# Console Gun



## cubsfanp226 (Feb 16, 2011)

Ok. I've got a Sig P238 that I carry in the center console in my SUV. Does great there, I've always concealed carried it in the center console. I found out a few months ago my wife and I will be expecting a little one. My question to people in a similar situation is what do you do? The obvious answer is taking the gun out of the console and carrying on my person. Are there any alternatives that I should consider, as I've always liked having a gun in that console.


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

My advice is to carry it on your person regardless of children present. 

GW


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

goldwing:


> My advice is to carry it on your person regardless of children present.


That is the best suggestion for all circumstances. Good job!


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## Scorpion8 (Jan 29, 2011)

If it's in the console while you're in the SUV, then I'd just make sure to train and raise your kids to respect it and "not to touch". But if you leave the vehicle, then take it with you.


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## SailDesign (Jul 17, 2014)

Also this:

Two charged in theft of guns | The Cleveland Daily Banner

Fifth sentence/paragraph is the important one...


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## Scorpion8 (Jan 29, 2011)

SailDesign said:


> Fifth sentence/paragraph is the important one...


Which is exactly why there's nothing on my vehicles like that -- no bumper stickers, no personalized license plates, no "life member" stickers, etc. I prefer anonymity.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

It might be against the law to store the loaded firearm in an unlocked console with others in the vehicle. Your handgun is now accessible to others and not in your possession.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

As *goldwing* was the first to write, here:
Do not "stash" your pistol. Keep it under your complete control by carrying it on your person at all times.
When you're not carrying it on your person, and there are children or visitors about, it should be locked away, preferably in a safe.

Truth: Jean and I both have car guns. However they are stored unloaded, under key-only access.


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## Tangof (Jan 26, 2014)

Scorpion8 said:


> Which is exactly why there's nothing on my vehicles like that -- no bumper stickers, no personalized license plates, no "life member" stickers, etc. I prefer anonymity.


I think you have matched my thinking exactly. When I was an active LEO I saw many cars broken into or at least vandalized because of NRA, "Cold Dead Hands", etc., stickers. The absolute worst was FOP ,Fraternal Order of Police. Guaranteed a key scratch at minimum. I don't leave any shooting paraphenalia including hats with shooting logo's in the car. Also, explain to Officer taking the report on your stolen vehicle that you just happened to have a loaded handgun in the car.


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

When traveling in a vehicle, make sure it is accessible... wherever that may be.

Gonna take the other side of this discussion since I find myself practicing the alternative carry option.

Trying to draw, seated, while wearing a seatbelt, possibly even IWB can be difficult and slow... under stress and under attack you may find yourself struggling to get your handgun out in time. I prefer the dash compartment which is easily accessible and much quicker. Most honestly don't even think about having to defeat the seat belt release, let alone train to draw while seated & belted in. How many of you actually train for this? I'd guess not many... be honest. Is it covered by a garment?... another obstacle to bypass while seated. Retention strap? 

I have kids and they have a great respect for "Daddy's guns" and understand they are not to be touched without my supervision. Never leave a firearm unattended a vehicle with children... even just to run into a convenience store for a min. Your firearm is your responsibility. Take it with you if you leave.

I see no issue with using compartments or steering column holsters as long a person is responsible and practices. The last place I want my firearm is a place that's hard to get to under stress.... you may not have time or see the threat in time to access it beforehand. 

Just my opinion on the subject... different strokes for different folks.


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

Buy a Beretta DA/SA with the decocking/safety lever. 1. The child must know to disengage the safety up(but possible if fiddling with it I suppose). 2. The DA is about 8-10 pounds and to defeat that and #1 would be unlikely and the child would need to be at least 2 years old I believe to have the strength and dexterity to even come close. 3. Depending, leave the chamber empty, accordingly the child would have to rack the slide and defeat 1. 2. and 3. And very important when the child is old enough to teach him/her gun safety and to never touch a firearm while parents are not present and watch this: NRA's "The Eagle has Landed."

https://eddieeagle.nra.org/


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

TAPnRACK said:


> When traveling in a vehicle, make sure it is accessible... wherever that may be.
> 
> Gonna take the other side of this discussion since I find myself practicing the alternative carry option.
> 
> ...


