# One step down from a 357 mag when it comes to stopping power



## T-55A5 (Apr 27, 2011)

What caliber (revolver) would be one step down from a 357 mag when it comes to stopping power

I'm looking at getting a 357 mag at the Houston gun show next weekend with a budget of $350.00 - $450.00

Just in case they are higher what would be....one step down......close to the stopping power of a 357 

Also I'm looking at something with a barrel from 4 inches to 6 inches


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## prof_fate (Jan 2, 2012)

Guns are not priced by stopping power...brand, age, condition, new/used and other factors.

When I went shopping for a 1911 45 I found them from $350 to $1800. Caused me to reflect on what I really wanted it for - target shooting/competion in my case, so long barrel and adj sights. That eliminated most choices - and all the cheap ones.

Magnums have the best stopping power followed by the bigger the caliber the better.


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## usmcj (Sep 23, 2011)

I'd suggest you concern yourself much more with proficiency with your firearm of choice, followed by shot placement, then .... maybe.... caliber. Even a hand cannon is worthless if you can't hit what you're shooting at.


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## T-55A5 (Apr 27, 2011)

usmcj said:


> I'd suggest you concern yourself much more with proficiency with your firearm of choice, followed by shot placement, then .... maybe.... caliber. Even a hand cannon is worthless if you can't hit what you're shooting at.


I am good shot with high powered hand guns & revolvers.....up to 20 yards..... thats why I would like a 357 mag, but if I can't find one in the price range I quoted then do they have high powered ammo for a .38

I don't have a revolver in my gun collection and was planning on getting a 357 to go along with my 1911 for house defence and if there is no strong ammo for a .38 then I will just look at a old collector revolvers to go with my WWII rifles


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## prof_fate (Jan 2, 2012)

there is 38+p - but you need a gun that is designed for it - a newer gun and you're not likely to find one in your price range


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## hemmigremmie (Jan 23, 2008)

Don't know were ya live but at a gun show here in Ohio i bought a nib s&w .38 special model 438. Its an airlight and i got it for 396.00 bucks tax n all. I really like the 158 grain ultramax ammo. You can get something, just shop wisely. Hg


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## Mr.Bluster (Feb 6, 2012)

The answer is .38 caliber, which a .357 will shoot. 
Next down, I would say, is a .327 federal magnum.


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## hideit (Oct 3, 2007)

the next step down is a lighter load of .357 magnum!!!
there are so many manufacturers out there are 357 loads that provide 294 ftlbs of energy up to 644 ftlbs of energy
just get a 357 and choose the ammo for the intended purpose - hunting / target / self defense


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## T-55A5 (Apr 27, 2011)

Went looking for a 357 mag at the gun show, but the cheapest was $520.00 and they had a few old revolvers so I went to a local gun store to look at 357's and as soon as I walked in the door I saw this Russian M1895 and when I noticed it came with everything you see I said "sold"

It's a 1940 Tula and except for the hand grip the gun (metal) is in perfect condition and it was oiled to death




























As soon as I get a chance I will shoot it


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Well, your Russian M.'95 revolver certainly is a few whole steps down from .357 Magnum. Maybe as many as 10 steps down.
It's also s-l-o-w to reload.
Certainly, I wouldn't recommend carrying it for self-defense. But that's your call, not mine.

I strongly suggest that you think carefully about what you're trying to accomplish, before you go out gun shopping again.
I must echo the suggestion made by *usmcj*, in response #3: It isn't "stopping power," a myth, but rather _bullet placement_ that does the job.


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## T-55A5 (Apr 27, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Well, your Russian M.'95 revolver certainly is a few whole steps down from .357 Magnum. Maybe as many as 10 steps down.
> It's also s-l-o-w to reload.
> Certainly, I wouldn't recommend carrying it for self-defense. But that's your call, not mine.
> 
> ...


If you go up a few replys you will notice I wrote:

""I don't have a revolver in my gun collection and was planning on getting a 357 to go along with my 1911 for house defence and if there is no strong ammo for a .38 then I will just look at a old collector revolvers to go with my WWII rifles"" 

It was either a 357 mag or a collectors item....the Russian M1895 is a collector gun

I will look for a 357 at another time


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## nightwalker (Feb 13, 2012)

I just picked up a Rossi 971 with a four inch barrel in 357 for $340. I love the way it shoots without much recoil at all. Adjustable sight is nice too.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

OK, so I'll just stick with:


Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...I must echo the suggestion made by *usmcj*, in response #3: It isn't "stopping power," a myth, but rather *bullet placement* that does the job.


