# what do you think of this carry option?



## YFZsandrider (Feb 28, 2009)

I've ordered a Kramer, around $130 (ouch). Every holster is custom built around a mold of the actual model of pistol. Since they are all made custom to order, you can have them make it custom for you, basically any way you want. I hear nothing but great things about the quality of the holsters form gun shop guys around here, but they are a local company. I just went down to their shop with my Kahr, and showed them what I want.

I ordered mine in a IWB for my Kahr P9. The holster will have a belt clip and the gun will sit at 15 degree tilt, and riding as low on the belt line as it can with the handle easily accessible. I tried on a few 15 degree IWB, nad the gun always felt like it was too high, and that half of the gun's mass was hanging outside the waist, it didn't feel very natural to me. It's propably going to end up being a little less of a quick draw with the gun's position, but for me, the more comfortable it is to carry, THE MORE OFTEN I WILL. 

There was just a shooting half mile from the house earlier today, really gets you thinking how you don't want to be caught without it.



Ayone have any input? Thanks


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Very likely, this will be the first in a long string of holsters you'll purchase, trying to find the "perfect" one for you.
Kramer makes good stuff, but you still may not be happy. As you gain experience, you will find your needs changing. That's perfectly normal. We all have boxes full of holsters we thought were exactly right, until we had used 'em for a while.
It doesn't matter.
What does really matter is that you practice with your gun and with your holster until you are smooth, quick, and effective. That takes a long time, so don't get impatient. Admit to yourself that you're a beginner, and don't let your ego take over.
Ask questions. Listen to the answers. Above all, practice, practice, practice.
Don't try for speed. Speed comes in time, after lots of slow practice. Try, instead, for smoothness. Slow smoothness. "Smooth is faster than fast."
Good luck.


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

+1 Steve

I personally try to tell people to not drop prime money on a super high end rig until they go through the growing pains and find what works best. Nothing is worse than spending a hundred plus on gun leather that you end up leaving in a drawer.And you'll never get your money back out of it so you will want to keep it.

I hope it works out for you though, statistics are against you but it's happened. You seem to have done a little research so at least you're not going in totally blind like many will.Comfort is a good thing. It feel like you have the titanic in your pants you wont like it(wow that sounds just plain wrong).

Post a pic when you get it. I'd like to see what it looks like.


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## Sureshot45 (Jul 3, 2008)

Kramer has a lot of my money. I have found their products to be worth the money. I have well over a thousand dollars in leather (Galco, O'Rourke, Gould & Goodrich, Kirkpatrick, Andrews, and others) and Kramer is top shelf stuff. Only one I would really recommend that you avoid is Tagua. The leather is cheap and just does not break and wasn't formed well to start.


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## YFZsandrider (Feb 28, 2009)

I am not a die hard carrier(not yet anyway:mrgreen, so for me, if the holster is not something I could throw on quick while running out of the house, then I would be less likely to take it. I wanted a belt clip for this very reason, rather than loops. The only thing I am wondering about is the extra material that some of these IWB holsters have for comfort, the wings that extend partway around the sides to spread out the "lump" of the rig, When I ordered my holster, I did not specify whether it would have them or not, but I still have a little time to clarify the build instructions, so any advice? Remember that this is a Kahr P9, so it won't be very thick to begin with. Thanks guys!

Pictured below is what they call "below the waistband clip" and their traditional IWB. Now the first holster is meant for smaller mouse guns, but what I told them is that I want somewhat of a hybrid between the two- an IWB clip that had a FBI tilt, but rode lower than the traditional style. Hopefully when its done, the holster will hold the gun concealed below the belt, with the exception of the handle and rear most inch or so of the slide protruding for access. Again, I WANT YOUR INPUT


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

OK, here's my input.
I think that positioning a holster down so low that most of the gun is below belt level greatly impedes your draw, while it does nothing for concealment.
No matter how low the pistol is positioned, you are still going to have to cover it with a shirt or jacket, because some of it is going to show if you don't.
That being the case, why not position the gun as high as possible, to make grabbing it much, much easier? (That's what I do...but that's just me.)
Under normal circumstances, the gun shouldn't be buried any lower than the rearmost edge of the trigger hole, where the triggerguard meets the grip. Otherwise, you're facing a struggle with your own pants at a moment when you need to make a quick, uncomplicated grab while keeping your attention focused on the other guy. (My belt holsters raise the gun so that the triggerguard clears the top of my belt, but that's just me...and, it only works with short pistols.)


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## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

Agreed. I think that low carry will make it hard to dray and will not do anything for the comfort. I have a Bianchi that uses a single leather loop snap that you can adjust the cant. It has a thumb break too that I didn't care for as much in an IWB but it rides pretty well. 

The leather loops on the Gould I have on me as we speak uses two snaps around the belt and it had a small cant to it but not a lot. I like the snaps because I think they keep the rig in place more than the clips will but that's just a personal thing. It's as easy to put on I just have ot snap the two loops shut rather than get the clip on my belt.

I think that low rid will cause the grip to be in your waistband and that is not going to be real comfortable. But I don't have to wear it. You might like it but it appears to me like that is going to cause some problems in the car or sitting in general.


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## YFZsandrider (Feb 28, 2009)

Damn it. Now you guys have got the wheels turning in my head! I'll do a little more looking and let ya know. The reason for having the lower ride is that when I wear my current cheapie IWB, the gun hangs half way out and especially when bending over, and with it fully loaded the mjority of the guns mass and weight is not tucked inside the waist.


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## Sureshot45 (Jul 3, 2008)

I have the IWB #3 for a Glock 32. I wouldn't change a thing. The gun rides securely and comfortably. The Kramer IWB #3 is the most comfortable IWB I own, and I own about 12.


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## niadhf (Jan 20, 2008)

I have one (desantis inner piece) that is a high carry with fbi cant. for my P-11 but made for a Kahr (not sure which make. It took some getting use to with the high carry, felt like the barrel wasn't where it should bne (of course i am also comparing to a pistol with a 3.5" barrel from before). BUT, once o found the right spot to put it, I like the holser a lot now. downside.. not tuckable whicih i need for work.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

YFZsandrider said:


> Damn it. Now you guys have got the wheels turning in my head! I'll do a little more looking and let ya know. The reason for having the lower ride is that when I wear my current cheapie IWB, the gun hangs half way out and especially when bending over, and with it fully loaded the mjority of the guns mass and weight is not tucked inside the waist.


You could have Kramer build you a higher-ride holster, and ask them to add a stiff extension to its bottom and sides to hold it in place.
The problem you were having with your cheapie IWB is as much the fault of the belt as that of the holster. Many people buy expensive holsters, and then skimp on the belt.
To properly support a loaded pistol, you need a stiff, thick belt. It should be made of two layers of best-quality (Hermann Oak) cowhide, cut from either the back or shoulder of the side, and at least 3/16" thick (1/4" is better). It should have a strong buckle, too.
The holster and the belt should each cost about the same amount of money, I think.


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