# Retirement



## paratrooper

When I retired, it was a no-brainer and I knew in my heart and soul that it was time. I didn't have to think about it, didn't have to review my financial status, and I didn't need anyone's opinion......except my wife of course. :smt083

Within the last two weeks, I've had two friends asking me about retirement and if they should be doing it. I told them that no way would I recommend doing it or not doing it. I told them that they would know when it was time. Chances are, if you have to think about it a lot, most likely you're really not ready. 

Anyways, it was just strange that two guys called me and wanted me to chime in on one of the most important decisions of their life. 

I think I handled it in such a way that they weren't offended or put off by what I said. I did tell them that it was a very personal decision and that they should share it with their spouses. 

BTW......years ago, a buddy of mine decided to retire, and he didn't tell his wife. Man oh man, was that ever a difficult time in his life. :anim_lol:


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## ronin11

my 2 cents: I retired 8 years ago, 20 years with the outfit and 50 years old. I have no wife, no kids & my parents have passed on, just he situation life has dealt me. In any event, the 1st month was great, lots of time at the range, multiple rounds of golf, caught up with friends, ect...By the middle of the 2nd month I was sitting or laying on the couch watching Oprah (just kidding) in the middle of the afternoon. I realized that all my friends were busy (married & families) and I was wasting away what was supposed to be the prime of my life. The job had called me several times to come back and at the 9 & 1/2 week mark, I did...One of the best things I could have done, now all I have is a couple of more years and it'll be 30 years & 60 y/o and more $ than I'll most likely ever spend. No one to leave it to, so Woo-Hoo!!!...The way I look at it now is that I am 2/3's done (statiscally speaking) and the last 1/3 will be all the fun & excitement I can handle...I've spent over 20 years working the mean streets of Miami-Dade County and I'm lucky to have made it this far...paratrooper you almost always have good threads and post for me to follow-up on...


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## Steve M1911A1

I, too, had to find something to do. So my retirement ended up far busier than my working life had been!
I signed-up to teach an art class in our local grammar school, I wrote articles for a magazine or two, I became a pretty good amateur actor and director, I did volunteer work for our music festival, and then, of course, there were all of the "honey-dos" that come with home ownership.
In her retirement, my wife became the village ballet teacher, she designed and runs an important local charity, and she, too, works hard for the music festival.
And now we have grandchildren.

Retirement? What's that?


(Truth: I have finally retired from my retirement. I am now catching up on a huge pile of books. But my wife is still going strong. Of course, she's a lot younger than I am...)


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## tony pasley

I have horses, beef cattle, garden, teaching children about horses and riding, grandchildren, and that is after working a full time job for a little over a year more.


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## rustygun

My FIL has been retired for 15 years now. Couple of weeks ago he was telling me how he waxed his trash can. I think he has way to much time on his hands.


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## GCBHM

The last time I waxed a trash can was in bootcamp! Granted I am not quite at that hump, but it's good to read the comments from the vets. Provides perspective.


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## MitchellB

Everyone is different. I had a friend that retired and he did not have a clue as to what to do with all his free time. Between that and his drinking problem he committed suicide in about a years time. Me at 58, on the other hand, was forced out of the job market a few months ago due to a disability and loving retirement (not the disability part). I can't get around as good as I'd like, but keeping busy has never been a problem for me. I probably spend too much time reading internet forums I enjoy like this one, but I really have too many hobbies and not enough hours in the day.


