# I may be done with WWB



## Maximo (May 26, 2006)

I have shot WWB for several years now and have never had any real problem with it until recently. I was at the range on Sunday with some friends and I put 500 rounds down range through 4 different guns. I was getting about 48-49 out of every 50 rounds in the ten ring for the first 200 or so rounds with the CCI Blazers. I switched to WWB and suddenly I was hitting, very consistently, well outside the 4-inch diameter ten ring I had been shooting at earlier. My friends and I all thought I may just be getting tired, after all it was 105 degrees here on Sunday and I had already shot 200 rounds. So I went back to the M&P and the CCI Blazers and was hitting the ten ring again. Switched back to the WWB and not only was I going wild again I had a squib and had to take the gun apart to remove the bullet from the barrel which was stuck right at the very end of the barrel. It was an easy fix but I through the rest of that box away, and I don't think I will go back to it when I can get the Blazers for just a few cents more than the WWB at Wal-Mart. 
I have had a lot of problems keeping the WWB on target in the past few months all of it bought at different times and different locations. Have I just had some bad luck or is this becoming more common?


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

I find the Blazer to be a bit more accurate. And, I too had some issues lately - 2 underpowered rounds in 1 box - they fired, but I could feel the difference, and the slide barely moved back to eject. 

I tried a box of Monarch recently - Academy was out of Blazer. It worked okay - pretty dirty stuff, I thought. Dirtier than the Blazer.


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## propellerhead (May 19, 2006)

I did an informal test with WWB and CCI Blazer Aluminum. I shot 50 rounds of each, 10 per magazine, alternating between the two. Accuracy at 7 yards was about the same. I didn't notice anything different. However, I get more weak rounds with WWB and it seems dirtier. I've been shooting just CCI Blazer Aluminum now also because it makes my range bag lighter.


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## 2400 (Feb 4, 2006)

Maximo said:


> I was getting about 48-49 out of every 50 rounds in the ten ring for the first 200 or so rounds with the CCI Blazers.
> 
> I switched to WWB and suddenly I was hitting, very consistently, well outside the 4-inch diameter ten ring I had been shooting at earlier.
> 
> ...


You were shooting Blaze and hitting the 10 ring, then you switched to WWB. Shooting WWB it was consistant but not shooting to the point of aim of the Blazer? Correct?

It's rare for 2 different brands of ammo to shoot to the same point of aim. Do they have the same weight and profile bullet?

As for the squib, I had several squibs from several different brands of factory ammo. If you keep having problems with WWb call them and tell them, also give them the lot number off the box.


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## scooter (May 9, 2006)

Ive been lucky I guess,I shoot WWB exclusively thru all my pistols and never a problem,no squibs ,light loads and accuracy is good (plenty good out to 25 yards with 4" or shorter barrels)


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## Maximo (May 26, 2006)

scooter said:


> Ive been lucky I guess,I shoot WWB exclusively thru all my pistols and never a problem,no squibs ,light loads and accuracy is good (plenty good out to 25 yards with 4" or shorter barrels)


I have had very good luck with it in the past; I have shot it for several years now without any problems until about the last 2 months. No mater where I have purchased it I have had a few problems, inaccuracy, inconsistent loads, and now a squib. Maybe I have just had some bad luck with it lately and just needed to bitch. Kind of like finding a bad M&P, it probably happens but not very common.


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## scooter (May 9, 2006)

I guess any manf. can have a batch of bad product,I think I'll stick withh WWB until I start having more than an occasional problem. So far so good.


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## Nathan Plemons (Aug 11, 2006)

I just dumped 240 rounds of WWB through my Para today, I had one minor feed problem, otherwise it was flawless. I've got 800 more rounds of it so I'll hold my complete opinion until I've shot all of that.


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## Guest (Aug 19, 2006)

WWB SUCKS!:smt076 that stuff is crap....FTF, FTE, everything....never again


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## scooter (May 9, 2006)




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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

wickedXD said:


> WWB SUCKS!:smt076 that stuff is crap....FTF, FTE, everything....never again


Ok, tell us how U really feel...


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## Baldy (Jun 21, 2006)

Maximo you are to try reloading. Bulid up your own round, and you know what you got. It's kind of relaxing too. I look at it as a hobby with in a hobby. Good luck with your shooting.


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## Maximo (May 26, 2006)

Baldy said:


> Maximo you are to try reloading. Bulid up your own round, and you know what you got. It's kind of relaxing too. I look at it as a hobby with in a hobby. Good luck with your shooting.


