# Remanufactured Ammo



## No_surrender (Sep 23, 2020)

Thoughts on remanufactured ammo? The Beretta M9A3 manual specifically states NOT to use remanufactured ammunition. Could this be a carryover from decades ago before solid remanufactured ammo equipment and processes? Or should we really avoid it? There’s definitely a significant cost savings to buying and using remanufactured ammo for range practice. So is there really a risk to damaging the firearm?


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

I do not use it.

In 1995, I blew up a Glock 17 using someone else's reloads.... Ever since then, I NEVER let use reloads.... I had someone wanting to try one of my guns years ago - but all they had with them was remanufactured ammo. I was not going to let them shoot that thru my gun.

I know many people online who buy ammo from Freedom Munitions. But, several years ago, I remember reading about some people having guns blow up...

A lot of people use the stuff, but I will not be one...


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

I agree with Shipwreck. I have a box of some brass cased .380 Auto, that I have had for a number of years, and it's still in the box...bought it at a gun show.

The cases are bulged at the bottom, skinny in the middle, and fat again at where the bullet seats. No thanks. I guess I am saving them to use, during the end of days, when that is the last box of ammo I have.


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## No_surrender (Sep 23, 2020)

berettatoter said:


> I agree with Shipwreck. I have a box of some brass cased .380 Auto, that I have had for a number of years, and it's still in the box...bought it at a gun show.
> 
> The cases are bulged at the bottom, skinny in the middle, and fat again at where the bullet seats. No thanks. I guess I am saving them to use, during the end of days, when that is the last box of ammo I have.


Would you mind posting a picture?

I have been getting mine from Super Vel and haven't had any issues. Went through 150 today, no problems. Their customer service is amazing, too, so that helps.

Side note to Shipwreck, no issues with the M9A3 today.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

I would never under any circumstances use remanufactured ammo in any of my guns just to save a few bucks. The risk of serious bodily injury, a ruined gun or God forbid if it fails if you use it to defend yourself is just not worth it, at least to me.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

No_surrender said:


> Would you mind posting a picture?
> 
> I have been getting mine from Super Vel and haven't had any issues. *Went through 150 today, no problems.* Their customer service is amazing, too, so that helps.
> 
> Side note to Shipwreck, no issues with the M9A3 today.


That's kinda' like saying I ran across the street into oncoming traffic 150 times and haven't gotten hit yet.


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## No_surrender (Sep 23, 2020)

desertman said:


> I would never under any circumstances use remanufactured ammo in any of my guns just to save a few bucks. The risk of serious bodily injury, a ruined gun or God forbid if it fails if you use it to defend yourself is just not worth it, at least to me.


$315 per 1,000 rounds in savings is more than just a few bucks. But I understand what you two are saying. By the time I go through the stock of remanufactured 9mm target rounds hopefully the stock levels of new ammo will have gone up and prices down.

I would never use the remanufactured round nose target rounds as defensive ammo so no worries there.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

No_surrender said:


> $315 per 1,000 rounds in savings is more than just a few bucks. But I understand what you two are saying. By the time I go through the stock of remanufactured 9mm target rounds hopefully the stock levels of new ammo will have gone up and prices down.
> 
> I would never use the remanufactured round nose target rounds as defensive ammo so no worries there.


Well you get what you pay for. There's a reason why it's so cheap.

But the $64,000 question is how much would it cost to replace your hand or eye's if the gun blows up while target shooting? Or the cost of a lawyer to defend yourself in a lawsuit if the person standing by you gets injured by your gun blowing up? All it takes is one squib round out of 1000. It's very easy to blow off a full magazine within a few seconds. During that time you may not even realize under rapid fire that the last round fired was a squib? Essentially you've got a grenade waiting to go off at the next trigger pull.

Again at least to me the risk is not worth $315 in savings. I'm not willing to take that one out of a thousand chance.


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## No_surrender (Sep 23, 2020)

desertman said:


> Well you get what you pay for. There's a reason why it's so cheap.
> 
> But the $64,000 question is how much would it cost to replace your hand or eye's if the gun blows up while target shooting? Or the cost of a lawyer to defend yourself in a lawsuit if the person standing by you gets injured by your gun blowing up? All it takes is one squib round out of 1000. It's very easy to blow off a full magazine within a few seconds. During that time you may not even realize under rapid fire that the last round fired was a squib? Essentially you've got a grenade waiting to go off at the next trigger pull.
> 
> Again at least to me the risk is not worth $315 in savings. I'm not willing to take that one out of a thousand chance.


