# This is going to be a dumb question... CCW Holstering



## jakeleinen1 (Jul 20, 2011)

Met a fellow CCW holder the other day, he was ccw-ing without a holster... thats right mexican style

Is this legal? I live in Iowa, i cant see how getting caught with a Gun w/o holster is going to look good should a cop check you out


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## JBarL (Sep 15, 2011)

To my knowledge there isnt anything in the books as far as having a holster for your concealed gun as long as it is concealed. I personally just stick my XD 40 cal in my waist band if I jump out of the truck to run into a place.

JBarL


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

JBarL said:


> To my knowledge there isnt anything in the books as far as having a holster for your concealed gun as long as it is concealed. I personally just stick my XD 40 cal in my waist band if I jump out of the truck to run into a place.
> 
> JBarL


the laws vary from jurisdiction to jurisdiction but i have never seen nor heard of an law requiring HOW your ccw be carried..... altho i do have to say the your method of carry isnt the safest and i advise against it.


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

The last time I heard a bad case scenario of carrying w/o a holster was the pink pistol fiasco where some guy borrowed his girlfriends pink pistol to go to the grocery store and shot himself in the pecker. Ouch! I presume the pink pistol didn't like men, or at the very least didn't like being carried w/o a holster?


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

conversely i have seen MANY laws concerning the type of holster for open carry..... some jurisdictions outlaw the military style flap holster because it covers and therefore conceals the pistol. some ban any holster without a positive method of securing the pistol.


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## JBarL (Sep 15, 2011)

Well personally I never carried a firearm that didnt have a hammer on it until a couple of weeks ago when I got a XD 40 Altho Im not used to it and I dont much like the safety features on it so I do not carry a round in the barrel I just keep em in the mag that way no discharge happens when I'm not expecting it lol. But I see your side Ted and Denner But I was trying to answer his question to my knowledge but I am fimaliar with Texas Law not all lol. OUCH is right lmao but in a high pitched kinda way lmao
JBarL


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

There is/was at least one state the requires(d) a holster for carry....I forget which one it was though...

In Iowa there is no requirement. I've Mex. carried a time or two just to experiment with different carrying positions but strongly advocate the use of a holster for carry.


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

Arizona man shoots himself in the penis with fiancee's little pink gun: cops - New York Daily News


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

VAMarine said:


> There is/was at least one state the requires(d) a holster for carry....I forget which one it was though...


Georgia, I think.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

Holly said:


> Georgia, I think.


OK so i did some research and fount that Georgia DID have a law that required concealed weapons to be in holsters but was interpreted to BAN ankle holsters for anyone except LEO.....

in June 2010 Georgia passed SB308 which did away with the holster ban and cleaned up some stupid and outdated regulations.


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## SMann (Dec 11, 2008)

VAMarine said:


> strongly advocate the use of a holster for carry.


Me too. :smt018:smt028


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## crescentstar69 (Sep 24, 2011)

It might be legal, but that doesn't make it smart. Get a holster, even a cheaper one is better than none. "It's all fun and games until you shoot your d%#* off"


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

crescentstar69 said:


> It might be legal, but that doesn't make it smart. Get a holster, even a cheaper one is better than none. "It's all fun and games until you shoot your d%#* off"


So I'm at no risk of injury, right? Sweeeeet... Gonna go carry holster-less today!


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## crescentstar69 (Sep 24, 2011)

Apparently, you are safe, HOLLY! LOL


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Holly said:


> So I'm at no risk of injury, right? Sweeeeet... Gonna go carry holster-less today!


Just don't Mexican-Carry at "4:30," or you may be left with little to sit upon, and maybe also a second "exhaust port."


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

Funny. :smt082


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## rgrundy (Jul 16, 2011)

I work with a holstered gun lots and hunt carrying one. You need a holster and you need one that covers the trigger so nothing like a piece of fencing wire or a tree limb hooks it and shoots you. And it needs to be stiff enough so the holster can't fold over and end up in the trigger guard. Carrying in an urban setting may be totally different but when you wear a pistol all the time and push, pull and shove things around while working enough to exert yourself an unholstered gun is dangerous.


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## fiasconva (Jun 14, 2009)

Any questions you have concerning Mexican style should be sent to Plaxico Burress. Enough said.


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## Packard (Aug 24, 2010)

DeSantis' Clip Grip allows holsterless carry. See: http://www.magnumarms.com/assets/images/Clip_Grip_202.jpg

(This is just a copy of a long-time-in-production-now-out-of-production grip.)

