# Help me pick a new 1911



## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

Well I have narrowed my search down to 4 possibilities for a new 1911 I am looking for some opinions on these and if you have a recommendation for another 1911 in the 950 to 1200 price range that would be cool also. The things that I want in a 1911:

1.	Reliability
2.	An accessories rail
3.	Reliability
4.	Nice black, green or tan finish

This gun will not really be for any tactical purpose but more just for looks and fun at the range. I may carry it on occasion but it will not be my concealed weapon (Already has a springer ultra compact for that). So the final 4 are as follows.

1.	The Kimber Custom TLE/RL II: http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/custom/tlerl.php
a.I can find this one for about 980.00 locally and I like that. However I have read some reviews that have lead me to believe that it may not be to reliable. 
2.	The Kimber Custom Warrior II: http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/custom/warrior.php
a.I really like this gun and it is in my price range but just barley as I can get it locally for 1170.00 but all the reviews I have read say it is a very reliable firearm.
3.	The Sig Revalution Nitro Rail: http://www.sigsauer.com/Products/ShowCatalogProductDetails.aspx?categoryid=25&productid=112
a.I loved the feel of the slide on this gun amazingly smooth however, I have heard a lot of negative things about the sig 1911's that sig hasent really been in the 1911 game long enough to get it right? 
4.	The Springfield Operator lightweight: http://www.springfield-armory.com/armory.php?version=33
a.I like the Springfield name, I already own 2 Springfield handguns (Ultra compact and XD-40 Service) I can get one of these for around 1100.00 locally.

Ok so those are the 4 that I am looking at. As of now I am leaning toward one of the Kimber's but I'm not sure and would like some feedback on all of them and what you guys think. Let me know, thanks.


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## falshman70 (Jul 13, 2006)

I have a Kimber Tactical Custom II and it's a nice gun. I've shot a Springfield Operator and it was very nice, also. I'm not much of one for rails on 1911s, especially if it's mostly for range use, but whatever floats your boat. I also have heard knocks on the Sig Revolution 1911s and would probably stay away from that one. Since I have a Kimber, I'd probably go with the Springfield, although if "lightweight" implies alloy frame, I wouldn't choose that for a range gun. Since you already have 2 Springers, you may want to try a Kimber. They're good guns.


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

You have mostly articulated what I have been thinking. I already have the springers so why not try something new. I would simply take the Sig off the list if weren’t for how nice that slide felt. I have owned at least 10 1911's in my life and I have never felt one that was that smooth... ever. Like I said I am leaning toward one of the kimbers but which one? I am the kind of person that if I end up getting something because it was less expensive than what I really wanted I will always regret it, but then again I have been looking at the Insight Light and Laser combos for like 250 and if I got the cheaper kimber I could get one of those as well and if I liked it I could sell the surefire x200 that I have now. So I am at a bit of an impasse I think.


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## Glockamania® (Dec 21, 2006)

I'd stick with Kimbers. I find that Kimbers are more of a solid brand in the 1911 area.

Or you can get an affordable MilSpec Springer.


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## noproblem5671 (Dec 6, 2006)

*1911s*

I love the Warrior, but unless you have big hands or you like larger grips I wouldn't give any weight to the cool looking grip factor. You'll end up wanting thinner grips. For a gun without an extend magwell i found it annoying. The more rounded 1911 grips don't point as instinctively for me. 
I wouldn't mind throwing a set of custom grips on the Warrior that would keep that look and get it to fit my hand the way I like.

I watched a cop in a class I was in shooting the Springer Operator, but it was the steel frame full size. It really shot like a dream. That thing really impressed me as a defense gun.

My buddy has really liked his Kimber TLE /RL, in fact he wants the same one now in 4".


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

Given the choices listed I'd lean toward the Sig. I own two springers and I really like them but those Sigs are really nice. I've owned Kimber too and they are nice 1911's I just like a Springfield more than a Kimber is all. I have never owned the Sig but have shot a couple and those things are just really smooth. Out of the box it is probably the best of the three.


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## KansKd (Jan 24, 2008)

My next 1911 is going to be a Sig. Been doing a little research on them and they're also a great piece. I'm looking at the Revolution C3 model. Don't get to caught up in the negative feed back an any brand of handgun, if you look thru the forums, every company has had bad things to say about them. I think the least thats been talked bad about has been S&W.


