# 9mm 147 Winchester for SD



## jeb21 (Jun 10, 2008)

I am interested in a good non +p self defense load for the 9mm. Winchester makes a 147 grain jacket hollow point that is inexpensive to buy. Does the 147 grain bullet have a good reputation as a self defense round or should I stick with a 115 grain hollowpoint?


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

I realize this may not directly answer your question and I apologize up front.

I'd highly recommend firing a round that does the following, in this order...

1. Functions well in your pistol.
2. You handle the pistols recoil well with the round in question.
3. You practice with the round in question.


Heavier rounds have two basic tendancies when it comes to reliability.

1. They function the recoil operation of the pistol well, because of slightly heavier recoil.
2. They are slightly wider to length near the tip than lighter rounds, which may cause feeding issues in short action pistols.


Now, that being said, shooting defensively has much more to do with putting rounds on target in critical areas than it does with what round you use. Putting rounds on target repeatedly has much more to do with what round you use. You can have the best wizbang round out there, but if you can't hit with it, it's as useless as a spitball. 

The difference in recoil from 115 to 147 is noticeable, but manageable. I'd go with what you can shoot more effectively.

Zhur


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## TOF (Sep 7, 2006)

I believe point of impact to be significantly more important than whether the bullet is gold plated.

I would feel well armed with the Winchester 147Gr. HP if it cycled my pistol reliably.

Stay safe


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## BeefyBeefo (Jan 30, 2008)

My XD is currently loaded with this round. It's inexpensive (compared to others), I practice with it, and it functions reliably in my pistols. Works for me!

-Jeff-


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## Growler67 (Sep 8, 2008)

Along with the above comments I would recommend to get some "feel" time behind them to see what is and isn't best managed by you and your firearm. I started with 124gr HydraShoks but switched to the 147gr some time ago. I made the change while living in Colorado and camping in the back woods from time to time. Instead of having one for city use and another (load) for camping, I switched to the 147gr figuring more mass had more benefits if I ever needed it. The 124's felt close to the 115gr ball I use (and still do) as general range ammo. Different but close. The 147gr does feel significantly different to 115gr. I believe most ballistic tests also show the 147gr has better penetration characteristics by comparison, FWIW.

After you decide, practice with it during your range sessions. There can and very well may be a difference in POA/POI compared to your usual range ammo. It's a good thing to know if/how much you might need to adjust to place your shots on target. I always end my range sessions with at least 2 full mags of HD/SD rounds to keep my POA/POI adjustments fresh in mind.


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## Marcus99 (Apr 23, 2008)

I won't tell you which round to use since thats an important decision to make when it comes to a self defense round and theres people more qualified than myself to recommend a round.

I have however put a few of those rounds through my P99. Specifically, they were Winchester Super-X 147gr Silver-coated, Hollow Point 9mm's. I'm pretty damn accurate with them, but in comparison to the JHP 115gr at Walmart for $19.97 they were too expensive. Overall, I liked them but I found them too pricey to shoot regularly. I do however have a box set aside for when I get my CCW.


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## jeb21 (Jun 10, 2008)

Thanks for the replies. One of the reasons I am considering switching to the 147 grain is that the cost for SD rounds is very low and this will allow me to practice more with the round. I will be shooting the bullet out of a Smith 3913 which, if you are not familiar with the weapon, is a single stack aluminum frame DA/SA pistol.

I used to keep the weapon loaded with 115 JHP but I have eventually shot through my supplies, when I went to replace the rounds, I found that prices has increased drastically.


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

zhurdan said:


> The difference in recoil from 115 to 147 is noticeable, but manageable. I'd go with what you can shoot more effectively.


*submoa* and I went round and round about this when I was in Afghanistan. He won the debate.

My subjective impression in the past was that 147s kicked more than 115s, but the numbers can't lie. Recoil energy as virtually the same between Winchester's 115gr JHP at 1225fps and their 147gr JHP at 990fps. http://www.handloads.com/calc/recoil.asp

I haven't gotten around to reevaluating my splits with 147s using my shot timer yet, however.


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## unpecador (May 9, 2008)

124gr JHP for me and it aint broke yet.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

This is a question I also had, and most of the research I did seemed to indicate that the 147 grain JHP's were originally designed for carbines, which send the bullet at higher velocities than a pistol, due to more time spent in the longer barrel. For this reason, a lot of the 'experts' claimed that the 147 grain would not expand properly out of a handgun.

I was very sorry to learn this, because both my CZ-75 and my Kahr PM-9 loved the cheap Winchester JHP's, shooting them closer to the point of aim than any other. I switched to 124 grain Speer Gold Dots, as a compromise, and they were reasonably close to POA.

However, I have seen some recent (amateur) tests in wet newsprint that indicates that these same 147 grain JHP's expand just as well as the smaller bullets, so I may start using them myself. 

As the other folks said, mainly just shoot what seems to work best in your gun. Hitting where you aim renders most arguments of this type irrelevant.


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## zhurdan (Mar 21, 2008)

Mike Barham said:


> *submoa* and I went round and round about this when I was in Afghanistan. He won the debate.
> 
> My subjective impression in the past was that 147s kicked more than 115s, but the numbers can't lie. Recoil energy as virtually the same between Winchester's 115gr JHP at 1225fps and their 147gr JHP at 990fps. http://www.handloads.com/calc/recoil.asp


It may very well be a perception issue, but I shoot the 9 a whole lot better with the 115's. On the other hand, I know for sure that the HK MP5 shoots the 147's a whole ton more reliably than the 115's. (Man that was a fun day of experimenting)

Interesting idea though Mike, perhaps I'll take the P99 out and do some split times with 115's and 147's.

Zhur


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## Dredd (Feb 22, 2008)

This is a good read. Some great information.
http://ammo.ar15.com/project/Self_Defense_Ammo_FAQ/index.htm


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