Also, some weapons when equipped with a rubber grip can be secure in a "Mexican carry". I had a S & W model 29 with a round butt and a 2-1/2" barrel. When equipped with a Pachmayer grip it would stay exactly in one place on my hip; I would also carry this in the appendix position both for strong side carry and cross draw carry.

The driving force for this was the fact that I could not find a holster for the gun. It was a limited edition and I got one of the very first. The Mexican carry held the advantage that when I got in the car I could quickly and easily switch to cross draw (and back again when I got out of the car).

But this only works well with select few weapons; the long heavy trigger pull on the 29 made it seem safe.

With the factory wooden grip it moved around too much; the rubber grip held it in place.

But if a holster is available it would be my preferred carry method. I don't carry anything now in the Mexican carry.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Packard said:


> ...ome weapons when equipped with a rubber grip can be *secure* in a "Mexican carry". [emphasis added]



Oh, no, they can't.
The gun may stay in place for a little while, but eventually, at exactly the wrong moment, it will slip and you will have your Plaxico Burress moment.



Packard said:


> ...I don't carry anything now in the Mexican carry.


_*Good!*_
It'd be terrible, to lose a good metallurgist from the forum.


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

jakeleinen1 said:


> Met a fellow CCW holder the other day, he was ccw-ing without a holster... thats right mexican style
> 
> Is this legal? I live in Iowa, i cant see how getting caught with a Gun w/o holster is going to look good should a cop check you out


Nothing illegal, just stupid.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

for those rationalizing and justifying "Mexican carry" (man i hate that this has become an acceptable term) ...i hope and pray that when your pistol falls and there is a negligent discharge that the bullet is completely contained in your own body and that no innocents are hurt or killed because you are too cool, lazy or rushed to safely carry your sidearm.


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## guardjim (Nov 4, 2011)

I carry a Ruger SP101 2" with a Clipdraw and have had no problems doing so. I carry it at the one o'clock position ( appendix) or at the four o'clock position. With the revolver I find that with the clip hooked on the belt and the cylinder below the belt the weapon is firmly in place and does not move around. The long double action trigger pull is the guns safety and with the gun wedged between me and the inside of of my pants I see very little chance of an accidental discharge and I have carried revolvers this way for many years. 
I have never tried the Barami Hip Grip or the DeSantis Clip grip but it seems they would be similar in carry.
Now we get to the Clipdraw for the semiautos. I have tried it. For me this is completely different as the weapon is flat and it shifts around and moves too much for me to feel secure with it and I would not carry anything but a DAO auto with a long firm trigger pull with this method. My semi autos go in a holster.


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## guardjim (Nov 4, 2011)

"Mexican carry" (man i hate that this has become an acceptable term)

Ted, Do some research on this term. From what I understand the Mexican government outlawed the people from carrying guns (sometime in the 1800's?) and the poor folks, farmers, small ranchers etc. who needed protection from bandits developed this method so that the gun was simple to "dump" and recover later if they saw the law coming, with no evidence of a holster to give them away. Probably more to the story, but seems to me they developed a very smart way to deal with the problem.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

guardjim said:


> "Mexican carry" (man i hate that this has become an acceptable term)
> 
> Ted, Do some research on this term. From what I understand the Mexican government outlawed the people from carrying guns (sometime in the 1800's?) and the poor folks, farmers, small ranchers etc. who needed protection from bandits developed this method so that the gun was simple to "dump" and recover later if they saw the law coming, with no evidence of a holster to give them away. Probably more to the story, but seems to me they developed a very smart way to deal with the problem.


this IS exactly my point, not one of these guys is a 19th century vaquero needing to protect himself from some despot and highwaymen..... the term has NOTHING to do with todays usage.

much like calling a terrorist who kills for money a freedom fighter.

thanks for making my point jim


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

guardjim said:


> I carry a Ruger SP101 2" with a Clipdraw and have had no problems doing so...


The Clipdraw is a pretty good solution to the problem of not wanting to wear a holster.
It works. Jean and I thoroughly tested a few of them, so we know.
Using a Clipdraw is not _so-called "Mexican" carry_.

(Is that better, Ted?)


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

:watching:


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> The Clipdraw is a pretty good solution to the problem of not wanting to wear a holster.
> It works. Jean and I thoroughly tested a few of them, so we know.
> Using a Clipdraw is not _so-called "Mexican" carry_.
> 
> (Is that better, Ted?)


lets just call it "the carry formerly known as mexican" .....