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## hud35500

I've been retired for a year and a half with no regrets at all! After 25 years on the job, it just hit me one day, I'M DONE!! Money was not an issue, as my retirement check would only be a couple hundred less than I was earning on the job. What I saved in gas more than covered that! My dept. offers seminars and other help for those who are considering retirement. I took full advantage of these services which eased any trepidation I had. My only hesitation was since I'd never retired before, how do I do it!! I know it sounds silly, but It was a truly strange feeling! My wife was rather nervous about it, but thanks to the assistance offer by my employer, her mind was put at ease. She actually became as excited as I was! 
Keeping busy has not been a problem. Between hobbies and domestic duties, there still aren't enough hours in the day! The wife was rather jealous for a while(she still works), but since I took over the shopping, cooking, and cleaning, her life has become less stressful. People still ask whether I'm going to get another job(I'm only 52), but since money is not an issue, what would I want another job for? I did spend the last year and a half pursuing a permanent disability claim, which has finally settled and started paying. A 43% disability rating shows how much wear and tear I suffered after 25 years. I have pain, but the best thing I did to relieve the pain was retire. 
The most important thing is to keep busy! I have partners who retired and do nothing but sit around and get fat. I didn't join a gym or take up marathons, but I exercise every day and stay busy. Hell, cleaning the house is tiring! I figure the best sign is that I haven't gained weight since I retired. I don't miss the job, but I do miss the people, but I keep in touch with some and have helped several with their retirement decisions. 

LIFE IS GOOD!!


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## RK3369

I'm 63 and have thought about it a lot over the past several years. My full retirement age is 66 so my plan is to retire at the end of that year (Dec birthday) and also between now and then to convince my wife to keep working so she's not at home nagging me all the time. I'll find enough to do on my own, at least for a few years. She just turned 62 so she could work another 4 years yet and stay out of my hair. That's my plan. when she retires, if we can afford it, we're going to do the liveaboard thing on a boat and cruise up and down the intracoastal, summers in the North and Winters in Florida or somewhere down South.


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## TAPnRACK

I'm a long way from retirement (still early 40's).... but it's interesting reading about how you guys are dealing with it. I look forward to being there someday... I would love more free time to pursue interests and travel.


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## paratrooper

Sounds as if some of you are as busy, if not busier than when you were working. 

I don't get that at all. Although, I have heard it mentioned many times by others. 

I figure I'm only going to get one chance at retiring, and I don't want to mess that up by part-time work, having hobbies, or just plain staying busy.


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## pic

Well I just went over my retirement situation.
I will need to work five more years after I'm dead :smt033


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## TAPnRACK

^ Lol, your not alone... seems to be a scary trend with a lot of occupations.


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## SailDesign

Yup! I went for an occupation that I would enjoy, at the expense of large amounts of income. I have been able to live reasonably, but a retirement fund was out of the question most years. Beginning to put some away recently, but I'm 60 next year so I have a ways to go. 

No regrets, though. And no jealousy for those that chose the other route, or were able to combine the two.


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## Bisley

I went at 62, this year. I was tired of my job, after 30 years, and I haven't looked back. I like retirement, because I never have to be anywhere unless I want to, and that is freedom. I've been offered some contract work, and I might eventually do some, if the terms suit me, but I'm going to be particular about what I commit to, these days.


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## paratrooper

One of the best things about my retirement, was not having to work shift-work anymore. I had been doing that for 30 yrs., and I know to some degree, it did take a toll on my health and marriage. 

I was sure that once I retired, I wouldn't be able to fall back into some kind of a normal routine when it comes to sleeping. I'm quite happy to say that I was wrong. Within two weeks or so, I was once again, sleeping like a normal person. 

The second best thing about retiring, was the fact that people were no longer threatening me with bodily harm, or shooting at me. No matter how you frame it in your mind, after so many years, it does tend to get personal. :numbchuck:


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## hud35500

I'm with you Troop, I don't miss the threats and bodily harm. The pain I live with is the result of all that though. I do work with my neighborhood watch, which has provide some enjoyable moments and I get to stay in touch with local LEO's.


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## faststang90

im only 38 and i had to take my 401 because every 3 months i would get my report and the fee they charged me was more than what my 85,000 was making. i was losing around 100 more than what my money was making from thier fee's. i took 45,000 and the other 40,000 in a account that im not lossing money now but im not sure what the irs is going to think about it.