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

Thanks for the input guys, here is where I am at as of now:

I think I have all but eliminated the Sig (Sorry DevilsJohnson & KansKd)

The Springfield is nearing elimination as well and the Kimbers are really climbing in my desire to purchase as I shot a custom TLE II yesterday and I shot it better than anything I have ever shot before. 

noproblem5671-Actualy I am 6'4" and do have really big hands, so much so that when shooting two handed I have to place my left thumb along the frame of my XD and it reaches past the take down lever and I can almost touch the tip of my ultra compact with my trigger finger. So big grips = good for me. So that’s one more notch for the warrior... 

I think we make have a winner. No to trick… I mean convince... the wife that the difference between spending 950 and 1170 is not that bad. I’m thinking of going with the old "Honey look at the extra features on this one, and its called the Warrior... how cool is that" or maybe "there both expensive guns babe but you still get what you pay for and this one is really nice" I was going to try "Look women see these (Pulling at my trousers) these are the pants in this family dang it and there on me" but that never ends well.


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

Oh, don't get me wrong. I have nothing against any of those listed pistols. I own two Springfield. I don't have any Kimber guns..I'm just not as big a fan of them as I am others. I said the Sig mostly because any company that boast a motto like "*To Hell and back reliability*" and then actually live up to it is a pretty big deal to me. The 1911's I actually own are Springfield. Para Ordnance,.Taurus, A Colt MK IV Officers ACP And (One)Rock Island. My carry is a LTC Para. I do plan on getting a Sig 1911 but at the moment only have the one 226. it's a great pistol but not a 1911. And I am a 1911 addict:smt023


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

ha yeah I picked up on that addiction, but as addictions go its not such a bad one. Yeah I decided on the kimber because I got to shoot one and well it was a really nice weapon. Im sure the Sig is a good gun but I like the looks of the Kimber better and it shot so sweet that I cant stop thinking about it.


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## Wandering Man (Jul 9, 2006)

Joeshwa24 said:


> I cant stop thinking about it.


Yep! Sure sign of an addiction. :smt023

Next, you'll be having sleepless nights until the purchase has been made. :smt086

Soon your wife will be complaining because your ignoring her because you're too busy reading about your new gun.:reading:

You'll be found huddled in the corner fondling your new Kimber. :smt074

You'll ignore your family obligations :smt102 ... going for days without bathing, or shaving shaving. artyman:

Welcome to the club. :smt021

:smt100

WM


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

LOL...well.... I went on Ableammo.com with the intention of getting my Warrior... and I did that... then I got the new Insight Light Laser combo... and after seeing that numberI went ahead and ordered the Pro TLE/RL II... Abbleammo.com loves me right now... my wife hates me...2300 dollers later I am super stoked that I have two guns comming and baught them with with my tax return... theres something about spending uncle sams money on a few guns that feels really good.:mrgreen::smt1099


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

I have a wife that can't seem to understand that even though I do have only two hands I need more than two guns. I make up all kinds of neat stories then end up talking her into shooting whatever my newest find might be and she will say "Boy it does shoot good don't it". She's more into long guns so I will pick some rifle up now and then so she can say ooOOOOOoooo and soften the blow that I have picked up yet another 1911. Some day she will understand. 1911's are like Lay's chips...You can't have just one:smt082

I don't own any Kimber pistols at the moment but I'm sure at some point that will probably change. Always room for another 1911:smt023


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Joeshwa24 said:


> LOL...well.... I went on Ableammo.com with the intention of getting my Warrior... and I did that... then I got the new Insight Light Laser combo... and after seeing that numberI went ahead and ordered the Pro TLE/RL II... Abbleammo.com loves me right now... my wife hates me...2300 dollers later I am super stoked that I have two guns comming and baught them with with my tax return... theres something about spending uncle sams money on a few guns that feels really good.:mrgreen::smt1099


So now that you've had the guns for a couple of months do you have any regrets? I too am in the same position as you were several months ago. I am contemplating whether to get the kimber Custom II or the Sig GSR Revolution nitron.
Any insight you or anyone else could provide would be helpful.
BTW, the gun would be used mostly as a target gun, and hobby type thing.


