# Oh yeah, this is going to leave a mark.......



## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

https://www.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-business-partner-falwells-says-161952490.html


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Who cares?

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I think it's hilarious!


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

I am fascinated by hypocrisy, of which the Falwells' behavior is a prime example.

"Do as I tell you, not as I do." _or_ "I'm so morally superior to all of the rest of you that nothing that I do could possibly be judged by the likes of you as being immoral."

Yeah. Right.
.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

WASHINGTON (Reuters) -* In a claim likely *to intensify the controversy surrounding one of the most influential figures in the American Christian conservative movement, a business partner of Jerry Falwell Jr *has come forward to say* he had a years-long sexual relationship involving Falwell's wife and the evangelical leader. 
Yahoo claims, Yahoo says. 
AFAIK Yahoo is full of libby bullshit that is always anti-conservative.
Enjoy the KOOL-AID!

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Falwell was / is a staunch supporter of tRump. 

Guilt by association. 

Daddy Falwell must be so proud of his son.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

https://www.yahoo.com/news/falwell-says-wife-had-affair-143147987.html


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

Well, the far right is often as looney as the far left.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> *Guilt by association.*


Using your logic, I guess you are going to vote (for the first time ever) for the anti-Second Amendment socialists.
Can I call you PARASAILDESIGN?

GW


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Who cares about Falwell, My God, the crap going on across the US with BLM and Snowflake Terrorist should be everyone's focus. No need for tabloid Sex crap that no one gives flying Pig sh** about. Come on Dems, this all you got. Weak, very Weak.
For the love of Pete, Kamajala Harris is Biden's VP pick. You want to talk about something SICK and DISGUSTING, then talk about that insane move by the demented Biden.
Man, that is something right out of Mad Magazine. I keep waiting for her to get Biden as soon as he turns his back on her. If I was Biden I would sleep with one eye open.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Goldwing said:


> Using your logic, I guess you are going to vote (for the first time ever) for the anti-Second Amendment socialists.
> Can I call you PARASAILDESIGN?
> 
> GW


I refuse to vote for either of the sleaze bags. It goes against my principles and grain.

But, just to throw you a bone, my wife is going to vote for tRump.

You can call me whatever you want. But............don't you dare call me late for dinner.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

RK3369 said:


> Well, the far right is often as looney as the far left.


Politics is politics! There isn't a right or wrong, or a good or bad. It's just politics.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> Politics is politics! There isn't a right or wrong, or a good or bad. It's just politics.


RUFKM?
Politics are why in Portland there are assholes in large groups walking through neighborhoods threatening citizens they have never met because they are white and have a nice house. 
parasaildesign it is.

GW


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

If you do not vote for Trump then Please spare us a post of yourself having a* Snowflake meltdown *because you cannot shoot and enjoy the sport like you use to. Go ahead and watch Samlaya Harris eat your lunch and your tax dollars squandered on BLM freebies. Police defunded, military defunded and on and on. 
And of course you hate Trump. He is a strong leader and as we know, Dems, hate strong leaders.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I don't like politicians in general. Never have, never will.

Me.....having a meltdown? Hardly! I'm just making observations is all. From what I have observed thru the years, is one party is and can be just as ignorant / judgmental as the other.

No one is holding a gun to my head and forcing me to choose one dirt bag over the other. Firearms have been a part of this nation of ours from the very start. Always has been, and always will be. I'm that assured.

I don't hate tRump. I can't imagine having a reason to hate anyone. But, he is a colossal dirt bag. Always has been, and always will be.

Just ask some members of his own family.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Lol, members of families have called each other names since mankind. I don't pay any attention to that kind of crapola. Trade, immigration, budgets,spending, second Amendment. Those are things YOU should care about. No one say's you have to vote for some guy or woman that you want to be best friends with, but someone you want to lead the country. All of which will affect you and your family now and years to come. Get over the fact that you hate politicians. Man up.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

POTUS's come and go. Damage is done, and the next one corrects it. This nation has survived all of it's President's so far. 

Each generation seems to do okay. We are still a nation. Seems like we will continue to be one for some time yet to come. 

Voting is a participation sport. You can play or not. That's exactly how it should be.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

We have reached the tipping point between remaining a Constitutional Republic or becoming a socialist aristocracy. What's at stake this coming election?

If the Democrats take control of all three branches of government:
(1) Replace two of the oldest Supreme Court justices with left wing radicals.
(2) Add left wing radicals to the Supreme Court so they have an overwhelming majority.
(3) Statehood for both DC and Puerto Rico giving Democrats four additional senate seats.
(4) Grant citizenship to the tens of millions of illegal invaders presently in the country.
(5) Universal healthcare regardless of citizenship.
(6) De facto open borders by rewarding those who enter illegally with social welfare programs.
(7) Defunding law enforcement and the military.
(8) Reparations for slavery.
(9) Universal basic income regardless of citizenship.
(10) Early release of criminals from prison.
(11) Recognize Black Lives Matter and ANTIFA as civil rights organizations.
(12) Cave to the UN and establish one world order.
(13) Green New Deal.
(14) Taxpayer funded abortions.
(15) Neuter the 1st Amendment.
(16) Neuter or abolish the 2nd Amendment incrementally.
(17) Complete public funding of colleges and universities.
(18) Relief of student debt.

Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) - a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers.

If this is what you want for the future of our nation then vote Democrat.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

In short, if the* PANDEMOCRATS* win, we are totally *SCREWED!*

*GW*


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

And to add a rampant rise in Racist giveaways. For example. They advocate giving a 15,000 credit to any new Black home owner. Two young people, just starting out, the Black family will receive the credit, the White family can go f off. Billions of dollars to Black colleges only. Sorry all others go F off. And it goes on and on.

They are out to destroy every thing that is good about this Country.

Some scumbag was on news the other day telling everyone it was OK to loot. Hey they are insured. Sick SOB


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

In a Democracy, the majority rules. If the majority decided they wanted your bike, they could take it. In a Republic, the bike is your property and you do not owe it to anyone. It cannot be taken against your will, by law. America is a Constitutional Republic. Therefore, the Constitution is the law by which we are supposed to be protected. In a Republic, the individual is protected FROM the majority, by the Constitutional law. A Constitutional Republic is what we were given. It is up to us to KEEP it.

*Constitutional Republic:*
A Constitutional Republic is a form of government where the head of state and other officials are elected as representatives of the people, representatives mandated to govern according to existing constitutional law. *It is because of this mandate that the elected class in a Constitutional Republic is limited in their power over the citizenry.* The United States of America was created as and intended to survive as a Constitutional Republic.

Our Constitutional Republic is separated into three separate but equal branches of government; the Executive, Legislative and Judicial, represented by the Presidency, Congress and the Courts. Because of this no branch has a rein on absolute power thus assuring that there will be checks and balances to the governmental system and protection for the rule of law.

Through the elected representation employed by our Constitutional Republic the influence of the majority is tempered by protections for individual rights as mandated by constitutional law. *Our form of government is deliberate in its attempt to thwart majoritarianism, thereby protecting political dissent and individuals and minority groups from the "tyranny of the majority" by placing checks on the power of the majority of the population.* The power of the majority of the people is checked by limiting that power to electing representatives who are required to legislate with limits of overarching constitutional law which a simple majority cannot modify.

