# Beginner's guide to a 1911



## fivehourfrenzy

Okay, I'd like to get a thread started about 1911s...basics about them, FAQ, etc.

For starters, they are SAO. Can be carried in three conditions:

Condition Three - hammer down, chamber empty. Slide must be racked to chamber a bullet in order to discharge.

Condition Two - hammer down, bullet chambered. Hammer must be manually cocked in order to discharge.

Condition One - hammer cocked, bullet chambered, safety on (safety can only be applied to a cocked hammer). Safety must be thumbed off in order to discharge. Condition One is referred to as "cocked and locked."

That's about all I know, other than the standard design chambers .45ACP. I have some other questions I'd like to get answered since I'm getting one.

1. Should a bullet be chambered only from the magazine? In other words, no locking the slide back and dropping a bullet in, then closing the slide. I've read the extractor has to slide over the casing rim and can get damaged. And if this is the case, would it apply to other semi-auto handguns, or just 1911s?

2. Is it okay to drop the slide on an empty chamber? I read that dropping the slide on an empty chamber can damage the sear or the hammer itself.

Are there any other quirks about 1911s I should be aware of?


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## js

not all 1911s are SAO... I shot a double action only one yesterday. First I'd seen and shot...ever. I can't for the life of me remember the model, but I'll find out.

just remembered... it was a Para-Ordnance


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## fivehourfrenzy

Para makes the DAO 1911s...I'm not big on DAOs myself. The one I'm getting is also a Para, but it's SAO.

Is it safe to dry-fire them?


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## Mike Barham

The 1911 has more quirks than any other fighting pistol. There are literally entire books devoted to them.

It should only be carried in Condition One when used defensively. *Cartridges* (not "bullets," which refers to the projectile only) should be loaded from the magazine, not through the ejection port. The slide should be gently lowered over an empty chamber if you like your trigger action.

The 1911 is picky about magazines. I used only Wilson 47Ds when I carried a 1911.

The 1911 is often picky about ammo. Some only work with hardball. Some like a particular nose shape. Some work with anything.

The 1911 has a sensitive extractor that must be adjusted just so to work reliably. This is a job best left to a gunsmith.

The 1911 works best with a polished feed ramp and breech face, other jobs best left to a gunsmith (if the work is needed).

The 1911's plunger tube and front sight like to come unstaked and take flight while firing.

Some 1911s like to fling empty cases right in your face.

The list goes on for a while. The plus side of the 1911 is that it is flat and easy to conceal, with ergonomics and trigger action second to no other fighting pistol.


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## JeffWard

Kinda like driving a 1970's Jaguar XK-E convertible as your daily driver...

There was never a better car ever built.

God Bless British Engineering... British sports cars are the best ever made... IF, YOU'RE A BRITISH SPORTS CAR MECHANIC...

JW

PS, Mike... Love the new Picture!


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## Mike Barham

JeffWard said:


> PS, Mike... Love the new Picture!


Thanks! :mrgreen:

Wine country was outstanding, as always. Strangely, I got more "thank you for your service" compliments in liberal California than I have here in more conservative Arizona. I even got a _verrrrrrrrry nice_ bottle of wine from J Vineyards as a gift from the staff there - free.

I don't go fishing for gratitude - I very seldom mention Afghanistan to anyone unless they ask - but it was very surprising in California. Then again, most people in wine country are farmers at heart.

Now back to your regularly-scheduled thread on 1911s, not wine. ;-)


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## Fred40

Mike Barham said:


> The plus side of the 1911 is that it is flat and easy to conceal, with ergonomics and trigger action second to no other fighting pistol.


I'm no expert, but I would add to that: The 1911's are really the ONLY .45acp's used in Bullseye (AKA Conventional Pistol) competition. Why......because they are (after a bit of gun smithing) the best tool for the job. That job being hitting the bullseye at 25 & 50 yards, shooting standing up, and one handed.


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## kenn

*1911 basics*

For some of you these videos will be helpful.

For some of you, these videos will be redundant.

For some of us, this is borderline porn

part 1


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## Steve M1911A1

Mike Barham said:


> The 1911 has more quirks than any other fighting pistol...The slide should be gently lowered over an empty chamber if you like your trigger action...