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Desperado-OPs said:


> So now that you've had the guns for a couple of months do you have any regrets? I too am in the same position as you were several months ago. I am contemplating whether to get the kimber Custom II or the Sig GSR Revolution nitron.
> Any insight you or anyone else could provide would be helpful.
> BTW, the gun would be used mostly as a target gun, and hobby type thing.


My mistake Joeshwa, I saw November 2007 on the top right of your post but I just realized that was your join date. After you get your new guns, please post your opinions of them.
Thanks


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

I have a Kimber Custom 2 and will in a couple of days have a Gold match 2 as well. I would pick a Kimber, not just because I own them but because of why I do. I find them extremely reliable; I have yet to have a jam of any kind that wasn't directly my fault (squib; I bought a new progressive loader at the same time I bought the first Kimber. There's a learning curve.). The only functional difference between the two you are considering are cosmetic, so consider that when choosing a price to pay. Since all Kimbers come standard with Match Grade Barrels, the only other big difference is a stainless barrel of which they have two different accuracy guarantees and custom installation choices.

As far as the accessory rail, I personally dont want to put a light/flair at my location to make me an easy target for BG's. If someones shooting in complete darkness, then it's time to run, not shoot. IMO

Also, the Kimbers *all *have a light trigger pull, stock out of the box.


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Thanks for the input WBoggs. Price-wise they are similar due to the $100 law enforcement rebate from Sig. I don't know too much about Kimber or 1911s for that matter but I currently own 3 different Sigs. So far, in 13+ years I haven't had a single problem with any of my Sigs. I'm kinda torn right now though because I wouldn't necessarily mind a change of pace from Sig. 
Also, the Custom2 slide and frame are black oxide and I'm not really sure what that is, whereas the Sig is Nitron stainless.
If you can tell me what black oxide is and what I can expect out of it as far as wear, rusting etc I'd appreciate it.


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## Guest (Feb 19, 2008)

Black Oxide is a matte black finish, fingerprint free, has proven durable for me. This is an example of Black Oxide as a gun finish; I like mine.

http://www.mmsonline.com/articles/0597bp4.html


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Ok so I went to the gun stores near me today and here is what I learned:

1) I don't like the Sig GSRs
2) I like Kimber
3) I can buy the Custom II for $679 + tax 
4) I can buy the Eclipse Custom II for $999.
5) I can buy the Eclipse Target II for $1069.
6) I can buy the SIS for $1099

To summarize: Kimber will be my next purchase I just don't know which one yet. I liked the Customs, SIS, and the Eclipses but I don't know if the Eclipse and SIS are worth the extra $300-$400.

Anyone have some advice or opinion?


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

That's a tough one:
The Custom 2 is a real bargain.
The 2 Eclipses sure are pretty guns and I would like one because of that too.
I'm not big on the SIS's aesthetically but that's purely a personal taste thing.

Of all the guns, considering the prices; I would either do the Custom 2 because of the value for the dollar or none of the ones you picked and get the Gold Match 2 and for he same or maybe a little less (depending on your supplier) than the SIS get the benefit of the hand fitted custom barrel and enjoy the accuracy. But then I'm a target shooter.

What ever Kimber you decide though, I assure you you will like it. They all at least have match barrels and bushings and my Custom 2 is a real good shooter. I jsut got the Gold Match 2 to step up accuracy a couple of notches.

Lots of luck, keep us posted.


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Ok I bit the bullet (so to speak) and bought a new gun. Early on I was able to rule out the Custom II and the SIS. While both are VERY nice, I really like the stainless finish on the Eclipse and the Springfield Loaded. PX9154. The price was about $150 more for the Kimber but I was still leaning that way. While comparing the 2 beautiful guns with the salesman he mentioned that Kimber only has a one year warranty and that's when it all changed.
I eventually decided to go with the Springfield. I'll ty to post the photo from their website. I would post my own but due to the 72hour rule in Illinois I will have to wait til Saturday.
Hopefully I will be as happy with my new toy as everyone in here seems to be with theirs.
Thanks for the help.

http://www.springfield-armory.com/armory.php?version=19

By the way, it's the one on the bottom right if it worked correctly.


