# Advice on new firearm



## shakinghorizons (Apr 20, 2012)

Hey everyone, I know these threads are quite subjective, but I am just looking for some advice. Many of the ranges around here have limited guns to rent, so I am limited as to what I can go shoot.

First and foremost, I am limited to a budget of $500. I'm willing to purchase new or used. I am seeking a firearm for concealed carry, in 9mm. The current firearm I carry (.380) is heavy (29oz) and has a low capacity (8+1). I am interested in both polymer and 1911 platforms, but would like a commander barrel and officer grip if I go the 1911 route. I have shot many 1911's (in .45, never in 9mm) and have shot the xd compact 9mm, xdm 9mm, and m&p compact 9mm (I have shot other calibers, but that is irrelevant). I preferred the m&p over the xd. I am not looking for a Glock. the I guess the reason for my posting is, what other firearms should I look into before spending the money on the m&p. I like the m&p, but don't want to limit my options. 

Any other suggestions for firearms? I'm willing to drive to a firing range that has specific firearms to rent, I would just prefer to be able to call around and see who has a specific firearm before taking a drive.


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## rex (Jan 27, 2012)

I can't think of much in that pricerange better than an M&P.Forget the 1911,you're talking the CCO in those specs but you may find a good deal on a used Officers model.Weight with those will still be in the neighborhood of what you have now though.Weight is subjective though,a good gun belt is much more comfortable than strapping a holster to a normal belt.

I'm not a big plastic fan,and I don't buy the "safe action" safety in the trigger.Glock started it and there are copies galore now,wrong place for a safety to me.If you do some searching,you might find an HK P2000 used at or a little above your budget.I have no experience with them but I've seen people go from the P30 to them for compactness.The guys at HKPRO forum are always liquidating their stock,occasionally I see some killer deals.HKs are unique in the trigger,they will show you definciencies in your grip and trigger pull really quick coming from a 1911.I don't think it's as bad with the P2000 or P30,but the larger USP and HK45 show it well.A common complaint switching to them is that they shoot low and latteral deviation opposite the strong hand-right handers shoot left.The compacts help because the trigger reach isn't as long,but you want small anyhow.Alot of shooting low is that HK sights them with a cover hold,if you use the dot as POI you're good,normal sighting will cause low strikes.

At that price and prefering plastic,I don't think you will go wrong with the Smith.


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## shakinghorizons (Apr 20, 2012)

Thanks for the reply. 
I guess I should state that I have a true "gun belt", I just consider my current firearm to be heavy due to the caliber.


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## chessail77 (Mar 15, 2011)

Go with the S&W M&P in 9mm or look and see if you can find their newest Shield model somewhere in 9mm or even .40, all should be in that price range.....JJ


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## goNYG (Apr 4, 2012)

Try the CZ RAMI series sub-compacts. If you don't like anything that small, the CZ P-01 is a compact version of the highly regarded CZ-75 platform. You can probably find them for a little more than $500. I have an FNH FNX-9 that I guess could be a CCW but I wouldn't know because there is no CC where I live, but it is a nice 9mm from a reputable company roughly in the $500 range.


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## berettabone (Jan 23, 2012)

Ruger sr9c or sr40c.........


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## LefteeTris (Jul 1, 2012)

My buddy just got an sr9c he loves it. Very nice gun


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## LefteeTris (Jul 1, 2012)

shakinghorizons said:


> Hey everyone, I know these threads are quite subjective, but I am just looking for some advice. Many of the ranges around here have limited guns to rent, so I am limited as to what I can go shoot.
> 
> First and foremost, I am limited to a budget of $500. I'm willing to purchase new or used. I am seeking a firearm for concealed carry, in 9mm. The current firearm I carry (.380) is heavy (29oz) and has a low capacity (8+1). I am interested in both polymer and 1911 platforms, but would like a commander barrel and officer grip if I go the 1911 route. I have shot many 1911's (in .45, never in 9mm) and have shot the xd compact 9mm, xdm 9mm, and m&p compact 9mm (I have shot other calibers, but that is irrelevant). I preferred the m&p over the xd. I am not looking for a Glock. the I guess the reason for my posting is, what other firearms should I look into before spending the money on the m&p. I like the m&p, but don't want to limit my options.
> 
> Any other suggestions for firearms? I'm willing to drive to a firing range that has specific firearms to rent, I would just prefer to be able to call around and see who has a specific firearm before taking a drive.


