# How bad is it to leave a magazine/clip loaded??



## stunter2b

I've searched this and seen all kinds of answers..

I have 4 clips for my beretta "home defense" and would like to keep them all loaded just wondering how bad is it for the spring.

I've also read that some say just keep 1 round less and it will be fine.


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## denner

All magazine springs are subject to fatigue, some magazines can go for years fully loaded and still function. Common sense tells you the less rounds in the magazine the less fatigue on the spring. Go to Wolff springs Q/A and they give a good take on the issue. I've personally have had magazine springs go for a year w/o a problem, but eventually they will fatigue and give you a malfuction. I've had this occur in AK mags and pistol mags.


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## MLB

Common sense is misleading in this case. Metal is fatigued by use, not stress. Storing a magazine loaded does not wear it out.


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## denner

MLB said:


> Common sense is misleading in this case. Metal is fatigued by use, not stress. Storing a magazine loaded does not wear it out.


Well, if you have more knowledge than Wolff gunsprings than perhaps you're correct, but I'll think I'll stick with their knowledge. Yes leaving a magazine fully compressed will eventually lead to fatigue and malfuntion, i've been there done that. If you believe that to be true than all the power to you.

Below is a message from Wolff Gunsprings:

5. How often should I change magazine spring? Should I unload my magazines, rotate magazines, load with fewer than the maximum rounds? 
Magazine springs in semi-auto pistols are one of the most critical springs and are the subject of much debate and concern. Magazines which are kept fully loaded for long periods of time, such as in law enforcement and personal/home defense applications, will generally be subject to more fatigue than the weekend shooter's magazine springs in which the magazines are loaded up only when shooting.

Magazine design and capacity also affect the longevity of the spring. In many older pistol designs, maximum capacity was not the always the goal such as with the 7 round 1911 Colt magazines will last for years fully loaded. There was room for more spring material in these guns which reduces overall stress and increases the usable life of the spring.

More recently higher capacity magazine have become popular. These are designed to hold more rounds with less spring material often in the same space. This puts more stress on the spring and will cause it to fatigue at a faster rate. Unloading these magazines a round or two will help the life of the spring. Rotating fully loaded magazines will also help the problem somewhat but it is not always practical.

In applications where the magazine must be kept loaded at all times, a high quality magazine spring such as Wolff extra power magazine springs, will provide maximum life. Regular replacement of magazine springs will provide the best defense against failure from weak magazine springs. Regular shooting of the pistol is the best way to be sure the springs are still functioning reliably.


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## stunter2b

Kinda what I wanted to hear...So if and when they do wear out its not like they wear out within a few months and more like a year or more. I can afford to buy new springs if its every year or so...Something the kids can buy good ol dad..lol

the price of my family's life vs. the price of a few springs isn't going to put me out I guess I just didn't want to have them wear out every month or so.

I'm going to preload all my clips but 4 should be enough 3 of them are stocks 11 rounds and the 4th is mec gar 12 rounds. If 45 rounds isn't enough I'm in trouble anyway..lol


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## SouthernBoy

stunter2b said:


> I've searched this and seen all kinds of answers..
> 
> I have 4 clips for my beretta "home defense" and would like to keep them all loaded just wondering how bad is it for the spring.
> 
> I've also read that some say just keep 1 round less and it will be fine.


Your Beretta doesn't use clips... it uses a box magazine. You can keep them loaded for a pretty long time. If you are concerned, make sure you have several and rotate them. I also load one less round in my magazines not so much to relieve pressure on the spring, but to reduce any chances of a failure to feed.


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## Blade

If Wolff says springs go bad by staying compressed, they better hire a metallurgist. A spring experiences fatigue due to flexing, not simply staying compressed. Unless it has been compressed past it's elastic limit, the point at which the metal actually begins to bend rather than flex. But that happens immediately, not over time. Now, having said that, springs can go bad over time. Environmental factors can cause the metal to gradually lose its tempering. But being compressed has nothing to do with it. This happens even if the spring is relaxed. And the rate at which it happens depends on the quality of the metal and the tempering process used. High quality springs, tempered properly can stay compressed almost indefinitely. 