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

VERY NICE:smt023

Now there's an option that makes sense; little cheaper and the same beautiful gun. I'm sure you'll be tickled with it, Springfield is certainly an A1 choice as well and every bit as pretty a gun as Kimbers similar design.

72 hours, how can you stand it?? Oh that's right, Illinois, the toughest gun laws in the Country (we herd in the recent shooting news reports); that's why you guys dont have any shootings. LOL :smt068


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Thanks for the kind words Boggs. 
Yeah Illinois is ridiculous with the gun control laws. I'm a sworn full time police officer and I still need to wait 72 hours. Always seemed kinda crazy to me seeing as I can walk into a gun store with a loaded gun on each hip but I can't leave the store with a gun I paid for for at least 72 hours. The only way around it, for the police at least, is to bring a certified letter from your chief stating the gun is for duty use. For me it isn't worth the hassle. I've waited over 37 years for my first 1911 so I guess I can wait another 72hours.


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

WOW!!! Your first 1911?!!!! I bet you're excited.

What prompted me to buy my first a couple of years ago was cleaning one for a friend of mine. I was getting bored as can be on disability and a friend admitted that he has several guns that have been in storage for many years and may not have been cleaned first so I offered to occupy some time cleaning them for him; one of them was a 1911. All I had to do was hold it and I was hooked.

You're going to love it; they aren't the most popular handgun for over 100 years for nothing.:smt023


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

I am definitely pretty excited about it. I was up until 145AM last night looking for better sights and lighter trigger jobs. I can see this is going to be a love affair from day 1.
Last night when I bought the gun I also bought two Wilson Combat 47D magazines (I read about them here on the forums), and a Blackhawk Serpa paddle/belt holster.


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

Well guys I went out and shot for about three hours yesterday and put just under 250 rounds through each gun respectively... Not one Jam of any kind. I love these guns. I went out back of my property and set up multiple targets on my range from 3 yard, 7 yards 10 yards and out to about 50 feet and I have to say that warrior is just dead on every shot. The Pro TLE did very well to but just like any other 1911 you can easily see the difference in the 4 and 5 inch barrel when shooting at a distance. That said it wasn't like I was missing targets my groupings were more like 6 inches out at 50 feet with the Pro TLE while the Warrior was giving me 2 to 4 inch groupings at 50 feet. In at the 3 and 7 yard targets I was shooting groupings you could put a half dollar over with both. I also let the Sun set and tested out my new Insight Laser/light combo and it was really awesome. That was the first time I had shot with the light on and attached and it worked beautifully. All in all I couldn't be happier. Another big plus; my wife loves the Pro TLE and is threatening to steel it so she is cool with the exorbitant expenditure. My wife busted out the camera and took some pic's I will see if I can get those up later.



Desperado-OPs said:


> Thanks for the kind words Boggs.
> Yeah Illinois is ridiculous with the gun control laws. I'm a sworn full time police officer and I still need to wait 72 hours. Always seemed kinda crazy to me seeing as I can walk into a gun store with a loaded gun on each hip but I can't leave the store with a gun I paid for for at least 72 hours. The only way around it, for the police at least, is to bring a certified letter from your chief stating the gun is for duty use. For me it isn't worth the hassle. I've waited over 37 years for my first 1911 so I guess I can wait another 72hours.


Hey Congrats on the first 1911... I'm sure you are going to love it, but dude I have now officially marked Illinois off my travel list. I make a point to never go to Communist countries... Seriously that's the worst thing I think I have heard in a long time. Not only are you serving people but the very people you are sworn to obey and protect are robbing you of your rights. That sucks.


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Glad to hear you love your new Kimbers!
I agree with you not wanting to come to Illinois Joeshwa. These liberals have ruined everything here! The majority of the population of this state live in the Chicago metro area and guns are taboo to some of these freaks. The rest of the state is just the opposite. Realistically, these professional liars/politicians feel they need to be proponents of gun control to appease these screaming liberals.
I need to move to South Dakota or the wild west!
Please kidnap me, my German Shorthair pointer and my gun collection.