Also I have a rock island armory 1911. Under 500$. I got a full size you can get the commander. Amazingly good gun and affordable!


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## shakinghorizons (Apr 20, 2012)

I have been contemplating the RIA commander or even the officer model, but can't seem to find anyone local that has them in stock. I stopped at a place last Friday and was told Armscor has them listed out of stock.


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## jdw68 (Nov 5, 2011)

So you like the Glock clone (S & W M & P), but you don't like the Glock. Ha! The S & W shield is a great gun, you could try that one. Of course, the Glock 26 is great also, but we have ruled that one out. I also have a Ruger LC9 and really like that pistol, but you would have to get use to the trigger pull. But what ever you do, please consider my words of wisdom. Don't under any circumstances take advice from some guy on a handgun forum.


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## TurboHonda (Aug 4, 2012)

berettabone said:


> Ruger sr9c or sr40c.........


Absolutely! I recently bought the SR9c new for $400. I selected it over a Glock 26, M&P, and XD. It is functional, intuitive, and comfortable. Just my opinion. I have 357's and a 45 for castle duty, but the 9mm is my daily carry.


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## Easy_CZ (Jul 20, 2012)

A CZ-75 Compact, S&W M&P 9c or a Ruger SR-9c would be on the top of my non-Glock, double-stack CCW list.


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## shakinghorizons (Apr 20, 2012)

jdw68 said:


> So you like the Glock clone (S & W M & P), but you don't like the Glock. Ha! The S & W shield is a great gun, you could try that one. Of course, the Glock 26 is great also, but we have ruled that one out. I also have a Ruger LC9 and really like that pistol, but you would have to get use to the trigger pull. But what ever you do, please consider my words of wisdom. Don't under any circumstances take advice from some guy on a handgun forum.


Yes, the m&p is a glock clone - just modified to be a better firearm 

I'm looking for something a little bigger than the LC9. Also, I will be shooting some of the suggestions listed, I would never buy one based on opinion.


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## jdw68 (Nov 5, 2011)

shakinghorizons said:


> Yes, the m&p is a glock clone - just modified to be a better firearm
> 
> I'm looking for something a little bigger than the LC9. Also, I will be shooting some of the suggestions listed, I would never buy one based on opinion.


Last line of my post was just a joke (found the contradiction humerous). For CCW the shield and LC9 size is hard to beat. If you want something bigger, then the S & W M & P, Springfield XD, and CZ-75 compact are possibilities.


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## SonnyMorales (Jul 26, 2012)

to tht OP, I was/am in your same situation.. After many trips to the gun shop (which is funny cause i sell guns at my shop, just not many new ones) i decided on the SR9c. I like the feel and look of the gun and was in my budget that I want to spend right now.

Though I would pick up the M&P and XD if I could, but for right now, for what I am looking for, the Ruger seemed to fit the bill..

As stated, make sure the forums and internet do not have a huge impact on your decision!! Only you will know what feels right... But quiet frankly I dont think you can go wrong with any of the choices, and if you can find used even better (assuming its not beat to hell)..

Please post back with what you got and how you like it after a range trip


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## chessail77 (Mar 15, 2011)

Using the ignorance benchmark that the M&P is a Glock clone then it stands to reason that the Glock is an HK clone.......JJ


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## jdw68 (Nov 5, 2011)

Ok, I feel like my bad joke my have caused confusion. I'm sorry, not only was I not funny but probably came across wrong. The contradiction of saying "take my words of wisdom, and don't take advice" that was just a joke. I know the whole idea of a forum is to get others opinion before making your own decision and am sure that is what you are doing. 
And, as for the Glock being an HK clone, I guess i would say that I don't see it as a clone of HK. The M & P is an obvious clone, some would even say an upgrade, but still a clone.


