# DA Trigger Bias



## dominic135 (Apr 13, 2016)

Never been interested in Handguns till 6 months ago. Bought 4 guns for my sons and I. The only DA trigger I have is on the Kahr cm4043. First of all, the gun is too small for my hands. I can only get a two finger grip on the little bugger and I've come to hate the gun. Aside from the size & .40 kick, I hate the DA Trigger.
I don't know if it's the size, but the front sight is all over the place by the time the trigger fires.
I'm wondering if other people feel that way about the length of travel (not hard to pull) messing up their aim? Is it me, The small size, or is there an advantage of having no resistance until the hammer snaps forward?
I don't like the DA feature for first shot on my 1911 or CZ75 either. I always cock the hammer for the first shot on a full mag. 
Is this just a normal preference for some people or am I doing something wrong?


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

A 1911 doesn't have a DA 1st shot only. It is either single action all the time or in the case of a Para Ordnance LDA, double action all the time.

As for the sights jumping, thats all you. Your trigger control needs work or there are other factors shaking your sight picture.

Trigger / action type is a personal thing. Some do better than others but all have pros and cons and those pros and cons are interchangeable from type to type.

Sent from my SM-G920R4 using Tapatalk


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## VAMarine (Dec 25, 2008)

Regarding your Kahr, due to the size, recoil, and trigger...

It is a hard gun to shoot well, particularly if you are newer to shooting.

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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

*How to Learn to Shoot With a DAO (Double-Action-Only) Trigger:*
First of all, don't rush the process. You have to work through it slowly, building smoothness as well as finger strength.
The key word here is _smoothness_. The mantra to remember is: "Smooth is faster than fast."

1. Stop shooting that gun. No more live ammunition for a while. You need to learn a new skill first.

2. Buy a medium-strength (red color) GripMaster exerciser. With it, practice both isolating your trigger finger, and also exercising it.
"Isolating" means being able to move your trigger finger _independently_ of your grip on the gun.
Grip the GripMaster with your lower three fingers, hold tightly, and maintain that strong grip. Keep relaxing and re-gripping until your lower three fingers can maintain the necessary strong grip without conscious effort on your part.
Now add-in your trigger finger. Maintain your lower-three grip, and just press the index-finger part of the exerciser in and out. Work at keeping your lower three from following along with the index finger (that is, don't "milk" the grip).

3. When you're able to isolate your index finger, do an at-home dry-firing exercise with your _proven-empty_ gun.
Stand in your preferred stance, present the pistol toward _a blank wall_ (with nothing to be used as a "target"), grip properly with your lower three fingers, and _slowly and smoothly_ press the pistol's trigger until its hammer falls (or its striker does). Remember that key word: _smoothly_.
Watch your sights, and monitor any movement relative to your eyes, or even from rear to front sight. Strive to press that trigger so smoothly that nothing moves except the trigger itself. This will take a lot of concentration, and also a lot of practice time.

4. _Do not practice this shooting technique for more than about 10 minutes at a time. _Do not practice this stuff more than twice a day, with the practice sessions a minimum of two hours apart. Working too hard at this will cause you to hurry, or to become sloppy, and you will only be teaching yourself bad technique.
The exception to this dictum is your work with the GripMaster exerciser. You can do that whenever you feel up to it, and until your fingers get tired. It's a good thing to do while watching TV, or while merely making conversation.

5. It'll take you about a month to get your fingers trained. Now you can go shooting. Make sure that the gun isn't moving along with your index finger, and that the gun's sights aren't moving in relation to each-other.
Don't stop exercising, and also don't stop doing your daily dry-fire practice _with an empty gun_. You will need to retain these easily-lost skills.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

dominic135 said:


> I don't know if it's the size, but the front sight is all over the place by the time the trigger fires.
> I'm wondering if other people feel that way about the length of travel (not hard to pull) messing up their aim? Is it me, The small size, or is there an advantage of having no resistance until the hammer snaps forward?


Kahrs work nicely for people with small to medium sized hands. But the trigger break is too far back, if you have larger hands. There are a few subcompacts that have shorter travel to the break point, and some, like the S&W Shield, that can be modified with aftermarket trigger parts to make them fit larger hands or long fingers. Don't judge all DA's by the Kahr. Full sized Glocks and XD's for example, have decent triggers that work well enough for a SD weapon with no manual safety.