If Wolff springs go bad that quickly, then it doesn't say much for the quality of their springs. Either that, or they're simply trying to convince you that you need to buy new springs.....from them of course.


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## denner

Blade said:


> If Wolff says springs go bad by staying compressed, they better hire a metallurgist. A spring experiences fatigue due to flexing, not simply staying compressed. Unless it has been compressed past it's elastic limit, the point at which the metal actually begins to bend rather than flex. But that happens immediately, not over time. Now, having said that, springs can go bad over time. Environmental factors can cause the metal to gradually lose its tempering. But being compressed has nothing to do with it. This happens even if the spring is relaxed. And the rate at which it happens depends on the quality of the metal and the tempering process used. High quality springs, tempered properly can stay compressed almost indefinitely.
> 
> If Wolff springs go bad that quickly, then it doesn't say much for the quality of their springs. Either that, or they're simply trying to convince you that you need to buy new springs.....from them of course.


Yes I heard the metalurgist theory of compressed springs never fatigue, but in my personnal experience they do. If you believe they don't all the power to you. What type of hi-cap magazine springs do you use that you can fully compress indefinitely without them suffering fatigue? Im my personnel experiece I've had fully loaded magazines in both my AK and pistols, having other magazines w/ the same springs not fully compressed and loaded. The ones that were not fully compressed functioned properly, the ones that I left fully loaded and compressed did not. So, whatever the metalugist theory holds I'll be sticking with the advice of Wolff gunsprings until I hear from a manufacturer that contests and guarantee's that you can leave a hi-cap magazine fully loaded and compressed indefinately w/o spring fatigue and or failure of the firearm to function properly.


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## Blade

Read my post again. I said that HIGH QUALITY SPRINGS TEMPERED PROPERLY can stay compressed almost indefinitely. A poorly made spring can lose half its strength the first time you compress it. I've seen war time magazines that have been found fully loaded after 40+ years, and they are still perfectly good. Think about it for a minute. If every spring went bad by simply being compressed for a length of time, then every car on the road would be sitting flat on its chassis after a couple of years. 

Yes, I have had cheap magazines go bad in a short time. But I've also replaced the springs in those magazines with GOOD springs and left them loaded for years without any problems.


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## denner

Blade said:


> Read my post again. I said that HIGH QUALITY SPRINGS TEMPERED PROPERLY can stay compressed almost indefinitely. A poorly made spring can lose half its strength the first time you compress it. I've seen war time magazines that have been found fully loaded after 40+ years, and they are still perfectly good. Think about it for a minute. If every spring went bad by simply being compressed for a length of time, then every car on the road would be sitting flat on its chassis after a couple of years.
> Yes, I have had cheap magazines go bad in a short time. But I've also replaced the springs in those magazines with GOOD springs and left them loaded for years without any problems.


OK, but who makes them? I'd like to know and give up wolff springs.


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## Blade

Look for chrome silicon springs. There are a number of sources. Brownell's offers them for many magazine types.


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## denner

Blade said:


> Look for chrome silicon springs. There are a number of sources. Brownell's offers them for many magazine types.


10-4


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## FNISHR

Guys, over on the various motorcycle lists this would be the equivalent of an oil thread.


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## SouthernBoy

Blade said:


> Read my post again. I said that HIGH QUALITY SPRINGS TEMPERED PROPERLY can stay compressed almost indefinitely. A poorly made spring can lose half its strength the first time you compress it. I've seen war time magazines that have been found fully loaded after 40+ years, and they are still perfectly good. Think about it for a minute. *If every spring went bad by simply being compressed for a length of time, then every car on the road would be sitting flat on its chassis after a couple of years*.
> 
> Yes, I have had cheap magazines go bad in a short time. But I've also replaced the springs in those magazines with GOOD springs and left them loaded for years without any problems.


That and a heck of a lot of other items. Excellent analogy.


