# Shield owners - clue me in



## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

I bought a Shield on an impulse, despite having an XDs45 and numerous other sub-compacts. I really like the XDs and shoot it well, but it seems that I'm always looking for that perfect sub-compact.

I've put 100 rounds of 115 grain FMJ through the Shield and I don't like the trigger. I'm pulling everything left and shooting 6" patterns at 10-12 yards, whereas I regularly shoot 2-3" groups at the aim point with the XDs.45. The Shield felt good when I bought it, and although I could tell the trigger was not as good as the XDs, I thought I would be able to get used to it quickly. I never did, in 100 rounds.

Does the trigger get better with more rounds fired? Or do I have to look for an after-market trigger?


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

Yes, the trigger does loosen up, but I would ask what is your finger position? You an also change a few things to make the trigger really nice and smooth. I replace the sear on my M&P45, and it went from a gritty 9lb factory pull to a crips 3.5 lb pull. Made a HUGE difference.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Yeah, I can spend $92 to make it like my XDs .45 that was already good from the factory. Ironically, that was about the price difference that tipped me over to trying the Shield, instead of the XDs 9mm. I like the Shield, but if I had it to do over, I'd probably have shelled out extra for the XDs 9mm. I'll probably go with the Apex sear kit if I don't improve within the next couple hundred rounds.

As for my shooting fundamentals, I stopped halfway through and put a few rounds through the XDs 45, and was shooting it up to decent standards. So, I'll have to make some adjustments with the Shield, or do the trigger work.


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

You can get a good sear from Apex for about $50. I changed it out myself, and it took about five minutes. Actually, my cousin changed it for me, but I watched him!


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## slayer61 (Aug 4, 2014)

*Shield in 9mm*

Granted the shot below is from 7.5 yards, but the shield is deadly accurate at that distance. 
The top target is my shield and the bottom was my SP2022. It works for me right out of the box. As GCBHM said there's some finger placement to consider...


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Yes, it is definitely better at 7 yards.


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## muckaleewarrior (Aug 10, 2014)

My Shield was and has been dead on right out the box. No issues or need for any work here. It's not as good as my Walthers especially at distance but it's just fine for its purpose. The Shield may just not be right for you.


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## Scott9mm (Jul 2, 2012)

My Shield trigger is about 6.5 lb, which is just about right (IMO) for a defensive carry gun. The drop sear does create a crunchy feel during take-up but the trigger firms up nicely just before a fairly crisp let-off. But there are also a special version (for Massachusetts , I think) with a horrible heavy trigger. Hopefully that isn't your problem.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

It's heavy enough that I haven't been able to adapt my normal trigger pull to compensate, so far. It only has a hundred rounds through it, so I'll work with it some more before spending any money on it. I've been able to shoot all of the other small handguns I've kept, by 100 rounds, but I'll try some more. Maybe I will move up close, say 5-7 yards and then try to work my way back out.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

I shoot and carry the M&P 9 Shield. At the beginning I shot low left (about 6"-8" distance out of the center of 10 yards). I don't know how many rounds I got trough mine but I am exercise the gun with 200 round every month. The trigger is.... hummm better. Is it the trigger that become better or I get used to it I don't know, but I shoot with the Shield now nice 3"-4" groups at 10-12 yards. Still a little bit low left but neglectable.


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## KeithC. (Dec 24, 2013)

I went round and round with that trigger as well. I am left handed so I was low and to the right 6" at 10 yards. I finally jammed my trigger finger in there all the way to the joint of the first digit and it stopped pulling. 

I don't know why that worked for me. Maybe the compressed frame size of the Shield did not work for the size hands I have. This is the only gun I have ever owned I shoot that way.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

This is good to hear, for me. I've been chastised quite a bit for 'blaspheming' against this very popular pistol, so I'm glad to find someone with a similar experience. 

I'm going to try a few more things before doing any work on the pistol, but jamming my finger into the first joint was a hard habit to break for me, a long time ago, so I'm reluctant to go that far. I don't really want a solution that will screw up the 'mechanics' that work for everything else I shoot. I've looked at a video on the sear upgrade, and I think I'm up to it, so likely I will go that route, if it doesn't start to wear in after a couple hundred more rounds. Or I may just try to knock some of the grit out of the striker safety channel and polish the existing sear and pin. If I screw it up, I can always buy the Apex parts.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

PT111Pro said:


> I shoot and carry the M&P 9 Shield. At the beginning I shot low left (about 6"-8" distance out of the center of 10 yards). I don't know how many rounds I got trough mine but I am exercise the gun with 200 round every month. The trigger is.... hummm better. Is it the trigger that become better or I get used to it I don't know, but I shoot with the Shield now nice 3"-4" groups at 10-12 yards. Still a little bit low left but neglectable.