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## pic

Did you initiate a direct rollover? Into the same type of account ?
any monies that was not taxed yet,,,, will be taxed.
unless you rolled the money over to a similar account.
I'm not an accountant, but you do not want to get in bad with the IRS.. Penalties will pile on quickly.


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## SouthernBoy

pic said:


> Did you initiate a direct rollover? Into the same type of account ?
> any monies that was not taxed yet,,,, will be taxed.
> unless you rolled the money over to a similar account.
> I'm not an accountant, but you do not want to get in bad with the IRS.. Penalties will pile on quickly.


Best thing to do is a direct rollover into a personal IRA. You will avoid taxes and have all of your money sitting there working for you for your future retirement. I did this twice with pension payouts and am only now starting to get close to when I am required to begin drawing on my IRA.


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## SouthernBoy

I retired five years ago as of next month. Didn't bother me a bit. I put in 29 years in software development, mostly as a software engineer, and don't miss one bit of it. This is because I am a planner/preparer type of person. I began the mental, and financial, process of getting ready for retirement several years before it happened. Sure, I miss the good times, some of the people, and a few other things. But I sure don't miss unrealistic schedules, creeping requirements, and coding on the fly with no clearcut requirements analysis... not to mention some managers who are void in the "people skills" department.

As for what I do? Whatever I want to do that I can afford, or nothing at all. I feel no obligation to do anything other than that which needs to be done. We can do pretty much as we want, no money concerns, and there is no feeling that I need to do this or that because I am retired. So if I want to sit on my butt and watch a movie in the middle of the day, I will. Or get in my car and take a nice drive, I'll do that. Or buy a new gun or go out to eat or whatever, I'll do it. A neighbor friend is also retired and we do lunch every Wednesday. I have a few old high school buddies in the area with whom I also have lunch. And the neighbor friend and I hit the range from time to time.... like this morning. I go much more often than does he.

Some men have a hard time retiring. My dad was like that. Somehow they feel that their personal worth is no longer a consideration. They feel that their life's work is part of them and defines them. Get over it. What defines you is YOU. So look forward to retirement and prepare for it, just as you would do for the day when your last child leaves the nest or when you cross that mid-life time when you begin to question where your life has been and where it's heading.

Retirement is a good thing. Embrace it and enjoy it.


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## paratrooper

SouthernBoy said:


> I retired five years ago as of next month. Didn't bother me a bit. I put in 29 years in software development, mostly as a software engineer, and don't miss one bit of it. This is because I am a planner/preparer type of person. I began the mental, and financial, process of getting ready for retirement several years before it happened. Sure, I miss the good times, some of the people, and a few other things. But I sure don't miss unrealistic schedules, creeping requirements, and coding on the fly with no clearcut requirements analysis... not to mention some managers who are void in the "people skills" department.
> 
> As for what I do? Whatever I want to do that I can afford, or nothing at all. I feel no obligation to do anything other than that which needs to be done. We can do pretty much as we want, no money concerns, and there is no feeling that I need to do this or that because I am retired. So if I want to sit on my butt and watch a movie in the middle of the day, I will. Or get in my car and take a nice drive, I'll do that. Or buy a new gun or go out to eat or whatever, I'll do it. A neighbor friend is also retired and we do lunch every Wednesday. I have a few old high school buddies in the area with whom I also have lunch. And the neighbor friend and I hit the range from time to time.... like this morning. I go much more often than does he.
> 
> Some men have a hard time retiring. My dad was like that. Somehow they feel that their personal worth is no longer a consideration. They feel that their life's work is part of them and defines them. Get over it. What defines you is YOU. So look forward to retirement and prepare for it, just as you would do for the day when your last child leaves the nest or when you cross that mid-life time when you begin to question where you life has been and where it's heading.
> 
> Retirement is a good thing. Embrace it and enjoy it.


Good post and a good attitude. :smt023


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## SouthernBoy

paratrooper said:


> Good post and a good attitude. :smt023


Thank you. I am by nature a happy and friendly person. So my approach to retirement is simple. Every day that you wake up, is a good day... no dirt over your face and no bugs making a meal of your body. The really crazy thing is, where have all of those years gone?


