# I'm PISSED!!!!!!



## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

This letter that I Emailed to the Attonery General and the agency that governs police officers Conduct and Training says it all.

:smt076*I'M PISSED*:smt076

Sirs,
I am concerned about an issue I have run in to with the Eagle County Sheriff's Office. I picked up an application for a Concealed Weapons Permit from the Eagle County Sheriff's annex in El Jebel. I contacted Detective Daniel Loya who is in charge of permit applications and was informed that I needed an NRA Basic Pistol Certificate. I complied with this and filled out the permit application and mailed it with the prescribed fees listed in the forms to the listed address of the Eagle County Sheriff's department in Eagle. I understood that the process could take up to ninety days so I was content to wait. I mailed the forms on or about the 15th of March 2008. I Email Detective Loya on the evening of April 25 to see if I could learn how the process was progressing. I was redirected to a person named Kelly. Kelly returned my Email with a generic response that stated that I would need to come in and be finger printed and a photo would be taken and they would start the process. It has now been 45 days since I mailed my application to The Eagle Sheriff's department. In that time no one from that department has contacted me and indicated that there were problems or further steps would need to be taken with my application or that the outdated form I was given had the incorrect fees listed. I do not feel that this application has been handled in a professional and timely manner. It would now appear that I have wasted 45 days waiting for a permit that has not even been processed. I would greatly appreciate it if you would look in to this matter and advise me as to what I should do to expedite this matter. I have enclosed an attachment of a copy of the only correspondence I have received since mailing my application and that, a response to my query.

Sincerely
George

I hope somebodies lunch gets eaten on this! :smt097


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## Baldy (Jun 21, 2006)

The AG will make a phone call and it will still take another 60 days more than likely. There's jerk's at all level of Government. Good luck.:smt076


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## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

That really sucks!


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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Many S.D. have many ways to slow down the process to discourge people from getting one. Several major cities in N.C. have done that just to limit the numbers, for the most part the S.D. got thier hats handed to them finally.


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## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

It sucks, but at least you're making noise about it. While you're at it, send the same letter to any State, County and local officials who might have an intrest - especially if they're gun-friendly. The squeaky wheel gets the oil!


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

This Sheriff has a reputation on this issue. He doesn't like to issue, and on top of that I beat him outa $300 that his guy charges for the NRA Certificate by going to a $60 way cool LEO NRA instructor in a diffrent county. My real hope is that my complant is just one among many and they ride him hard on it. I'm clean as a virgin so I'm not worried in the least about being denied. Although I'd best be on my best behavior when I see a Sheriff's car for a bit. I wouldn't be suprised if I wasn't "made" by one after I get my permit.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

kev74 said:


> It sucks, but at least you're making noise about it. While you're at it, send the same letter to any State, County and local officials who might have an intrest - especially if they're gun-friendly. The squeaky wheel gets the oil!


He's an anti-gun sheriff in this county for a reason! There are two counties that are very wealthy ski resort types. Eagle and Pitkin Counties don't like guns cause the rich folk don't like us "low born" to have guns. As an example: There was a letter to the editor in this weekends paper from a woman that thought that the main highway serving the valley should be closed during the Elk migration so they won't get hit and killed. Never mind the fact that nobody could get to work or supplies like groceries couldn't be delivered.

*That's the mentality I deal with here! *:smt011


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## Marcus99 (Apr 23, 2008)

I know what you're talking about George. I'm waiting on my FID and while I believe the law states they have to issue it to me assuming I check out, I don't think there is a statute telling them to issue it to me in a set amount of time. The impression I got was that issuing of permits was a side thing that they'll do when they've got the time.

Luckily for me though the issuing officer taught D.A.R.E to my class when I was a kid and she remembered me and we got off pretty well so I don't think she's got any hard feelings against me and the permit.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Marcus99 said:


> I know what you're talking about George. I'm waiting on my FID and while I believe the law states they have to issue it to me assuming I check out, I don't think there is a statute telling them to issue it to me in a set amount of time. The impression I got was that issuing of permits was a side thing that they'll do when they've got the time.
> 
> Luckily for me though the issuing officer taught D.A.R.E to my class when I was a kid and she remembered me and we got off pretty well so I don't think she's got any hard feelings against me and the permit.


They fixed that problem here. The law states they have 90 days to issue or deny. That is what pissed me off so bad. I thought I was half way home.


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## Marcus99 (Apr 23, 2008)

gmaske said:


> They fixed that problem here. The law states they have 90 days to issue or deny. That is what pissed me off so bad. I thought I was half way home.


I'm going on 7 weeks now (I went down March 12th and did the whole process), and she said it _normally_ takes 6-8 weeks. Be it that normally actually means what it's supposed to or that it really means that only the minority get it in that time I don't know.