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## zhurdan

Wolff springs... A company in the business of selling you springs tells you that they need to be replaced. Stunner. News at eleven, bridge for sale. 

I use wolff springs and can tell you from FIRST HAND experience that 6 of my 1911 mag have had several hundred cycles, been left compressed for weeks if not months at times and they are still running strong. Imagine that.


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## denner

zhurdan said:


> Wolff springs... A company in the business of selling you springs tells you that they need to be replaced. Stunner. News at eleven, bridge for sale.
> 
> I use wolff springs and can tell you from FIRST HAND experience that 6 of my 1911 mag have had several hundred cycles, been left compressed for weeks if not months at times and they are still running strong. Imagine that.


Did you read this part?

Magazine design and capacity also affect the longevity of the spring. In many older pistol designs, maximum capacity was not the always the goal such as with the 7 round 1911 Colt magazines will last for years fully loaded. There was room for more spring material in these guns which reduces overall stress and increases the usable life of the spring.

More recently higher capacity magazine have become popular. These are designed to hold more rounds with less spring material often in the same space. This puts more stress on the spring and will cause it to fatigue at a faster rate. Unloading these magazines a round or two will help the life of the spring. Rotating fully loaded magazines will also help the problem somewhat but it is not always practical.

That said, what Wolff is telling me coincides with my experience, so I believe them, you may not. I have experience w/ high cap magazines only, not 1911's. As Wolff stated, 7 round 1911 magazine springs will last for years fully loaded, a different story with h/cap magazines, but believe what you want to believe. If anyone beleives you can indefinately leave a fully loaded hi-cap magazine for years and have no spring fatigue and malfunctions then it's their belief, but I would not advise it.


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## matt_the_millerman

stunter2b, just some advice but i think you should really just rotate those MAGAZINES into your range trips at least a couple times a year. Then theres nothing to worry about, plus you'll know they are functioning 100%.


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## usmcj

To put this one to rest, you have to understand creep. Creep is the slow flow of a non-ferric metal like copper, brass and lead under force. At temperatures outside of a furnace, steel doesn't have any appreciable creep. Under most conditions, steel flexes and then returns to its original shape. When pushed past its elastic limit, steel will bend and not return to its original shape. All designers of well-made magazines make sure the spring never approaches the elastic limit when the magazine is fully loaded. Honest. This means the spring will not weaken when the magazine is fully loaded -- not even over an extended time. Like 50 years. American Handgunner recently ran a story about a magazine full of .45 ACP that had been sitting since WWII and it ran just fine on the first try. So there you go.

Rest of the article.... Magazine spring madness: 'creep' to your 'elastic limit' to un-earth the urban legend of 'spring-set' | American Handgunner | Find Articles


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## WI45

not to mess with the thread, but, don't forget about the springs in your gun, they are also integral part of it's functioning.:watching:


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## zhurdan

denner said:


> Did you read this part?
> 
> Magazine design and capacity also affect the longevity of the spring. In many older pistol designs, maximum capacity was not the always the goal such as with the 7 round 1911 Colt magazines will last for years fully loaded. There was room for more spring material in these guns which reduces overall stress and increases the usable life of the spring.
> 
> More recently higher capacity magazine have become popular. These are designed to hold more rounds with less spring material often in the same space. This puts more stress on the spring and will cause it to fatigue at a faster rate. Unloading these magazines a round or two will help the life of the spring. Rotating fully loaded magazines will also help the problem somewhat but it is not always practical.
> 
> That said, what Wolff is telling me coincides with my experience, so I believe them, you may not. I have experience w/ high cap magazines only, not 1911's. As Wolff stated, 7 round 1911 magazine springs will last for years fully loaded, a different story with h/cap magazines, but believe what you want to believe. If anyone beleives you can indefinately leave a fully loaded hi-cap magazine for years and have no spring fatigue and malfunctions then it's their belief, but I would not advise it.


I understand what you are getting at and I should have added more info. I'm using 10 round Chip McCormick mags. Also, I have 10 HK USP 45 magazines which use Wolff springs. Granted, the USP doesn't get shot quite as often, but the magazines sit fully loaded and have functioned fine for approx 5 years.