All fine, but take it with you when you leave the car.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

TAPnRACK said:


> When traveling in a vehicle, make sure it is accessible... wherever that may be.
> 
> Gonna take the other side of this discussion since I find myself practicing the alternative carry option.
> 
> ...


I've done the same thing, my gun stash spot was usually under my drivers floor mat.

I would purposely buy extra special floor coverings to prevent printing.

Plus accessibility to the gun by anybody else was out of reach.

I'm in favor of teaching children about guns when they've reached a certain maturity level, which will differ from child to child, but children are still children, like you said "Tap n Rack , I would not leave the children alone with the guns.

I don't know if you've ever done road patrol in your duties, but , say you pulled over a carload of young men cruising the town.

Things weren't jiving with the plates ,vehicle or whatever. Computers were acting funny.
You decide to ask the driver using your vehicles outside speaker intercom system to please step out of the car.
Should that person reach over to his dash compartment to possess his CCW handgun? Probably not.

Now you finally approach the vehicle, and the driver admits he has a handgun in his unlocked glove compartment or console. 
You kinda , might get a little mad that any and all passengers in that vehicle could have accessed the handgun putting you at risk prior to your knowledge of a known handgun in the vehicle.

You're the more experienced and trained professional then I, did I go overboard with the scenario?

:smt023


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

I deal with guns in cars daily, if not weekly... most are CPL carriers that either have it on their person or stowed in a compartment. As long as I know WHERE it is... it can stay there throughout the stop. I'm not into holding firearms during a stop unless I know there is going to be an arrest (warrants, criminal charges, etc) following shortly. 

Only time I order someone out of a vehicle using my loudspeaker is during a high risk or felony stop... and my gun is usually out. If the driver stated there was a gun in the car... we would simply have the occupants exit one at a time, secure them, and secure the firearm for everyone's safety. 

Carrying in cars is very common in my area and most are valid carriers.... it's not a big deal to me since I instruct CPL classes and am a proponent of CCW/CPL. I was actually surprised when I discovered just how many actually have CPL's in the Detroit area. 

I once stopped a guy on 8 Mile who had a sawed off shotgun leaning against the front passenger seat.... he was told by his instructor it was legal because it was concealed, and he had a valid CPL, lol. 

All kinds out there....


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

What's a CPL?


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

Concealed Pistol Licence.... same as a CCW or whatever certain states call their version of a concealed carry license. Michigan chose to go with "CPL".


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

TAPnRACK said:


> Concealed Pistol Licence.... same as a CCW or whatever certain states call their version of a concealed carry license. Michigan chose to go with CPL.


For a minute I thought it meant "console permit license" lol.

You mean the state of Michigan considers a revolver " A PISTOL ", I personally agree, now I have Michigan to back me up, lol. 
:smt033


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## Goldwing (Nov 5, 2014)

denner said:


> Buy a Beretta DA/SA with the decocking/safety lever. 1. The child must know to disengage the safety up(but possible if fiddling with it I suppose). 2. The DA is about 8-10 pounds and to defeat that and #1 would be unlikely and the child would need to be at least 2 years old I believe to have the strength and dexterity to even come close. 3. Depending, leave the chamber empty, accordingly the child would have to rack the slide and defeat 1. 2. and 3. And very important when the child is old enough to teach him/her gun safety and to never touch a firearm while parents are not present and watch this: NRA's "The Eagle has Landed."
> 
> https://eddieeagle.nra.org/


Sorry to disagree, too many variables going on. First, the purpose of the gun is to be ready at an instant to defend yourself. If the gun is "safe" enough to have a toddler fiddling with it then it is not ready to do what it is meant to do. If you have the gun on you you can forget about making the gun safe for three year olds and dangerous for bad guys.

GW


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I understand your point "GW" . But the OP wants to keep his gun in the console.

He (the OP)now has Tap n Racks approval.:mrgreen:

I myself really like the DA/SA mechanism. 

It's a very good plan to be ready in an instant, in my opinion part of that plan is the safety factors involved. Protecting yourself and your family from yourself.

I agree just carry the gun on your person. :smt023

But I think Denner may have been implying that if you must carry in the console, his suggestion was the safety of the children and family. 