Was it your fingerprints that maybe slowed it down? I don't know if they use ink where you had it done, but my town use's a scanning device and sends it to the state over the net. She told me that a lot of the time the scanner is fussy and doesn't like the prints and she has to call people back in a few weeks later. I emailed her a week after, real friendly, and checked with her to make sure the prints went through alright. Gotta keep on their ass about it is the way I figure it.


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

Geeze thats nuts isn't it.
Marcus, I remember when I got my FID in Mass. I was 15 and walked out that day after seeing our chief of police (and husband of my moms best friend in college). Then it was free, and good for life. Of course that all changed. And it was only 25 years ago, its not like I'm an oldtimer.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Well I played the game now I'm gonna be their worst nightmare. I'm gonna Email, I'm gonna call, I'm gonna call the Mayors office. I'm gonna bug the daylights outa the AG and anybody else that I can find. That sucker is gonna cringe when he hears my name!

*THIS IS WAR!*


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## ander254 (Mar 13, 2008)

Both my parents filed for their CCW's about a week ago. Instead of mailing it they went to the sheriff's office to deliver it. they were printed on the spot so no issues there. only 8 more weeks of waiting.


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## TOF (Sep 7, 2006)

gmaske said:


> Well I played the game now I'm gonna be their worst nightmare. I'm gonna Email, I'm gonna call, I'm gonna call the Mayors office. I'm gonna bug the daylights outa the AG and anybody else that I can find. That sucker is gonna cringe when he hears my name!
> 
> *THIS IS WAR!*


Play it cool George. Bureaucrats have their methods of making things very difficult. Be angry but don't let them know that you are. Remain respectful whether you respect them or not. We do not want you to lose the WAR so play it cool.

:smt1099


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

TOF said:


> Play it cool George. Bureaucrats have their methods of making things very difficult. Be angry but don't let them know that you are. Remain respectful whether you respect them or not. We do not want you to lose the WAR so play it cool.
> 
> :smt1099


There are a few laws that we have to follow whether we like it or not. There a few laws that they have to enforce whether they like it or not. Not to worry as I'm a civil person but i *do* intend to lean as hard as I can without being a total a$$hole.


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## 220combat (Oct 26, 2007)

If you make things ugly for them while you are waiting, they can make things real difficult for you. Attitude is everything you don't want them to think they are giving a permit to a lunatic. 

Make waves after you have been approved.


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## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

220combat said:


> If you make things ugly for them while you are waiting, they can make things real difficult for you. Attitude is everything you don't want them to think they are giving a permit to a lunatic.
> 
> Make waves after you have been approved.


You said it! :smt023

You've got to be polite. Don't make them cringe until after you've got your papers. Then devote all your anger to help change the system for those who follow. And if you haven't done so already, JOIN THE NRA!!! There aren't too many groups who are effectively helping to change gun laws and policies for the better.


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## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

niadhf said:


> Geeze thats nuts isn't it.
> Marcus, I remember when I got my FID in Mass. I was 15 and walked out that day after seeing our chief of police (and husband of my moms best friend in college). Then it was free, and good for life. Of course that all changed. And it was only 25 years ago, its not like I'm an oldtimer.


I think mine was $5 and good for life as well. Issued same day as well, if I remember correctly. That was just about 20 years ago.


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## fivehourfrenzy (Aug 12, 2007)

I called the KY state police over a week ago and complained, and they said they'd mail it right out the next day. Still haven't gotten it yet.

The same thing happened with my car. It got broken into and the window was out. It sat at the Volvo dealership for three months, and every week my dad called, they said, "Oh sorry, we're having trouble getting ahold of a window for an 850. We have to order one from Sweden. Call us back next week." Finally I went in there, pulled one of the parts guys aside, and said, "Look man...you've been telling us every week for the last 12 weeks that you couldn't get a window for my car. I don't buy it a bit. C'mon, I know you guys are better than this." He looked at the floor, nodded his head, and went to a computer. Within a minute he said, "Our distributor in CA has one...we can have it here tomorrow." I thanked him, and two days later, I had my car back.

I wanted to go in with an attitude and rip somebody a new one, but instead I emphasized my disappointment in their lack of effort, and it won the battle. Kill people with your kindness.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Ya I know......But I can't help but vent a bit! They are showing me by their actions a total disreguard for me as a person. Totally dismissed as a nothing. It's completly RUDE!


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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Keep copies of everything, after you get approved then write a little article for any one who will print it. Send all state law makers copies, the A.G.'s office, they will love you for it. Tourist dollars being what they value some may not want to spend them in your county after reading about the local S.D. mind set, a lot of those wealthy resort types are quietly well armed.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Ok, I cooled off enough to call and talk to the gal. They have my application but they have "lost" the money orders :smt011. I have the recipts so I can cancel them and I'm only out $30.00 instead of $112.50. I'm gonna drive over and get the prints and photo's done and repay the fees and GET A RECEIPT! She said she'd do what she could to expidite my application without me even asking. She made an interesting statement that my application had just apeared on her desk and it was unusual in that they date stamp all of them and mine wasn't stamped (something fishy here!). How can you trust a Sheriff's department with stuff like this going on! I guess you just gotta roll with the punches, suck it up, and keep on rolling.
I'll tell ya one thing, I'll be sure to note who NOT to vote for come Sheriff election time.