I read up a little on this. First, thank you very much for brining the possibility of risk to my attention. This does make me nervous, but not to continue shooting remanufactured ammo...makes me nervous to shoot any number of rapid shots for any type of drill. It seems as though squibs in newly manufactured rounds occur nearly as often as remanufactured rounds. With that said, how can this be avoided altogether? How can one be certain that even mass produced "new" rounds aren't going to contain an error?

While I am not discounting the dangers of a squib or that the possibility of a squib is probably greater when using remanufactured rounds, I am curious if the methods used today to assemble remanufactured is safer or better than 2-3 decades ago? If the dangers are so great and firearm manufacturers advise against it, how do these companies stay in business and why is it even legal in the first place?

I'd also like to verify my understanding of the risk. The problem isn't so much of a squib or dead round, correct? That is to say the cartridge doesn't fully execute its intent...firing pin contacts primer and powder goes boom, but projectile stays in the barrel. This will probably take some work to remove and hopefully no damage is done, but that's not the real danger...it's what may come next, correct? Another squeeze of the trigger and that round contacts the stuck bullet, which could cause the barrel to explode?

If that's the case, would it be relatively safe to execute drills using remanufactured ammunition whereby after each individual round is fired the target is verified to have a hole in it indicating no squib?

Any other patrons out there feel different when it comes to using remanufactured ammo?


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## rustygun (Apr 8, 2013)

I have shot 1,000's of freedom munition remanufactured ammo, 9MM and .45 ACP without issue. I don't know about any other remanufactured ammo. I don't shoot just anybody's reloads though. I know one person whom I trust enough to shoot their reloads. I reload myself but my carry gun is stuffed with top grade factory ammo. It is a choice every shooter has to make for themselves your gun your body parts.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

No_surrender said:


> I read up a little on this. First, thank you very much for brining the possibility of risk to my attention. This does make me nervous, but not to continue shooting remanufactured ammo...makes me nervous to shoot any number of rapid shots for any type of drill. It seems as though squibs in newly manufactured rounds occur nearly as often as remanufactured rounds. With that said, how can this be avoided altogether? How can one be certain that even mass produced "new" rounds aren't going to contain an error?
> 
> While I am not discounting the dangers of a squib or that the possibility of a squib is probably greater when using remanufactured rounds, I am curious if the methods used today to assemble remanufactured is safer or better than 2-3 decades ago? If the dangers are so great and firearm manufacturers advise against it, how do these companies stay in business and why is it even legal in the first place?
> 
> ...


You're welcome, that was my intention. Whether you decide to continue using it or not and whether that risk is worth it is up to you.

I've fired tens of thousands of rounds over my lifetime all using factory ammo and never had a squib round. Is there a possibility of getting one? Sure, but it's highly unlikely. If you do get a squib round with factory ammo more than likely it would be due to outside factors such as improper storage.

Since I've never EVER considered using remanufactured rounds. I couldn't tell you whether the methods used to remanufacture it are safer or not? With remanufactured rounds I don't think that there's any way of knowing where the used brass came from and how often it has been reloaded? Other than what the remanufacturer claims. You can only reload brass a given amount of times due to metal fatigue as the brass expands and contracts both from firing and resizing the case. That's the reason why cases have to be trimmed to size too.

Indeed firearms manufacturers advise you not to use it in their products and for good reason as the risks of using it are far greater than using factory ammo.* Again you do get what you pay for.* If they were to make remanufactured ammo illegal they would also have to make reloading your own ammo illegal as well. At least if you reload your own ammo and know what you're doing YOU have complete control over the entire process. Not some 9 to 5'er who can't wait until 5 o'clock.

I don't know? I would think that firing one round then having to check the target to see if there's a hole after each round fired would get old awful fast? Not too practical especially if you're practicing shooting for self defense.

You're right the problem isn't a dud round or one that goes off and gets stuck in the barrel. It's what happens when a round gets stuck and another round is fired. A dud round can easily be ejected from the gun the same as a live round. Except with a dud round you have to wait before you eject it to make sure it's not a hang fire. In which case if ejected too soon the round could explode in your face.


