# Wrong way to carry.



## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

There's a fellow I know (and whom I used to associate with) that stopped by to see me, last week. When he exited his vehicle I immediately saw his Glock holstered _outside_ of his clothing. Through the course of conversation I queried what he called himself doing; wearing his weapon in clear view. He stated that he could, because he had a carry permit. Well. I knew that he had a CCW because I was one of those who provided him with a reference, a few years past, and he had informed me of his being granted with a permit. This guy has made a 180 degree turnabout, and I am SO regretful that I helped him to achieve what he had desired.

But, anyway, he went on to say that Texas has an 'Open Carry' policy, and I countered with - '_But this isn't Texas_' (I live in New York State). It made no difference to him, and he went on to say that he had been carrying his gun in that manner ever since purchasing it - which (I am sure) was either the latter part of 2010, or very early this year. He often travels to Canada, to play bingo, and has seemed to have encountered no problems releasing the gun from his belt in front of the Border Patrol Officers.

Now, unless something has indeed changed - in my geographical area, regarding pistol carrying policies (that I haven't heard about) - CCW means _Concealed_ Carry Weapon. That weapon is not supposed to be worn/carried in visible fashion. The fact that he hasn't been stopped, yet, is very surprising to me, and I wonder what the penalty would be if he was to indeed be stopped for that infraction(?), one day.


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## JBarL (Sep 15, 2011)

As I sat here and read what your friend was doing sounds like he is awaiting for the cops to arrest him and he loose all gun rights he had... notice the word HAD cause as soon as he gets caught that will be the word he will use for now on. Now on the other part about Texas. Texas IS NOT A OPEN CARRY STATE and if he has a CHL permit then that means he needs to have it concealed, but he will soon not have to worry with concealing it. Now I am a certified Handgun Instructor and I live in Texas also a DPS certified CHL instructor and I would know for a fact Texas does not have a open carry law only if you are your own private property can you open carry. hope he comes to understand the rules and the laws of that state before he gets thrown into prison.

JBarL


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

as neither texas NOR new york is an open carry state it will be a rude awakening for your friend one day. his arrest on a firearms violation will most likely result in him losing his ccw forever. he needed to read and understand the law. one other note....new york does not honor any other states ccw permit, so his carry on a texas ccw in new york is illegal in and of itself.

i live in oregon, an open carry state with a few cities that have banned open carry. your ccw permit in oregon trumps all local ordinances. so with the ccw i can open carry even in the banned cities. 

said it before, say it again .... read and know the laws, if not you will pay for your ignorance


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## Packard (Aug 24, 2010)

In New York you must carry concealed unless you are in uniform. I see armor guards out of uniform with exposed weapons but all of them are in violation. All it takes is one nervous civilian to call it in and it becomes a "disturbing the peace" offense. This would entail an immediate surrender of the weapon, and if convicted, the loss of the pistol licence. 

I would keep it concealed, definitely.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

NLAlston said:


> There's a fellow I know...[who] often travels to Canada, to play bingo, and has seemed to have encountered no problems releasing the gun from his belt in front of the Border Patrol Officers...


In front of _Canadian_ border-control officers?
Do Canadian border-control officers see him store his pistol inside his car, and carry it with him into Canada?

Sorry: I don't believe this. Had a Canadian border-control officer, or a RCMP officer, seen him bring a pistol into Canada, he would already be spending a significant portion of his life in a Canadian prison.
Either that, or he has provided himself with a Canadian handgun license...which seems unlikely, given his other notable behavior.

And if he means that he does this in front of US Border Patrol officers or border-control officers, he is extremely foolish. Although he is breaking no US federal law, a border-control agent should report his behavior to the New York State Police, checking for a state permit, and one of them eventually will. It will be to your friend's lasting regret.

Your friend seems somewhat suicidal.


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## recoilguy (Apr 30, 2009)

Steve is correct. It takes some major paperwork to get a pistol into Canada. Just to go to a competition but one that was strapped to your belt.....that just won't happen. There is a lot in this persons first ever post I find "unusual" from the NY open carry to the Texas open carry to crossing a border with a gun on his belt to the attitude described. I am glad that person is not my friend because if he does actually do the described behavior he will only be doing them for a short while.