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## Steve M1911A1

SouthernBoy said:


> ...I am by nature a happy and friendly person...


I had noticed that.

Good way to be: You'll probably never get an ulcer, nor maybe hypertension as well.


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## paratrooper

I tend to be crabby and suspicious of everyone. 

My luck, I'll live to be 110. :smt102


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## faststang90

i took 45,000 total. i took 30,000 in cash and paid 15,000 in taxes. the rest went into a ira


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## Tip

Retired at an early age the end of last month. 35 years 1 month 13 days on the job - 1 job (actually 3 companies - got bought twice) from college till the end. Was well taken care of. Planned well - actually got a raise to retire - sufficient funds to take me to 145+ if I last that long! LOL! Already have 5 job offers for consulting gigs if I want 'em -- NOPE I am done.
Advice to youngsters -- SAVE 75% of every raise you get - you still get a raise - twice! Max 401k asap and manage it yourself - half aggressive, half relatively safe - keep it balanced. When the aggressive suffers the safe usually does well and vice versa.


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## SouthernBoy

Steve M1911A1 said:


> I had noticed that.
> 
> Good way to be: You'll probably never get an ulcer, nor maybe hypertension as well.


Thanks, Steve. I do have high blood pressure but it is easily controlled with meds.


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## SouthernBoy

Tip said:


> Retired at an early age the end of last month. 35 years 1 month 13 days on the job - 1 job (actually 3 companies - got bought twice) from college till the end. Was well taken care of. Planned well - actually got a raise to retire - sufficient funds to take me to 145+ if I last that long! LOL! Already have 5 job offers for consulting gigs if I want 'em -- NOPE I am done.
> Advice to youngsters -- SAVE 75% of every raise you get - you still get a raise - twice! Max 401k asap and manage it yourself - half aggressive, half relatively safe - keep it balanced. When the aggressive suffers the safe usually does well and vice versa.


The problem with most young folks is that they tend to live close to their means. This is not just the purview of young people but for many, if not, most people in their working years. If they could save each month the same amount that both they and their employer send to the feds for social security, beginning when the enter the work force, they would be multimillionaires at retirement. But the enticement of a nice home and the finer things in life eats up any such plan.

Your advice is good and sound and congratulations on you being able to do what you did for yourself.


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## Tip

Exactly why I advocate saving the bulk of raises. Takes nothing away from what you are already living on. Reward yourself with a little bit but save the rest.


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## hud35500

I remember being young and reckless once, but I took advantage of my employers deferred comp(on the advice of a veteran officer) and maxed out my contribution ASAP! Every raise went to the 457. This was the advice I passed on to new hires. It's sad that very few took my advice. Most are too busy partying, buying expensive toys, and generally living beyond their means. while I pretty much live off my retirement(which is also better than most depts.), the 457 is there as a buffer, just in case.


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## theburtman

I'm 60, and chomping at the bit to retire. I'm trying to hang on until 62. I think I have saved enough, live a modest lifestyle, and have plenty to keep me busy. My fear is that I will need to go back to work because of miscalculation, or other unplanned for financial drain. The idea of going back to work doesn't scare me, it's that the economy is so bad, and it's easier to find a job if you have a job.


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## otisroy

I'm beginning to hear more about the administration investigating an option to confiscate people's 401Ks and IRAs in another redistribution scheme and it scares the hell outta me. I retired from the Air Force a few years ago and now I'm maxing my 401K contributions and thinking of starting a Roth to go with it so I can get to that "I'm ready to retire" feeling. They've already mismanaged our Social Security and now they want the chance to mangle my 401K and IRA?


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## Steve M1911A1

There was (and maybe still is) an Obama-government scheme to replace your retirement account(s) with a Ponzi-pyramid scheme very similar to what Social Security has become.
It was (is?) called something like "MyRA," or something equally silly. (I assume that the "my" part refers to Obama, not to you.)
So far, it was (is?) completely voluntary...just as Social Security originally was. So far.