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## fivehourfrenzy (Aug 12, 2007)

I called the KSP yesterday and spoke with the same guy that was supposed to reissue my paperwork 9 days prior. He said he mailed me another set and it should've been there, so he would do it once more. He said if I don't get something in the next week, call him and they'd have to revise the method of delivery. Hell, I'll drive to Frankfort and get it myself if I have to. This is ridiculous...today marks the 93rd day since I took it into the courthouse and paid them $65 and such. It normally takes 21-28 days.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

FHF
Sounds like you're having as much fun as I am. Do ya get the feeling sometimes that you're urinating against the wind:smt005


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## fivehourfrenzy (Aug 12, 2007)

No, but on an electric fence.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

I went down and had my photo and prints taken. They let me go home so I must be ok. Believe it or not that is the first time I've ever seen the inside of a jail. They do the photo's in the processing area of the jail so you see what the BG's see just before they stick them in a cell. The digital finger print thingie is pretty dang cool. Lots of metal detectors, electronic doors, and bullet resistant glass. The Lady LEO that brought me back always faced me or was behind me until we were in the processing area and then one of the two LEO's was always watching me. Very interesting!


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Will I Emailed my "friend" at the Sheriff's office to see what I could find out. This is the reply I got:

I still haven’t received anything back from CBI or FBI. Investigations are still working on it. 



Kelly

I'll bet ya if I were wanted for something they'd have been on my door step two weeks ago. What a bunch of crock!


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## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

gmaske said:


> Will I Emailed my "friend" at the Sheriff's office to see what I could find out. This is the reply I got:
> 
> I still haven't received anything back from CBI or FBI. Investigations are still working on it.
> 
> ...


My county just went to digital fingerprinting. I was talking to the deputy who was taking my prints and he told me if they wanted to, they could run my prints through the FBI database and have the results back before I made it back to my car. It still took 3 months to get my permit though.

Civil Serveants + gun unfriendly sheriff = be patient and wait :smt022


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## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

I grant that some people in authority will drag their feet under these circumstances. I would like to point out what is a probable cause. Ineptitude. 
When dealing with the government you are often dealing with inept people that have no desire to help you. Be insistent, note dates, times and names. Repeat this information whn you call for follow up.

What is the status of your NRA membership? They can often be of help if it is an intentional delay.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Let's put it this way....I was warned by my NRA pistol instructor and a number of other people that "My Sheriff" has a reputation. I've already fired off a letter to the AG with the first situation I ran into. I haven't heard anything back from them on that one yet either. It is just barely 30 days since I finally got the ball actually rolling for real. It's just really frustrating to swim up stream sometimes.


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## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

Since you are a member, contact them. start at the local level and move up. It would be amusing to be the instigator of a lawsuit by the NRA against your local sherrif. If he has this reputation, the NRA can shake the trees and a letter to the state and county from them may carry more weight tha a letter from you. You pay for a membership, use the benifits.


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## gmaske (Jan 7, 2008)

Old Padawan said:


> Since you are a member, contact them. start at the local level and move up. It would be amusing to be the instigator of a lawsuit by the NRA against your local sherrif. If he has this reputation, the NRA can shake the trees and a letter to the state and county from them may carry more weight tha a letter from you. You pay for a membership, use the benifits.


I'll give this some thought! I'm inclined to let it roll for a bit longer. My pistol class instructor told me to give him a call if I had some problem so I think I'll start there first. He's a LEO so you never know what's going on.


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## Nozoki (Feb 1, 2008)

I applied for my permit here in VA on the 31st of March. Dropped it off in person and paid the fees. No pictures or fingerprinting had to be done so it only took a few minutes. Then came the wait. They have 45 days to issue here and they used every minute of it. The court clerks office actually issues it, so I called a few days before the time limit was up and the clerk said it was ready and I could come pick it up or have it mailed to me. She actually wound up giving it to my mom at a graduation party for my cousin's daughter. The clerk is my cousin. :smt033 and I was out of town for the week.
But still, my permit says it was issued on April 15th. That's 2 weeks after I applied for it. It was not delivered until I called her about it in mid May. I need to ask her why they do that crap.


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## Old Padawan (Mar 16, 2007)

gmaske said:


> I'll give this some thought! I'm inclined to let it roll for a bit longer. My pistol class instructor told me to give him a call if I had some problem so I think I'll start there first. He's a LEO so you never know what's going on.


An NRA letter or Lawsuit serves the public good and may help others after you.


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