# Ammo Question / 9MM



## gilream (May 5, 2009)

I just put 17 rounds of PMC Eldorado Starfire Jacketed hollow point ammo into a 15 round Glock magazine. I purchased some PMC Bronze FMJ ammo at the same time and 15 is all I can get into the Glock magazines. My caliper measures the case heads of the FMJ ammo at .3895” and the hollow point ammo at .3875; so the hollow points are definitely smaller and I suppose that’s the reason that I got two extra rounds in the magazine. Is this something that I should worry about? Thanks in advance for your help.


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## BeefyBeefo (Jan 30, 2008)

Don't overload your magazines. If you are using a 15-round magazine, put 15 rounds in it no matter what type of ammo you are using. This is what they were designed to hold...


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

What* HE* said


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## PhilR. (Apr 25, 2007)

gilream said:


> My caliper measures the case heads of the FMJ ammo at .3895" and the hollow point ammo at .3875; so the hollow points are definitely smaller and I suppose that's the reason that I got two extra rounds in the magazine.


Let me get this straight -- a reduction of .0020" for fifteen rounds will allow you to put in two more rounds, rounds that measure .3875" to begin with? You better redo your math.....


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## gilream (May 5, 2009)

I realize that the mathematical difference does not add up to two extra rounds. I'm new to handguns and wanted to know if this is normal or out of the ordinary and if I'm ok with placing the extra two rounds in the magazine. I have been advised to never excede the stated limit of a magazine. This is something that I did not know and now I do know. I appreciate the help. What I do not particularly appreciate are wisecracks to a legitimate question. If you think it's a dumb question please just remain quiet and let others answer.


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

You're best to not put more into the mag than what is supposed ot go in them. It can lead to a failure.


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## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

gilream said:


> What I do not particularly appreciate are wisecracks to a legitimate question. If you think it's a dumb question please just remain quiet and let others answer.


Just a friendly head's up about this forum: we're serious about guns but also like to have fun and stick it to each other on occasion. Most guys here, myself included, are not "P.C." and will call it like they see it. My suggestion is if you get a response you don't particularity like, ignore it. Pointing it out is going to do nothing but start a flame-fest that invariably leads to the thread being closed.


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## Guest (May 15, 2009)

gilream said:


> What I do not particularly appreciate are wisecracks to a legitimate question. If you think it's a dumb question please just remain quiet and let others answer.


We would rather see your feelings hurt than some part of your body as a result of your error.

Scott


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## PhilR. (Apr 25, 2007)

gilream said:


> I realize that the mathematical difference does not add up to two extra rounds.
> 
> What I do not particularly appreciate are wisecracks to a legitimate question. If you think it's a dumb question please just remain quiet and let others answer.


You should go back and re-read what you stated. No, wait - I'll quote it here for you:

"My caliper measures the case heads of the FMJ ammo at .3895" and the hollow point ammo at .3875;* so the hollow points are definitely smaller and I suppose that's the reason that I got two extra rounds in the magazine*. (Italics/bold mine)

It was_ your _ (incorrect) conclusion using the numbers you came up with, not mine or anyone else's. Now here you state that you know the math, when in fact in your first post you certainly didn't show it. Who's fault is that? We don't know what's in your head - we can only reply to what you put up, and what you put up in your first post indicated a distinct lack of a capacity to reach a realistic conclusion based on the information you gathered.....


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## gilream (May 5, 2009)

Fair enough. Point well taken. Last thing I want to do is start a flame fest. I gather that handgun magazines with certain brands of ammo can have a little extra capacity built in for functionality and even though there is a bit of extra room there, we should stay within the stated limit. Thanks again for your help.


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## Guest (May 15, 2009)

gilream said:


> I gather that handgun magazines with certain brands of ammo can have a little extra capacity built in...


 Quality ammunition conforms to the SAAMI (Sporting Arms and Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute) standards. While there might be extremely slight variations in size due to manufacturing tolerances, they are pretty much uniform and they just don't vary that much from one brand to another, at least not to the point where you can put in two cartridges over the limit into a magazine.

I am from Missouri... Show Me!

Scott


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## nolexforever (Apr 3, 2009)

are they of the same grain? 124 or 115?

my speculation is that the slightly smaller JHP creates enough room in the double stack mag to allow two more rounds. my reasoning for this is because in a double stack, not all of the round makes contact with one above or below. 

i agree with everybody else not to overload mag. because if u are like me, i tend to count my rounds as i shoot at the range and u wouldnt want to find an extra round or two still in the gun, when u think its empty.

feel free to correct me if i'm wrong.