I have to admit that I will stash an unlocked handgun in the house, easier to access then a safe in my opinion. But the gun will be a DA/SA PLATFORM....Though there are some new tech handy gun safes out there today. I may get called on that one,lol.


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

When we say "console", it can mean many different locations in a modern vehicle.... dash console, glove box console, center console (armrest)...etc, etc.

I think the glove box may be too far for most to access quickly and I prefer the dash console compartments which are much closer to the driver... unless i'm a passenger. Depending on where I am and time of day (high risk area), I may stuff it under my left thigh keeping the grip exposed for quick access without a lot of movement on my part. 

Everyone has their own take and no one way is right or wrong.... as long as you train and use consistency in your chosen placement in the vehicle. Some methods are quicker than others, but the bottom line is do what is comfortable and makes sense to you based on your vehicle. I use different a location when driving my wifes SUV since it has a different layout than my sedan. 

I believe education of children should start when the parent thinks they are ready... I feel taking the "mystery" out of guns is a key to them understanding the importance of respecting a firearm. They should ALWAYS be locked up... but I don't think they should be a "secret" once the child is old enough to explain the dangers of playing with guns and explain safety precautions needed to ensure safe handling. Every parent has a different take on the subject... this has worked for me. I don't come home with a briefcase in my hand... I walk in with a duty bag and rifle case in my hands, I can't keep my firearm ownership a secret from my kids.... so I don't. They understand what Daddy does and know not to touch anything without permission. YMMV.


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## SailDesign (Jul 17, 2014)

TAPnRACK said:


> When we say "console", it can mean many different locations in a modern vehicle.... dash console, glove box console, center console (armrest)...etc, etc.
> 
> <snip-de-dip!>


From the first post, "center console".


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

Well I have a center "in-dash" console and an armrest center console.... my wife has center compartment just below the radio (center console?)... are they not all center consoles? 

After reading the OP... I found it up for interpretation. Maybe i'm over thinking it.... naw.


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## SailDesign (Jul 17, 2014)

TAPnRACK said:


> Well I have a center "in-dash" console and an armrest center console.... my wife has center compartment just below the radio (center console?)... are they not all center consoles?
> 
> After reading the OP... I found it up for interpretation. Maybe i'm over thinking it.... naw.


Hey - I'm not judging - just sayin' ....


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## muckaleewarrior (Aug 10, 2014)

Good information here. I have a place that I place my gun near the console that allows me to access it if needed when driving. But I cannot have my gun at either of my jobs so I have to lock it up. Either in my glove box (like at my early morning part-time job where I am just a few yards away from my car at all times) or in my portable gun safe that I use most of the time.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

TAPnRACK said:


> Well I have a center "in-dash" console and an armrest center console.... my wife has center compartment just below the radio (center console?)... are they not all center consoles?
> 
> After reading the OP... I found it up for interpretation. Maybe i'm over thinking it.... naw.


As a passenger getting in your vehicle, would I be allowed to store my CCW handgun in your center dashboard console?


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

pic said:


> As a passenger getting in your vehicle, would I be allowed to store my CCW handgun in your center dashboard console?


Um, that would be a "transfer," which is illegal in Washington State without going through a licensed dealer first.
And then, if you want it back, we have to go back to the same dealer for you to be allowed to take it.

If we or our car is ever attacked, I sure hope that the dealer is close by!

(Am I laying on the snark a little too thickly? Naaah...)


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I started laughing just as I read to the word transfer and throughout ! Very good 
:smt033


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## PT111Pro (Nov 15, 2014)

> Steve
> Truth: Jean and I both have car guns. However they are stored unloaded, under key-only access


Sorry to say that Steve -
Well - that made no sense. Leave the guns in the home Safe that's much better. Nothing more worse than a attacker that see a gun near you and the gun is unloaded. Or more worse you grab a unloaded gun in an event of emergency.
I'll think people have to make a choice. Carrying a gun means carrying and not storing. A gun in the console is a storage item doesn't matter if loaded or unloaded.

I carry my gun in a holster between console and passenger seat. It is concealed but accessible. If I have someone in the car with me, I keep it in my holster on my hip. If I leave the vehicle, the gun leaves with me. It's called a carry gun not storage gun.

