# Custom 1911



## dcowles (Jul 26, 2015)

Considering purchasing a custom 1911 in the $2500 range. Maybe Commander size. Best bets?


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

Wilson Combat, Ed Brown, maybe a Volkmann


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## dcowles (Jul 26, 2015)

How about Republic Forge?


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## dakota1911 (Jun 9, 2015)

In Commander size the Brown Kobra has a history. Wilson recently introduced a real 4.25 inch Commander size. Look at the others websites also. Cabot has an interesting Commander but I think it is out of your price range. If you don't want to shoot it and just drool and brag about it then that might get you a pristine 1950 low serial number Colt Commander, maybe even with a rotting box.


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## krunchnik (Nov 27, 2011)

Nighthawk is also another in the custom category-I am just naming cause I dont actually own any custom 1911's-though some day maybe


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

I own three custom-made 1911s.
From my experience, I have this to offer:

1. First, long before you ever order a custom or semi-custom pistol, gain a whole lot of practical experience in the discipline in which you will be using the gun. By doing that, you will have a much better idea about what you are going to spend your money on. There are so many possible modifications, from a simple trigger-job all the way to a ported barrel, that it is impossible for someone without experience to spend his money wisely.

2. While you are gaining this experience, ask around for gunsmiths who have done custom work, carefully look at the work, ask the owner for an evaluation of the gunsmith and his work, and ask about the personality of the gunsmith. A workman who will not listen to you, nor at least discuss your ideas with you, is not someone to give money to.

3. Develop a personal relationship with the chosen gunsmith, by giving him small projects and repairs to do for you. Judge his attention to detail, and his willingness to listen. If the gunsmith will let you watch him work, and if you can keep yourself from distracting him, spend a few hours in his shop, once or twice a week.

4. Now you are ready to order a custom-made pistol, rifle, or shotgun. Go to it.

Judging by a couple of lengthy phone conversations, I suggest that Terry Tussey might be a good choice...if there's no good gunsmith in your immediate area.


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## buckhorn_cortez (Feb 16, 2014)

You'll have a difficult time finding a true custom for $2500. For $2500 (new cost) you could find a Les Baer, Guncrafter, Ed Brown, Wilson X-TAC, Springfield Professional, and maybe a Nighthawk. 

Or, you could buy a used gun - but, then it's not really YOUR custom gun, is it?

Finding a good custom 1911 gunsmith who will do small jobs and let you watch is a fantasy. The well known 1911 custom gunsmiths all have backlogs, are probably not in your state, will have to work your order into their production schedule - and they're not doing a full custom gun for $2500.

A full custom is going to cost you a minimum of $3000 and more like $4000 - $5000. As an example, the last full custom I had done took 26 months and cost $4200 - and I provided the frame and slide.

As another example, a friend purchased a Les Baer for $1800 and sent it to Alchemy Custom Weaponry because the owner used to work for Les Baer, knows the guns intimately, and does great custom work. For another $1800, and 8 months in time, he will have a full custom Les Baer. So, that gun will cost $1800 + $1800 = $3600 and the work is done over an 8 month period. You're hardly going to be watching the gunsmith work with those kind of production times.

So, for your $2500, you're going to have to look at a "semi-custom" or take a chance on a lesser know 1911 gunsmith who will work cheaply. Cheap and good? Good luck on that one as good 1911 gunsmiths aren't cheap.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

buckhorn_cortez said:


> ...Finding a good custom 1911 gunsmith who will do small jobs and let you watch is a fantasy...


That hasn't been my experience.
You don't have to go to a well-known gunsmith, to get a really good custom-built gun made for you. There are many smaller shops where really good work is done, but they are known only locally.

I have, during my life, found a few.
For instance, there's a young, new gunsmith here in our community. He does quite good work. I've trusted him with a few difficult jobs.
There's also a gun engraver here, who does excellent, artistic work out of his home.


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## buckhorn_cortez (Feb 16, 2014)

> That hasn't been my experience.
> You don't have to go to a well-known gunsmith, to get a really good custom-built gun made for you. There are many smaller shops where really good work is done, but they are known only locally.
> 
> I have, during my life, found a few.
> ...


That's always a possibility. But, the problem with custom guns is that unless the gun has been made by a "known" 1911 gunsmith (Heirloom, Harrison, Volkman, Chambers, Rogers, etc.) you increase the resale risk should you want to sell the gun. People who are into the history of custom 1911's know who Armand Swenson is and are willing to pay the price for a Swenson gun - specifically because of the name associated with the gun.