*"A pure unbridled democracy is a political system in which the majority enjoys absolute power by means of democratic elections. In an unvarnished democracy, unrestrained by a constitution, the majority can vote to impose tyranny on themselves and the minority opposition. They can vote to elect those who will infringe upon our inalienable God-given rights. *Thomas Jefferson referred to this as elected despotism in Notes on the State of Virginia (also cited in Federalist 48 by Madison):"

*While establishing the foundation of a new fledgling nation. The founders of this country determined that there was no higher authority other than our "creator". They established that it was our "creator" who granted us our unalienable rights, not by mortal man. Only our "creator" can revoke those rights, not any elected government, government officials or the electorate. I don't think that the founders of our nation had our mothers and fathers in mind as "our creator"? *

*They founders had to set up a body of laws "The Bill of Rights" to prevent the government from enslaving it's people. Regardless of which political party is in power. That is why they fought and won a revolution. All government officials take an oath and are sworn to uphold those laws "so help them God". *

*As an American citizens we do indeed have those rights as specified in our "Constitution" under the "Bill of Rights". The words "endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights" were put there for reason. It really doesn't matter whether anyone is religious or believes in God or not. If that were the case we would have nothing but chaos, anarchy and an out of control government that could do whatever it wishes without any repercussions. Nazi Germany, Stalinist Russia, Pol Pot's Cambodia, Mao's Communist China etc. are only a few examples of what can happen when "others" do not recognize or accept our "God given rights". Who is to determine who or what is law abiding? The followers of Hitler were considered "law abiding" as they were carrying out the laws and wishes of their established government.*

*I know it's always been said around election time that this is the most important election.
However I have no doubt that: THIS IS INDEED THEE MOST IMPORTANT ELECTION OF OUR LIFETIME.*


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

I support those two homeowners in St Louis who stood in front of their house with guns in hand. If it comes to that, I have no concern about doing the same...and I have plenty of ammo.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

Goldwing said:


> In short, if the* PANDEMOCRATS* win, we are totally *SCREWED!*
> 
> *GW*


Out of all the elections of my lifetime and I've voted in every one since I turned 18. This IS without question the one that worries me the most. Even worse than when the black militant community organizer from Chicago was elected. The Democrat Party continues to grow more radical each election cycle. All one has to do is listen to members of The Squad, ANTIFA, BLM, Bolshevik Bernie, etc. The Democrat Party embraces them all with open arms. It's enough to scare the shit outta' any freedom loving American.

Biden is a feeble old man going senile and a contemptuous criminal who enriched his own life and family from his years of public service and influence. He's got more baggage behind him than America's busiest airports. I believe that he was put up to this by the Democrat Party in order to get the first black female president and will step down shortly after he is inaugurated if he wins the election. Turning the reins of power over to that miserable wretch that the Democrat Party chose as his running mate.

*In 1956 Nikita Khrushchev said: "We do not have to invade the United States, we will destroy you from within. We can't expect the American people to jump from capitalism to communism, but we can assist their elected leaders in giving them small doses of socialism, until they awaken one day to find that they have communism".*

*I believe that Khrushchev was aware of America's lax immigration system and the failure of immigrants both legal and illegal to assimilate into our culture. Along with failing to speak our language. He knew that eventually multiculturalism would do us in. We've made it too easy for people to come to the United States and live as though they've never left their home country. Except of course a life of poverty in the United States is far better than where they came from. For them it's like hitting the lottery courtesy of the American taxpayer.*


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## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

It would be nice to read a thread with a "political leaning" with out all the typical leftist democrat style name calling, slurring, and lying.

Trump is hated (feared) by the established career politicians because he is not one of them. He is a successful businessman and he acts and leads like a successful businessman and this is a great threat to the lifelong career politicians we have in congress...


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

https://video.parler.com/I6/Gp/I6GpphE6K4ZR.mp4


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Check out these video's. Scumbags go down. 
So what would be your preferred weapon in caught with Terrorist?

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/08/25/watch-man-shot-in-head-at-kenosha-riots/


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Jeb Stuart said:


> Check out these video's. Scumbags go down.
> So what would be your preferred weapon in caught with Terrorist?
> 
> https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2020/08/25/watch-man-shot-in-head-at-kenosha-riots/


That arm is a stump by now. That is why you want to be polite to a man with a scary black rifle.
NOW THAT IS GOING TO LEAVE A MARK !

GW


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Yea, it won't be raising that fist in the air the next time a American Flag is presented.

It looks like the guy with the Rifle was out to protect the Car Dealership which is just one of building etc. destroyed by the Terrorist.








https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...w-Kenosha.html


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

After reading and watching that. It sounds to me like those rioting savages got what they deserved. Good riddance to the two that were killed. Who the f'k needs them anyway? I guess one of them won't be riding his skateboard or rioting anymore? It doesn't look the shooter got the swine who kicked him in the head though? Too bad.

The guy that was shot in the arm was wearing a paramedics hat and had a pistol. I don't know what the story was with him? My guess is that he pulled his pistol on the man with the rifle and was subsequently shot in the arm? But I'm only guessing.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

https://spectator.org/minnesota-v-derek-chauvin-et-al-the-prosecutions-dirty-little-secret/

Seems the drug infested Floyd killed himself. Drowned in his own toxic drug infested body.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

Jeb Stuart said:


> https://spectator.org/minnesota-v-derek-chauvin-et-al-the-prosecutions-dirty-little-secret/
> 
> Seems the drug infested Floyd killed himself. Drowned in his own toxic drug infested body.


What's really troublesome about all of this is that the cops have already been tried and found guilty by the media. There's no way in hell that they're going to get a fair trial. If they're found not guilty in a court of law, what we're seeing going on today will look like a family picnic.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

They will be found guilty because they need a "Scapegoat". Not familiar or knowledgeable about the law. But it would seem to be a case that would go to a higher court of Appeals. At some point they are going to have to follow the law. (Hopefully) And they would have to be proven if a jury case, beyond a reasonable doubt. Hopefully, if so, there is at least one sensible, honest Human on the Jury.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

In my mind a convicted felon resisting a cop has already decided his own fate. Assholes with nothing to lose are the most dangerous type. 
They should be approached by the same numbers of cops that the cops face in the libby run cities during a riot.

GW


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Lol, they could give a flying Pig about Floyd. Heck they are shooting themselves to Pieces in Chicago, and other crap hole towns. Floyd just gave them a excuse to do what the love to do.


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## rickclark28 (Apr 14, 2019)

These people only care about power and will use any excuse to loot and cause harm. None of this with these groups will end well. No matter what you give them they want more.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> I refuse to vote for either of the sleaze bags. It goes against my principles and grain.
> 
> But, just to throw you a bone, my wife is going to vote for tRump.
> 
> You can call me whatever you want. But............don't you dare call me late for dinner.


Which side will you fight for ?? when the SHTF


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

If shit becomes revolutionary, I don't know if neutral exists.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

pic said:


> Which side will you fight for ?? when the SHTF


Not saying that it could never happen, but if it does, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> Not saying that it could never happen, but if it does, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.


Sure glad we can count on you PARASAIL!

GW


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## Dubar (Sep 8, 2019)

mdi said:


> It would be nice to read a thread with a "political leaning" with out all the typical leftist democrat style name calling, slurring, and lying.
> 
> Trump is hated (feared) by the established career politicians because he is not one of them. He is a successful businessman and he acts and leads like a successful businessman and this is a great threat to the lifelong career politicians we have in congress...


Best go reread the posts and get your facts straight, the only name calling I spotted was from the typical rightists.

Trump is hated because he's immoral, only cares about himself, and would/will throw his own family under the bus to get or keep what he wants. The problem as I see it in DC is that the Republicans and Democrats have let him do it. He has divided the country like never before and is inept at foreign relations. Again, he ONLY cares about himself.

If Trump and Biden are the only choices we have, the future looks very dark. We need true public leaders NOW and not a bunch of self-righteous scumbags either taking everything away or giving everything away.

I'm glad I'm old, wouldn't want to be my grand kids or even my kids, they're going to have a big bill coming they'll be stuck with having to pay back.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Dubar said:


> *Trump is hated because he's immoral, only cares about himself, and would/will throw his own family under the bus to get or keep what he wants.*


Opinions are fine, but you speak as an author. Where are the facts that back your "FEELINGS"?

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Goldwing said:


> Sure glad we can count on you PARASAIL!
> 
> GW


I never committed to anything or anyone.

If I don't believe in someone, I won't support or legitimize that individual. You present an individual that has some morals and scruples, and a proven track record, and I'll get on board.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Goldwing said:


> Opinions are fine, but you speak as an author. Where are the facts that back your "FEELINGS"?
> 
> GW


You're as bad as Sean Hannity! He's got his nose so far up tRump's butt, all you can see are the soles of his feet.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

If you like the way things are going being a proud veteran and career cop, you make me question what the hell happened to you?

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Goldwing said:


> If you like the way things are going being a proud veteran and career cop, you make me question what the hell happened to you?
> 
> GW


I don't like the way things are. Things change for a wide variety of reasons. I don't like the way LE is currently acting.

Not everything has to be resolved with lethal force. In my day, _hands on_ was an acceptable approach and resolution. I'm not going to go into a long and drawn-out speech here, in regards to how LE is handling things. But the short of it is, LE needs to be more willing to physically engage, rather than to present a firearm. I will leave it at that.