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## Cannon (May 1, 2016)

Many have trouble using a DA trigger there so used to most SA because that's what a lot of them learned on. Rather than learn they blame the gun when in almost all cases its the guy pulling the trigger that's to blame not the gun.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

dominic135 said:


> Never been interested in Handguns till 6 months ago. Bought 4 guns for my sons and I. The only DA trigger I have is on the Kahr cm4043. First of all, the gun is too small for my hands. I can only get a two finger grip on the little bugger and I've come to hate the gun. Aside from the size & .40 kick, I hate the DA Trigger.
> I don't know if it's the size, but the front sight is all over the place by the time the trigger fires.
> I'm wondering if other people feel that way about the length of travel (not hard to pull) messing up their aim? Is it me, The small size, or is there an advantage of having no resistance until the hammer snaps forward?
> I don't like the DA feature for first shot on my 1911 or CZ75 either. I always cock the hammer for the first shot on a full mag.
> Is this just a normal preference for some people or am I doing something wrong?


The Kahr trigger design is not DA. It is a DAO (Double Action Only) without second strike capability.


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## dominic135 (Apr 13, 2016)

*Thanks*



dominic135 said:


> Never been interested in Handguns till 6 months ago. Bought 4 guns for my sons and I. The only DA trigger I have is on the Kahr cm4043. First of all, the gun is too small for my hands. I can only get a two finger grip on the little bugger and I've come to hate the gun. Aside from the size & .40 kick, I hate the DA Trigger.
> I don't know if it's the size, but the front sight is all over the place by the time the trigger fires.
> I'm wondering if other people feel that way about the length of travel (not hard to pull) messing up their aim? Is it me, The small size, or is there an advantage of having no resistance until the hammer snaps forward?
> I don't like the DA feature for first shot on my 1911 or CZ75 either. I always cock the hammer for the first shot on a full mag.
> Is this just a normal preference for some people or am I doing something wrong?


Thanks to all of you for the input! I was planning on selling the Kahr and steering clear of DAO pistols. I still may trade it for a bigger grip option but now I'd like to master dual action as well. All the input was helpful.

Also... not putting down the Kahr. It's a great design, well made and reeks of quality. I must take the blame for buying on line without ever holding one in my hand!


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## Cannon (May 1, 2016)

When I bought my Taurus PT-111 G2 online I was able to handle one at a local store, I was very impressed with the gun. Its been the best low cost EDC sub compact/compact I've ever owned, fits my big hands very well. A lot of the small EDC pistols are just to small for my hands.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

dominic135 said:


> Thanks to all of you for the input! I was planning on selling the Kahr and steering clear of DAO pistols. I still may trade it for a bigger grip option but now I'd like to master dual action as well. All the input was helpful.
> 
> Also... not putting down the Kahr. It's a great design, well made and reeks of quality. I must take the blame for buying on line without ever holding one in my hand!


If I may make a few suggestions for you... Try to locate and handle the following guns, if that is possible in your area. And if you can, try to find a range that rents guns and try to shoot these to see how they fit and work for you.

M&P series. This fine series of semi-auto pistols can be had in the very popular 9mm, .40S&W, and .45ACP calibers which are quite commonly purchased by many in the gun community. The M&P has among the best ergonomics and just feels great in the hand. They are accurate, well made, and fine shooters. They utilize a SAO trigger design (Single Action Only) in that the trigger's action is just to release the sear from its capture of the striker. However, the general description of their trigger is DAO (Double Action Only).

The CZ 75B. This is a DA (Double Action) semi-auto pistol, also known as DA/SA (Double Action/Single Action) and also feels wonderful in the hand. Accurate, strong, reliable, and another fine shooter.

There are certain a heck of a lot more fine pistols from which to choose: Glock, Springfield Armory XD, Ruger, H&K, and more. Stick with the proven products, buy quality, take your time to take a good decision and one with which you won't be sorry. Then enjoy your purchase(s).


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

If you hate the gun, you won't practice with it or will you want to carry it. My advice is to get rid of it, and go to a larger pistol...especially in .40 S&W. JMHO.


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## dominic135 (Apr 13, 2016)

I own the CZ75b and love it... although I do cock the hammer for 1st shot on a full mag. In DA, the trigger is stiff, much harder pull than the Kahr. It's taken about 1200 rounds for me to shoot it well but I know the gun is still better than me. I'm learning.
Also have a .22 cal 1911 and .22 cal Rough Rider 6 gun. For some reason, the better I get on the 9mm, the worse I get on the .22's! It's all been fun!
Thanks for the input!


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

dominic135 said:


> I own the CZ75b and love it... although I do cock the hammer for 1st shot on a full mag. In DA, the trigger is stiff, much harder pull than the Kahr. It's taken about 1200 rounds for me to shoot it well but I know the gun is still better than me. I'm learning.
> Also have a .22 cal 1911 and .22 cal Rough Rider 6 gun. For some reason, the better I get on the 9mm, the worse I get on the .22's! It's all been fun!
> Thanks for the input!


That very heavy trigger on the CZ 75B can be vastly improved for very little money and ten to fifteen minutes of your time. Install a 13-pound hammer spring and watch your trigger do a 180 on its feel and pull weight.

CZ Mainspring 13Lb


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