Sounds familiar.

I like the pistol, and chose it because I wanted to compare it to the XDs, which I really like. Also, 9mm is cheaper to practice with, and I need lots of short-barrel practice to stay in the accuracy 'groove' I like to maintain. I find that the extra concentration required to shoot sub compacts benefits my overall marksmanship skills, but I don't want to have to adjust my mechanics too much, or it defeats the purpose.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Dry firing while focusing only on the sights movement might help detect if it's a trigger issue.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

It is a trigger issue.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Bisley said:


> It is a trigger issue.


Hope you work it out.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Thanks. I think I will, and I believe that I will like it as much as everyone else, when I do.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

Like I said earlier, I don't know if the trigger goes better or if I get used to it. Bu when I go to the shooting range it makers a difference if I shoot a different weapon first.
If I shoot the Shield first I shoot nice groups 3"-4" a little down left out of the middle.
If I shoot a other weapon first there is a little difference.
Last time I took a M&P 9c and the Walther PPQ with me and shoot the MP9c and PPQ first. When I than took the shield to do my monthly practice I shoot 7"-8" low left in a 6"-8" group in a distance of 10 yards. It took me 10 rounds shooting down the pipe to make acceptable groups on target again.

So is it the trigger? I still like that little gun because it's thin with a short handle that is easy to conceal even in a suit and tie in the office and the feel in the hand is very nice. But if I can, I always carry the PT111 (wiliam sights) or the MP9c because of the better shooting results on target.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

A good sub compact (in my opinion) is well capable of 1-2" 'groups' at 10 yards, if the trigger mechanics of the shooter are up to it. I don't shoot that well, now, but I can shoot a couple of mine nearly that well when I'm practicing enough. With the XDs .45, I shot 5 rounds inside of 3" with one bulls eye on the same day as my poor performance with the Shield. I'm hoping to shoot that well with the Shield so I can save a little by shooting 9mm, a lot more than I will shoot the .45. The .45 in a gun that small starts to fatigue me somewhat after a few magazines and my accuracy starts declining, so I don't practice enough (though it's still fine for self defense carry).


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

UPDATE

I decided to be a little more pro-active than just shooting up another $50 worth of ammo to get used to the trigger.

I watched a video of the Apex sear kit installation and decided that I should be able to hone the sear and block pin to look like the Apex parts. I did that, using a small file and 400 grit sand paper, and I think I may have helped it a bit. The trigger is still 'spongey' before it gets to the break point, but it breaks clean, with a lighter pull. I can dry-fire it with my normal mechanics without losing sight picture on the target, so if that translates into better accuracy and function is still good, I probably won't get the Apex kit.

On another note, I forgot to mention that I also have another issue that seems fairly common with this pistol. The slide doesn't always lock back upon emptying the magazine, and it takes an almost superhuman effort to lock it back manually, with no magazine inserted. I attribute this to the extra-strong nested recoil springs, so I intend to shoot a lot of extra-hot 147 grain hand loads through it, in hopes of wearing everything in well enough for this to function better. If that doesn't work, I may break the file and sand paper out, again.

Another thing - not very important (to me) - is that the Shield is supposed to field-strip without having to pull the trigger. I have not found this to be true, so far, but that doesn't bother me because I'm used to it from other striker fired pistols.

I'll post back with results when I get back out to the range (unless I get embarrassing results :mrgreen.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

> Bisley
> The slide doesn't always lock back upon emptying the magazine, and it takes an almost superhuman effort to lock it back manually, with no magazine inserted. I attribute this to the extra-strong nested recoil springs,


Talking about the S&W M&P 9 Shield.
This is what I noticed right from the beginning and I thought first something is wrong with the gun until I realized, that the hard to pull slide with this hard recoil spring is there on purpose. The pistol is not made for people that have arthritis or similar problems. Pulling the slide back can be a task and after cleaning and put together the gun again, it could be very difficult to pull the slide back to turn the disassembly pin back in normal position to secure the slide again. 
I know we male often don't see that as an issue until we have arthritis or similar problems. I recommend before purchasing a shield to field strip the gun and put the gun together to see if it works for you. Just saying.

When my daughter carried this little shooter for a week or so, I had to put the gun together that she could carry it as long her H&K was in the shop. She was not able to pull the slide far enough back to fill the chamber with a round.