No, I'm not fond at all of the way things are going. I did my time in the barrel and I'm done with it. I'm now living out the rest of my life as hassle free as possible.

You show me an individual with some ethics, scruples, and as I've already mentioned, a proven track record, and that person will get my vote.

I think tRump received three if not more, military deferments. Maybe as many as five. I'm not sure. He's never worked an honest job in his pitiful life. He's had it all handed to him on a sliver platter since he could walk and talk. His own siblings think little of him.

Unlike you, I don't have a man-crush on the buffoon.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

The BLM and Antifa crap is insane. Support the men in Blue, EMT's, Firefighters or just get the f out of the Country. We are sick of being at War with the BLM and ANTIFA! Do not like Ameria? Move to Somalia are some other stick hole.
And F Gov Northam of VA


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## Dubar (Sep 8, 2019)

Goldwing said:


> Opinions are fine, but you speak as an author. Where are the facts that back your "FEELINGS"?
> 
> GW


Facts?!?!?! All you have to do is listen to him talk to know he's a pompous ass and has no idea of how an average person or family lives. If he'd keep his big mouth shut he just might gain some support, but he can't control himself. I agree with some of his policies, like *illegal* immigration (and the wall, but put it around California and/or Hollywood), but take away what he's done thru executive action and what has he really done for "the country" and not just his cronies or the religious fanatics?

His dictatorial behavior is ruining this country. Why does everything have to get HIS approval? Why can't agencies like the CDC, post office, and others make their own decisions based on their knowledge and expertise? He's got the pot so stirred up about voter fraud that no matter what the outcome it'll be a mess.

It makes me want to puke when I see Graham and McConnell (also Pelosi and some of the Dems) behave the way they do. *NONE *of them are doing what's good for the country, only their special interest groups.

Drain the swamp?!?!?! It's only gotten bigger and deeper the last 4 years.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

I am a average guy and family. He understands me just fine. To say that he has done nothing for the Country is just down right ignorant. Do some homework.
I laughed at your comment that he is a Dictator. Obviously you never even took a US Gov class. We still have the Senate and Congress not to mention the Legislative branch. 
You want to blame anyone, blame the Dem controlled Governors like the Piece of S*** in Virginia that is behind BLM.
Many times I wish President Trump was a Dictator. This Crap going on now would have been stopped a long time ago. 
I love Trump. Strong Leader. Without him this Country would be owned by either BLM or China. If Kallayala Harris becomes President, then you will get what you wish for and it will be the death of America.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

As I've mentioned before in the past, this is why I don't like to discuss P&R. Both are a complete joke. 

I think of everyone on here as a friend. I don't come here to argue or call each other names. It's just not worth it! 

Argue over politics or religion? I was perfectly happy arguing about Taurus's.


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## rickclark28 (Apr 14, 2019)

*Politicians have everyone turned on each other. They have divided the country. Civil unrest on a epic level is next. That is what you get when you let the anarchists and criminals get away with violence. 
*Lately I am not sure if we will make to election day. Many of us are sick and tired of the anarchy and lawlessness.


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## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

I would like to see any of the hateful allegations proven. The man that's immoral donating 100% of his salary? The man that took in a family (black too) that had a family tragedy? "Throw his children under the bus" for personal gain? I'd like to see one example of that! Instead of bowing to Arab nations and kissing Asian butts, he has stood up for America, American people and American lives. He has done more for this country than the muslim and whore monger that proceeded him, by far.Trump is hated, actually feared, because he is not the typical career politician, and they are threatened with having their gravy train taken away (name one democrat congressman that is not a millionaire and set with a huge pension for life). All the allegations against Trump are fabrications by leftist, fearful, hateful democrats and those dupes that believe their lies...


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

paratrooper said:


> As I've mentioned before in the past, this is why I don't like to discuss P&R. Both are a complete joke.
> 
> I think of everyone on here as a friend. I don't come here to argue or call each other names. It's just not worth it!
> 
> Argue over politics or religion? I was perfectly happy arguing about Taurus's.


Neither one of them is a joke. Both are very serious about what they want for the US. Biden's if elected and his policies will not be a joke when this country is taken over by BLM and the other Marxist factions. Trade, Immigration, and on and on is NOT a joke. 
It is also obvious that the Biden/Kamala ticket rarely speaks about all the issues facing the US and the World, but instead focus on one thing. BLM and trashing Trump. Why? Because they are not concerned about anything else. Meanwhile the world and our enemies will move even closer to harm the US. 
*Do you really believe that our Enemies are not taking total delight in seeing Americans destroy their own cities? *1500 business's in MN alone destroyed. My God Man! BLM and Antifa are doing their work for them.
Unfortunately the 2A rights are not a joke to either one. One is for protecting those rights and one is for taking them away. I for one, am not laughing.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

Nor am I. I fear we are on the verge of widespread confrontation, and some folks ought to consider the consequences of widespread civil unrest. Most of America will not stand by and allow their homes or families to be harmed, and most of America is white, non Hispanic or Latino according to Wikipedia. I don’t believe anyone is looking for this, but the actions of a few are planting the seeds for widespread racial division in the future. Agitators demonstrating for change are actually moving the racial divide in the opposite direction, imo.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Dubar said:


> Facts?!?!?! All you have to do is listen to him talk to know he's a pompous ass and has no idea of how an average person or family lives. If he'd keep his big mouth shut he just might gain some support, but he can't control himself. I agree with some of his policies, like *illegal* immigration (and the wall, but put it around California and/or Hollywood), but take away what he's done thru executive action and what has he really done for "the country" and not just his cronies or the religious fanatics?
> 
> His dictatorial behavior is ruining this country. Why does everything have to get HIS approval? Why can't agencies like the CDC, post office, and others make their own decisions based on their knowledge and expertise? He's got the pot so stirred up about voter fraud that no matter what the outcome it'll be a mess.
> 
> ...


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> I never committed to anything or anyone.
> 
> If I don't believe in someone, I won't support or legitimize that individual. You present an individual that has some morals and scruples, and a proven track record, and I'll get on board.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

BIDEN ? KAMALA ? 
You've got to be joking around. 
Devils advocate?

Or you're just a dummy. , lol


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I was done a long time ago,, trying to change stupid. 
It's embedded


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

My sister is committed to ignorance. She resists any info that does not support her point of view.
I blocked her calls today. 
If I engage her in a debate I win. If I win, she gets stupid and ruins the BILs day.


pic said:


> I was done a long time ago,, trying to change stupid.


I cannot agree more.

GW


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Dubar said:


> I agree with some of his policies, like *illegal* immigration (and the wall, but put it around California and/or Hollywood), but take away what he's done thru executive action and what has he really done for "the country" and not just his cronies or the religious fanatics?


WTF?


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Dubar said:


> His dictatorial behavior is ruining this country. Why does everything have to get HIS approval?


He is the President.

GW


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

I get sickened when I hear the nonsense of the left that Trump has done nothing. BS

I highly suggest all to listen to this Father talk about the attack on his daughter's school and her murder. 
At the disgusting and I repeat disgusting OBAMA "Restoritive Justice" policy, which blames Teachers and Parents for the behaviour of Students. OH, yes, I am very familiar with this policy which is one of the most insane policies to hit school systems. I could go on and on. 
Watch this, and then tell us that Trump does nothing. Just watch it!



https://www.breitbart.com/politics/...l&utm_term=down-range&utm_campaign=20200828dr


----------



## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

And as typical a lot of very vague, off the wall allegations are voiced, and some even believe them as facts. I believe if you are going to say something bout someone, yes even in politic, is to speak facts and not just parrot internet, or democrat "wisdom"...


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I think I mentioned previously that I know of a few individuals that have had the opportunity to know him personally to some degree.

Of the four individuals, three were adamant that he is a horse's ass, and the fourth individual, said that he was "okay," as long as you were on guard.

They are all professionals within their chosen career field. I'd trust any four of these guys with my life.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> They are all professionals within their chosen career field. I'd trust any four of these guys with my life.