If you have a local, unknown gunsmith make your custom 1911, you have a gun of unknown provenance and worth. There is a local gunsmith where I live that does impeccable work, and I have no doubt could put together a 1911 as well as any of the well known 1911 gunsmiths.

The question then becomes why would you pay the same amount to have him make the gun or a well known 1911 gunsmith as the cost will be the same - but the resale values will be totally different.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

If your decision to buy a pistol (or have it custom-made) is to be based upon its "resale value," rather than upon its practicality, I suggest that your priorities may be just a little bit skewed.

Besides, fine custom work will always be quite evident to the discerning buyer, regardless of the maker's name or fame.
And you would have more say-so and control over the local gunsmith's work for you, than over one who is far away and available sometimes by e-mail.

There are very few so-called custom-gun makers who are worthy of the name. Most of them merely make run-of-the-mill modifications to standard, factory-made guns. Any really competent gunsmith can do that, so it isn't really necessary to pay extra for the famous name stamped upon the gun.


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## buckhorn_cortez (Feb 16, 2014)

> If your decision to buy a pistol (or have it custom-made) is to be based upon its "resale value," rather than upon its practicality, I suggest that your priorities may be just a little bit skewed.


Nothing makes taking resale value into consideration and "practicality" (whatever that may be) mutually exclusive. If you don't take resale value into consideration for the total investment then you might as well just pile $100 bills in your driveway and set them on fire as you have more money than sense.


> Besides, fine custom work will always be quite evident to the discerning buyer, regardless of the maker's name or fame.


Uh..huh...well, then if you have a choice between a "fine custom" by a local gunsmith, and equally "fine custom" by a well known, name gunsmith - why would you choose the unknown gunsmith above the well known gunsmith? That's why Armand Swenson's guns still command a high price while the ones made by a local, unknown gunsmith fall in value. The unknown gunsmith's work is of unknown value, while the known gunsmith's guns are a known commodity with a market value.



> And you would have more say-so and control over the local gunsmith's work for you, than over one who is far away and available sometimes by e-mail.


That's pure projection on your part. While you can visit the local gunsmith, there is little that you cannot accomplish long distance through emails, telephone calls, and trading photographs. The top 1911 gunsmiths are used to working that way and will go out of their way to make sure you get what you want.

You're attempting to make this into a huge problem - it's not.



> There are very few so-called custom-gun makers who are worthy of the name. Most of them merely make run-of-the-mill modifications to standard, factory-made guns. Any really competent gunsmith can do that, so it isn't really necessary to pay extra for the famous name stamped upon the gun.


I see...so Stan Chen, Chuck Rogers, Marianne Carniak, Luke Volkmann, Joe Chambers, Harrison Custom, Heirloom Precision, etc. are hardly worthy of the name...? Ummm...I'm throwing my BS flag on that statement as you obviously have NO idea what you're talking about.

The last custom I had built was done by Bob Marvel. I sent Bob exactly what he asked for, a raw, unfinished .45 caliber slide, and a raw, unfinished 9mm/.38 caliber frame and he built the gun starting with those parts. That's hardly "merely making run-of-the-mill modifications to standard, factory-made guns."

Again - I don't think you know what your talking about, since the custom gunsmiths I've talked with will start with your choice of a base gun or unfinished parts - that's your call.

If you want to work with an unknown, local gunsmith and do over-the-shoulder supervision because that makes you feel better - that's your choice. But, it will not automatically result in a better finished product just because you say so.

There is a logical way to approach the problem of getting a gun built other than just going to a local gunsmith and hoping for the best in lieu of using one of the top 10 or so 1911 gunsmiths. One way to find a relatively local high quality gunsmith is by consulting the American Pistolsmiths Guild, and seeing if there is a member in your state that belongs to that organization.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

buckhorn_cortez said:


> That's always a possibility. But, the problem with custom guns is that unless the gun has been made by a "known" 1911 gunsmith (Heirloom, Harrison, Volkman, Chambers, Rogers, etc.) you increase the resale risk should you want to sell the gun. People who are into the history of custom 1911's know who Armand Swenson is and are willing to pay the price for a Swenson gun - specifically because of the name associated with the gun.
> 
> If you have a local, unknown gunsmith make your custom 1911, you have a gun of unknown provenance and worth. There is a local gunsmith where I live that does impeccable work, and I have no doubt could put together a 1911 as well as any of the well known 1911 gunsmiths.
> 
> The question then becomes why would you pay the same amount to have him make the gun or a well known 1911 gunsmith as the cost will be the same - but the resale values will be totally different.