I would say I have shot with this gun about 2500 rounds so far, all 9mm Luger 147gr loads, some even 147 gr +P but the skirts in the home are not able to put the gun back together due to the very hard to pull slide.

I still like the little gun but the gun has definitely issues.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Yep, it isn't always perfect from the factory. But, I want to like it because it feels good in my hand and I think it will be accurate with a reasonable trigger pull. The other small issues, I will either solve or get used to them.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Another update:

I managed to get out to the shooting range, briefly, and put a few magazines through the Shield. It still functions perfectly after my venture into DIY 'gunsmithing' on the trigger sear. The trigger pull is within acceptable limits now, and I think some disciplined practice will eventually have me shooting it as well as I want to. I don't notice the sponginess or grittiness I mentioned earlier, so maybe I was over-thinking that. I'm still pulling it left a little, more often than not, but I can at least get an occasional bulls eye at 10 yards. This tells me that it is now down to a concentration issue, and I won't achieve any consistency till I get more practice in.

I ran WWB 115gr. factory loads through it, followed by a variety of 124gr. and 147 gr. hand loads. It definitely likes the 147 gr. 'hot' loads best, as has been the case with all of my 9mm pistols. That is good, since it is my choice in self defense ammo, and since I stocked up on Midway 'blems,' back before all the pricing craziness started. These blems are Hornady XTPs that have some minor discolorations, but are still within 'specs.'


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

FINAL ANALYSES ON SHIELD

I swung by the range this morning and put another hundred rounds through the Shield. I had the place to myself, early, and concentrated somewhat better, although I didn't decide to shoot until I had already had a full pot of coffee. Also, I used my normal vision bi-focals, so the front sight focus was less than perfect. But, all this is fairly typical of a normal day for me, so I guess I got a pretty fair representation of what I can expect in any sort of self defense scenario. I took a crappy cell phone photo of my last three targets. They are nothing to brag about, but fairly representative of my accuracy with this pistol, on this day.

The top picture is one magazine of 147 gr. handloads at 10 yards, slow fire. The lower pictures are 115 grain Winchester white box, semi-rapid fire at 7 yards.










In the final analyses, I probably won't carry it much, unless my shooting with it improves, but it is a decent, reliable little pistol, that delivers a potent round accurately, with very manageable recoil. The occasional bulls eye when I knew I was following through correctly tells me that it is capable of very good accuracy - I just have not mastered it, yet, and may never. It will be a good practice gun, because it forces me to concentrate on the fundamentals more than anything else I shoot on a regular basis. I think a person with shorter fingers and hand might shoot it a lot better than I can, so far.


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

Bisley said:


> FINAL ANALYSES ON SHIELD
> 
> I swung by the range this morning and put another hundred rounds through the Shield. I had the place to myself, early, and concentrated somewhat better, although I didn't decide to shoot until I had already had a full pot of coffee. Also, I used my normal vision bi-focals, so the front sight focus was less than perfect. But, all this is fairly typical of a normal day for me, so I guess I got a pretty fair representation of what I can expect in any sort of self defense scenario. I took a crappy cell phone photo of my last three targets. They are nothing to brag about, but fairly representative of my accuracy with this pistol, on this day.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I think if you were able to extend the grip a little you'd have better success. I attest to the pistol's accuracy, but trigger control is huge on these smaller guns. I really like it, but it could pose a real problem for those with larger hands. I really want to get my hands on the G43 to compare, though.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

By the time the G43 gets here and the prices stabilize, I'll probably be off on a different tangent. :mrgreen:


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## Greybeard (Mar 17, 2013)

I have the full size M&P9 and it feels pretty much the way it did from the get go. The trigger on these guns is factory setup for self defense and tactical and not so much for target. My son has installed an APEX trigger kit in both his Shield and Full and I think his pulls at about 4 lbs now which is much better for target.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Yeah, I have pretty much resigned myself to the idea that this is a short range defense gun, in my hands. I have seen people shoot them very accurately and I have other pistols with the same sighting distance that I, myself, shoot well. But when you combine that short sighting distance with a poor trigger, it may just be too much to overcome for the 'casual' shooter. I simply don't spend enough time and money on shooting to reach the proficiency level needed to shoot this particular one as well as I shoot some of the others.