Joe Biden and Kameltoe Harris are professionals in their fields. I don't trust them with shit.
By continuously criticizing TRUMP, You become an advocate For "Sniff and Blow" (Joe and Kameltoe)

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Goldwing said:


> Joe Biden and Kameltoe Harris are professionals in their fields. I don't trust them with shit.
> By continuously criticizing TRUMP, You become an advocate For "Sniff and Blow" (Joe and Kameltoe)
> 
> GW


You don't see or hear me praising or condoning Biden at all. Personal character plays a big part for me, when it comes to judging others. And yes, we all judge others at times, whether we admit to it or not.

We all know of some, that we would trust our lives with. We have that much confidence in them to acknowledge that.

When you decide to become a public servant (politician in this case), you open yourself up to full and complete inspection of your life. If you ain't up to the task, then maybe you shouldn't run for office or position.


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> I think I mentioned previously that I know of a few individuals that have had the opportunity to know him personally to some degree.
> 
> Of the four individuals, three were adamant that he is a horse's ass, and the fourth individual, said that he was "okay," as long as you were on guard.
> 
> They are all professionals within their chosen career field. I'd trust any four of these guys with my life.


What were they referring to ? Afraid of what ?
I would love to golf a round with TRUMP. 
He's gotta be a stitch ( lmao ) to be around.


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> You don't see or hear me praising or condoning Biden at all. Personal character plays a big part for me, when it comes to judging others. And yes, we all judge others at times, whether we admit to it or not.
> 
> We all know of some, that we would trust our lives with. We have that much confidence in them to acknowledge that.
> 
> When you decide to become a public servant (politician in this case), you open yourself up to full and complete inspection of your life. If you ain't up to the task, then maybe you shouldn't run for office or position.


Exactly why Joe Biden Stays well hidden. 
HE SURELY Isn't up for the task


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

pic said:


> What were they referring to ? Afraid of what ?
> I would love to golf a round with TRUMP.
> He's gotta be a stitch ( lmao ) to be around.


A general disdain for the _man_......and I use that term pretty loosely. His word doesn't mean squat to those that know him well. He doesn't accept blame for anything. And, he's not above making family members take a fall when he feels it's necessary.

He's not used to being told no, and he lets everyone know that. He thinks he knows more about most anything that might come up. I could go on and on, but it's not necessary.

I wouldn't walk across the street to sit down and share a pitcher or two of beer with him.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> A general disdain for the _man_......and I use that term pretty loosely. His word doesn't mean squat to those that know him well. He doesn't accept blame for anything. And, he's not above making family members take a fall when he feels it's necessary.
> 
> He's not used to being told no, and he lets everyone know that. He thinks he knows more about most anything that might come up. I could go on and on, but it's not necessary.
> 
> I wouldn't walk across the street to sit down and share a pitcher or two of beer with him.


Can't see the forest through the trees.
When a person focuses too much on small detail (trees), and misses the big picture (forest).

I surely believe the USA needs a strong military, the USA needs its manufacturing jobs. The right to bear arms.
The Democrats will start whittling away at everything I believe in.
I can go on and on.

I can't respect your opinion of your leftist views , I can't change it. Not trying.
I'm not upset, you're very intelligent.

The Trump haters of today are looking at the little picture.
In the big picture we need Trump to win this election.

I can't believe you never mention the Democrats rioting and looting ?
Who's behind these riots, it's organized.
*Blaming it all on Trumps personality is not reasonable. 
I would like to hear real issues that you don't agree with about Trump*
The attacks in DC , it's all Trumps fault.
The Trump haters are not seeing the forest through the Trees


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

For the last several elections, for me it’s been an issue of which is the better of two bad choices. Sad situation, but that is where this country is and has been for 25 years. If you want to pay more taxes, turn everything you have over to the government, pay for more free lunches for kids of parents who have no parental responsibility, and give up your right to self defense, vote Democrat. If not, vote Republican. Individuals don’t matter in the grand scheme of things, or should I say they matter less to Democrats than to Republicans.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

*BLM's Perpetual Fake Outrage Cycle*
Here we go again: Manufacture. Rinse. Repeat.

Everyone knows the cycle. Everyone knows it ends with false and incomplete narratives eventually being debunked by actual facts. Everyone knows that the racial mythmakers and political opportunists end up with fame, wealth and glory - but never any criminal punishments or moral accountability.

Everyone knows, yet on and on and on it goes.

Step 1: Spread out-of-context video clip of Black man subdued or shot by white cops across national media airwaves and social media platforms.

Step 2: Riot.

Step 3: Accuse law enforcement and America of "systemic racism," decry police brutality and demand "justice" for fill-in-the-blank "victim."

Step 4: Riot.

Step 5. Enter Al Sharpton, Benjamin Crump, Black Lives Matter chief propagandist Shaun King, and the rest of the racial hoax crime brigade.

Step 6: Persecute and prosecute involved police officers.

Step 7: Burn, loot and maraud nationwide.

Step 8: Demand more funding for "restorative justice," "alternative" policing, sensitivity training and "anti-racism" programs.

Step 9: Bury all evidence of justified police action while screaming, "Racism!" ever louder.

Step 10: Lie in wait for the next opportunity to return to Step 1.

*https://www.amren.com/commentary/2020/08/blms-perpetual-fake-outrage-cycle/*


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

pic said:


> Can't see the forest through the trees.
> When a person focuses too much on small detail (trees), and misses the big picture (forest).
> 
> I surely believe the USA needs a strong military, the USA needs its manufacturing jobs. The right to bear arms.
> ...


*Just for the record,* I've never blamed tRump for any of the rioting or looting. Not once. If anyone was to blame it would be LE, and I've stated that already.

I'm not hoping, nor am I expecting, anyone to change my views. Just like I am not expecting to change anyone's views. My views are what they are. They are just views and/or opinions that I express from time to time.

I dislike the Democrats. Never have had any use for them. I tend to lean right, and that too, has been stated previously.

And, be assured, I can see the forest for the trees. I just don't get lost in them like so many tend to do.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> I've never blamed tRump for any of the rioting or looting. Not once.* If anyone was to blame it would be LE,* and I've stated that already.


Parasail, have you ever considered the D.A. in Hennipin county that sat on the exculpatory George Floyd autopsy for nearly three months while major cities burned in riots because they had predetermined the guilt of the cops involved?
How in hell is it the cops fault that Floyd had enough FENTANYL in him that he would have died sitting in a chair at home?
Your logic is flawed, your sources are biased. 
Yeah, blame the cops!
Make sure you don't blame the felons that fight with the cops when they are at risk of going back to prison if they get arrested one more time. That would be racist wouldn't it?
GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

In the case of George Floyd, as well as Jacob Blake, there was absolutely no reason for LE in both matters, to act as they did.

Floyd was cuffed and laying prone. No need for a continued knee on his neck. Blake didn't need to be shot 7 times in the back. Once would have sufficed. There were three or four cops on scene, and they couldn't physically control him?

I'm as pro-cop as it gets. But, that doesn't mean they get a free pass no matter what they do.....or don't do.

My point is, LE has backed away from _hands-on control_, and too quick to use lethal force. LE is not the judge, jury and executioner.

And, I'm not giving criminals a free pass either. It's a fine line that needs to be walked when you're in LE. You either do it successfully, or you don't. No one is right 100% of the time.

My logic is flawed? You're the one with the......."My way or the highway" mindset.

At least I do my best to keep an open mind and be considerate as to what others may think or believe.

AFAIK, I've never personally criticized anyone on here for their political beliefs. And yes, I've made critical remarks in regards to both sides of the political aisle.

When it comes to expressing your opinions, it might be best to stick to plumbing. You're a long ways away from being any kind or sort of an authority when it comes to LE tactics and procedures.

Last time I checked, LE is still composed of humans. That makes them just as vulnerable to mistakes as anyone else. Problem is, their mistakes can mean life or death for others.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

I will have to call BS on all that. Might want to read up on the latest news about Blake. I mean a whole slew of information now out. Everything the left wing media put out was a lie. He did in fact have a knife. If he had a gun or used the knife the cops could have been killed. Not Blakes first rodeo with the cops and guns either. Blake was a dirtbag. Just a piece of scum. A violent thug and nothing good..
Why is it that crap like him never have to be accountable for their actions? He had every opportunity to stop and obey the police. And if he had taken the car (which was not his) with those kids in the back seat would have been a much worse scenario. 
I suppose if you were the cops you would have backed away and if he had a gun you might very well be DEAD and worse for the kids.