Yes, the scheme was (is?) an attempt at redistribution, with later payback using inflation-reduced dollars.
The government dole is running out of money.

Our government can't maintain our country's infrastructure (roads, bridges, _etc_.) because the money has been spent on transfer payments (that is, the dole).
Our country can't appropriately subsidize its Constitution-mandated postal service because the money has been spent on transfer payments (that is, the dole).
And now, it can't even maintain the dole.

(By "the dole," I mean not only buying votes from the terminally-lazy poor, but also giving overly-generous retirement payouts to unreëlected, two-term congresscritters as well.)


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## SailDesign

Steve M1911A1 said:


> There was (and maybe still is) an Obama-government scheme to replace your retirement account(s) with a Ponzi-pyramid scheme very similar to what Social Security has become.
> It was (is?) called something like "MyRA," or something equally silly. (I assume that the "my" part refers to Obama, not to you.)
> So far, it was (is?) completely voluntary...just as Social Security originally was. So far.
> 
> Yes, the scheme was (is?) an attempt at redistribution, with later payback using inflation-reduced dollars.
> The government dole is running out of money.
> 
> Our government can't maintain our country's infrastructure (roads, bridges, _etc_.) because the money has been spent on transfer payments (that is, the dole).
> Our country can't appropriately subsidize its Constitution-mandated postal service because the money has been spent on transfer payments (that is, the dole).
> And now, it can't even maintain the dole.
> 
> (By "the dole," I mean not only buying votes from the terminally-lazy poor, but also giving overly-generous retirement payouts to unreëlected, two-term congresscritters as well.)


Can't pay the dole? Don't spend $$$ on wars that don't actually protect the country......


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## Steve M1911A1

I apologize that I can't get into a discussion about this.
It's because I'm too busy standing in line, waiting for my welfare check.


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## SouthernBoy

Steve M1911A1 said:


> I apologize that I can't get into a discussion about this.
> It's because I'm too busy standing in line, waiting for my welfare check.


I've been thinking about going down to Honduras the sneaking back into the country over the New Mexico border. That way I can claim illegal status and get all sorts of goodies.

On a serious note, ask those who are so willing to give our money to the willfully indigent to point to the section in the U.S. Constitution that mandates this (hint: it ain't in there). Then ask them to open their checkbooks and give all they wish. Hell, they should open the doors to their homes and just let them all in.

Now I need to find that line you're in so I can get my welfare check, too.


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## SailDesign

SouthernBoy said:


> <snippage>
> On a serious note, ask those who are so willing to give our money to the willfully indigent to point to the section in the U.S. Constitution that mandates this (hint: it ain't in there).
> <snip again!>


There isn't one that says "Ignore those that need help,", either.


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## Steve M1911A1

SailDesign said:


> There isn't one that says "Ignore those that need help,", either.


...The free-will aspect of American civic and political philosophy militates for charity being freely given by a sympathetic individual, rather than being coerced by government.
Based upon the widely-accepted concept of free will-as seen, for instance, in the First Amendment-it is indeed my constitutional right to "ignore those [who] need help."


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## SailDesign

Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...The free-will aspect of American civic and political philosophy militates for charity being freely given by a sympathetic individual, rather than being coerced by government.
> Based upon the widely-accepted concept of free will-as seen, for instance, in the First Amendment-it is indeed my constitutional right to "ignore those [who] need help."


Granted, it's your right. But there is nothing that makes it your duty.....


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## Steve M1911A1

SailDesign said:


> Granted, it's your right. But there is nothing that makes it your duty.....


Nothing I wrote even implied that I, or anyone, considers it a "duty" to ignore the needy. Please don't set up straw men as your opposition to my positions: It's dishonest.
But ignoring the needy is indeed a right.