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## T-55A5 (Apr 27, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> OK, so I'll just stick with:


If I have to use the M1895 to defend my self (against someone on drugs or wearing body armor) at the house then I will aim for the head or legs

If I can get to my 1911 or Glock 30 then it will not matter....a .45 will not penetrate body armor, but will cause enough damage (internally / blunt trauma) to stop them


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## rex (Jan 27, 2012)

T-55A5 said:


> If I have to use the M1895 to defend my self (against someone on drugs or wearing body armor) at the house then I will aim for the head or legs


DO NOT do that!The State's attorney will nail you to the cross.Never shoot to wound,it shows you were not in fear of your life or great bodily harm because it won't necessarily stop the threat.A head shot is also known as execution,good luck with that one.Practice the Mozambique drill,doubletap COM and 3rd to the head.I would do a couple COMand if he's not stopping or getting too close,then pop the pumpkin as a last resort.


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## T-55A5 (Apr 27, 2011)

rex said:


> DO NOT do that!The State's attorney will nail you to the cross.Never shoot to wound,it shows you were not in fear of your life or great bodily harm because it won't necessarily stop the threat.A head shot is also known as execution,good luck with that one.Practice the Mozambique drill,doubletap COM and 3rd to the head.I would do a couple COMand if he's not stopping or getting too close,then pop the pumpkin as a last resort.


 What's the Mozambique drill & doubletap COM


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

He told you, but his explanation wasn't clear.

Hit the torso twice, as quickly as you can, aiming for center-of-mass (COM), and then observe. If that hasn't decisively ended the fight, put one shot into his head.


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## rex (Jan 27, 2012)

Sorry about that.Law enforcement and defensive pistol in general is taught to shoot 2 rounds center of mass,which is the chest area where all the vital organs are,hence double tap COM.The old B-27 target the police used is basically a human outline from the crotch up.Years ago the FBI came up with a target that was politically correct (the B-27 was black like normal targets),the Q I think,and it looked like a big blue bowling pin.The combat,or action shooting sport known as IPSC and IDPA use a cardboard target with a rectangle for the torso and a box on top for the head.The IPSC targets are nice for a human reference,but I use 9x11 sheets of paper or paper plates.Either is just about the right size if you place them over your chest.

I don't recall the specific run or times to strive for,but the basics of the Mozambique drill is doubletap center of mass and 1 in the head.

Head shots aren't as easy as they seem.Unlike practicing on targets,humans move so there's something that affects shot placement if you don't work with moving targets.Also,the brain only takes up part of the head.Depending on the round used it way just wound them and piss them off more.An effective headshot is basically from the eyes/ears up.

If you ever have to fire for self defense,your only goal is to stop the threat to live through it.Without lots of practice to ingrain muscle memory and an instinct to function without thought,there are lots of misses in defensive shootings.You may miss completely,hit an arm,leg,unintentional vasectomy,it happens.What you want to do is shoot COM to disrupt the central nervous system or take out major organs to dissuade their attack,and shoot until the threat stops.

I remember a shooing case about 20 years ago that's kind of funny but reinforces this.Joe Scumbag breaks in the door and the lady is armed with a hgh capacity 9mm I think.Well,once he kicks the door open and comes in she lets go,runs the mag dry,reloads and dumps more in him.When the police arrive they asked why she shot him so many times,and she said because he didn't fall down.Come to find out when she shot him he fell back on the door and a coat hook or something snagged him so he couldn't drop.I can't remember if it was in the NRA's Armed Citizen or from Mas Ayoob,a cop,firearms trainer and expert witness for self defense cases.

The majority of attacks happen within 21ft,and most of those are under 6ft.There's a 7yd (21ft) rule that is the death zone.If someone is at 21ft with a knife,or any weapon,if you try to draw and fire when they advance,if you get a shot off you're stabbed anyway and a lung or even heart shot still makes them a threat for a minute to do more damage.If pulling a gun is warranted for the situation,you want it out and and ready before they are at 7yds if possible.

Hope this helps.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

rex said:


> ...An effective headshot is basically from the eyes/ears up...


I have been reliably told that the brain-stem is the best fight-stopping target, and it's centered within the nose-to-chin area.
I am unsure that I could shoot quite that well, under mortal stress.

I might go for the neck, though: A center hit stops one's breathing pretty dramatically, and near misses to the sides remove the brain's blood supply.


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## rex (Jan 27, 2012)

Man I type slow,I didn't know you posted while I did mine.

Yeah,the brain stem is excellent but I see it like you do,a small target.So far I've never had to draw in about 25 years and hope I never will,but the way the country and economy are going it's getting harder to remain optomistic about that.The normal dirtbag doesn't worry me much more than normal,it's those young little wannabe retarts that are in way over their head trying to be the cool badassesthat are going to be a big problem.Thank God FL still believes in the Constitution and hasn't roll over to the New World Order mindset.


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