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## clance (Jun 9, 2012)

I personally would look that the Kahr P9.

Here a little while ago, my son in law was looking for a conceal carry and I recommended the Kahr P9. Looking on Kahr Talk forum (http://kahrtalk.com//forum.php) I was able to find him a used P9 with the original box/papers that had nightsights, 2 holster (IWB & OWB) 4 8rds. magazines for $375.00. He had a little problem at first, according to him it didn't look like the guy ever cleaned the pistol. But after a good cleaning his problems stop and he got a great deal.

Kahrs that I found on the forum for sale:

http://kahrtalk.com//showthread.php?t=14260

http://kahrtalk.com//showthread.php?t=14053 (_while he states only wants to sell in the DFW area, I'm sure that if you do a little talking he might change his mind_)

GunBroker.com listings: http://www.gunbroker.com/Semi-Auto-Pistols/BI.aspx?Keywords=*Kahr+9mm

Good luck!


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## shakinghorizons (Apr 20, 2012)

I have held the kahr models (pm9, cw9, etc) and just didn't care for the feel. Thanks for the suggestion though!


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## rex (Jan 27, 2012)

chessail77 said:


> then it stands to reason that the Glock is an HK clone.......JJ


That's funny.Boy did they miss the mark there.


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## recoilguy (Apr 30, 2009)

The S&W Sigma is a Glock clone, a very poor example of one but one none the less. The S&W M&P I have to disagree. Why ? Because I know guns and this is just not so. 

The K9 is nothing like the 2 Kahrs you mentioned but if you don't like the feel of Kahrs I am sure you would not like the K9 either. 

So many opinions in this thread right now, my opinion is simple, get the best gun you can afford and if you can not afford a good one save for a while longer. Internet knowlege is nothing compared to real hands on. Too many internetters speak with authority but sadly are incorrect with authority.

RCG


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

shakinghorizons said:


> Hey everyone, I know these threads are quite subjective, but I am just looking for some advice. Many of the ranges around here have limited guns to rent, so I am limited as to what I can go shoot.
> 
> First and foremost, I am limited to a budget of $500. I'm willing to purchase new or used. I am seeking a firearm for concealed carry, in 9mm. The current firearm I carry (.380) is heavy (29oz) and has a low capacity (8+1). I am interested in both polymer and 1911 platforms, but would like a commander barrel and officer grip if I go the 1911 route. I have shot many 1911's (in .45, never in 9mm) and have shot the xd compact 9mm, xdm 9mm, and m&p compact 9mm (I have shot other calibers, but that is irrelevant). I preferred the m&p over the xd. I am not looking for a Glock. the I guess the reason for my posting is, what other firearms should I look into before spending the money on the m&p. I like the m&p, but don't want to limit my options.
> 
> Any other suggestions for firearms? I'm willing to drive to a firing range that has specific firearms to rent, I would just prefer to be able to call around and see who has a specific firearm before taking a drive.


You might want to look into the Ruger guns. Check out the SR9c or the LC9, both are great for CC.:smt1099


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## clance (Jun 9, 2012)

shakinghorizons said:


> I have held the kahr models (pm9, cw9, etc) and just didn't care for the feel. Thanks for the suggestion though!


I'm guessing that you want something along the lines then of a compact double stack seeing you leaning toward the XD or M&P, apparently you don't care if it's thin or not. Between the two I would go with the M&P personally, I just like the feel and point of aim of the pistol better then the XD.