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

You might ask the place where you bought it about the trigger; by the looks of it, it appears to have the hardware capable of lightening the trigger. You may just need that tweaked a little rather than replacing any hardware.

Also Wilson Magazines are definitely good ones but for a good bit less money Chip McCormick's have a very good reputation.

http://www.midwayusa.com/ebrowse.ex...Returned=20&PageSelect2=1&RecordsReturned2=20

And many of them are on sale now.


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

Desperado-OPs said:


> Glad to hear you love your new Kimbers!
> I agree with you not wanting to come to Illinois Joeshwa. These liberals have ruined everything here! The majority of the population of this state live in the Chicago metro area and guns are taboo to some of these freaks. The rest of the state is just the opposite. Realistically, these professional liars/politicians feel they need to be proponents of gun control to appease these screaming liberals.
> I need to move to South Dakota or the wild west!
> Please kidnap me, my German Shorthair pointer and my gun collection.


Eh forget the north man I lived up north for a few years and it's to dang cold... come down to New Mexico where we still have freedom and good shooting weather all year round. I mean I can walk down the street (and do) with my pistol proudly displayed in its Galco leather completely legally.



wboggs said:


> You might ask the place where you bought it about the trigger; by the looks of it, it appears to have the hardware capable of lightening the trigger. You may just need that tweaked a little rather than replacing any hardware.
> 
> Also Wilson Magazines are definitely good ones but for a good bit less money Chip McCormick's have a very good reputation.
> 
> ...


The McCormicks are great Mags I have never had a single issue and all my after market mags have always been McCormicks. I now plan on dropping some Coin on some of them once again.

As far as the trigger Job I wouldn't tamper with your trigger unless you are a gun smith or very familiar with the inner workings of your firearm and even then realistically I wouldn't do it. Just take it to a good gun smith.


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

Desperado-OPs said:


> Glad to hear you love your new Kimbers!
> I agree with you not wanting to come to Illinois Joeshwa. These liberals have ruined everything here! The majority of the population of this state live in the Chicago metro area and guns are taboo to some of these freaks. The rest of the state is just the opposite. Realistically, these professional liars/politicians feel they need to be proponents of gun control to appease these screaming liberals.
> I need to move to South Dakota or the wild west!
> Please kidnap me, my German Shorthair pointer and my gun collection.


My gun dealer guy recently told me a story about an FBI Agent that was denied buying a gun with our (Pennsylvania's) Insta-Check System. The problem was eventually straightened out but you would think someone would be appropriately embarrassed about that one.


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

The truth of the matter is that people who have hits on there background checks are not going to buy guns from a store so background checks and waiting periods simply do not work. On top of that its an infringment on my ability to keep and bare arms.


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2008)

Joeshwa24 said:


> As far as the trigger Job I wouldn't tamper with your trigger unless you are a gun smith or very familiar with the inner workings of your firearm and even then realistically I wouldn't do it. Just take it to a good gun smith.


I can see how what I typed might have been misread; I never meant to do it yourself but to take it to a gunsmith and ask them; meaning have them do it and/or identify the parts to see if they only need to tweak it. Messing with a trigger yourself would be real stupid.


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Yeah the weather here is great!!!! Today was a balmy 22 degrees. Quite the warmup from two days ago when the high was 7 degrees witha steady -15 wind chill.
Regarding the McCormick mags.... I will definitely keep those in mind for the next time I'm buying mags. The gun comes with 2 (I think) and I bought the two Wilsons. And a friend of mine just gave me 2 colt mags and 2 crappy fake Colt mags.


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

Joeshwa24 said:


> The truth of the matter is that people who have hits on there background checks are not going to buy guns from a store so background checks and waiting periods simply do not work. On top of that its an infringment on my ability to keep and bare arms.