I deeply resent that the government has taken from me the right to pick and choose the charities, and the individuals, to which, and to whom, I am to donate.
Thus, all of our voluntary charitable donations are made after the government has, in the previous year, forcefully taken involuntary contributions from us.

And the worst feature of all is that the government doles out our money, merely in order to buy the votes of the lazy and the inadequate.


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## hillman

Secular governments and charity are not related. The various forms of 'dole' are not charity. US Social Security is not 'dole'. Maybe we need an agreement on terms here?


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## SailDesign

Steve M1911A1 said:


> <snippage>
> And the worst feature of all is that the government doles out our money, merely in order to buy the votes of the lazy and the inadequate.


Cynical? You? Say it ain't so...

We disagree there - I see the country protecting its citizens. And I'm not going to change my mind (or yours) so let's just leave it there, shall we?


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## Steve M1911A1

hillman said:


> Secular governments and charity are not related. The various forms of 'dole' are not charity. *US Social Security is not 'dole'.* Maybe we need an agreement on terms here? [emphasis added]


Once again, a possible straw man rears its empty head.

Social Security is neither a dole nor an "entitlement."
(The government would like you to believe that it's an "entitlement," so that the system's money can be wrongfully appropriated for use as part of the dole.)

Why isn't Social Security a dole?
Because, in order to receive the payout, you have to have first paid-in. A dole, by definition, is something you receive as a gift, free of charge.

"But," you might say, "I don't have to pay into Social Security anywhere near the amount of money I'll be receiving."
That's true _today_, now that the system has been converted into a gigantic Ponzi scheme. But as originally constituted, money paid into Social Security was to be kept in a separate fund, and the money invested in US Government Savings Bonds and similar Treasury instruments, so that it would earn modest interest and thus would equal the expected payout when the time came.
Even today, when our children's input goes directly toward paying our withdrawals, if you calculate-in the modest interest that the scheme _should_ be earning, Social Security is not a dole.
And it's an "entitlement" only so far as we participants were forced by law to have paid into the scheme. We are _entitled_ to that money. It's already ours.

Are the terms clear now?


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## hillman

I have always been clear about Social Security. Are you clear about charity?


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## Steve M1911A1

hillman said:


> I have always been clear about Social Security. Are you clear about charity?


In this case, snarking doesn't help you make your point.

As I already wrote, in posts #39 and #41 of this thread, real charity is a gift, given freely by the donor.
Nothing that any government does constitutes real charity, because, from the donor's point of view, there is no free will involved. Thus, it is not a gift, freely given.

If I haven't the right to say, "No, I don't want to give," then it isn't charity.

Are we settled on that issue now?


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## paratrooper

Never known the government to give something away w/o strings attached.


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## SouthernBoy

The government was never intended to be in the business of propping people up with funds given willy nilly for whatever reason(s) were convenient or in vogue. In my youth, to be on the public dole was embarrassing and shameful which is how it should be. But in contemporary America there is a sense of entitlement for all manner of monies and services by those who are the takers (clean word for parasites). I make a number of contributions during the year and in some years, the amounts have exceeded ten thousand dollars in donations... the largest part being clothing and household items. Of course there is a tax writeoff incentive but why not? It's my stuff owned and given freely by me.

So don't try to tell me about charity or the free will of giving. What I do not like is the government doing what they do at my expense. From free medical care to food stamps to housing to you name it.


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## SouthernBoy

paratrooper said:


> Never known the government to give something w/o strings attached.


As Reagan said. The worse ten words may be, "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you."

What I've said for years about this is;

How much is it going to cost?
What am I going to lose?

There are some who tend to like, and even favor, socialism as an economic system. They believe that a socialistic approach to our fiscal problems would be the answer to all of our ills. That only government can really plan and control production and output, and equity in income and wealth. Well I'll say this right now. Socialism is next to the most evil form of economic and government run systems yet devised by Man. It completely ignores fundamental human traits and instincts and flies in the face of economic logic. Look at the extreme forms that socialism has taken over the centuries. Nazism, communism, fascism... all of which are evil incarnate. Frankly, the only good socialist/communist is the one that lays on the ground and doesn't breathe.