----------



## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Jeb Stuart said:


> I will have to call BS on all that. Might want to read up on the latest news about Blake. I mean a whole slew of information now out. Everything the left wing media put out was a lie. He did in fact have a knife. If he had a gun or used the knife the cops could have been killed. Not Blakes first rodeo with the cops and guns either. Blake was a dirtbag. Just a piece of scum. A violent thug and nothing good..
> Why is it that crap like him never have to be accountable for their actions? He had every opportunity to stop and obey the police. And if he had taken the car (which was not his) with those kids in the back seat would have been a much worse scenario.
> I suppose if you were the cops you would have backed away and if he had a gun you might very well be DEAD and worse for the kids.


You're as bad as "plumber's butt" ( GW ). Don't know what you do for a living, but I know it's not LE related.

I can't even begin to count the number of dirt bags I dealt with over the course of my career. Never felt the need to kill them though, just cause they were dirt bags.

They were indeed held accountable. I made sure of that. Those that didn't want to comply, did so, on my terms.

Your understanding of LE, the law, and how it is applied, is very rudimentary. Almost to the point of being crude. Both LE and citizens must function under society's accepted norms and practices.

There's a learning curve in LE. You can be the best book smart guy on the laws around, but if you don't know how to apply them, it will come back and bite you hard on the butt.

In both the Floyd and Blake cases, LE didn't perform as was expected. It's just that simple and straight forward.


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Lol, the damn tasers did not even work on Blake. Funny but I bet all the cops out there will disagree with you. So what would you have done. Wait until after he went into the car and see if it was just a baloney sandwich he was going after?
And no matter how you cut it, F Blake, would not be in the condition he is in now if he just obeyed the f'inging law. And no matter how you cut it, a dirt bag is off the streets.

Again, read this about scum bag Floyd:

*An Active-Duty Officer Analyzes the Latest George Floyd Video*
*https://www.amren.com/commentary/20...ficer-analyzes-the-latest-george-floyd-video/*


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

The Icon of a Terrorist! BLM is a Terror Organzation that is tearing our Country apart.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

"If you don't take CONTROL of the situation, the situation will take CONTROL of you!"

Take a few moments, think about that, and let it sink in.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> In the case of George Floyd, as well as Jacob Blake, there was absolutely no reason for LE in both matters, to act as they did.
> 
> Floyd was cuffed and laying prone. No need for a continued knee on his neck. Blake didn't need to be shot 7 times in the back. Once would have sufficed. There were three or four cops on scene, and they couldn't physically control him?
> 
> ...


What makes you think you know the facts of the situation before and after. 
You're prejudiced against the blue, goes back along way, none of my business. 
You've never backed the blue on this forum.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

pic said:


> What makes you think you know the facts of the situation before and after.
> You're prejudiced against the blue, goes back along way, none of my business.
> You've never backed the blue on this forum.


You've said some misguided things in the past, but this one takes the cake.

"Against the blue"? Seriously? I'm all for good cops that have an idea as to what in the Hell they're doing. Those that are clueless, well, there's only so much that you can do.

I saw the same video as you did. You don't have to be a PHD to see that things went south in a real hurry. The cops were supposed to be in charge of the situation. They lost control, and then had to resort to* EXTREME* measures to regain control.

What was wrong with physically standing in front of the suspect and stopping him from walking away? Why wasn't an impact baton deployed? He was on the ground at one point, and then he wasn't. Two or more officers on-scene, and he still got up and walked away from them?

Shot 7 times, point blank in the back? Who in the Hell does that?

LE is a full-on contact sport. It is from day #1 when you start, and day # whatever until you retire.

Re-read my statement in post #79......and take your time doing so.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> You've said some misguided things in the past, but this one takes the cake.
> 
> "Against the blue"? Seriously? I'm all for good cops that have an idea as to what in the Hell they're doing. Those that are clueless, well, there's only so much that you can do.
> 
> ...


You're arm chair quarterbacking with a definite conclusion based on media reports. 
You should especially know things are not always how they appear. 
And you should especially know there are always two sides to every story.

I didn't mean to upset you I'm sorry. 
But you're very critical of your brothers in blue based on information the media serves. I'm sorry. Don't get mad.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> In the case of George Floyd, as well as Jacob Blake, there was absolutely no reason for LE in both matters, to act as they did.


They were both felons resisting arrest. Floyd was on his way to an overdose death before the cops showed up. What transpired between the drug addled Floyd and the officers during a felony arrest would have turned out much differently had Floyd complied with the officers.

Blake was going for a knife when he was shot. Not being an "AUTHORITY" that knows everything about law enforcement like you PARASAIL, don't you continue with force until the threat is eliminated?
Maybe just wing the perp so he can cut up your partner before you beg him to stop?

Tell us PARASAIL, What was the proper way as a good democrat to handle these incidents?

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

It's no use trying to make any sense to you guys. You're going to believe what you are programmed to believe and think.

I've been in those situations many, many times. Been there and done that! They weren't anything special or unusual.

It doesn't take me months to come to some sort of a conclusion. You have video! What in the Hell else do you need?

In all careers and professions, there are professionals and there those who are nothing more than a warm body showing up for work to earn a paycheck. They don't go above and beyond the call of duty, as they come to realize the pay is the same.

There are plenty of warm bodies in LE, as in *ANY* profession. I'm proud to state that I was more than just a warm body. No brag.......just fact.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> It's no use trying to make any sense to you guys. You're going to believe what you are programmed to believe and think.
> 
> I've been in those situations many, many times. Been there and done that! They weren't anything special or unusual.
> 
> ...


Great non-answer! You sound just like some democrat Congressmen I have listened to recently.

Now seriously, what would YOU have done with Blake, a known violent felon with a warrant on him, after he has been tased and fought his way loose from several officers and is doing his very best to get his hands on a deadly weapon?
On the other hand, how about George Floyd, also a violent felon who has taken a lethal amount of FENTANYL, is attempting another felony, and is resisting arrest. Keep in mind that Floyd was 6'4" and 223 pounds. By the way EMTs had been called to treat Floyds' respiratory issues prior.
You blame the cops who send suspects to liberal prosecutors who enjoy releasing the skunks without any incentive for them to return for trial and possible sentencing.
Please tell us how "MORE THAN A WARM BODY" gets the job done. You are the authority, right?

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Naw.......I'm done with this. No use explaining to someone who has a closed mind. That, and I don't have the motivation to waste any more time on you.

Like I said previously, with you, it's your way or the highway. If I ever have any questions about PVC pipe or plumber's dope though, I'll know who to ask.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> Naw.......I'm done with this. No use explaining to someone who has a closed mind. That, and I don't have the motivation to waste any more time on you.
> 
> Like I said previously, with you, it's your way or the highway. If I ever have any questions about PVC pipe or plumber's dope though, I'll know who to ask.


Great! Another non-answer from the authority on how cops get the job done.
You state that these officers did it all wrong but when I ask our resident authority on the subject what is the correct way to solve the problem that the officers in question got wrong you reply that the discussion is over.
If you want to disparage my career choice have at it, PARASAIL. 
One question, when is the last time you received a non-government funded paycheck?

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I'm a caring and compassionate guy, so I'm gonna help you out some.

What part of......._*I don't have the motivation to waste any more time on you*_.......are you struggling with?

Can you zero in on the part that's confusing you?


----------



## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

paratrooper said:


> I'm a caring and compassionate guy, so I'm gonna help you out some.
> 
> What part of......._*I don't have the motivation to waste any more time on you*_.......are you struggling with?
> 
> Can you zero in on the part that's confusing you?





paratrooper said:


> There are plenty of warm bodies in LE, as in *ANY* profession. I'm proud to state that I was more than just a warm body. No brag.......just fact.


I can waste plenty of time arguing with someone who makes his point about how the cops were warm bodies and then has no response when asked what the correct actions by the cops should have been.
Since PARASAIL claims to have the answer, I am interested to hear it.

GW


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Yep, tasered twice and shot 7 times. I wonder what this guys drug test will look like. I bet the cop did not even realize 7 shots were fired. Things were happening fast, this guy was not going down and he was scared to death. And who would not be?