The smaller pistols that I shoot well are the CZ RAMI and the XDs45, both of which have a longer distance between where the heel of my hand contacts the back of the grip and the point at which the trigger breaks. This allows me to 'finish flat' on the trigger pull and therefore I can 'follow through' properly without having to alter my grip. The Shield is OK when I'm simply shooting at 12" steel plates, even from 15-20 yards - I just cannot 'bear down' and shoot smaller targets, as I expected I would be able to. With the Shield, I have to do everything perfectly to hit a 1" bulls eye, and as you can see from the targets, I don't often do everything perfectly.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

Exactly. With a weapon that I can't shoot somewhat satisfying, I shoot just not enough. Sure I take my Shield every 2-3 weeks out to the range, hammer 100-150 rounds down the pipe. 
It is more like, - OK, lets shoot it so it's not going even more worse. Hammering round after round down the pipe not even expecting to make satisfying hits. As soon as I can (shot enough rounds so I justify it for me) I take a other gun to shoot for fun.

A gun that is no fun to shoot will always be a gun of the back row. I ask often how I could carry the gun if I have a hard time to shoot decent groups on a target range in a distance between 20-30 feet with it. Would it be in a event of real threat not even more worse?
I'll carry that gun in the office because of concealing and the office dress code and convinced myself that in office distances accurate hits not really matter.

I like the gun how it holds, loaded with 124gr ammo the gun is very balanced in the hand and aims good but I am not satisfied what I personally can do with it.

Will see what happen if I put the APEX in it, if that don't help the gun goes definitely in the back of the safe and I have to carry more inconvenient the M&P 9c, because of the dress code and concealment until I find a different single stack.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

That nails it down pretty good, in my opinion.

Hopefully, all of my shooting will end up being for my personal pleasure, but it is also important to feel like I could use it well in a self-defense situation. For me, there are many pistols that I enjoy shooting more. The Shield is above the Ruger LCP on that list, slightly above the Kahr K series pistols that also do not fit me very well, and below everything else, to varying degrees.

In your case, since you don't have problems with the 'fit,' the Apex kit might be a good solution. The CZ RAMI that I love to shoot was problematic (feed and eject issues) for several months, before I got it like I wanted. But, it was always an outstanding short-barreled target pistol, so I stuck with it.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

Changed the shield9 trigger kit. I did not change the fire pin safety bold because I don't wanted to mess with the rear sights on the little pistol.
Went out yesterday to the indoor range and voila!!!!

The gun is now a smooth shooter. It pulls like silk and the break point is clear like a fresh spring morning on lake Tawakoni.

After about 5 Minutes the target showed a apple sized hole, the bulls eye fall out and that in a shooting, of for a 3" barrel gun, respectable distance of 15 Yards or 45 feet. 

A gun that is fun to shoot and the shooter on fast drawing can produce 8 of 8 head hits on a target in 10 Yards 30 feet distance is a real comfortable carry gun for edc.
Opinion off.

Look's like that trigger kit made at least one happy.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Wow! That's much more improvement than I got from my 'shade tree' trigger job. The springs must really make a lot of difference. 

I may re-visit my Shield experiments, based on this report. Thanks!


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

At least I like it and that is important when it comes down to my personal carry gun. 
I'll think it is even better and even more a remarkable difference since I had this MA compatible trigger. Others that have a non Communist trigger in the beginning, may don't have that much difference. I don't know.

I like it for sure and since I'm still not to old and don't have any memory health issues, and therefore still can handle a manual safety without getting confused if the safety is on or off, have absolutely no problem to carry that gun. It is now a real good little carry gun. At least for me.


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## Donn (Jul 26, 2013)

I've heard the stories regarding M&P triggers for years. Transitioning from a 1911, trigger was night and day to begin with for me. The gurus at my LGS say let it run itself in, which is what I'm doing. FWIW, my Shield was better out of the box than either my full size or Compact 9. If I ever get a few extra $$$, I might try an Apex kit on my 9c just to see what everyone's talking about. Till then, I'm satisfied with what I've got.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

@Donn
My Grandpa always told me not to buy a S&W if I don't want to spend a arm and a leg for a gunsmith after purchase. It's true and there is no change since the 1970ties. 

It looks like with the Smith & Wesson semi automatic guns it is always the trigger. Not listening to my Grandpa, my first semi automatic S&W was a Sigma and I had my own ohh ahh wit S&W, just telling you.
Looks like S&W makes their guns to make the after market happy. The next S&W that I had was the SD9VE a good gun but needed a upgrade as well and is now a gun that you could use. The M&P's that I have need upgrades to make it a gun. At the moment I should upgrade my M&P 9c too but since I carry the PT111Pro (the same size gun than the M&P 9c) that have already a decent trigger, so I see no need for it at the moment and with the additional 90 Dollar it comes than close to the P290 anyway.

Comparing and buying a S&W you have to check first if someone makes a trigger upgrade for the S&W and add the upgrade TAG for the trigger to the gun purchase. That is just how it is with S&W. Without an upgrade it is not even a gun. That is my experience with S&W. 
Opinion off.