Not only have I seen them work just fine... I'm also of the belief that springs ARE a consumable part. Use them until they no longer are working, then replace them HOPEFULLY with a spring that you have on standby. It just kinda bothers me when people ask the question regarding springs going bad because they are a consumable part, just like magazines. If they won't function anymore, buy a new damn magazine! Springs are not meant to last forever, but to say that leaving them loaded is the reason for their demise actually CAUSES more stress because if those people buy that notion, they continually load and unload their magazines by hand to "avoid it" which is another cycle. Cycling being the thing that causes fatigue.

To be even more clear, I've got several other magazines for several different guns that stay loaded all the time, and function when used. AR15 magazines, Walther P99, HK USP's, MP5 magazines, 92fs, FAL, and many others. Many have Wolff springs if they are available for those magazines, some don't. Either way, they're all loaded and when they start to show signs of fatigue, they get replaced.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell

if you leave your clips full, the papers will eventually fall out and then you have to rebend them...


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## scooter

TedDeBearFrmHell said:


> if you leave your clips full, the papers will eventually fall out and then you have to rebend them...


However your pistol magazines should be just fine.


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## Blade

My wife has trouble with her clips all the time.....clothes keep falling off the clothes line


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## scooter

For clarification to newbs
Clips (stripper clips)








magazines


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## paratrooper

MLB said:


> Common sense is misleading in this case. Metal is fatigued by use, not stress. Storing a magazine loaded does not wear it out.


Eggzactly! :smt023


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## recoilguy

Blade said:


> If Wolff says springs go bad by staying compressed, they better hire a metallurgist. A spring experiences fatigue due to flexing, not simply staying compressed. Unless it has been compressed past it's elastic limit, the point at which the metal actually begins to bend rather than flex. But that happens immediately, not over time. Now, having said that, springs can go bad over time. Environmental factors can cause the metal to gradually lose its tempering. But being compressed has nothing to do with it. This happens even if the spring is relaxed. And the rate at which it happens depends on the quality of the metal and the tempering process used. High quality springs, tempered properly can stay compressed almost indefinitely.
> 
> If Wolff springs go bad that quickly, then it doesn't say much for the quality of their springs. Either that, or they're simply trying to convince you that you need to buy new springs.....from them of course.


I have been in the steel industry for the past 28 years. What Blade has posted here is correct.

Springs are steel and steel is subject to metallurgy. It is not an opinion and it is not a experiance. It is the science of steel. A spring loaded is a spring doing what it is intrended to do and does not cause fatigue. If you load and unload your spring (mag), the more often you do so the more fatigue your spring experiances. The metulurgist "theroy" is not a theroy it is metallurgy. Your experiance has to have other factors involved that you are not mentioning or simply unaware of. Blade is correct, weather you choose to believe science or rely on experiance you have had in uncontrolled situations is up to you. However, if you choose other then science you are choosing wrong!

RCG


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## zhurdan

recoilguy said:


> I have been in the steel industry for the past 28 years. What Blade has posted here is correct.
> 
> Springs are steel and steel is subject to metallurgy. It is not an opinion and it is not a experiance. It is the science of steel. A spring loaded is a spring doing what it is intrended to do and does not cause fatigue. If you load and unload your spring (mag), the more often you do so the more fatigue your spring experiances. The metulurgist "theroy" is not a theroy it is metallurgy. Your experiance has to have other factors involved that you are not mentioning or simply unaware of. Blade is correct, weather you choose to believe science or rely on experiance you have had in uncontrolled situations is up to you. However, if you choose other then science you are choosing wrong!
> 
> RCG


Tried going to Science route on the last 4326 posts related to the EXACT SAME THING, but that didn't work. I agree, wholeheartedly that springs go bad due to cycling, not static position.

Wolff springs is dependent on people NOT believing that though. ;-)


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## Steve M1911A1

scooter said:


> For clarification to newbs
> Clips (stripper clips)


I always thought that "stripper clips" were what Gypsy Rose Lee used, to temporarily hold her clothing on.