:smt1099


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

Holly said:


> :watching:


:numbchuck:


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

TedDeBearFrmHell said:


> :numbchuck:


:smt076:buttkick::nutkick::smt071:anim_lol:

Popcornsmilie


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

:smt083


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## guardjim (Nov 4, 2011)

Huh? I'm new here.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Not to worry...
It's merely the Battle of the Smileys.
It's a non-nuclear exchange.

In truth, they may merely be exchanging vows of undying love and devotion.
:anim_lol: :smt083


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Not to worry...
> It's merely the Battle of the Smileys.
> It's a non-nuclear exchange.
> 
> ...


Smart *ss... :mrgreen:


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## Packard (Aug 24, 2010)

TedDeBearFrmHell said:


> ...i hope and pray that when your pistol falls and there is a negligent discharge...


This with a modern side arm. I forget the year they passed the law that required the weapons to be drop-safe, but it was sometime after I started shooting, and all the weapons that don't have that feature would be 25 + years old.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

Packard said:


> This with a modern side arm. I forget the year they passed the law that required the weapons to be drop-safe, but it was sometime after I started shooting, and all the weapons that don't have that feature would be 25 + years old.


No, not all "new" guns are drop safe.


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## Packard (Aug 24, 2010)

VAMarine said:


> No, not all "new" guns are drop safe.


 Which ones are not? Name one that will. They have to comply with the Gun Control Act of 1968 which required that it be dropped on a concrete surface from a height of 39".

To my knowledge, as long as your waist is not 39" + from the floor, then if the weapon falls to the ground from that height it will not fire.

To my knowledge they have not repealed that provision (but a quick Google search shows that the document is over 400 pages long and too long for me to search out the passage).

The two methods I know about are the inertia firing pin and the hammer block. The latest has the firing pin made from titanium and uses a strong spring. The titanium is so light that it cannot develop enough inertia to set off the primer. This is mechanically very simple and it works.

I cannot imagine a manufacturer flouting this law. A single lawsuit for failing to include this would probably put them out of business.


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## JeffWard (Aug 24, 2007)

Clipdraw&#8230; For Secure Carry Without a Holster

With a proper belt, in jeans, I can do cartwheels and keep my gun... It also works WITH a proper holster, so you can carry with a holster, but for those quick-trip-to-the-store moments, you're good...

JeffWard


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## Packard (Aug 24, 2010)

JeffWard said:


> Clipdraw&#8230; For Secure Carry Without a Holster
> 
> With a proper belt, in jeans, I can do cartwheels and keep my gun... It also works WITH a proper holster, so you can carry with a holster, but for those quick-trip-to-the-store moments, you're good...
> 
> JeffWard


This is no more or less secure than my S & W 29 with rubber grips. The big cylinder kept it from coming out of the belt too easily, and the rubber grip kept it from falling down my pants.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

Packard said:


> Which ones are not? Name one that will. They have to comply with the Gun Control Act of 1968 which required that it be dropped on a concrete surface from a height of 39".
> 
> To my knowledge, as long as your waist is not 39" + from the floor, then if the weapon falls to the ground from that height it will not fire.
> 
> ...


How about this for starters.

*Ruger - LCP® Product Safety Warning and Recall Notice*



> Ruger has received a small number of reports from the field indicating that LCP pistols can discharge when dropped onto a hard surface with a round in the chamber. We are firmly committed to safety and would like to retrofit all older LCP Pistols. The retrofit involves installation of an upgraded hammer mechanism at no charge to the customer.


Or maybe this one?
*http://www.ruger.com/SR9Recall/index.html*



> We have determined that some Ruger SR9 pistols manufactured between October 2007 and April 2008 can, under certain conditions, fire if dropped with their manual safeties in the "off" or "fire" position. The pistols will not fire if the manual safety is in the "on" or "safe" position.
> 
> We will retrofit all affected SR9 pistols (those with serial number 330-29999 or *lower*) with these parts *at no charge* to our customers. In order to ensure correct fitting, the new parts must be installed at our Ruger factory in Prescott, Arizona. We will remove the old parts and install the new trigger group promptly, at no charge, and will return the pistol to you. The old parts will not be returned.