Now I take 3 of my 5 cent back.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Well, it has to do with where we live, in part.
People don't steal cars here: There's no place to drive them away to. We're on an island.

But, yes, our car guns are in our cars, even when we're on the mainland.

The other factor is that at least one of us is always carrying a pistol that is "ready to go." Usually, that's me.
The car guns are there for more serious purposes: One of them, in each car, is a rifle.
Instant access is not an issue, but availability is.

A gun of any kind that's at home, in our safe, doesn't do us any good, were we to need it.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

STEVE, 

What , if any, wildlife on the island may be a concern to defend against? 
Thanks


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

None, really.
No bears. No poisonous snakes.
Lots of deer, raccoons, geese, gulls, and eagles.

Several meth labs. Some marijuana plots.
Very few unpleasant people.

It is just my habit to have a rifle in each car, and a pistol too.

Only once did I have to put a deer, hit by a car, out of her misery.
I wasn't carrying a "big gun," so I was glad to have my .45 ACP car pistol for the job.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Mostly Just curious if any black or brown bears would swim to visit the island.

The islands sound very nice. 

Maybe a little whale watching at times?


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## SailDesign (Jul 17, 2014)

pic said:


> Mostly Just curious if any black or brown bears would swim to visit the island.
> 
> The islands sound very nice.
> 
> Maybe a little whale watching at times?


Deer will swim (that's how they get to my island) but don't know about bear. Not particularly common here...


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

SailDesign said:


> Deer will swim (that's how they get to my island) but don't know about bear. Not particularly common here...


Sound like a slice of heaven .

You ALSO have a nice little spot in RI. doing what you love, SAIL


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

pic said:


> Mostly Just curious if any black or brown bears would swim to visit the island.
> 
> The islands sound very nice.
> 
> Maybe a little whale watching at times?


Land-based bears don't seem to swim all that well, and there aren't many on the nearby mainland either. We humans are the top predator here.

At least one bison ("buffalo") made it to Orcas, many thousands of years ago. He was killed and butchered here by the proto-Amerinds who came every summer to fish, and to harvest clams, mussels, and oysters. His very complete skeletal remains were discovered, well preserved in a small swamp, a couple of years ago.

The raccoons and squirrels came by floating log. We come and go by Washington State Ferries (when they're running properly).

Whales we got: Orcas, mostly, but also grays. Lots of porpoises, at least two different kinds of curious and unafraid seals. The best whale watching is from kayaks, but you need lots of patience, very strong arms, and a guide. We have a friend who lives on his boat, whose previous cat made friends with a harbor seal.

*Side Issue:* _Why it is foolish to trust the promises of government..._
When Washington State took over the Black Ball Ferry Line that served all of the Puget Sound and Salish Sea area, state government promised that the ferry system, necessary to these islands and to one Puget Sound island, would be treated just like any other part of the state highway system.
Now, a little more than 50 years later, the mainland has an extensive freeway system and lots of fairly new arterial roads, but the ferry system needs at least three more boats to meet the demands of today's travellers and locals, and also needs to replace another three over-age boats which have deteriorated badly. Also, foreseeable future needs will require even more ferries than that.
But state government continually runs out of money. Mainland roads get the repairs they need, and Seattle gets its new tunnel, but even though ferry fares have risen to almost incredible heights, we never get new boats, and the older ones keep on breaking down. It is now cheaper for a working commuter to own a second ("beater") car on the mainland and pay the walk-on fare, than it is to pay the car fare on the ferry every working day.
Mainland voters see islanders as "rich people," which some of us are, completely forgetting that at least 50% of us are working for a living, either on an island or on the mainland. But the majority of the state's voters would oppose giving us "rich people" the ferry service commensurate with the state's promise that the ferry system would be treated just like any other part of the highway system. Thus, state legislators beggar the ferries and support the mainland's roads, because they want to be reëlected.

Those mainland voters have just now been handed a shocking surprise: Toll-road lanes on their freeways, for commuters who want to get to work on time, and tolls for using bridges which previously were free. (But that won't affect the ferry mess.)


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## SailDesign (Jul 17, 2014)

pic said:


> Sound like a slice of heaven .
> 
> You ALSO have a nice little spot in RI. doing what you love, SAIL


Yuppers!


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