# 357 Snubbies



## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

Thinking about getting a 357 snubbie again. I like a revolver I can drop in my pocket. I had an S&W model 60 years ago. It fell apart after I shot it too much. I'm soliciting opinions about 357 vs. 38 special, etc. How much more effective is 357 than 38 & 38 special?


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

oldphart said:


> Thinking about getting a 357 snubbie again. I like a revolver I can drop in my pocket. I had an S&W model 60 years ago. It fell apart after I shot it too much. I'm soliciting opinions about 357 vs. 38 special, etc. *How much more effective is 357 than 38 & 38 special?*


Compared to .38 Special+P. In a snubbie probably the only advantage of a .357 Magnum is punishing recoil, increased muzzle blast, noise and about 150-200 fps increase in velocity on average. 

*Revolver Velocity Versus Barrel Length - Lucky Gunner Lounge*
Mar 13, 2017 · The S&W 686-3 also showed a major drop in velocity with the Magtech 158 gr.357 Magnum load even though the same barrel had comparatively high velocities with some


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

desertman said:


> Compared to .38 Special+P. In a snubbie probably the only advantage of a .357 Magnum is punishing recoil, increased muzzle blast, noise and about 150-200 fps increase in velocity on average.
> 
> *Revolver Velocity Versus Barrel Length - Lucky Gunner Lounge*
> Mar 13, 2017 · The S&W 686-3 also showed a major drop in velocity with the Magtech 158 gr.357 Magnum load even though the same barrel had comparatively high velocities with some


Thank you.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I prefer the 357 round myself. 
But if it's to throw into your pocket, dunno. 
The 357 is gonna be heavy.
Don't know if a smaller framed revolver vs the big frame while shooting hot 38s will be much different in recoil. 
Good luck


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

pic said:


> I prefer the 357 round myself.
> But if it's to throw into your pocket, dunno.
> The 357 is gonna be heavy.
> Don't know if a smaller framed revolver vs the big frame while shooting hot 38s will be much different in recoil.
> Good luck


You can get J frames in 357. I've shot them; my question is about how 400 fps more muzzle velocity makes that much difference in a short barreled gun.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Penetrating ability.
Especially with defragging rounds . If both defrag properly , the 38 won't penetrate as well as the 357.
Deeper penetrating frags have a better chance of reaching vital areas.
400 fps is significant when your velocity is around 1000 fps give or take.
Your choice will be fine. 
I would shoot the j frame in 357 magnum first, before buying it. If they make them anymore


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

pic said:


> Penetrating ability.
> Especially with defragging rounds . If both defrag properly , the 38 won't penetrate as well as the 357.
> Deeper penetrating frags have a better chance of reaching vital areas.
> 400 fps is significant when your velocity is around 1000 fps give or take.
> ...


They make them. Smith Makes several. And Taurus.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

You should shoot a 357 magnum in a smaller frame before you buy it. 
It might be ok for you. I think it'll be more felt recoil


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

pic said:


> You should shoot a 357 magnum in a smaller frame before you buy it.
> It might be ok for you. I think it'll be more felt recoil


I've shot them. My question is ballistic. Is the extra FPS worth it?


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## badge851 (Jan 29, 2013)

oldphart said:


> I've shot them. My question is ballistic. Is the extra FPS worth it?


I have to ask you please, is the recoil worth it? In my case, it is not, so; consequently, all of my pocket revolvers are 38 Special.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

oldphart said:


> I've shot them. My question is ballistic. Is the extra FPS worth it?


Yes, I would rather defend myself up close with a 357 magnum.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

oldphart said:


> I've shot them. My question is ballistic. Is the extra FPS worth it?


What good is the extra FPS if you can't accurately hit your target?


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

badge851 said:


> I have to ask you please, is the recoil worth it? In my case, it is not, so; consequently, all of my pocket revolvers are 38 Special.


That's sound rational thinking.


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

desertman said:


> What good is the extra FPS if you can't accurately hit your target?





desertman said:


> What good is the extra FPS if you can't accurately hit your target?


It's a short range weapon for encounters of five feet, like a mugging. With crimson trace grips I could hit pretty well at 15 feet.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

oldphart said:


> It's a short range weapon for encounters of five feet, like a mugging. With crimson trace grips I could hit pretty well at 15 feet.


Then you might as well buy a .44 Magnum with a 2 1/2 inch barrel. Except you may have a little trouble dropping it in your pocket. Unless of course you're Captain Kangaroo.


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## SSGN_Doc (Mar 12, 2020)

What I’ve seen in snubby .357 velocities, gets the magnum round to about 9mm velocity range with similar weight bullets, but that is out of a 4” Autoloader by comparison.

big thing in my mind, is when selecting a defensive load to carry, is if the bullet was designed to operate are velocities attained in a 4” or longer barrel, or if the projectile was designed to operate as short barrel velocities. When they change the alloys of jacket and core, and change the jacket with pre-scoring to allow a bullet to get the same penetration and expansion levels within a certain velocity envelope, that is where the round should be loaded.