Baldy I have considered it but all my autos are 9mm and I can't justify the cost of the equipment since that is about all I shoot and I already pay less that $5 a box. That, and my other hobbies are already taking up a lot of room in my garage. It is already full of tools, hiking equipment; dartboard, leather working bench, two cars, and those are just my garage hobbies. 
I had a friend in high school that reloaded his own rounds, while out shooting with him one day I was standing to his left and just behind him and he fired 1 round through his .44 and the stinking thing just exploded. We both had to go to the emergency room. He had to have shrapnel removed from his hand and I had to have a piece removed from above my right eye. I have never really gotten over that. I know reloads can be more accurate but if factory ammo blows up on me, I at least have someone to sue.:mrgreen:


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## Baldy (Jun 21, 2006)

Hey Max I can understand that. What I can't understand not all, but some of these guys as soon as they buy a revolver or pistol that says Mag on it they got to load full house loads. I was in a shop the other day, and they had 3 blowed up revolvers. All from home made over loads. Go figure. I load for accuracy not the big boom. Have a good one.


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## jwkimber45 (May 6, 2006)

I've shot a TON of the stuff with no problems.....of course it was all through real guns. Kimber, HK, and Glock mostly........


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## scooter (May 9, 2006)

jwkimber45 said:


> I've shot a TON of the stuff with no problems.....of course it was all through real guns. Kimber, HK, and Glock mostly........


Ya just had to use the "G" word dincha....:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


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## Maximo (May 26, 2006)

scooter said:


> Ya just had to use the "G" word dincha....:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


I thought that was funny too. "all through REAL guns" Then listed a Glock. :smt082


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## jwkimber45 (May 6, 2006)

Hey, they're not pretty, I don't particully care for 'em. Hell I don't even own one anymore. BUT they do go bang EVERY TIME.


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## Nathan Plemons (Aug 11, 2006)

jwkimber45 said:


> BUT they do go bang EVERY TIME.


Unless you ask the LAPD, then they just break.


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## scooter (May 9, 2006)

Nathan Plemons said:


> Unless you ask the LAPD, then they just break.


:watching:


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

LAPD's problems were confined to the Glock 21. I also have to wonder just why LAPD had all these problems, when no one else has reported major problems with the 21 since it was introduced.

In defense of WWB, I have shot tens of thousands of round of it with no problems, in .32, .380, 9mm and .45 ACP. I continue to be completely satisfied with it as practice ammo.

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## Nathan Plemons (Aug 11, 2006)

Mike Barham at Galco said:


> I also have to wonder just why LAPD had all these problems, when no one else has reported major problems with the 21 since it was introduced.


Because the LAPD probably bought more glocks at any one time than anybody else. It could have just been a bad production run, but you can't deny that it happened.

What amazes me is that people are willing to accept production "flukes" when they're dealing with their own pet company, but it's completely unacceptable when it's it's a company that they don't care for for some other reason.

The simple fact of the matter is that with ANY company mass producing ANY product, there will be production variation, it is simply not economically feasable to run 100% quality control on absolutely every component of every product. If a company did that nobody would be able to afford their product.

All we can do is accept that ANY company is going to potentially have problems with ANY product. That doesn't make them a bad company, that makes them normal. What truly defines a company is how they handle those problems. Do they make it right, or do they deny them? That is how the company should be judged. :smt1099


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## Maximo (May 26, 2006)

Nathan Plemons said:


> Because the LAPD probably bought more glocks at any one time than anybody else. It could have just been a bad production run, but you can't deny that it happened.
> 
> What amazes me is that people are willing to accept production "flukes" when they're dealing with their own pet company, but it's completely unacceptable when it's it's a company that they don't care for for some other reason.
> 
> ...


That was well put. I am probably premature in swearing off WWB, after all I have shot it for at least 10 years now without a lot of problems, just one here and there. If you shoot as much as I do and stick with just one or two brands of ammo you will eventually come across a bad round. 
As for company reputation, your right, we are all probably guilty of dismissing our favorite gun companies mishaps and too quick to completely condemn one we don't care for. For example Glock had problems with frames cracking in the very beginning, S&W had problems with the Sigma frames cracking in its beginning. Glock almost completely overcame the reputation of their early hiccups and S&W didn't until recently. Too many people feel the need to bash what the other guy shoots in order to make what they shoot and carry look better. I have had guys at the range actually go out of their way to come over to me and make fun of my Sigma, I just shrug them off and keep shooting a baseball sized hole at 20 yards with my crappy Sigma, while they are all over the target with their $1000 guns. I have my preferences the same as everyone here does, and I try hard not to knock, or sound like I am knocking what someone else uses, though I may have done just that with this thread. I know my recent experience with Winchester is not the norm but has been frustrating nonetheless. Someone may have shot 100,000 rounds of WWB without a hitch but that does not change my recent experiences and frustrations with it. I will more than likely go back to using it. I do the same with guns I don't like; I rent one or shoot friends once in a while to see if my taste has changed because they sometimes do. I have never cared for Glock, Sig, or HK, I don't like the grip angle on any of them, it is not a quality problem. Once you get to a certain level of quality the rest just becomes gravy. Glock, S&W, HK, Springfield, Sig, IMI, Walther, ect. are all about the same in quality, it is the subtle differences that make a firearm right for each person. Like Nathan said a company should be judged on how they deal with problems with their products because they ALL have them at times.