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## PhilR. (Apr 25, 2007)

nolexforever said:


> are they of the same grain? 124 or 115?
> 
> my speculation is that the slightly smaller JHP creates enough room in the double stack mag to allow two more rounds. my reasoning for this is because in a double stack, not all of the round makes contact with one above or below.


It doesn't matter what the grain size of the bullet is, the diameter will still be within a few thousanth's of an inch in diameter. This is because the bullets are standardized in their diameter (to within a few thousanth's) so that they can go down a bore the size of which will never change.

You should do the math: a .002 difference in bullet diameter x 15 rounds does not equal the bullet diameter of even one extra bullet, much less two. Even if you fudge in a decrease in overall height of say 50% because of the double-stacking (it won't actually be that much since a 50% decrease would put the bullets side by side, but I don't know how much it actually would be), you still would not have made up enough space to fit one extra bullet.

Also, it's not bullet diameter that is the deciding factor anyway. Case diameter determines stack height, and that will be essentially the same, no matter what the bullet grain or diameter is. The reason for this is because the cartridges stack up on their sides, with the widest part of the cartridge touching the ones above and below. Most semi-auto cartridges headspace on the case mouth, so that part of the case would have to be larger in diameter than the bullet itself, otherwise the cartridge would fall down the barrel instead of stopping in the chamber.


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## tekhead1219 (May 16, 2008)

gilream said:


> I purchased some PMC Bronze FMJ ammo at the same time and 15 is all I can get into the Glock magazines.


It really doesn't matter what ammo you buy. On the mag it says 15 rds. It was designed for 15 rds, only put 15 rds. in it. Just my .02.


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## gilream (May 5, 2009)

It's time for me to Man Up here. This Crow tastes a little gamey!









I'd like to offer an appology to all. I simply miscounted the rounds and I will attempt to explain. On Tuesday I purchased the Glock 19 and bought some ammo at the same time. The owner limits everyone to 3 boxes per day and only FMJ. I asked for and he agreed to sell me, one box of JHP ammo since I had purchased the pistol. He went to the back room and came back with a small box, 20 count, of hollow point 9MM ammo. As I loaded the magazine that night I oriented the box in rows of 4 instead of rows of 5 which I am used to. As result, I mistakenly thought that I had put 17 rounds in the magazine. In fact I only got 14 rounds in it but I'll not even mention that. I got some great advice and learned a great deal from the posts.


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## PhilR. (Apr 25, 2007)

gilream said:


> It's time for me to Man Up here. This Crow tastes a little gamey!


heh heh... welcome to the club.....:mrgreen:


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## Supermanwoot (May 16, 2009)

DevilsJohnson said:


> You're best to not put more into the mag than what is supposed ot go in them. It can lead to a failure.


I was shooting a glock at the range the other day (now i think just because its a glock it had problems) and I had a LOT of trouble getting the 15th round in there even, and sure enough first shot: ejects the shell casing but then loads 1 and 1/2 rounds into the breech and the slide couldn't close all the way.

then on the last shot the slide closed all the way and didnt stay action open despite being out of ammo... hmm glocks....


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## Guest (May 16, 2009)

Supermanwoot said:


> hmm glocks....


So you're saying that their motto *GLOCK PERFECTION* isn't totally accurate?


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## SaltyDog (Jan 1, 2009)

Supermanwoot said:


> I was shooting a glock at the range the other day (now i think just because its a glock it had problems) and I had a LOT of trouble getting the 15th round in there even, and sure enough first shot: ejects the shell casing but then loads 1 and 1/2 rounds into the breech and the slide couldn't close all the way.
> 
> then on the last shot the slide closed all the way and didnt stay action open despite being out of ammo... hmm glocks....


Well I don't think you can blame the Glock for that - whoever owns that Glock has some problems, weak magazine spring, weak or broken recoil spring or rod and it could be the ammo among other things.

It happened to my Sig P229 - the last round did not leave the slide locked back - changed out the magazine spring and it works fine.

I have an addictive SIGness and GLOCK ROCKS!


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## Supermanwoot (May 16, 2009)

scottaschultz said:


> So you're saying that their motto *GLOCK PERFECTION* isn't totally accurate?


ha i dont know why I threw this in this thread, I guess it was just an example of overloaded magazines and the glock in question was VERY USED, not that it should matter. Also, I have nothing against glocks, just an old magazine I'm sure


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

Yeah..That sounds like a wore out mag...It happens. I don't have a problem with Glocks either. I just don't want to own one :smt082


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