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

It entirely depends on who's doing the reloading; the equipment and quality control. I've had squib loads with factory ammunition before. I have a good friend who reloads and he has top of the line equipment and for my reloads once fired factory brass and he's real good at it, I don't have any issue with his reloads.

I bring him all my once fired brass, buy primers, powder and bullets, but at the end of the day, at least when ammo is stable, it doesn't really save me anything when new factory rounds are 27 to 35 cents. But if you cant find ammo that's a different story. I've had good luck with Freedom munitions in the past.


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## wirenut (Dec 16, 2015)

I have a company near me that strictly does only reloading and I have never had an issue with any caliber that they sell.
I believe the manufacture has to put that in their manual as per the CYA lawyers rulings.


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## SamBond (Aug 30, 2016)

No_surrender said:


> The Beretta M9A3 manual specifically states NOT to use remanufactured ammunition.





wirenut said:


> I believe the manufacture has to put that in their manual as per the CYA lawyers rulings


True that *^*. 
Also, the gun maker expects factory ammo to be within SAAMI specs. They, like I, don't trust "no tellin who's" ammo to be safe. (As in not overloaded).
I never ever fire somebody else's reloads, only my own. There are too many "By The Book" reloaders that believe their ammo is safe (and quality) because they used a recipe found in a reloading manual.
Those guys are probably safe enough but it takes knowing how to 'read' the fired brass and understand how to measure fired case expansion to make actual quality ammo. It's a skill that takes time and dedication to learn. It is much like learning to 'read' spark plugs from a race engine. It just ain't in "The Book".

Sam


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## wirenut (Dec 16, 2015)

SamBond said:


> True that *^*.
> Also, the gun maker expects factory ammo to be within SAAMI specs. They, like I, don't trust "no tellin who's" ammo to be safe. (As in not overloaded).
> I never ever fire somebody else's reloads, only my own. There are too many "By The Book" reloaders that believe their ammo is safe (and quality) because they used a recipe found in a reloading manual.
> Those guys are probably safe enough but it takes knowing how to 'read' the fired brass and understand how to measure fired case expansion to make actual quality ammo. It's a skill that takes time and dedication to learn. It is much like learning to 'read' spark plugs from a race engine. It just ain't in "The Book".
> ...


This is the company I only use on reloads.

https://www.foxriverammo.com/default.asp


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## SamBond (Aug 30, 2016)

Shipwreck said:


> In 1995, I blew up a Glock 17 using someone else's reloads....


I've heard of a 40 cal Glock blowing with a reload. The blame seemed to be something about the case not being supported well enough in the web / head area with the Glock. Multiple reloads weakens that area of the case so then... Boom.
This may have been nothing but a lame excuse for an overload. I'm not a Glock guy so I really don't know. Any Glock-ers here have information on that idea / theory?

Sam


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Many 40s had unsupported chambers, and yea - most kabooms seem to be with 40 cal guns. And, it almost always seems to be a reload involved, when you hear the entire story.

But, yea - this happened to me with a 9mm round. The father of my first wife had thousands of 9mm rounds he loaded before he died. When I met her, he was already diseased. His rounds commonly did not feed properly in my gun. And, then one day... boom...


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

No_surrender said:


> Would you mind posting a picture?
> 
> I have been getting mine from Super Vel and haven't had any issues. Went through 150 today, no problems. Their customer service is amazing, too, so that helps.
> 
> Side note to Shipwreck, no issues with the M9A3 today.


Yeah, here ya' go. They were in a kinda generic colored box that says Precision. I pulled two out at random, but the pic isn't the best.


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

rustygun said:


> I have shot 1,000's of freedom munition remanufactured ammo, 9MM and .45 ACP without issue. I don't know about any other remanufactured ammo. I don't shoot just anybody's reloads though. I know one person whom I trust enough to shoot their reloads. I reload myself but my carry gun is stuffed with top grade factory ammo. It is a choice every shooter has to make for themselves your gun your body parts.


I would not mind shooting the "retreads", as long as they were loaded by someone like Freedom Munitions, Black Hills, or any other companies that actually do this in a big way.

Sometimes, at gun shows, you get some clown with a progressive loader, spitting out ammo to sell there, and those are the ones I don't trust.


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