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## Nathan Plemons (Aug 11, 2006)

FWIW, I only made the Glock comment as a joke. I know Glock makes fantastic guns, just not for me. I made the comment to point out that even the mighty Glock is not without their problems.

All you have to do to find a problem with any company is look.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Maximo said:


> That was well put. I am probably premature in swearing off WWB, after all I have shot it for at least 10 years now without a lot of problems, just one here and there. If you shoot as much as I do and stick with just one or two brands of ammo you will eventually come across a bad round.
> As for company reputation, your right, we are all probably guilty of dismissing our favorite gun companies mishaps and too quick to completely condemn one we don't care for. For example Glock had problems with frames cracking in the very beginning, S&W had problems with the Sigma frames cracking in its beginning. Glock almost completely overcame the reputation of their early hiccups and S&W didn't until recently. Too many people feel the need to bash what the other guy shoots in order to make what they shoot and carry look better. I have had guys at the range actually go out of their way to come over to me and make fun of my Sigma, I just shrug them off and keep shooting a baseball sized hole at 20 yards with my crappy Sigma, while they are all over the target with their $1000 guns. I have my preferences the same as everyone here does, and I try hard not to knock, or sound like I am knocking what someone else uses, though I may have done just that with this thread. I know my recent experience with Winchester is not the norm but has been frustrating nonetheless. Someone may have shot 100,000 rounds of WWB without a hitch but that does not change my recent experiences and frustrations with it. I will more than likely go back to using it. I do the same with guns I don't like; I rent one or shoot friends once in a while to see if my taste has changed because they sometimes do. I have never cared for Glock, Sig, or HK, I don't like the grip angle on any of them, it is not a quality problem. Once you get to a certain level of quality the rest just becomes gravy. Glock, S&W, HK, Springfield, Sig, IMI, Walther, ect. are all about the same in quality, it is the subtle differences that make a firearm right for each person. Like Nathan said a company should be judged on how they deal with problems with their products because they ALL have them at times.


What are U doing saying stuff that makes sense... U can't do that


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

Nathan Plemons said:


> Because the LAPD probably bought more glocks at any one time than anybody else. It could have just been a bad production run, but you can't deny that it happened.


I've talked to a few LA cops about the issue, and there is no doubt that it is more than an internet rumor. I'm not sure how many Glock 21s LAPD bought, but I find it hard to believe they bought more than the entire previous production of that gun (which has been around for, what, a decade or more?), which was never reported to have endemic problems. Strange situation, but it definitely did happen.

Anyway, I generally stick to guns in the calibers for which they were originally designed. I'll take my 1911s in .45 ACP, thankyouverymuch, and my Glocks in 9mm!

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## Nathan Plemons (Aug 11, 2006)

Mike Barham at Galco said:


> but I find it hard to believe they bought more than the entire previous production of that gun (which has been around for, what, a decade or more?), which was never reported to have endemic problems.


Probably not, but figure they probably ordered a very large quantity at one time, so they may have encompased the whole of the problem. Furthermore you have to consider the other customers. Granted many police departments use Glocks, but of the whole of Glock's customer base, how many of them really shoot as much as the LAPD?

You can sell a million guns to regular consumers who may never put 1000 rounds through a gun as long as they own it. When you start selling to a customer who truly tests the product, that is when you start seeing failures. Personally I'd say it's just bad luck, a bad batch of parts, and extreme use by the LAPD.


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## BerettaMan (Feb 4, 2006)

+1 what jwkimber45 said, but he forgot to mention Beretta.


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## J.R. (Jul 6, 2006)

I've never had any problems with WWB!!! I bought a Ruger Vaquero in .45colt few years back and could not find any COWBOY ammo for it within 100 miles (any brand). My project manger heard me talking about this to a co-worker and told me his step-mom work for Winchester.Sent this lady email with my problem and told her I was working for her step-son and 10 days later 500rounds showed up on frontporch with no name! Called my wife thanking her and she told me she didn't know what in the hell I was talking about! Next day at work asked my boss if his step-mom had anything to do with my 500rds and he told me surprise:mrgreen: she had factory do special run as they found out this part of VA/NC dealers were out! Turns out she works for complaint dept at Winchester.I'm very loyal to Winchester ammo.IF YOU HAVE PROBLEMS CONTACT THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The way Glocks get bashed on here,I hate to hear what ya'll have to say about my Daewoo DP-51 9mm?????:smt067 :smt067 :smt067 Randall


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