But another pistol if you want a double stack compact worth looking at is the CZ 75 D PCR or CZ 75 P0-7 (_I have a custom PCR just love it as well as a first model TP-9 Kahr, love that one too_). Both have decocks both are light (_first one has a alloy frame the other polymer_) both magazines carry 13 rounds and both meet NATO standards for what it's worth.

The CZ is concidered comparable to the Browning High Power (BHP) which set the standard in pistol ergonomics which I agree after having owned approx. 8 BHP in my time, giving the last one up for the PCR due to its light weight, the ability of DA/SA and the decock.

CZ in my opinion is one of the best buys out there and I would have no problems putting up my PCR against pistol out there costing several hundred$ more, for accuracy, reliability, fit and finish.


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## jdw68 (Nov 5, 2011)

recoilguy said:


> The S&W Sigma is a Glock clone, a very poor example of one but one none the less. The S&W M&P I have to disagree. Why ? Because I know guns and this is just not so.
> 
> RCG


The M & P is an obvious clone. Kahr PM9 is also a (single stack) Glock clone. Lots of gun makers have created their version of the Glock just because it's a great design. Some folks cannot admit this because they hate Glocks. Easier to hate the Glock than everthing derived from the Glock. HA! My favorite part of your post was "Why? Because I know guns":anim_lol:


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## recoilguy (Apr 30, 2009)

I am not sure I understand your post but it appears you are calling me a Glock hater and impying I don't know much about handguns. Before I go any further with this thread I would like a point of clarity. I hope you aren't calling me a Glock hater and I would like to undersand the laughing smiley face thing so similar to that which my 7th grade daughter uses on her internet posts.

RCG


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

jdw68 said:


> The M & P is an obvious clone. Kahr PM9 is also a (single stack) Glock clone. Lots of gun makers have created their version of the Glock just because it's a great design. Some folks cannot admit this because they hate Glocks. Easier to hate the Glock than everthing derived from the Glock. HA! My favorite part of your post was "Why? Because I know guns":anim_lol:


ok, so the sigma IS a glock clone... s&w settled a lawsuit out of court and had to make changes in the design and pay glock a huge punative damage settlement. they did not recieve a licensing agreement however. 
the m&p is a direct desendant of the 2nd generation sigma, the model produced AFTER the design changes mandated by the settlement. 
so the m&p is no more a glock clone that the glock is a clone of the hk vp70 (12 years before the glock) or the browning hipower.

a polymer firearm isnt unique.... remmington started making the nylon 66 in 1959 (11years before the vp70)....

and i do know guns


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## rex (Jan 27, 2012)

jdw68 said:


> The M & P is an obvious clone. Kahr PM9 is also a (single stack) Glock clone. Lots of gun makers have created their version of the Glock just because it's a great design. Some folks cannot admit this because they hate Glocks. Easier to hate the Glock than everthing derived from the Glock. HA! My favorite part of your post was "Why? Because I know guns":anim_lol:


"Everything derived from the Glock" , what could that be?

Striker fired? Nah

Plastic frame? Nah

Polygonal bore? Nah

Rotten,cheap sights? Eh,maybe

Safe Action? yes,but it's an oxymoron.

The Glock was designed as a cheap gun for the masses,masses meaning non gun loving people that like many LEO's and some military,could care less about guns and only have one because you shoved it in their hand.Now you have a person that is not proficient in handgun handling and safety holding a gun with the safety right in the worst place,the bangstick.Common sense would prove this is counter productive to the original intent.

Being a dangerous gun? Bingo

If you like Glocks,more power to you,if you don't like me,who cares?I think the most of Browning's 1911 and HKs,and if you ask I will give you my opinion,but the Glock lovers just really put the love/hate debate in a whole new class.The gun is not the most fantastic piece of machinery it's made out to be.How long did it take them to cure a known problem that caused them to blow up?Isn't the locking system a modified Browning design dating to the early 20th century?C'mon now,hyping up the mundane gets old and rediculous after a while.


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## shakinghorizons (Apr 20, 2012)

Other than the Glock clone debate, thanks for everyone's opinion.


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