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## paratrooper

One of the most valuable lessons I leaned while in the military, is that you don't volunteer for anything. 

If the military wants you to do something, they'll tell you. :smt1099


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## hillman

Steve M1911A1 said:


> In this case, snarking doesn't help you make your point.
> 
> As I already wrote, in posts #39 and #41 of this thread, real charity is a gift, given freely by the donor.
> Nothing that any government does constitutes real charity, because, from the donor's point of view, there is no free will involved. Thus, it is not a gift, freely given.
> 
> If I haven't the right to say, "No, I don't want to give," then it isn't charity.
> 
> Are we settled on that issue now?


Yep, looks like we are in complete agreement on definitions, if nothing else. "Snarky"? Moi?


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## RK3369

faststang90 said:


> im only 38 and i had to take my 401 because every 3 months i would get my report and the fee they charged me was more than what my 85,000 was making. i was losing around 100 more than what my money was making from thier fee's. i took 45,000 and the other 40,000 in a account that im not lossing money now but im not sure what the irs is going to think about it.


You better transfer that money to an IRA account in a bank or investment house within 60 days, or you will incur essentially a 45% penalty on drawing it before you are 59 1/2. There is a 10% Federal early withdrawal tax penalty on that transaction and also it will be taxed at your regular income tax rate, so you could end up losing almost half the money to the tax man. You can roll it over to an IRA within 60 days and avoid the penalty, but don't wait because that deadline is not flexible. It gets very expensive to take deferred money out of any program before you are 59 1/2. I am a CPA and have seen this mistake made numerous times by people over the years. Don't be tempted to use the money for something else, because when next April 15th rolls around, you're going to be looking at a big tax bill.

sorry, I didn't read far enough along. I guess you already decided to bite the bullet somewhat on the tax hit. Hope you don't find that you owe significantly more when your taxes are filed for this year.


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## SailDesign

Steve M1911A1 said:


> <snip>
> 
> As I already wrote, in posts #39 and #41 of this thread, real charity is a gift, given freely by the donor.
> 
> <More snip>


Or because there's a huge tax deduction available if you do it just right.... Let's be fair.


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## RK3369

SailDesign said:


> Or because there's a huge tax deduction available if you do it just right.... Let's be fair.


Ok, but given the choice, I'm sure most people would rather give it to a "charity" for a reasonable cause, than to the government for any of it's uses, over which they have no control. At least if you give it to a charity you can kind of select one that appeals to your humanitarian interests. Maybe something like the "lets get rid of liberal thinkers charity", or something like that.......:yawinkle:


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## SailDesign

RK3369 said:


> Ok, but given the choice, I'm sure most people would rather give it to a "charity" for a reasonable cause, than to the government for any of it's uses, over which they have no control. At least if you give it to a charity you can kind of select one that appeals to your humanitarian interests. Maybe something like the "lets get rid of liberal thinkers charity", or something like that.......:yawinkle:


Oooohhh.... Low blow! :anim_lol:


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## RK3369

sorry, couldn't resist. I acknowledge the inappropriate remark. Without liberal thinkers, we would still be in the dark ages although, at times, it seems like the libs pull us into Star Trek territory also.


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## SailDesign

RK3369 said:


> sorry, couldn't resist. I acknowledge the inappropriate remark. Without liberal thinkers, we would still be in the dark ages although, at times, it seems like the libs pull us into Star Trek territory also.


Not inappropriate from where I sit. I at least have the ability to laugh at myself - something I have found few people can manage these days. It leads to better communication, I've found - and I have been glad to find some in here on both "sides" with the same ability.

Let's face itm, if you can't laugh at American politics you are a pretty sad person. :mrgreen:


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## RK3369

SailDesign said:


> Let's face itm, if you can't laugh at American politics you are a pretty sad person. :mrgreen:


agreed, but it's also pretty depressing. Nobody there really wants to change anything. The entire system is too self serving. Term limits, Term limits, Term limits. Oops, sorry, my OCD busting in again.