Put a heavy duty constructed bullet that needs 1,300 + fps to have enough energy to punch the projectile deep enough and get it to expand so it doesn’t over penetrate, into a gun with a barrel tha can only accelerate the bullet to 1,000 to 1,100 fps, and the bullet will perform differently. It may over penetrate due to an inability to hit optimum expansion Or even get expansion to start at all.

on the other end of the spectrum, push a projectile 200 to 300 fps faster that it was designed to go, and you may end up with fragmentation and inadequate penetration.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

oldphart said:


> It's a short range weapon for encounters of five feet, like a mugging. With crimson trace grips I could hit pretty well at 15 feet.


The 357 magnum is a great round. If that's what you want ,get it.
The 357 magnum round is a beast


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

desertman said:


> Then you might as well buy a .44 Magnum with a 2 1/2 inch barrel. Except you may have a little trouble dropping it in your pocket. Unless of course you're Captain Kangaroo.
> View attachment 20158
> 
> 
> View attachment 20159


That's an outrageous piece.


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## ks1 (Jul 29, 2021)

Kimber K6S is a solid option - a very well made gun. And it handles 357 Mag recoil surprisingly well (this is subjective, of course).


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

ks1 said:


> Kimber K6S is a solid option - a very well made gun. And it handles 357 Mag recoil surprisingly well (this is subjective, of course).


Thank you.


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## LauraCraft (Sep 19, 2021)

357 Magnum revolver delivers some of the *best performance* from a handgun. Its bare-bones design and easy-to-use mechanism make it perfect for beginners.


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## bigtex10mm (Apr 1, 2021)

Carrying a .357mag and having the ability to shoot .38special from it is, in my opinion, you are handicapped. My wife has a Ruger SP-101 that she shoots with full house 158gr JHP's and is incredibly accurate with it. It is her carry weapon, when she carries. She is an average to small woman, but she is not recoil sensitive.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

LauraCraft said:


> 357 Magnum revolver delivers some of the *best performance* from a handgun. Its bare-bones design and easy-to-use mechanism make it *perfect for beginners.*


Of course everybody's different, and unless they start out using .38 Specials preferably wadcutters I wouldn't recommend starting out with .357's out of a short barreled revolver.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

bigtex10mm said:


> Carrying a .357mag and having the ability to shoot .38special from it is, in my opinion, you are handicapped. My wife has a Ruger SP-101 that she shoots with full house 158gr JHP's and is incredibly accurate with it. It is her carry weapon, when she carries. She is an average to small woman, *but she is not recoil sensitive.*


But the problem is that some people are indeed recoil sensitive no matter how many rounds they shoot. But they'll never know until they fire their first handgun. It makes no sense to start out with the biggest and baddest. Just as it makes no sense to go out and buy the biggest, baddest Harley when you've never even ridden a 5 H.P. mini bike.

By all means buy a .357 Magnum revolver then start out with .38 Specials once they're used to that then try some .357's. Starting out with .357's is a bad idea that can lead to a lifelong flinching habit that may be difficult to break. With the right ammo .38 Specials can be a very effective self defense round especially at close range. I don't think that you'll find too many people volunteering to take 5 or 6 in the chest or gut with them at close range? Jack Ruby took out Oswald with a single .38 round to his abdomen. John Lennon was hit 4 times with one round piercing his heart killing him.

The biggest advantage in buying a .357 revolver is that you can shoot the shit out of it with .38 Specials without putting too much wear and tear on the gun. As it was designed to handle a more powerful round. Then when you become proficient with it you can start practicing with .357's to determine if that round is for you. Maybe it will be and maybe it won't only the individual firing the gun can determine that.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Getting the small frame 357 might a good choice. 
The smith n Wesson frame is forged vs the ruger s investment casting method. Ruger and smith both have forged or billet cylinders, and that's what takes the explosive 357 impact. 
A smaller forged frame will weigh almost the same as a cast frame. 
The forged frame is more condensed then the cast frame.


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## oldphart (Oct 20, 2007)

Thank you.


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## Brian48 (Dec 1, 2014)

I've fired .357s out of a jframe size gun before. It's pretty darn brutal. I keep .38spl +Ps in my Model 60. That said, I love snubbie revolvers. Full house .357 loads are much better suited for kframe or Lframe guns if you can carry them concealed comfortably. I carry these occasionally, but generally only during the colder months when I can wear the appropriate clothing to conceal them. The Model 19 on the right is same model I used to carry on duty when I was on embassy duty during the Marine Corps. The 2.5" model was standard State Dept issue at the time (late '80s) and is very comfortable for conceal carry with the right holster. The 686+ on the left is my woods gun, but I've carried concealed every now and then if I'm wearing a jacket.


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