RCG


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

after a lil research i am gonna drop a few canadian gun laws here for american travelers .....

first... *prohibited guns*.... all .25 cal and .32 cal AND any handgun with a barrel of less than 4.14 inches (this means many compacts and virtually ALL sub compacts are illegal to cross the border under any circumstances).

next *restricted guns* is all other handguns and it takes a mountain of paperwork PRIOR to crossing the border to get permission to bring your favorite pistol. (self defense and hunting are NOT valid reasons according to the canadian govt site i was reading).

then the *non-restricted guns *(shotguns and long guns) .... you have to do a smaller mountain of paperwork and pay the fees.

so you say "F them, my friend Jean Claude has guns, i shall just use one of his when i get to Quebec" well not exactly... to use a canadian gun you must obtain a "Temporary Borrowing License"

and you will have to present the correct paperwork if you wish to buy ammo....

god bless the 2nd amendment


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## sharpshooter (Jan 26, 2011)

there is a guy here (NC) that works nights at a gas station, that open carries while working with a ccw permit. He"s gotten nothing but support from the local police.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

sharpshooter said:


> there is a guy here (NC) that works nights at a gas station, that open carries while working with a ccw permit. He"s gotten nothing but support from the local police.


north carolina is an open carry state, no ccw permit required

OpenCarry.org - State Information For North Carolina


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> In front of _Canadian_ border-control officers?
> Do Canadian border-control officers see him store his pistol inside his car, and carry it with him into Canada?
> 
> Sorry: I don't believe this. Had a Canadian border-control officer, or a RCMP officer, seen him bring a pistol into Canada, he would already be spending a significant portion of his life in a Canadian prison.
> ...


I wish to thank all who responded with their feelings & opinions on this matter.

Steve, I should have been more clear, but I didn't mean that this individual was taking his gun _into_ Canada - in an outright open carry state of fashion. According to him, he goes up to the officer's station, states that he is surrendering his weapon until he completes his visit there, and releases his holstered weapon _right in front_ of the officers. That didn't seem at all real to me, and this character could very well be lying, but it is what he had stated. I, too, had previously thought Texas to be an open-carry state (until information, to the contrary, had been given within some of these replies). But even if that _had_ been true, NYS is not Texas. I tried to tell him that, but it was all to no avail.

I have known this guy for about 40 years, and he used to wear the classification of 'friend'. But that has changed, over more recent times. I don't know what happened, but he is definitely not the person that I once knew. I no longer pal around with him, and he'll stop by if he happens to see me in the driveway, or yard, while in transit through my neighborhood. That is the full extent of our association.

He seems to have adopted that Clint Eastwood's '_Make my day_' attitude, and I am not at all comfortable with that. Hopefully, he'll (somehow) settle back into a state of sensibility & responsibility. It isn't just a matter of his having positioned himself outside of the parameters of the law - regarding the _one_ matter of concern that's been addressed, here - but the very warped sense, that he holds, of what that gun means to him; and of the Superman's cape that he has equated it to.


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

NLAlston said:


> He seems to have adopted that Clint Eastwood's '_Make my day_' attitude...


I want to be a cowboy, too! :smt071


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## MLB (Oct 4, 2006)

Your former friend will very likely lose his permit soon, though if he's not incarcerated it doesn't sound like it would stop him from carrying anyway. Hopefully it will occur in a non-dramatic fashion. His loss will be our benefit too; we don't need that type of press.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

MLB said:


> Your former friend will very likely lose his permit soon, though if he's not incarcerated it doesn't sound like it would stop him from carrying anyway. Hopefully it will occur in a non-dramatic fashion. His loss will be our benefit too; we don't need that type of press.


I totally agree with you.


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## zeke (Nov 24, 2011)

I think you should sit down with this guy and keep reading and explaining the laws for concealed carry until he gets it. It might just save his life!


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

zeke said:


> I think you should sit down with this guy and keep reading and explaining the laws for concealed carry until he gets it. It might just save his life!


I have, indeed, tried that. But this fellow just seems to turn a deaf ear to what I have attempted to express to him. That he has a CCW puts him in the frame of mind that he can carry & treat his weapon in any manner that he deems fitting. But all that I have tried to give him came from '_me_'. I will try to find some written documentation to forward to him - in hopes that it will effectuate a change in his mindset.


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## OldCurlyWolf (Oct 28, 2010)

Sorry about your former friend. You just can't fix STUPID.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

OldCurlyWolf said:


> Sorry about your former friend. You just can't fix STUPID.


Absolutely.


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## jcsandals (Aug 11, 2011)

I know it's probably not the best idea... You tried a good slap? Since he was apparently not always like this maybe all he needs is a "helping hand" if you know what I mean. Give him a good slap next time hes at your house and tell him to straighten out/burst his bubble. Or not... But hey what are friends for right? Doesn't work with everyone, but when you start to get a big head getting a little shock like that can sometimes humble you long enough to see the light. 