I've never had a custom made 1911 myself,, I always thought it cost more upfront for the famous name vs the same cost of a no name


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

pic said:


> *I've never had a custom made 1911 myself*,, I always thought it cost more upfront for the famous name vs the same cost of a no name


Neither have I. I just can't see spending that kind of money for a 1911. I've got a Detonics Combat Master (my favorite), two Kimbers (Super Carry Pro and RCP II) and a Colt. They all go bang when I squeeze the trigger and I can hit what I want to hit with them. For around $1100 and change you can have an HK45C my personal favorite and EDC.



> Take a new pistol out of its box and subject it to field conditions in the hands of some of the toughest, most dedicated men in the U.S. Army and it will either fail the test or pass on its own merits.
> 
> H&K spec sheets note that anticipated service life for the HK45-C is 20,000 rounds, which should be more than enough for any training, deployment or home-defense situation.
> 
> The HK-45C did all that was asked of it by competitors in the Best Ranger Contest. The pistol was dunked in the water, abused in the heat and mud, fired from various positions at typical combat pistol distances and came through without a hitch.---http://www.gundigest.com/firearm-gun-reviews/new-hk45c-storms-through-best-ranger-competition





> HK45C / HK45CT
> 
> Used by US Navy SEALs, including SEAL Team 6 (DEVGRU), the HK45C (compact) / HK45CT (compact tactical) is a compact pistol chambered in .45 ACP.---http://www.americanspecialops.com/special-ops-weapons/hk45c-pistol.php





> These guns passed extensive test par*a****meters that included firing very high (24,000) round counts both suppressed and un-suppressed, in harsh conditions that ranged from desert environments to water submersion. They have also passed testing that includes bore-obstruction and other destructive tests.---http://www.tactical-life.com/gear/hk45c-us-navy-seal/2/#hk45c-2011-barrel


With accolades such as these you can't go wrong. And about a third the price of a custom 1911. They work and they work very well right out of the box without any expensive customization.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

buckhorn_cortez said:


> ...I don't think you know what your talking about...


...And that's where our conversation ends.

Disagreement does not necessarily mean that one participant doesn't know what he's talking about.
It means only that his experience is different from yours.
In this case, it also means that one participant has different criteria than you do.

But to build those disagreements into an _ad hominem_ attack brings everything to an end.
And this is it.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...And that's where our conversation ends.
> 
> Disagreement does not necessarily mean that one participant doesn't know what he's talking about.
> It means only that his experience is different from yours.
> ...


Right on there brother! Rest assured that anyone that has read your posts and has any familiarity with guns does indeed know that you do know your stuff. There are a lot of exceptionally skilled individuals that are out there that are not well known. I've worked on cars and guns for the better part of my life, most if not all of my friends are "gearheads". It's a fascination with mechanical things we all have. You'd be surprised at how many talented individuals that are out there. Including hobbyist's who's work is on par or even surpasses professionals. One friend of mine is making a '32 Ford Roadster from scratch all except for the running gear (engine and tranny). Frame, body, suspension components, everything. Unfreakin' believable! To see this man's work will make your jaw drop. Reminiscent of the early coach builders of the 30's and 40's. This man can make anything. He's made hoods, fenders, grilles, castings you name it for a lot of the car people out here. He's a retired tool and die man who does this for a hobby and just for the love of it.

If one knows what they are looking for it's easy to spot and feel shoddy workmanship when it comes to mechanical objects and the machining of parts. Including fit and finish. As far as custom 1911's go. Does the person that has their name on the gun actually make the gun themselves or have subordinates doing the work? Or in some cases farm the work out? If so the customer really has no idea who is making it. Just because it says Les Bear on it does not necessarily mean that Les Bear has actually made it. I'm only using that as an example.


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## Desertrat (Apr 26, 2007)

I don't think I would ever consider a true custom gun with the thought of "resale value"....if I do it....Im taking it to the grave with me!


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## 1911crazy (Jul 16, 2015)

Is this your first 1911A1 purchase?

My first three new 1911a1's had problems they were around $500 each. If they were $2,500 each me and the ceo would have a direct line. I like plain Jane 1911's. For $2,500 I could buy probably 4 new decent 1911's.


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## casurvivor (Jan 23, 2015)

I have a Kimber that must be Custom, it says so on the slide, actually custom II..................just kidding


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## cedarhill (Apr 9, 2013)

I added a beavertail grip safety and combat trigger to a Colt Gov 1911, series 80. The old spur hammer was hammering my hand. I now consider that my custom pistol and it only cost @ $800 used. Sweetest, best shooting pistol I have.


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