Here is what the cops should have done. Drove up and saw a group of African Americans doing their thing fighting and just then drove on. Never stopped and even got out. A no win situation. 
And why did they call the cops in the first place? They hate them.


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## rickclark28 (Apr 14, 2019)

No win situation for LE in any situation these days when it comes to some communities. The left has run these cities for decades and have done NO one any good. I am ashamed at the way the leaders of both parties have failed the rule of law. Letting the anarchist and left wing socialist groups get away with looting and rioting. It is long over due and the time has come to back LE and take back the streets. Selling out the men and women in LE should have consequences so the media and politicians should pay the price. The marxist are getting a foothold and NO one seems to care.


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## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

I have had to deal with some high power businessmen in the past. All high level successful businessmen are not soft spoken, meek/mild, or "nice guys". To some that come from a political standpoint, those ignorant of successful businessmen, Mr. Trump may come off ah a "horses ass", but in the wishy washy, flip flop, lying world of politics decisive, authoritative actions/talk is necessary, which is rare in congress today...


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

No name calling allowed . ( parasail )
Parasail was a stitch, but paratrooper isn't a parasail, lol.
Let's have fun.....
Adult fun ( old farts )

Let's get it under control guys. Myself included.

This is the best HANGUNFORUM.NET in the free world


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I cut down 21 dead ash trees, I can't move my body.
It was husqvarna vs stihl. 
I rented a 60 Foot articulating boom lift. 
*Everything had to be pieced out.*
Unbelievable, I'll never do that again.

Tomorrow into the creek to buck up what had to go into the creek.

Estimates were 300$ per tree plus


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Emerald ash borer, I'm gonna kill that bastard when I see him ,lol.


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Two gallons of bar oil, when you mix your chain saw gas you need to use ethanol free gas.
Two sets of files, two extra chains.
Finding a chain for the husqvarna was difficult, it was an older quality husqvarna


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Most of you guys are okay............until the subject of P or R comes up.

Then you all get all bat $hit crazy and stuff.................


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> Most of you guys are okay............until the subject of P or R comes up.
> 
> The you all get all bat $hit crazy and stuff.................


Including you,,, you cocksucker. , lol
Love , love, love


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

That's a new word I didn't realize I was using cutting down the trees.
Grandkids were exposed to my outdoor communication skills. Lmao. 

My daughter called me and said the kids were mimicking grandpas vocabulary,,,lmao

It's universal


----------



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I asked my daughter what did I say ?
I was shocked when my daughter repeated those words back to me. Lmao


----------



## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

People calling me names has rarely bothered me, except when some one called me a democrat...


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Those that call me names, almost never concern me. 

But.....it was the ones that just stood there, starring at me, that put me on edge (guard).


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## Dubar (Sep 8, 2019)

rickclark28 said:


> Politicians have everyone turned on each other


You left out the media and online forums/internet in general. Topics like this is what gets folks collective panties in a wad.

I come to gun forums to learn about guns and try not to comment on political and religious topics, but sometimes I have to speak my opinion otherwise the people I disagree with will run rampant. I wish forums like this would shut down the P&R stuff, no need for it on a gun forum. If you want to talk about P, R, or even 2A, it should be done on forums dedicated to those topics.

There's agitators on both sides.


----------



## Dubar (Sep 8, 2019)

Goldwing said:


> He is the President.
> 
> GW


So he loads his work day up with day-to-day stuff that really isn't in his wheelhouse. Why does the president have to be the deciding factor on ALL things when there's people already in charge of government agencies (CDC, FBI, CIA, USPS, etc) who get paid big bucks to run them? Let them do their job(s).

As it stands, the job is too big for 1 person to handle. POTUS ought to be nothing more than a figure head and let the real decisions be made by competent elected officials. Of course we have to find some and vote them into office first. Do you want POTUS making decisions about what little Johnnie eats for lunch, or do you want him to worry about getting the economy on track and protecting our country and ensuring people get a fair shake?

Better yet, define the duties of president as foreign relations and elect a 2nd president (or use the VP) as in charge of domestic relations. As it is Trump has mired himself down into the weeds of everyday matters that don't allow him (or any other president) to be effective.

President of Foreign Relations, President of Domestic Relations...I like the sound of that. They could even be from different parties!!!


----------



## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Dubar said:


> You left out the media and online forums/internet in general. Topics like this is what gets folks collective panties in a wad.
> 
> I come to gun forums to learn about guns and try not to comment on political and religious topics, but sometimes I have to speak my opinion otherwise the people I disagree with will run rampant. I wish forums like this would shut down the P&R stuff, no need for it on a gun forum. If you want to talk about P, R, or even 2A, it should be done on forums dedicated to those topics.
> 
> There's agitators on both sides.


I'm a long time member of a m/c forum. They too, used to have a P&R section. They did away with it some time ago.

It got pretty bad and caused a lot of trouble. Now.....if you bring up a P&R topic, you will be warned once. Twice, and you get banned for good.

Looking back, most everyone is happy it's gone.


----------



## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Where Antifa terrorist originate. Study Marxism and the revolution going on today and you see their roots start in the many liberal colleges. A great article was written on this. The Biden Snowflakes.

Here is a example.

*https://www.breitbart.com/tech/2020...-offers-course-on-how-to-overthrow-the-state/*


----------



## Slowalkintexan (Feb 6, 2007)

Time for this to be closed.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Slowalkintexan said:


> Time for this to be closed.


I second the motion.


----------



## mdi (Jan 11, 2020)

These kind of discussions can go on forever with never a consensus or even a neutral meeting point arrived. So, I'm done...


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

Goodby, These Country is not don


paratrooper said:


> I second the motion.


Of Course you do. Close the thread. Not politically correct. The truth hurts, cannot handle the truth. No one here getting on their Knees to suck up to these dirtbags, and that bothers a whole lot of people. NO! you do not want anyone to NOT be politically correct. Agree with you and suck it up. Now here is what is so interesting. NO ONE EVER TOLD YOU OR GAVE YOU A ORDER TO RESPOND, COMMENT ETC OR EVEN POST! But now YOU want to shut it down. LOL, sorry dude, we still have freedom of speach and do not get on our knees for your left wing "politically correct, shut down the First Amendment" crap. 
You want to LEAVE then for God sake LEAVE, but do not tell anyone to SHUT DOWN anythiing. How dare you? Just leave us alone!


----------



## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Jeb Stuart said:


> Goodby, These Country is not don
> 
> Of Course you do. Close the thread. Not politically correct. The truth hurts, cannot handle the truth. No one here getting on their Knees to suck up to these dirtbags, and that bothers a whole lot of people. NO! you do not want anyone to NOT be politically correct. Agree with you and suck it up. Now here is what is so interesting. NO ONE EVER TOLD YOU OR GAVE YOU A ORDER TO RESPOND, COMMENT ETC OR EVEN POST! But now YOU want to shut it down. LOL, sorry dude, we still have freedom of speach and do not get on our knees for your left wing "politically correct, shut down the First Amendment" crap.
> You want to LEAVE then for God sake LEAVE, but do not tell anyone to SHUT DOWN anythiing. How dare you? Just leave us alone!


Blah, blah, blah........go on and get it off your chest. Don't close it down. I don't give a damn either way.

Discussing P&R on here gets no one anywhere fast. No matter what anyone of us might say, it won't change a damn thing.

BTW.....since I started the thread, I was just giving my okay to shut it down if deemed appropriate.

You sure do get offended easily enough. You one of those _snowflakes_ that people mention from time to time?

And, this is a privately run forum. There are no Constitutional Rights here. You might be better off going to a P&R forum that welcomes such nonsense.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

If some people on this forum wish to continue on this topic, I see no reason to close it. For those that wish to close it, just don't respond to it, ignore it and go on to something else. This way those who wish to continue this discussion will still have the freedom to do so. Pretty simple concept, huh?

I do this every time a Democrat has something to say. I'll either change the channel or hit the mute button or simply not read it. I'd be willing to bet that there are many Democrats that do the same with Republicans? But as much as I both loathe and despise the Democrats and just about every God damn thing that they represent. They still have the same right to express their opinions as I do.

It's the same with the 2nd Amendment. If somebody does not wish to exercise that right, I'm fine with that. But they have no right telling the rest of us that we do not have that right.