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## SailDesign

RK3369 said:


> agreed, but it's also pretty depressing. Nobody there really wants to change anything. The entire system is too self serving. Term limits, Term limits, Term limits. Oops, sorry, my OCD busting in again.


Yup! For sure. And less lawyers. Except that they seem to be the only self-serving scum who are interested in doing that job.


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## SouthernBoy

RK3369 said:


> sorry, couldn't resist. I acknowledge the inappropriate remark. Without liberal thinkers, we would still be in the dark ages although, at times, it seems like the libs pull us into Star Trek territory also.


Uh, oh. You've been smoking the cheap stuff. I was a lefty in my youth but then I grew up and found out want happens when you wish in one hand and sh-t in the other. Reality bites. I am still a liberal... but a classic one instead of what passes for that persuasion in present day America. Classic liberals were what many of the Founders were, which actually makes me a Constitutionalist.


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## SouthernBoy

SailDesign said:


> Not inappropriate from where I sit. *I at least have the ability to laugh at myself - something I have found few people can manage these days.* It leads to better communication, I've found - and I have been glad to find some in here on both "sides" with the same ability.
> 
> Let's face itm, if you can't laugh at American politics you are a pretty sad person. :mrgreen:


We can certainly agree on this. A good sense of humor starts at home... as in one's ability to recognize their own failings from time to time and laugh at them.


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## RK3369

SouthernBoy said:


> Oh, oh. You've been smoking the cheap stuff. I was a lefty in my youth but then I grew up and found out want happens when you wish in one hand and sh-t in the other. Reality bites. I am still a liberal... but a classic one instead of what passes for that persuasion in present day America. Classic liberals were what many of the Founders were, which actually makes me a Constitutionalist.


well if you define that as being socially fairly liberal but fiscally pretty conservative, I guess I fall into that group also. I don't really care what others do as long as it doesn't affect or bother me, but I don't want to have to pay for them to do it.


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## Steve M1911A1

SailDesign said:


> Or because there's a huge tax deduction available [for charitable contributions] if you do it just right.... Let's be fair.


...Except that at our level of income, the tax deduction isn't quite so "huge."
But that's OK-we give money to charitable causes anyway.


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## SailDesign

Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...Except that at our level of income, the tax deduction isn't quite so "huge."
> But that's OK-we give money to charitable causes anyway.


Yeah, well, you're not alone there.


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## otisroy

Heck, maybe I should "retire" now before social security benefits are slashed. As the saying goes, you never hear about welfare running dry. Not gonna happen, but food for thought.


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## paratrooper

SouthernBoy said:


> We can certainly agree on this. A good sense of humor starts at home... as in one's ability to recognize their own failings from time to time and laugh at them.


I rarely rely on myself to recognize my own failings. I have plenty of family, friends and acquaintances, that will do that for me for free. :smt033


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## SouthernBoy

paratrooper said:


> I rarely rely on myself to recognize my own failings. I have plenty of family, friends and acquaintances, that will do that for me for free. :smt033


Yeah, that happens. But you know... it's hard being right all the time when so many around you are so dead wrong.

(a little humor in the morning never hurts)


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## SailDesign

SouthernBoy said:


> Yeah, that happens. But you know... it's hard being right all the time when so many around you are so dead wrong.
> 
> (a little humor in the morning never hurts)


But, how would you know? :anim_lol:


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## SouthernBoy

SailDesign said:


> But, how would you know? :anim_lol:


Because I know that humor is right and a good thing.

(Oh wait... me thinks that's not what he means.)


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## Ford Truck

At my last place of employment, the politically correct "thought police" ran rampant. I toughed it out for 14.5 yrs. and walked out 11 days before my 62nd birthdate. I do miss some of the people but I miss that environment like I'd miss dose of the clap. I'm so thankful I don't have to punch a time clock anymore.


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