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## boatdoc173 (Mar 15, 2014)

Bisley said:


> I bought a Shield on an impulse, despite having an XDs45 and numerous other sub-compacts. I really like the XDs and shoot it well, but it seems that I'm always looking for that perfect sub-compact.
> 
> I've put 100 rounds of 115 grain FMJ through the Shield and I don't like the trigger. I'm pulling everything left and shooting 6" patterns at 10-12 yards, whereas I regularly shoot 2-3" groups at the aim point with the XDs.45. The Shield felt good when I bought it, and although I could tell the trigger was not as good as the XDs, I thought I would be able to get used to it quickly. I never did, in 100 rounds.
> 
> Does the trigger get better with more rounds fired? Or do I have to look for an after-market trigger?


Bisley

you just made my day easier

I too bought the shield(first) and due to my lack of confidence in carrying that lousy trigger(which has no real safety to it), I just bought the xd-s in 9mm

Although I like the shield on the range. That bogus in -trigger "safety " device make s me nervous. I could never carry it with a round in the chamber. I prefer a glock type safety. The xd has that + the grip safety. I shoot it well

my ? is--does anyone out there know if there is an after market in trigger safety for the shield that will be glock like( or xd like)?

the engineers @S+W made a huge mistake calling this trigger safe--JMHO


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## mercury (Dec 5, 2012)

I have two shields in 9mm.

At 25 feet, one shoots high and left, with a lot of spread. The other shoots centered, with much tighter groups. From the same shooter!


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

I put the Apex straight trigger kit and the Apex sear kit in my Shield, at the cost of about $140. It is now as good as the XDs factory trigger, and I have about the same amount of money invested in the pistol, maybe a little more. If I had it to do over, I'd just buy the XDs-9 and be done with it, but I didn't so it cost me some time and a few more dollars than I would have spent on a new XDs-9 to rectify the situation...better than taking a loss on the Shield, in my opinion. I am now finished with being aggravated about it, and I'm happy with the Shield and I now know how to work on it.


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## Nuallangus (Mar 15, 2015)

Just bought a shield 9MM for the wife for x-mas. She loved the way it fit her hand, she didn't like my LC9. I did test out the shield (hehe) I thought it shoots a bit better than my LC9, I may have to get a shield for myself. The trigger seems fine but not great and shoot ok with it, we all need to remember this is a carry gun not a bulls eye competition gun. As far as take down with out pulling the trigger, the sear needs to be deactivated for this to happen, read the manual if your not sure how to do this.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Nuallangus said:


> ...we all need to remember this is a carry gun not a bulls eye competition gun.


There is considerable room for improvement with a handgun that the shooter can only manage to achieve 'patterns' with, at ten yards, without getting anywhere near bulls eye competition levels.


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

> Nuallanguns
> .....we all need to remember this is a carry gun not a bulls eye competition gun.


Well - yea U right but when you know you could be better than that. For me is it all about placement, than penetration and than expansion. I know others have a different line up and opinion. But I see it that way. In my office set up depending where I am and what I do, to the door is it about 20+ yards. If something happen, I have (hopefully never) to bridge that distance with that shield. If the intruder comes with a automatic rifle I have may be only one shot. Therefore shoot-placement is for me very important.
I'm satisfied after the Trigger work and carried that little gun the entire summer long.
And yes I would recomend that little shooter to my family.


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## GETCHERGUN (Oct 6, 2014)

Bisley said:


> UPDATE
> 
> I decided to be a little more pro-active than just shooting up another $50 worth of ammo to get used to the trigger.
> 
> ...


You can field strip all the M&P products without trigger press.
Clear your shield and leave the slide locked back.Look below the ejector and you will see a yellow wire bent into a funny shape.
Take a retracted ball point pen and capture the top of that wire and gently push it down until it is fully visible in your mag well.

Now you can field strip without trigger press.


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## Malcap (Apr 19, 2016)

It has been recommended not to change nor adjust stock trigger systems on a carry pistol by court room experts. It just doesn't go down well with juries. The 9 Shield has a striker deactivator lever inside the chamber which was painted yellow but fades with cleaning. Check the manual for specifics. That get's pushed-down with a small screw driver or plastic armorers tool. It gets reset with an empty magazine just pushed into the well. The pistol is a bit difficult to work the slide. A little trick is to both push forward on the grip, while you pull back on the slide. While doing that, I push-up on the slide lock with the meatier portion of my right thumb to lock it back. Nice handgun. Shoot safe.


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