Once we are willing to relinquish any one of our civil liberties we will begin to lose them all. As members of a gun forum who's civil liberties are constantly under attack that shouldn't be too hard to understand?


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## Jeb Stuart (Jan 19, 2020)

-


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Jeb Stuart said:


> Lol, you Do, give a damn, got [email protected] And the comments here DO get commented fast! We Americans with honorr do hate your liberal commie attacks. And guess what? Every time you post, True Americans will be there to SHUT your ugly face down.


As I've mentioned in the past, I do lean to the right. It's just that I'm not in love with politicians or politics.

I'm not a commie nor a liberal. Period! I don't get caught up in all the BS that accompanies both subjects.

I've yet to see any one individual or any one political party destroy this country of ours. You simply cannot please 100% of the people 100% of the time. Ain't never gonna happen.

Oh, and before I forget, what is your definition of a True American?


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

When a forum member posts links to lefty outlets like yahoo, or huffington etc, and never from a conservative source, I take notice. When I state my conservative point of view and said forum member says "I'm done with you." rather than debate the merits of their point of view, I take notice.
It is chicken shit to accuse and then when there might be some doubt about the members facts, game over.

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Is that you squeaking again GW? 

A little WD-40 in the right place will take care of that.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Yeah, you're really clever. Almost changed my mind about being a conservative pro Second Amendment, Pro Life, Anti-Socialist kind of American man. 
Almost. But I will never try to be non-committal and have things both ways. I will stand for the things that make this country great. 
You can keep posting your tripe.

GW


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Dubar said:


> So he loads his work day up with day-to-day stuff that really isn't in his wheelhouse. Why does the president have to be the deciding factor on ALL things when there's people already in charge of government agencies (CDC, FBI, CIA, USPS, etc) who get paid big bucks to run them? Let them do their job(s).
> 
> As it stands, the job is too big for 1 person to handle. POTUS ought to be nothing more than a figure head and let the real decisions be made by competent elected officials. Of course we have to find some and vote them into office first. Do you want POTUS making decisions about what little Johnnie eats for lunch, or do you want him to worry about getting the economy on track and protecting our country and ensuring people get a fair shake?
> 
> ...


Are you joking ? Just a figure head. 
The corruption within the agencies you've mentioned is unacceptable. 
They just tried to unseat a rightfully elected president. 
Why ?


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> Those that call me names, almost never concern me.
> 
> But.....it was the ones that just stood there, starring at me, that put me on edge (guard).


Maybe they don't understand your political logic. 
You don't vote, you don't have a horse in the game. 
But your views (posts) stir up political debate. 
Why comment about politics in a progressive stand when most gun forums
Are not progressive??


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

pic said:


> Maybe they don't understand your political logic.
> You don't vote, you don't have a horse in the game.
> But your views (posts) stir up political debate.
> Why comment about politics in a progressive stand when most gun forums
> Are not progressive??


I don't own a Dodge, but I have opinions on them. I was in LE for 30 yrs., but yet if I make an observation about it, and it doesn't fit the agenda or narrative of others, I hear about it.

If you weren't in LE, maybe you shouldn't comment about it.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> I don't own a Dodge, but I have opinions on them. I was in LE for 30 yrs., but yet if I make an observation about it, and it doesn't fit the agenda or narrative of others, I hear about it.
> 
> If you weren't in LE, maybe you shouldn't comment about it.


My family was all law enforcement.
The old timers didn't like the new and upcoming full of piss n vinegar policeman.
I don't know how big your department was , but many policemen couldn't stand each other. Lots of politics involved.
Maybe that's why you're critical of the blue, something might have happened along the way , maybe not.
Policemen don't get along with each other like people assume.
There are Major separations or Clicks happening.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

My point was and still is, I was never critical of the right. But.....my feelings about tRump are pretty clear. 

No need for me to elaborate again, but he's a far cry from being moral and/or ethical. Not at all deserving to be POTUS. 

We can and should have done far better.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> My point was and still is, I was never critical of the right. But.....my feelings about tRump are pretty clear.
> 
> No need for me to elaborate again, but he's a far cry from being moral and/or ethical. Not at all deserving to be POTUS.
> 
> We can and should have done far better.


I understand your feelings about Trump,,,I just don't agree. 
If Biden wins the economy will tank into darkness, if trump wins ,we all win


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

How many times I was in an elevator loaded with cops. 
As the elevator was emptying, I could hear comments all the time. 
He's all COP, that f,,in arsehole. 
I've seen cops go fist to fist. 
Don't tell me your law enforcement career was peaches n cream


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Cops hang out with cops, that becomes their social life.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Road patrol usually retires in 20 years, unless you're a detective or investigator.
You can only take that road patrol radio for so long before you break down


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## Slowalkintexan (Feb 6, 2007)

My goodness, Jeb, and Para..,.whatever....you guys do get a little heated up...
That’s good, we do need comic relief, and that’s what you two are.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

paratrooper said:


> I don't own a Dodge, but I have opinions on them. I was in LE for 30 yrs., but yet if I make an observation about it, and it doesn't fit the agenda or narrative of others, I hear about it.
> 
> *If you weren't in LE, maybe you shouldn't comment about it.*


At least for me it's not about being in law enforcement or not? It's about the concept of innocent until proven guilty. Those cops were tried and found guilty by the news media, not in a court of law. As a result riots and looting are taking place in major cities all across America continuously for well over 90 days. Innocent people's businesses and lives have been destroyed.

Other than two short film clips that were shown to the entire nation none of us was there to witness what actually took place before those shootings. It just seems to me that if the suspects cooperated with the police those shootings wouldn't have happened? I doubt very much that those cops just couldn't wait to blow away the first black person they encountered? They've probably arrested dozens of blacks without incident during their careers.

I certainly would not want to be a cop that's for sure. They're damned if they do and damned if they don't. Now they've got to deal with a hostile media and politicians out to sensationalize their every move for ratings and political power. Because of that there is no way in hell that those cops will get a fair trial. If found not guilty what's happening now will seem like a peaceful family picnic. You can count on that.

Unfortunately this is what has become of our country. God help us if it happens to any one of us. As the media along with over zealous prosecutors are already vilifying anyone who try's to defend themselves with a firearm.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

pic said:


> I understand your feelings about Trump,,,I just don't agree.
> If Biden wins the economy will tank into darkness, if trump wins ,we all win


It's not about Trump. The bottom line is that if he is not elected to a second term along with the Democrats controlling both houses. We can pretty much kiss our 2nd Amendment rights good bye and The United States of America will become a socialist welfare state. That has been the Democrats intentions all along. Those who are dependent on government to sustain them are the Democrat's core constituency. They vote for the hand that feeds them.

I could not stand Mitt Romney, McCain or Jeff Flake but held my nose and voted for them. As it was more important for me that the Republicans had some control over the government. For the time being they've held off the inevitable. However it's only a matter of time before the United States is no different than any third world aristocracy ruled by oligarchs.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Nothing better than an actual video of an incident. I stand by my statement that cops need to get back to basics, and that being using more of a hands-on approach. 

Nothing can be said that justifies an individual being shot point blank range in the back.......7 times. 

No need to keep a knee on an individual's neck when he is prone, face down on the ground, and cuffed, and you have three other officers with you. 

Piss poor judgement on the officers' actions. There's a price to be paid. 

You show me a justified use of force and I'm all for it. You show me some BS and it won't fly.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> Nothing better than an actual video of an incident. I stand by my statement that cops need to get back to basics, and that being using more of a hands-on approach.
> 
> Nothing can be said that justifies an individual being shot point blank range in the back.......7 times.
> 
> ...


We have major protests happening in Rochester Ny, the subject was spitting on the police and telling them he had covid. 
He was walking down the street naked. Died a week later with traces of pcp in his blood

I only read parts of the article, didn't watch the video.

https://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/202...ed-in-asphyxiation-death/7511599159631/?ur3=1


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

_If you weren't in LE, maybe you shouldn't comment about it._
My thought is that some people either can't or won't learn lessons that keep on being taught every day in America.
1) Do not disobey the law.
2) When you can't obey rule #1, take your medicine when you get caught. Be nice.
3) The cops would prefer not to shoot your stupid law breaking ass so don't encourage them to do so?

