# H&K P30, DA/SA versus LEM for home defense



## tvphotog (Feb 24, 2016)

I'm new to handguns, and have been thinking hard about one for home defense. Originally I liked the PPQ and tested it on the range. I liked everything about it, but was concerned about the lightness and short pull of the trigger. I agree that the best safety is my brain and index finger, and I plan to practice weekly to get familiar with the gun. But with a home break-im, adrenalin pumping and heart racing, I don't want stress to take over and move my finger into the trigger guard with a light trigger there. 

I've seen the P30 ( the range didn't have one to rent) and like the longer pull of the trigger in DA and when decocked. But that first shot in an emergency may be the only time in my life I'll need absolute accuracy, and I wonder whether the long but softer pull in the LEM is a better compromise. I know I can get it with a safety, but that's another thing to remember in an emergency. I've heard lots of stories of someone trying to pull the trigger in a break-in, only to find he/she forgot to release the safety. 

Do you think the LEM is a good compromise, with the longer draw of the trigger a factor in safety? I like the P30 very much, and don't mind the extra money, just wonder what you think of the two triggers.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Many people claim that they tend to pull the gun sideways with that LEM trigger. While not the same, I'm not a huge fan of the Kahr trigger... Which makes me think I probably wouldn't like the LEM trigger.

I've been told by many to try to soot an LEM gun prior to buying one. I have owned 9 different HK pistols - I have a P2000 and P2000sk. All of those Hks (and the two I own now) are DA/SA guns. I've decided to just stay with that. 

I have dry fired an LEM gun - but until I get to actually shoot one, I'm not interested in taking the chance. I already go thru guns like water as it is


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## tvphotog (Feb 24, 2016)

Shipwreck said:


> Many people claim that they tend to pull the gun sideways with that LEM trigger. While not the same, I'm not a huge fan of the Kahr trigger... Which makes me think I probably wouldn't like the LEM trigger.
> 
> I've been told by many to try to soot an LEM gun prior to buying one. I have owned 9 different HK pistols - I have a P2000 and P2000sk. All of those Hks (and the two I own now) are DA/SA guns. I've decided to just stay with that.
> 
> I have dry fired an LEM gun - but until I get to actually shoot one, I'm not interested in taking the chance. I already go thru guns like water as it is


You have other DA pistols with a longer pull. I'm new at this, but is it the longer pull or the nature of the LEM trigger?


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I like the DA/SA format for the safety reasons you mentioned. 

I like the long first pull option,,,or I may just cock the hammer back , now I'm in single action. 
Good luck


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

I'm a fan of the LEM


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## tvphotog (Feb 24, 2016)

VAMarine said:


> I'm a fan of the LEM


Can you tell me why you like it? What about my question about safety when used for home defense?



pic said:


> I like the DA/SA format for the safety reasons you mentioned.
> 
> I like the long first pull option,,,or I may just cock the hammer back , now I'm in single action.
> Good luck


As I recall, the P30 has a bobbed hammer, can't cock it.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

It may be the "LEM" if the bobbed hammer can't be hand cocked


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

tvphotog said:


> I'm new to handguns, and have been thinking hard about one for home defense. Originally I liked the PPQ and tested in on the range. I liked everything about it, but was concerned about the lightness and short pull of the trigger. I agree that the best safety is my brain and index finger, and I plan to practice weekly as I've enjoyed target practice in the past. But with a home break-im, adrenalin pumping and heart racing, I don't want stress to take over and move my finger into the trigger guard with a light trigger there.
> 
> I've seen the P30 ( the range didn't have one to rent) and like the longer pull of the trigger in DA and when decocked. But that first shot in an emergency may be the only time in my life I'll need absolute accuracy, and I wonder whether the long but softer pull in the LEM is a better compromise. *I know I can get it with a safety, but that's another thing to remember in an emergency.* I've heard lots of stories of someone trying to pull the trigger in a break-in, only to find he/she forgot to release the safety.
> 
> Do you think the LEM is a good compromise, with the longer draw of the trigger a factor in safety? I like the P30 very much, and don't mind the extra money, just wonder which trigger I should be testing.


Just leave the safety off. Indeed a safety is another thing to remember. At least in my experience all of the standard factory weight triggers are perfectly safe even in a stressful situation. Including striker fired guns and SA semi auto's. DA/SA's, DAO semi auto's with their longer trigger pulls even more so. All though there have been some I've yet to hear of too many accidental discharges (AD's) with standard factory trigger weights. I've never had one in all the years I've been shooting all types of handguns.

Guns that have had trigger work done are another matter altogether, depending on how light the triggers have been modified. Especially ones that are so light that the slightest movement could set them off. Except for competition only, these are an accident waiting to happen.

