# Indiana Mall Shooting Made Me Think



## Babbalou1956 (Sep 2, 2014)

Hero took out the mass shooter from 40 yards with a carry gun. I don't even shoot over 15 yards with my carry guns. Maximum range is 25 yards where I shoot. Could I hit a silhouette target from 25 yards with my Ruger LCR or SIG P290RS or Beretta Pico? Never tried it so I don't know. Next trip to the range I will try. With my range guns no problem. Pocket guns, won't be easy. They said the hero was carrying a Glock & shot 10 times so I know it wasn't a 42 or 43. I can't carry anything bigger comfortably.


----------



## armoredman (Oct 14, 2021)

I never saw anything about the good guy's gun, but I read he was wearing t-shirt and shorts, and the pictures of him show him a lot skinnier than me. Maybe a G-19? The 27 and 43X show mag capacity of ten - did he stop at ten because that was all he had, empty the magazine?


----------



## Higgy Baby (Aug 10, 2021)

The range I go to has backstops set at 10, 20 and 30 yds. I always set up at 10 yards, but will occasionally put a target up at 30. With my Kahr CT380 and Ruger LCP max - I struggle getting on paper. With my Sig P365 I can do much better.
With my larger guns- Canik DA or Elite, Beretta 92, Sig 228 and so on- I can do it.
BUT...a 40+ yard hit with small handgun is a good shot.


----------



## Tangof (Jan 26, 2014)

I just did the yearly LEOSA shoot and this year it was just four shots at 25 yards anywhere on the silhouette. Not very difficult, but add another 15 yards and I'd say this man was doing some shooting and under stresstoo.


----------



## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Since I shoot on my own property I have targets set up from 3 yards to 50 yards for me to practice with. I carry a full size 1911a1 daily


----------



## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

40 yards? In a crowded shopping mall. One heck of a shot and or shots.


----------



## armoredman (Oct 14, 2021)

Last news article I read said he may have connected with his very first shot. Distance may have been 50 yards and he closed to 40, if I read it right. Time to set up the steel out a little farther. Maybe a drill, *Eli's Nightmare, ten rounds, start at 50, draw from concealment on buzzer, fire at least one round from 50, close to 40 yards, subcompact pistol only. unmodified, and must navigate between three obstacles to simulate innocent bystanders, must score 8 hits on target, 1 must be A Zone, total time allowed 15 seconds*. Might be a little eye opening for us.
Edited the drill to reflect the coroner stated the murderer was hit 8 times and the Chief stated the entire shootout took 15 seconds.


----------



## Gary1952 (Jun 6, 2021)

I train at 7 and 10 yds with my Sig P220 and FN FNX-45. the range only goes out to 25 yds next time I go will have to try that one and see how go I do


----------



## hike1272.mail (Nov 19, 2021)

Babbalou1956 said:


> Hero took out the mass shooter from 40 yards with a carry gun. I don't even shoot over 15 yards with my carry guns. Maximum range is 25 yards where I shoot. Could I hit a silhouette target from 25 yards with my Ruger LCR or SIG P290RS or Beretta Pico? Never tried it so I don't know. Next trip to the range I will try. With my range guns no problem. Pocket guns, won't be easy. They said the hero was carrying a Glock & shot 10 times so I know it wasn't a 42 or 43. I can't carry anything bigger comfortably.


Remeber he was 22 with all the vibrato that goes with a 22 year old.
Great accuracy --> 10 shots at 40 yards with 7 hits (according to the LEOs) with a Glock! The killer had a Glock also and it looked like a 43 or 26.


----------



## hike1272.mail (Nov 19, 2021)

denner said:


> 40 yards? In a crowded shopping mall. One heck of a shot and or shots.


It was in the Food Court (so it was not so crowded with people standing up and milling around) and the killer was at the restroom portal (a easy to see and the killer was not running around). The Good Samaritan did a very good thing (protecting the innocent) and accomplished difficult shoots for most civiliams. The GS is to be thanked and wished "God Speed" with his own psychological trauma!


----------



## hike1272.mail (Nov 19, 2021)

armoredman said:


> Last news article I read said he may have connected with his very first shot. Distance may have been 50 yards and he closed to 40, if I read it right. Time to set up the steel out a little farther. Maybe a drill, *Eli's Nightmare, ten rounds, start at 50, draw from concealment on buzzer, fire at least one round from 50, close to 40 yards, subcompact pistol only. unmodified, and must navigate between three obstacles to simulate innocent bystanders, must score 8 hits on target, 1 must be A Zone, total time allowed 15 seconds*. Might be a little eye opening for us.
> Edited the drill to reflect the coroner stated the murderer was hit 8 times and the Chief stated the entire shootout took 15 seconds.


