen greatly over the past few years. We use to hear that home owners were beat-up/robbed but now, they are shot. We don't leave guns lying around the house for us to return home to find them pointed at our chest/head when we walk in the door but others don't think about that and it is a very valid point. With that being said, we both feel that having a weapon close (never more than 10 feet away). The 9mm in the living room is moved into the bedroom at nite when we turn it. The 45acp in the kitchen is not an exposed weapon but it allows us access to a weapon if we have to retreat to the safe room from the living room in a hurry. The main issue is with our house's floor plan. From the living room to the bedroom, two exterior doors open into house so if we didn't keep Gorilla braces on those doors, we could be cut off from the safe room. I still feel those braces can be broken and they are delays for intruders that will hopefully buy us more reaction time. 
The shotgun idea, for me, is a viable option. I now think the gas operated semi-auto in 20 gauge is the way to go. Light, less recoil and still offers tremendous firepower. I am leaning towards the Mossberg model but I have also looked at the TriStar 12 ga. semi. My wife and I are headed to Lowes this afternoon to pick up outside lights for the front and back. I will also add motion detector lights at the driveway, front walk and rear corner of the house today. 
Really good advice and even though some may be bored with the topic, think about the good it does to discuss these things. New home owners, new gun owners who search the net for advice may come across our words and use them to formulate their own home defense plans. Cheers! MR


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## northstar19 (Aug 11, 2013)

Instead of a shotgun, your wife might take better to an AR-15. Very light, very accurate, lots of rounds, and low recoil.


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