I say go with the P30 leave it as is, whether it's the LEM or standard version and forget about all of these hypothetical situations. The standard DA trigger pull is not that bad unless you really jerk the gun while pulling the trigger. More than likely if you do have to use it within your home it will be in a close range situation where you will more than likely hit your target with that first shot. Unless of course you're a really terrible shot in spite of how much you practice. In which case owning a gun may not be such a good idea in the first place. I just bought a DAO RM380 and was able to put all 6 rounds into a four inch circle at about 20 feet in spite off it's long trigger pull and re-set. Which is certainly acceptable for self defense. Of course I have no idea of how much shooting experience you have.

On a side note: At least in my opinion, HK makes the best polymer pistol on the market today.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

I just looked at a P2000 with light LEM at the local store (I'm sick today, but I'm sick of sitting at home) - EXACT same gun (3 mags and night sights) that I have... Except for the trigger. 

I dry fired it a few times. Basically, the length of a DA trigger on every pull - but the break is at the very, very end of a long pull.... And, the "light" LEM trigger still didn't break as lightly as I thought the "light LEM" would. I dry fired the normal LEM trigger a few years ago, so I thought the "light" LEM would break lighter than what it did. 

I can tell I would not like that trigger for each and every shot.

I'll stick with DA/SA, personally.

I would suggest not jumping on LEM unless you can try one for yourself


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

There are a LOT of different variants...

Not all P30s (plural)have the safety, the P30S (See for SAFETY) has a thumb safety


The P30 V1 is Light LEM , the P30 V3, is DA/SA w/ decocker.

The P30S V3 is DA/SA w/ decoder and safety.

Ship, be very careful with the P2000, there are very few factory light LEM guns out there. Most are V2, the heavy LEM. You need to check the box to be sure unless you have changed out the oats yourself or can verify the pull weight.

I like the LEM as it has a consistent trigger pull weight like a lot of popular guns but has a longer length of pull like the other set of popular guns.

I dislike decockers and have mixed feelings on thumb safeties.

As for the question on home defense, I will remember read and reply later. Finishing lunch.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

pic said:


> It may be the "LEM" if the bobbed hammer can't be hand cocked


I installed a "bobbed hammer" from HKParts.com on my HK45C which is not the LEM version. The LEM version has a completely different hammer and is also bobbed. I like bobbed hammers on DA/SA semi auto's. It forces me to be able to put my first shot on target. Besides cocking the hammer, like disengaging a safety is just something else you have to do in a self defense situation. Especially if one consistently practices cocking the hammer for their first shot with a DA/SA semi auto which defeats the purpose of having one. In which case their probably better off with an SA semi auto. Personally I prefer a striker fired pistol for self defense because of their consistent trigger pull. But they're not for everybody mostly because of misconceived safety concerns.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

I would be comfortable with either the or a P30 V1 or V3 or the P30S V3.

If you have qualms about the safety don't get a "S" model.

Do try and shoot a LEM guns side by side with a DA/SA and see which you like better.

I don't think any of them have a legit advantage over each other, it's all a matter of preference.


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## tvphotog (Feb 24, 2016)

VAMarine said:


> I would be comfortable with either the or a P30 V1 or V3 or the P30S V3.
> 
> If you have qualms about the safety don't get a "S" model.
> 
> ...


Thanks very much. The hard problem around NYC is having enough ranges with rentals of both guns. Will try and test fire both.


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## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

VAMarine said:


> Ship, be very careful with the P2000, there are very few factory light LEM guns out there. Most are V2, the heavy LEM. You need to check the box to be sure unless you have changed out the oats yourself or can verify the pull weight.


That is very possible. But either way, I am sticking with DA/SA. I have carried my P2000 for almost a year now. Really love the gun (in DA/SA). I switched from a M&P Shield. I like the extra capacity, and never liked that the shield wasn't DA/SA.


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## SEAN680 (Mar 12, 2016)

Does anyone know of a website for H&K that sells parts that is not the manufacturers website? Like GLOCKMEISTER.COM for Glocks??


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

SEAN680 said:


> Does anyone know of a website for H&K that sells parts that is not the manufacturers website? Like GLOCKMEISTER.COM for Glocks??


You can try HKparts.net they are an authorized HK parts dealer. They seem to have everything and sell original factory parts. I don't know of or think that there are any companies making parts for HK products other than HK. Probably for good reason as HK makes the best polymer pistol on the market today. They are a gun manufacturer who make their guns primarily for law enforcement and the military, who happen to sell guns to the public.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

SEAN680 said:


> Does anyone know of a website for H&K that sells parts that is not the manufacturers website? Like GLOCKMEISTER.COM for Glocks??


Top Gun Supply and EGUNPARTS have hkparts as well.

The HK web shop has some as well.

I've had good luck on GunBroker as well.

HkParts.net usually has the best selection l, but not the best prices.


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