The LEO said 7 out of 10 shoots and the coroner confirmed 8 out of 10! Truly remarkable and magnificent shooting! Truly a wonderful savings of tens of lives in Indiana. My Hero!
(And the Bain of Gun Banners as he proved them All Wrong!)
Kudos Eli!


----------



## Babbalou1956 (Sep 2, 2014)

This story is driving leftists crazy. Some in the media are bashing the 22 year old man who stopped the shooter. They say he was carrying illegally (false) & should be arrested & it was wrong to shoot the bad guy. I would ask them, if you were in that mall getting shot at would you want the good guy armed? Yes or no? If nobody did anything for an hour like in Uvalde how many would have died? Maybe dozens. Anyway, this afternoon I'm going to see if I can hit a paper silhouette target at 25 yards 8 of 10 times with 3 of my smallest carry guns. Ruger LCR 38, SIG P290RS 9mm & Beretta Pico. Will show my results later.


----------



## old tanker (10 mo ago)

Shooting targets at 25 and 50 yards, with one hand, was standard when I first began to learn to shoot a pistol. That was the foundation for all the shooting games that came later, Bullseye, IHMSA, IPSC and CAS.


----------



## Gary1952 (Jun 6, 2021)

when I go to the range I practice at 7 and 10 yards. with my Sig P220 with the 3.9" barrel or my Colt Defender Lightweight 3" barrel. but sometimes I'll give my FN FNX-45 some range time


----------



## Islands7 (Nov 30, 2016)

Curious, sincerely - what caliber takes 8 shots before a guy falls? Guessing less than 357/45?


----------



## Babbalou1956 (Sep 2, 2014)

Here's my results. 10 shots from 25 yards with 3 of my carry guns. Also one range gun for comparison; Canik TP9SF. Surprised I hit the paper, never tried this with pocket guns. My local range is only 25 yards. I really need to adjust windage on my Beretta Pico 380 & Canik. Way off.





























Had a decent group going with the Canik but blew it with that 6:00 shot. I'll call it a flyer like it's Youtube. : ) Upper right target.


----------



## Higgy Baby (Aug 10, 2021)

I need to do that....I've always shot at 7/10 yards with my carry guns. Occasionally set up a 30 yd for fun. I need to get serious with long range shooting. My range max is 30. If you can hit at 30- close up will be automatic. 

P.S. How do you like that Canik? I have the SF Elite which is slightly smaller- 15 round. And the DA, which is full size with a DA/SA trigger and a decocker. Mine have been fantastic....and they were a little over $300 when I bought them. That was the best buy in hand guns I have ever seen.


----------



## Babbalou1956 (Sep 2, 2014)

Higgy Baby said:


> I need to do that....I've always shot at 7/10 yards with my carry guns. Occasionally set up a 30 yd for fun. I need to get serious with long range shooting. My range max is 30. If you can hit at 30- close up will be automatic.
> 
> P.S. How do you like that Canik? I have the SF Elite which is slightly smaller- 15 round. And the DA, which is full size with a DA/SA trigger and a decocker. Mine have been fantastic....and they were a little over $300 when I bought them. That was the best buy in hand guns I have ever seen.


Really liking this Canik. I got the TP9SF right before the pandemic & paid $299 at Academy Sports. Did 2 trigger mods & put on a grip sleeve but stock otherwise. Before I got this my most accurate pistol was my Ruger MK 3 .22 with a Volquartsen trigger kit. I could shoot 3" groups at 25 yards offhand, no rest. 10 shots. The Canik matches that. Well, except for that one bad shot. I'll try this again after I push the sight right. It's hitting slightly left. Used to hit right but I pushed the sight too far left.


----------



## Gary1952 (Jun 6, 2021)

hopefully my next .45 hole punch will be a H&K HK45 compact


----------



## Shipwreck (Jan 26, 2006)

Babbalou1956 said:


> Here's my results. 10 shots from 25 yards with 3 of my carry guns. Also one range gun for comparison; Canik TP9SF. Surprised I hit the paper, never tried this with pocket guns. My local range is only 25 yards. I really need to adjust windage on my Beretta Pico 380 & Canik. Way off.
> Had a decent group going with the Canik but blew it with that 6:00 shot. I'll call it a flyer like it's Youtube. : ) Upper right target.