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## chessail77

If the OP wants security for his family and doesn't want to take chances then easy enough....go to a range yearly or every six months or even more often and practice, run all your mags and check them and if they function fine ...leave them loaded until the next trip etc.....JJ


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## denner

Ah, the Metalurgist, the one who can transform the eternal steel spring into 24 karat gold, generally, the wizard standing around a boiling cauldron; pointed hat; wand in hand, and newt hair and bat wings in the other. When I've purchased new handguns w/ exceptionally stiff magazine springs that would literally bruise my fingers trying to get those last rounds in, you know what I did, I fully loaded them and left them set for a week, no compress/decompress and wallah! magic, no more bruised thumbs and stiff springs. Likewise, when I left my ak mags fully loaded no compress/decompress for about a year or so, in an ak that has never, ever, misfed, and wallah, the ones I had fully loaded failed to perform consistently w/ the last one, two, three, round's in the magazine. Ah, my faithful, 100% maintained 92 which had never misfed anything was inserted a magazine, believing as you believe. The 15 round beretta factory mag was loaded for car and home defense no compress/decompress for over a year and wallah! a misfeed in about the 5th or 6th round, and consistently thereafter. The 92 had never, ever, failed to cycle. I was so shocked and beside myself thinking what if. You can believe what you wish to believe, wizards and all, but for me fully compressed magazine springs in high cap mags over the year mark is a definite no go.:watching: Whether it be from compression or other elements be forewarned.


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## thndrchiken

First off you do NOT have clips, they are magazines. Secondly leaving a magazine loaded will not harm the spring. The spring is weakened by use i.e. compress/decompress. If you have 4 magazines leave two loaded and then switch them out every 6 months.


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## scooter

Well you can keep buying the 6mo. wolff springs and I will stick to my 5yr. factory springs and everybody is happy Okee dokee:watching:


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## recoilguy

zhurdan said:


> Tried going to Science route on the last 4326 posts related to the EXACT SAME THING, but that didn't work. I agree, wholeheartedly that springs go bad due to cycling, not static position.
> 
> Wolff springs is dependent on people NOT believing that though. ;-)


You are obviously correct sir. I find it is much wiser to keep my mouth shut (or on some cases my fingers) and have people think me a fool then open it and remove the element of doubt. To disparage an entire science and relegate it to the realm of wizardry, I am at a loss for words.

RCG


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## denner

Yes, I'll stick with my experience over the metalurgist engineer who's fully compressed magazine springs will leave him one day with a click instead of a bang. Well, I'm off to see the wizard, for that magical "spring."


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## Holly

Steve M1911A1 said:


> I always thought that "stripper clips" were what Gypsy Rose Lee used, to temporarily hold her clothing on.


Leave it to Steve to have the only comment worth reading on this subject.

:smt038


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## Steve M1911A1

_Pace_ *Denner*, new springs always "take a set," and shorten a little bit. But this is not the same as "lose strength" or "fail."

A long time ago, I published a review of Wolff recoil springs for the Government Model .45, as opposed to similar springs by another maker.
The other guy claimed that his springs would take less of a set than did Wolff springs, and that therefore his were better.
If I remember correctly, I fired 100 rounds with each spring. The challenger's spring took a set of 0.25", while the Wolff spring lost 0.37"; but both springs still required the very same compression force, and both springs were faultless in operation.
I continued the test, but it became futile. Each spring remained at its same (post-set) length, and both springs continued to provide proper operation.

Post-first-use spring set may make loading a magazine easier, but it does not indicate fatigue failure, or even potential failure.
Only repeated flexing fatigues a spring. Once set, modern well-made springs do not shorten appreciably because of a steady-state load.