Here's a way to release the slide onto an empty chamber without ruining your expensive, three-pound trigger job:
Pull the trigger and hold it pulled while you release the slide and let it close forcefully.
If your pistolsmith did a proper trigger-job, with flat and exactly radial mating surfaces on the sear and hammer, nothing will jar loose. And if he didn't, it won't matter anyway.


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## JeffWard

PS...

I've been informed by Springfield that my XD with a competition trigger job should have the slide dropped on an empty chamber either...

If it's SA, don't slam it down!

JW

PPS I'll have to watch those videos when my fiance is not around...


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## fivehourfrenzy

Well, I ordered my 1911 today. Should be here Thursday so I'll get pics up.


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## fivehourfrenzy

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Here's a way to release the slide onto an empty chamber without ruining your expensive, three-pound trigger job:
> Pull the trigger and hold it pulled while you release the slide and let it close forcefully.
> If your pistolsmith did a proper trigger-job, with flat and exactly radial mating surfaces on the sear and hammer, nothing will jar loose. And if he didn't, it won't matter anyway.


I read keeping the trigger back prevents the sear from getting rammed the wrong way. However, the reason I ask is I do it with my XD due to the fact I keep it loaded with +P ammunition, so setback is a concern. With .45ACP, I don't really have to worry about it. I just like being able to drop one in the chamber, then inserting the magazine instead of racking the slide, then dropping the magazine and pushing another round in, then reinserting it.


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## 1911 driver

*1911*

One thing you have all missed with regard to the 1911 and its idiosyncracies is that one must shoot it with your firing side thumb resting firmly on the thumb safety. By the by ....that Todd Jarrett video is an absolute abomination. He is very poor instructor...! One does not instruct by jerking the student all around and never shutting up. What a joke.


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## kenn

*even better*



JeffWard said:


> PS...
> 
> PPS I'll have to watch those videos when my fiance is not around...


You know ev1 would watch if your fiance did one though. We can start a letter-writing campaign if you want.

She does an AR-15 takedown one that's even better.


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## Richard

Mike Barham, 

I own about 18 1911s and they all feed ball and JHPs; I think the feeding problems were mainly with the early 1911s. 

A good 1911 is a joy to own and one that has problems can send you to the "Nut House!" I am a minimalist and I am very happy with a 1911 with descent sights, bobbed hammer, and a good trigger. Any thing less requires attention and anything more is fluff. 

Regards, 

Richard


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## Mike Barham

Richard said:


> A good 1911 is a joy to own and one that has problems can send you to the "Nut House!" I am a minimalist and I am very happy with a 1911 with descent sights, bobbed hammer, and a good trigger. Any thing less requires attention and anything more is fluff.


I agree that lots of 1911s are ruined by unqualified people tinkering with them. As Col. Cooper wrote, all we really need are "sights you can see, a trigger you can use, and a dehorning job."

But at all the upper-level shooting courses and pistol matches I've attended, 1911s were by far the least reliable pistols on the firing line. The most recent example was a trip to Front Sight in Nevada. Five of the six 1911s in the class malfunctioned at least once, one malfunctioned several times, and one malfunctioned _many_ times. The Glock, SIG, Beretta and CZ pistols also in the class all ran flawlessly, as did the single revolver.


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## fivehourfrenzy

Well an example of a malfunctioning 1911 would be mine had I not done a bit of reading up on them, and not knowing what should and shouldn't be done with one. After I learned the "standard" 1911 is SAO, I knew I needed to learn more about them before getting one.


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## Bob Wright

As far as I'm concerned, its a M1911 if its GI issue. Otherwise its a Government Model.

The manual of arms for the pistol has, during "Inspection Arms" the magazine removed and tucked into the belt. The slide is then opened and locked, and the "Raise Pistol" position assumed. At the command "Order Arms!" the slide release is pressed, allowing the slide to go forward, and the trigger pulled as the slide goes into battery.

While I shot and carried the .45 while in the Army, I've only owned one, a Colt Gold Cup. This gun supposedly was set up for hardball, and my 185gr. JHP loads worked good, both functioning and performance wise, though I only used this pistol for crows, plus a good bit of paper targets.

Revolver man that I am, my choice for a good defense pistol is a good .45 Auto, especially the likes of the Combat Commander. I've had little experience with it, but the 10mm looks impressive to me. But still think I'd go with the .45 ACP.

Bob Wright


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