Maybe not. Some guns are easy to pull to the side when you pull the trigger. Try resting the gun on a sandbag and try again.

I find some grip shapes have me pull the gun to the side, and some grips do not.


----------



## hike1272.mail (Nov 19, 2021)

denner said:


> 40 yards? In a crowded shopping mall. One heck of a shot and or shots.


It was in the food court where most of the people were seated. The Good Samaritan and the Killer were at eye level. The Killer was at the entryway to the restrooms.
Next time that you're in a mall, check out the food court and the restrooms. It's a perfect setup for the Good Samaritan, that is, he was probably making a clear shot.


----------



## stickumcap (Oct 12, 2015)

Read that someone familiar with that mall said it was closer to 40 feet not yards.


----------



## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Not surprising the more a story is told the more it grows usually


----------



## JamesCC (Mar 21, 2019)

denner said:


> 40 yards? In a crowded shopping mall. One heck of a shot and or shots.


I’d like to know how much he trained at a range, or even practiced. Is that pure natural talent or did was he an avid gun prepper guy


----------



## Jjones45 (Sep 25, 2019)

Well whether it was 40 feet or 40 yards, 8 out of 10 shots on target in a stressful situation is impressive. Makes me wonder if Eli had a red dot on his Glock. Maybe a MOS of some variety (g19,g26,g43x,g48)


----------



## Jjones45 (Sep 25, 2019)

tony pasley said:


> Not surprising the more a story is told the more it grows usually


Yeah, next thing we’ll hear is Eli shot tight groups the size of quarters in this bad guy. Nobody is ever gonna live up to his heroism and lore lol. Whether he wants it or not he’s the face of concealed carry and pro second amendment sheepdogs. Take a picture with this guy if you see him so one day you can show your grandkids, before there’s nothing left but a bronze statue of him at the nra. In all seriousness he did a fantastic job that I don’t feel many could have done as effectively given the circumstances


----------



## bhchang1 (7 mo ago)

Does anyone know if the good guy was using a red dot?


----------



## gwpercle (Jun 8, 2018)

I never carry a gun that doesn't have a hammer that I can cock the revolver or pistol with .
The reason is this incident ... I can shoot a lot better single action at 40-50 yards (that's half a football field) than I can shooting double action with hammerless revolver / pistol .
There might be a need for accurate long rang shooting ... and fast DA shooting may not be the answer .
Gary


----------



## Brazz (6 mo ago)

I was intrigued by this story also. Here’s a few things i‘ve read. He motioned people to safety and was over 40yds away in the beginning using an support beam to lean on. Then moved closer to about 40yds hitting the subject 8 times out of 10 shots fired with his glock 9mm. He said that his grandfather taught him how to shoot. This young man has no military or LE training. The illegal reports was that no weapons are allowed in the mall. Which is really not serious, but purchased Glock used legally.
He still had to get a lawyer and there’s a GoFundMe page to help with the fees.

My worry would have been a 40yd shot vs rifle, and LE showing up taking me out as the 2nd shooter. We wouldn’t find that truth for days.
Glad it all worked out for him, the lives he probably saved, and for us CCW folks here.


----------



## JamesCC (Mar 21, 2019)

Jjones45 said:


> Well whether it was 40 feet or 40 yards, 8 out of 10 shots on target in a stressful situation is impressive. Makes me wonder if Eli had a red dot on his Glock. Maybe a MOS of some variety (g19,g26,g43x,g48)


Exactly that is great accuracy. I hope they do a real style documentary on this whole story and show law abiding citizens doing great things with their firearms to save others


----------



## armoredman (Oct 14, 2021)

The mall was posted No Guns, but in Indiana that sign has no force of law, so he broke no laws.


----------



## JamesCC (Mar 21, 2019)

armoredman said:


> The mall was posted No Guns, but in Indiana that sign has no force of law, so he broke no laws.


Yet the left will scream he did. Dudes a hero


----------



## armoredman (Oct 14, 2021)

JamesCC said:


> Yet the left will scream he did. Dudes a hero


Yes, lying comes as naturally to the Left as breathing.


----------



## Johwar (Dec 31, 2020)

stickumcap said:


> Read that someone familiar with that mall said it was closer to 40 feet not yards.


Nope…40yds.


----------



## JamesCC (Mar 21, 2019)

armoredman said:


> Yes, lying comes as naturally to the Left as breathing.


This whole fbi raid thing is a joke too


----------