Holly said:


> Leave it to Steve to have the only comment worth reading on this subject.
> 
> :smt038


"Ah, me public! My fans!" -Bugs Bunny


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## MLB

denner said:


> Well, if you have more knowledge than Wolff gunsprings than perhaps you're correct, but I'll think I'll stick with their knowledge. Yes leaving a magazine fully compressed will eventually lead to fatigue and malfuntion, i've been there done that. If you believe that to be true than all the power to you.
> 
> Below is a message from Wolff Gunsprings:
> 
> ***spring-selling company advice to buy springs often snipped from here***


Well, I don't have the cauldron and pointy hat required, but I do know a bit about steel and fatigue (Honestly, I do try to keep my trap shut on the many things I'm ignorant about). Fatigue is caused by repeated changes in stress (or strain many purists may argue). It's worse with stress reversal. A static load simply will not cause a fatigue failure though.

I think the confusion on the issue is due to the common use of the word "fatigue" as being tired from exertion. "Fatigue" as used in discussing metal failure has a more specific meaning. It doesn't get tired though :mrgreen:

On the plus side, changing your springs often is good for the economy.


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## jiml100

*oh darn*

oh darn that means my 1956 chevy is done i cant drive it anymore the springs are probably bad now. they have been compressed for years. there si no different stress on a compressed spring or a relaxed spring


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## paratrooper

My younger brother is an aero-space machinist. He has had numerous parts that he manufactured, flying on various space shuttles, as well as other flying machines. 

Although he is not a metallurgist by trade, he's like one rung below being one. He knows his metals very well. 

I asked him the same question being posed by the OP. He said not to worry about it.


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## denner

My question then is this. All springs are not created equal are they? Is there only one uniform steel spring available which has been particle tested for flaws in the metallurgy, or would you believe that doesn't exist as with rifle barrels and AR bolts. Or, are there higher or lesser grades of spring steel used in manufacturing? I think so. Does the atmosphere; temperature, humidity, condensation, salt, effect the life of a fully compressed magazine spring over time? As far as leaving a vehicle stationary for long periods of time, I would suggest putting the vehicle on racks if you've ever heard of them.


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## desertman

I know when it comes to vehicles:
For long term storage some say it is recommended to put the vehicle up on safety stands to relax the vehicles suspension. I've yet to change any of the springs on any of the antique cars that I have owned. I had no idea before I bought them how long they had been sitting or how they had been stored for an extended period of time. The ride height was always within specs. Given how often automobiles are driven (flexing their springs) and sometimes sitting for extended periods (compressing their springs) in my experience hasn't affected them either way. I would think that this principle would also apply to gun springs, however it is recommended to change recoil springs after a certain amount of rounds have been fired. However gun springs and automotive springs are two different things. I've seen where gun manufacturers recommend changing the recoil springs in semi auto's but never the magazine springs? Just for the hell of it and for my own piece of mind I never load my magazines to capacity. If the mag holds 10 rounds I'll load it with 10, chamber a round and leave the remaining 9 in the mag. As of yet I've never had a malfunction with this practice.


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## Steve M1911A1

denner said:


> My question then is this. All springs are not created equal are they? Is there only one uniform steel spring available which has been particle tested for flaws in the metallurgy, or would you believe that doesn't exist as with rifle barrels and AR bolts. Or, are there higher or lesser grades of spring steel used in manufacturing? I think so. Does the atmosphere; temperature, humidity, condensation, salt, effect the life of a fully compressed magazine spring over time? As far as leaving a vehicle stationary for long periods of time, I would suggest putting the vehicle on racks if you've ever heard of them.


It's not just a question of metallurgy, but rather more one of heat-treatment. Eighteenth-century flintlocks contain springs which had been hand-forged with somewhat questionable metallurgy and heat-treatment by color alone (not reliable temperature measurement), yet these springs persevere today. They do break, but more as a result of flexing and metal fatigue than of composition and temper.
Springs, even ancient, hand-forged leaf springs, can be left fully compressed with impunity. Only repeated cycling will finally destroy a well-maintained spring (of any kind).

Yes, of course corrosion affects spring life. But the affect of corrosion is independent of flexing and metal fatigue. A relaxed spring, once corroded, is just as useless as a deeply-flexed spring that has corroded.