I'm mostly joking of course, though I have seen it work.... Sorry to hear that. I have a buddy who does things that I disagree with as well (regarding ccw). I do not like to spend time hanging out fishing/shooting with him anymore because he can't keep from drinking while he carries. I understand having a few beers when fishing, but not carrying inside city/county lines like that... It's true that cats and bears may still attack you while you're having a brew and when I camp I have access to my shotgun and some sort of pistol - but I'm also way the hell out there. However, while inside of city/county land I do not feel at ALL comfortable with the idea of walking around with a weapon open or concealed if alcohol is on the menu. Bad ju ju


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## uspastime (Jan 28, 2010)

Print out this thread and send it to him.

Bob


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## Baldy (Jun 21, 2006)

Having been to Canada many times in years gone by there is signs posted that you can get fined $10,000 and receive 10 years in jail for having a hand gun in Canada. They are posted right where you get off the Ambassador Bridge in customs into Canada. The bridge runs from Detroit,Micigan over to Winsor, Ontario Canada.


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## swampcrawler (Sep 15, 2011)

I open carry quite regularly.

The catch is, its LEGAL here in louisiana.


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## jcsandals (Aug 11, 2011)

It's (open carry) legal here in colorado too and I have open carried. I just prefer to conceal it so people don't act differently around me when I go to the store or to a friends house. Not that I should feel weird, I guess thats my problem. I think open carry is very healthy for the non-gun enthusiasts to see. That way they know they are around and that you're allowed to carry. So good on you :smt1099


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

jcsandals said:


> I know it's probably not the best idea... You tried a good slap? Since he was apparently not always like this maybe all he needs is a "helping hand" if you know what I mean. Give him a good slap next time hes at your house and tell him to straighten out/burst his bubble. Or not... But hey what are friends for right? Doesn't work with everyone, but when you start to get a big head getting a little shock like that can sometimes humble you long enough to see the light.
> 
> I'm mostly joking of course, though I have seen it work.... Sorry to hear that. I have a buddy who does things that I disagree with as well (regarding ccw). I do not like to spend time hanging out fishing/shooting with him anymore because he can't keep from drinking while he carries. I understand having a few beers when fishing, but not carrying inside city/county lines like that... It's true that cats and bears may still attack you while you're having a brew and when I camp I have access to my shotgun and some sort of pistol - but I'm also way the hell out there. However, while inside of city/county land I do not feel at ALL comfortable with the idea of walking around with a weapon open or concealed if alcohol is on the menu. Bad ju ju


Sorry it took so long getting back, but I have been really busy.

As far as trying anything else, with this guy, is concerned - I have passed my end point with him. I don't want him stopping by here, anymore, and I most certainly won't be visiting him. I was talking with someone who was a mutual friend of the both of us, who shared with me how that particular individual had, since, went 'rogue'. I was left quite shocked by the revelations, and the worst of them was in how he had pulled his gun on his wife, when she was gearing up to leave him. It wouldn't have been an easy task, at all, for a man to find a better wife than she was to him, and she did RIGHT by moving ahead with her life - without him. But, to pull a gun out on her - and threaten that he would kill her if she tried to take their house? I had never known him to be anything like that, and wouldn't have given him a reference for his pistol permit if I _had_ known. This guy is about two years younger than myself (I am 63), but I know teens who carry themselves in a much more responsible fashion than _he_ does. I don't know what came over him, but he sure did flip.


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## Raymond (Dec 3, 2011)

In Tennessee here we can carry openly or concealed even though our permit is a conceal carry permit. I have never been in favor of carrying openly as I believe surprise is a good thing to have on my side.


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## JerryMac (Dec 4, 2011)

Never argue with an idiot - they'll bring you down to their level then beat you with experience


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> In front of _Canadian_ border-control officers?
> Do Canadian border-control officers see him store his pistol inside his car, and carry it with him into Canada?
> 
> Sorry: I don't believe this. Had a Canadian border-control officer, or a RCMP officer, seen him bring a pistol into Canada, he would already be spending a significant portion of his life in a Canadian prison.
> ...


Wow. It's been a few years since I had started this thread. But I'd been away from the forum, for a lengthy period of time, and just happened across these postings. However, I wanted to clarify something that I had written.

When I had mentioned about that former friend's behavior with his gun, in front of Border Patro Officers, I think it might have been read the wrong way. This guy often went to Canada to play bingo. Declaring that he had a firearm, to the booth officer, always (understandably so) resulted in him being directed to the Customs Office. What I DIDN'T understand was his stating that he'd walk into the Custom's Office with his holstered pistol OPENLY carried on his belt. He said that they would take it, and hold it until his return - without any issue about his having carried it like he did.

Either this former friend was flat-out lying, or there was something definitely wrong with the Officers at the Custom's Office.


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