Never assume a safety of any type is going to do it's job.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

Packard said:


> This with a modern side arm. I forget the year they passed the law that required the weapons to be drop-safe, but it was sometime after I started shooting, and all the weapons that don't have that feature would be 25 + years old.


seriously packard? this is the stupidest excuse for unsafe action i have seen yet for a PLETHORA of reasons..... not everyone has a new gun, safeties fail and sh!t happens.... unsafe action is unsafe action every time

because your car has ABS doesnt mean it will not wreck, you still wear a seat belt.

:smt018


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## recoilguy (Apr 30, 2009)

VAMarine said:


> How about this for starters.
> 
> *Ruger - LCP® Product Safety Warning and Recall Notice*
> 
> ...


Both models are drop safe now. I don't believe you can still buy one that isn't. Neither os the guns mentioned had the trigger saftey on them pre re call.

RCG


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

recoilguy said:


> Both models are drop safe *now*. I don't believe you can still buy one that isn't. Neither os the guns mentioned had the trigger saftey on them pre re call.
> 
> RCG


Yes, key word being _*NOW, *_but in the time frame between * October 2007 and April 2008 *(Clearly not 25yr old guns) it was quite possible to get a gun that is "built after blah blah blah all new guns are drop safe blah blah blah" when clearly they are not despite the manufacturers "best" efforts. How many guns you think Ruger fielded in that time frame of that particular model? How would you have liked to be one of those persons that had a dropped gun fire? Please, by all means tell them that any gun made after "X" year is drop safe...


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## recoilguy (Apr 30, 2009)

Thats why I said *now*......I have the ability to cognitively understand simple sentences. I did not for one minute dispute your statement or your claim. I agree with you that not all guns produced for the past 25 years are drop safe. I can't believe any gun produced by some manufacturers are safe at all. I just wanted to make clear to anyone reading this and considering one of the 2 weapons you impunded that they have been fixed and are safe now to buy.

To answer your question...I would not like to be anyone who drops any gun even if it does not fire. I try not to do that. As far as telling someone who dropped a gun that fired they are safe now.....the models in question are manufactered safe now. The models in question are an entirely different design now. I am not asking anyone to buy one nor am I suggesting it to anyone. In fairness to Ruger, who did make a faulty product then step up admit it, fix the ones out there, improve the design, and continue to sell the improved guns in question at a very reasonable price, I wanted it to be pointed out they fixed what the missed.

I don't know how there can be a problem with the that.


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

I'm not debating Ruger fixing the issue. Simply providing well documented instances of firearms within "the last 25 years" that were not drop safe, contrary to Packards thoughts that (allow me to paraphrase)"Dropping a gun these days is a non issue due to safety improvements since 1968"The point is that just because a gun is new / produced after the GCA does not make it drop safe. There will ne other makers to have similar issues eventually. All one has to do is look at 1911s made after the GCA that predate the addition of the series 80 fps to find guns that were mass produced AFTER the GCA that were not drop safe. I could list a few more in there I'm sure, but I think those several examples should suffice.


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## HK Dan (Dec 22, 2010)

Where are you in Iowa? If you're in the central or eastern part of the state, you need to come shoot with us at Wolf Creek!


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

*Packard*;
For all I know, Plaxico Burress's pistol had a "drop-safe" firing-pin safety.
But his injury was the result of accidentally pulling the pistol's trigger as he was trying to keep it from falling down his pants' leg.
No "drop-safe" device will save you from the results of that kind of reflexive action.

The same, exactly, is true of the guy who recently tried very hard to negligently shoot his, um, manly equipment off.

No mechanical safety will save you from your own reflexes gone awry.
However, you can easily and relatively cheaply insure against this sort of, um, emergency action by simply using a Clipdraw or wearing a holster.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> *Packard*;
> For all I know, Plaxico Burress's pistol had a "drop-safe" firing-pin safety.
> But his injury was the result of accidentally pulling the pistol's trigger as he was trying to keep it from falling down his pants' leg.
> No "drop-safe" device will save you from the results of that kind of reflexive action.
> ...


i prefer that they use the method that i referred to, stop the bullet with your own body!


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

TedDeBearFrmHell said:


> i prefer that they use the method that i referred to, stop the bullet with your own body!


It'll hit too low, I'm sorry to say.
But if they get lucky, there's always that femoral artery!


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## TedDeBearFrmHell (Jul 1, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> It'll hit too low, I'm sorry to say.
> But if they get lucky, there's always that femoral artery!


on the good side, they just MAY qualify for the yearly darwin awards


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