GW


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

https://images.app.goo.gl/4xpRDnJGDyy7NeR99

Rochester mayor is black along with the police chief, yet they call it a white racial systemic killing


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

paratrooper said:


> Nothing better than an actual video of an incident. I stand by my statement that cops need to get back to basics, and that being using more of a hands-on approach.
> 
> Nothing can be said that justifies an individual being shot point blank range in the back.......7 times.
> 
> ...


Maybe it was, but that's for a court of law to decide, not us, the media or anyone else that was not actually there. That's the whole concept of innocent until proven guilty. You'd better be careful of what you wish for.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

desertman said:


> Maybe it was, but that's for a court of law to decide, not us, the media or anyone else that was not actually there. That's the whole concept of innocent until proven guilty. You'd better be careful of what you wish for.


That's part of the whole problem with the justice system. Takes way too long for a court hearing / trial, and death sentences languish for decades at a time.

You think trial lawyers want a fast and speedy trial? Hell no! A fast trial doesn't always mean justice denied.

What's to debate in the Blake incident? You have a clear and accurate depiction of what occurred.

He was on the ground at one point, and then he wasn't. Rather than jumping on his ass, or using impact batons, the cops chose to follow him with their duty weapons drawn to see what he was going to do. What's so wrong with physically standing in front of him, blocking him from evading them?

No matter how many times you watch the video, or tear it down frame by frame, the outcome ain't gonna change.

No justification at all for how the officer in question responded.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Goldwing said:


> _If you weren't in LE, maybe you shouldn't comment about it._
> My thought is that some people either can't or won't learn lessons that keep on being taught every day in America.
> 1) Do not disobey the law.
> 2) When you can't obey rule #1, take your medicine when you get caught. Be nice.
> ...


I couldn't agree more! What's so hard about obeying the law? Well.....apparently many find it to be very challenging indeed.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

paratrooper said:


> That's part of the whole problem with the justice system. Takes way too long for a court hearing / trial, and death sentences languish for decades at a time.
> 
> You think trial lawyers want a fast and speedy trial? Hell no! A fast trial doesn't always mean justice denied.
> 
> ...


Getting into the problems with our criminal justice system is a whole other issue. But the bottom line is that under our system of government you are still innocent until proven guilty.

No I don't have a clear and accurate depiction of what occurred in the Blake incident. I wasn't there, I only saw what the media wanted me to see and hear. For all I know the person who called the police might have warned them that Blake was armed and dangerous? That he already threatened to kill the caller? Told the caller that he would kill the police when they arrived? All hypothetical of course but possible nonetheless. At any rate that will all be up to a court to decide. Not you, me or the media. That's my whole point.


*Fact check: Jacob Blake faces assault charge, has no gun ...*
www.usatoday.com/story/news/factcheck/2020/08/28/...
Aug 28, 2020 · It is true that Blake did have an active warrant for sexual assault and several other crimes related to domestic violence at the time he was shot. But Blake not convicted of any prior gun offenses.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

desertman said:


> Getting into the problems with our criminal justice system is a whole other issue. But the bottom line is that under our system of government you are still innocent until proven guilty.
> 
> No I don't have a clear and accurate depiction of what occurred in the Blake incident. I wasn't there, I only saw what the media wanted me to see and hear. For all I know the person who called the police might have warned them that Blake was armed and dangerous? That he already threatened to kill the caller? Told the caller that he would kill the police when they arrived? All hypothetical of course but possible nonetheless. At any rate that will all be up to a court to decide. Not you, me or the media. That's my whole point.
> 
> ...


I had heard that the caller was his own wife or g/f. She had a restraining order and he wasn't supposed to be at the house.

Yes, a dirt-bag, but the fact remains, LE lost control and it cost them dearly. Can you imagine the monetary settlement that is going to evolve from all of this? That's money out of the tax-payer's pockets.

And, I'm saying that our current criminal justice system isn't perfect by any means. It needs to be over-hauled badly.

Not every single incident needs to be studied under a micro-scope for months, or even years at a time. There-in lies part of the problem.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

paratrooper said:


> I had heard that the caller was his own wife or g/f. She had a restraining order and he wasn't supposed to be at the house.
> 
> Yes, a dirt-bag, but the fact remains, LE lost control and it cost them dearly. Can you imagine the monetary settlement that is going to evolve from all of this? That's money out of the tax-payer's pockets.
> 
> ...


Again it's not up to you, I or anyone else that wasn't there to decide whether LE lost control or not. It's up to the court after all of the evidence is presented. The cops will have their day in court, if found guilty they will get what is coming to them. I have no problem with that.

What's really f'ked up is if they are found not guilty the riots, looting and destruction of both private and public property will continue. All with the blessing of the Democrat Party and their minions in the media. It's gotten to the point that I don't trust the media any more than I trust the Democrats. The media is in it for ratings and the Democrats are in it for absolute power and control. They both have an agenda that's destroying our Constitutional Republic.

I agree our criminal justice system is all f'ked up. But the principle of innocent until proven guilty is not. I guess that if you are going on trial would you want to be tried by a neutral party? Or would you rather be tried and found guilty by the media and those who have an agenda?

Unfortunately criminal cases do need to be studied under a microscope. People's lives are at stake both the criminal and the innocent. Innocent people have indeed been incarcerated or even executed for crimes they didn't commit. Likewise criminals have been allowed to walk free to continue their lives of crime. If you were going on trial wouldn't you want everything possible to be used in your defense leaving no stone unturned? Or would you rather be tried in a kangaroo court?

I'm not a lawyer and have little regard for the legal profession. They don't call them "liars for hire" for nothing. But they are a necessary evil compared to what the alternative is.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

desertman said:


> Again it's not up to you, I or anyone else that wasn't there to decide whether LE lost control or not. It's up to the court after all of the evidence is presented. The cops will have their day in court, if found guilty they will get what is coming to them. I have no problem with that.
> 
> What's really f'ked up is if they are found not guilty the riots, looting and destruction of both private and public property will continue. All with the blessing of the Democrat Party and their minions in the media. It's gotten to the point that I don't trust the media any more than I trust the Democrats. The media is in it for ratings and the Democrats are in it for absolute power and control. They both have an agenda that's destroying our Constitutional Republic.
> 
> ...


Exactly, if the people under trial are innocent and an acquittal will cause riots ,,,,so be it


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

https://www.handgunforum.net/xf/thr...eds-should-be-considered-when-charged.165283/


paratrooper said:


> https://www.yahoo.com/news/exclusive-business-partner-falwells-says-161952490.html


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Jeb Stuart hasn't gotten back to me as of yet.

Anyone know what the definition of a _*True American*_ is?

The suspense is killing me.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> Jeb Stuart hasn't gotten back to me as of yet.
> 
> Anyone know what the definition of a _*True American*_ is?
> 
> The suspense is killing me.


You're reaching, leave it alone. 
Drinking a black cup of coffee, smoking a cigarette, hanging out with friends.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> Falwell was / is a staunch supporter of tRump.
> 
> Guilt by association.
> 
> Daddy Falwell must be so proud of his son.


Everyone is guilty on the right, this time by association, other then a quick clip.

Did trump collude with the Russians ? WE ARE INTO ANSWERING QUESTIONS, let's go through all the unanswered questions you n everyone else has asked. , lol

Were there politics in law enforcement?
Question 1 
Guilt by association, you stand by that comment?


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

True American, Audie Murphy, Sgt. York, 
Andrew Jackson ( Louisiana Purchase) 
Lewis and Clark, 
There's to many to mention.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I would like to think I am a True American. But, until I have a definition, I suppose I'll really never know for sure.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

paratrooper said:


> I would like to think I am a True American. But, until I have a definition, I suppose I'll really never know for sure.


What's a True American ? If you consider yourself A True American


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

You're privileged considering the lefts opinion. 
You are not a True American According to the progressive agenda


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## Slowalkintexan (Feb 6, 2007)

Para, you really need to take a break and let this go.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

Slowalkintexan said:


> Para, you really need to take a break and let this go.


Let him speak his piece. I want to know what he thinks.

GW


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

It's all good, after all, this is only an internet forum, and in the scheme of things, really doesn't mean all that much at the end of the day.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

paratrooper said:


> It's all good, after all, this is only an internet forum, and in the scheme of things, really doesn't mean all that much at the end of the day.


And with that, we're calling this one done.

Para, you're a good dude. 

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk


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