 You're exactly right, I don't know the real numbers but I'll wager the avg. gang thug don't have a CCW permit and I doubt they got their gun at a FFL dealer. Looking up an owner by the serial number works on TV really great but in the real world all that is accomplished with waiting periods and background checks are jobs for bureaucracies. I'm sure some people that live in gaited communities far away from the real world. I'd like to see how far Hillary would pick up a hand gun if she was in a back alley and a bunch of dope heads high enough to find her attractive. :smt082

Really glad you new to 1911 people are enjoying your new addictions. I have 8 different 1911's as of today. There's a gun show in a couple weeks though..hahahahaa!!! Ya can't have just one:smt023


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

DevilsJohnson said:


> You're exactly right, I don't know the real numbers but I'll wager the avg. gang thug don't have a CCW permit and I doubt they got their gun at a FFL dealer. Looking up an owner by the serial number works on TV really great but in the real world all that is accomplished with waiting periods and background checks are jobs for bureaucracies. I'm sure some people that live in gaited communities far away from the real world. I'd like to see how far Hillary would pick up a hand gun if she was in a back alley and a bunch of dope heads high enough to find her attractive. :smt082
> 
> Really glad you new to 1911 people are enjoying your new addictions. I have 8 different 1911's as of today. There's a gun show in a couple weeks though..hahahahaa!!! Ya can't have just one:smt023


Yeah most of the libs would more than likely change there tune in a second if they lived in the real world. It's sad to say it but the size of our government has created a disjointing between those who make the laws those who enforce them and those who live under them. This is the beginnings of socialism and our disenfranchised proletariat is all but eager to bow there head and let it come. If the economy doesn't collapse first; I think we are going to have to make a decision very soon as to how many of our rights we will let the government take from us. The right to defend myself and my family didn't come from any bill of rights but from the fact that I live and breathe. When a politician assumes that he has power to give and take those rights has ascended himself in his own mind (Whether consciously or subconsciously) to a god-like status; again all stemming from a disconnection with the reality that he or she so nobly tries to govern. Its time we stopped trying to fight the government on there own field, it slanted and corrupt. I am not in anyway indorsing violence against our government, what I am saying is standing and saying "The second amendment guarantees my right to keep and bare arms" is a moot and ultimately failing argument because it is based in bureaucracy and a piece of paper. As we all know bureaucracy and paper change with every new politician but the heart of a free man never does and it's from there that our battle cry should come. I love our country but America did not grant me my freedom it recognized it God granted it to me the day I was born.


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

Joeshwa24 said:


> I think we make have a winner. No to trick&#8230; I mean convince... the wife that the difference between spending 950 and 1170 is not that bad. I'm thinking of going with the old "Honey look at the extra features on this one, and its called the Warrior... how cool is that" or maybe "there both expensive guns babe but you still get what you pay for and this one is really nice" I was going to try "Look women see these (Pulling at my trousers) these are the pants in this family dang it and there on me" but that never ends well.


how about "honey, remember when you were buying (shoes?) and i suggested going to the mall cheap store and you said "i'll go to the brand store. spending a little extra for better qulity is worth it?" Will this is the same situation.

but if you try the pants thing, set up the video camera and post the video please:smt033


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## Joeshwa24 (Nov 14, 2007)

LOL....yeah... well I already spent the money for both and Im still here so I think Im cool.


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## Desperado-OPs (Feb 17, 2008)

Yesterday my wife asked me if a bought another gun. When I told her I did, she wanted to see it. Since I haven't received it yet, I showed her the pic from Springfield's website. She liked the way it looked and then said it's nice for only a couple of hundred dollars. 
I didn't have the heart to tell her the real cost I just told her it was a little more than a couple hundred.


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## kenn (Dec 13, 2007)

*Whoa...*



Joeshwa24 said:


> LOL....yeah... well I already spent the money for both and Im still here so I think Im cool.


Hot damn! How did you swing that?
I'm thinking Jedi mind trick. "These are not the droids you are looking for."
Please, teach me. I am willing to learn.


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

Joeshwa24 said:


> LOL....yeah... well I already spent the money for both and Im still here so I think Im cool.


I saw that after I posted. But hey there is always the NEXT purchase to think about.


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## OJ (Dec 25, 2006)

First step is to go to a gun dealer that sells all brands.

Second step is to look at and handle them all.

Third - if the dealer says OK - dry fire them all.

Forth - keep notes of prices, plusses and minuses.

Fifth - if you and the sales person are still friends, go back to the Series 70 Colts. By this time, the sales person should be willing to sell you one and give whatever discount you want.



















:smt033


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