Of course, a spring that remains fully compressed "takes a set," and shortens slightly. But that also happens to springs which have been compressed and then relaxed only once.


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## miketx

denner said:


> Well, if you have more knowledge than Wolff gunsprings than perhaps you're correct, but I'll think I'll stick with their knowledge. Yes leaving a magazine fully compressed will eventually lead to fatigue and malfuntion, i've been there done that. If you believe that to be true than all the power to you.
> 
> Below is a message from Wolff Gunsprings:
> 
> 5. How often should I change magazine spring? Should I unload my magazines, rotate magazines, load with fewer than the maximum rounds?
> Magazine springs in semi-auto pistols are one of the most critical springs and are the subject of much debate and concern. Magazines which are kept fully loaded for long periods of time, such as in law enforcement and personal/home defense applications, will generally be subject to more fatigue than the weekend shooter's magazine springs in which the magazines are loaded up only when shooting.
> 
> Magazine design and capacity also affect the longevity of the spring. In many older pistol designs, maximum capacity was not the always the goal such as with the 7 round 1911 Colt magazines will last for years fully loaded. There was room for more spring material in these guns which reduces overall stress and increases the usable life of the spring.
> 
> More recently higher capacity magazine have become popular. These are designed to hold more rounds with less spring material often in the same space. This puts more stress on the spring and will cause it to fatigue at a faster rate. Unloading these magazines a round or two will help the life of the spring. Rotating fully loaded magazines will also help the problem somewhat but it is not always practical.
> 
> In applications where the magazine must be kept loaded at all times, a high quality magazine spring such as Wolff extra power magazine springs, will provide maximum life. Regular replacement of magazine springs will provide the best defense against failure from weak magazine springs. Regular shooting of the pistol is the best way to be sure the springs are still functioning reliably.


They're in business to sell springs. From my personal experience:

Let's translate this topic over to automatic transmission springs, which is something I have plenty of experiance with. And, a spring is a spring. This is a picture of the second gear accumulator spring and housing in a 4L60 transmission.










The bigger round part with the hole in the middle is the accumulator piston which, when the trans shifts to second, is moved by oil pressure to compress the spring shown. This is how they control shift feel. It cushions the application of the clutch or band that applies for second gear. A band in this case. So imagine how many times your vehicle shifts to second gear in a day, and then multiply that by the years old it is, and you can imagine that spring compressing and releasing a jillion times. Not unlike the spring in your pistols magazine, but you don't shoot your pistol that much. If the spring is never activated and released, it does not get fatigued.

Here is one from a typical rebuild that has failed from that affore mentioned jillion compressions and releases.










I have never seen one that is broken that hasn't been subject this wear and tear. In conclusion since the spring in your pistol is made the same way, unless some outside force acts on it, it will not wear out, unless maybe you fire thousands and thousands of rounds through it, moving the spring on and off a jillion times. Let me add that I once built a trans that had no 2nd gear from the factory. That was found to be caused by a passage that had not been drilled out. That spring was like new and the tranny had 90k on it.


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## Freethought

stunter2b said:


> Kinda what I wanted to hear...So if and when they do wear out its not like they wear out within a few months and more like a year or more. I can afford to buy new springs if its every year or so...Something the kids can buy good ol dad..lol
> 
> the price of my family's life vs. the price of a few springs isn't going to put me out I guess I just didn't want to have them wear out every month or so.
> 
> I'm going to preload all my clips but 4 should be enough 3 of them are stocks 11 rounds and the 4th is mec gar 12 rounds. If 45 rounds isn't enough I'm in trouble anyway..lol


 They aren't " clips " , you're not shooting a Garand , a revolver with moon clips or pinning your hair up. They're **magazines**................


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## Bobshouse

What would you expect Wolff to say? They are in the spring business and want to sell more and more.


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## boatdoc173

I have been advised and I follow this :

rotate the ammo and magazine every so often. I change magazines and reload the ammo every 4-6 months. I used different magazines so they are not compressing the springs all the time in the same magazines( they do not take a set) I have had zero issues this way.


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