# Any of you concerned?



## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

With the way our country is going and the way things are back in DC, some concerns have cropped up in my household. 

My wife and I are both retired. We've saved some money and put it in a savings account. It's not a huge amount, but it is still substantial. We are not sophisticated investors. My wife gets SS and I get a fed. govt. pension. We don't have any CD's, 401K's, stocks, bonds or the like. 

My wife has been suggesting that due to the current economy and the way our country is struggling, we should withdraw a major portion of our savings and just keep the cash at home. She's talking like 95% of it. Leave enough in the account to keep it open. 

Me, I feel that it's safe in the bank. Maybe I'm wrong. That's the issue that we're dealing with. I have told her, that if we do what she suggests, we need to upgrade to a much better vault. Something that has a 1st rate fire-rating and weighs much more than the ones I have right now. 

Anyways, I'm curious as to how some of you feel about what I have posted. Are we the only one's disappointed and nervous about what is going on, or could happen in the near or not so distant future?


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## Cait43 (Apr 4, 2013)

While there is some room for concern I don't believe one needs to withdraw monies and turn it into cash.. If our country went belly up I believe cash won't be of any value.........

What needs to be done is for both parties and the president need to stop finger pointing, whining, and throwing tantrums and vote to raise the debt limit now since they will raise it eventually... America has always had a debt..... Granted now its in the trillions but that is partly do to time marches on.... Gas is no longer 32 cents, a auto is no longer $3,000, etc., etc.

US national debt 1800-1925
Historical Text Archive: Electronic History Resources, online since 1990

US national debt 1929-2008
US National Debt 1929-2008


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## Tennjed (Oct 21, 2011)

Taking money out if the bank is the wrong move. Way too risky. The same people that back your bank backs your cash. The federal govt. what makes you think their backing if cash is any safer than them backing your bank? Same people.

Cash is not replaceable. Contact you insurance company and see if it would be insured against theft and fire. In the bank it is insured with the FDIC. If the govt fails to the point FDIC wouldn't cover you I doubt cash would be worth anything. Cash is only paper. What makes it valuable is the strength of the govt issuing it


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## 1jimmy (Jul 30, 2011)

your concerns are very real. however cash at home would not be the way to go for a host of different reasons some which are mentioned above. i would rely on the fact that your not the only ones in this situation and the majority of our so called leaders who control these happenings have just as much if not more to lose than you do. i am also retired with a state pension and face similar concerns as your wife does but i have come to the conclusioon riding out the current situation is better than making a drastic move.


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

Cait43 said:


> While there is some room for concern I don't believe one needs to withdraw monies and turn it into cash.. If our country went belly up I believe cash won't be of any value.........
> 
> What needs to be done is for both parties and the president need to stop finger pointing, whining, and throwing tantrums and vote to raise the debt limit now since they will raise it eventually... America has always had a debt..... Granted now its in the trillions but that is partly do to time marches on.... Gas is no longer 32 cents, a auto is no longer $3,000, etc., etc.
> 
> ...


I'm not understanding you're reasoning here? Oh, national and international debt at the present time shouldn't be a concern? It's all relevant? Time is just marching on? Let's just raise the debt ceiling every six months and print new money to pay debt and spend w/o cutting spending. The national government is in huge trouble as it stands. Our national debt and international debt has increased more under this Socialist President than all presidents combined. When Bush left office our national debt was $5,662,216,013,697, currently it's almost 17 trillion. Blame it on the GOP? Thank goodness someone had the balls to shut this bankrupt government down and attempt to cut the fat. The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much.


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## Ksgunner (Aug 17, 2013)

denner said:


> I'm not understanding you're reasoning here? Oh, national and international debt at the present time shouldn't be a concern? It's all relevant? Time is just marching on? Let's just raise the debt ceiling every six months and print new money to pay debt and spend w/o cutting spending. The national government is in huge trouble. Our national debt and international debt has increased more under this Socialist President than all presidents combined. When Bush left office our national debt was $5,662,216,013,697, currently it's almost 17 trillion. Blame it on the GOP? Thank goodness someone had the balls to shut this bankrupt government down and cut the fat.


My thoughts as well sir..


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

The larger question I have is this: Our Fed bank system is printing money like crazy and dumping it into the system. It's also buying Treasury bonds back ( supposedly) to offset the inflationary tendancy of just printing money and dropping it into the system. What I'm not seeing is why there is not huge inflationary pressure on the value of our currency. Despite what the Treasury is doing by flooding the system with more currency, which should tend to make the value of currency drop, the price of gold has dropped drastically on the world market over the past 6 months. This in and of itself tends to make me believe that currency and precious metals values are being rigged by a pool of very wealthy individuals or nations for their own political, social or individual goals. IT makes no sense to me with so much currency being dumped into our system that we aren't in the midst of a huge inflationary spiral. I guess the only reason much of it is not showing up in the economy in general is because only a small percentage of our population can be approved for borrowing under current fed underwriting standards. Most people's credit scores are not high enough to meet current bank (read fed regulator's) lending standards, thus most folks can't qualify to get mortgage financing to purchase homes. If the Fed eases up the underwriting requirements, watch out for the s*it to hit the fan then. Right now, I wouldn't hoard cash or take it out of a bank, i'd be buying gold and silver and holding that, because when inflation does hit, that's going to be far safer a medium to have on hand than cash will be.

and yes, I'm concerned about where our country is heading. Last I heard 49% of the US population is receiving some form of Federal benefit. Now part of that is Social Security so I don't think you can consider that a Federal Benefit, it's a payment in exchange for monies remitted over your working career. However, when the percentage of the population on the Federal benefit rolls gets high enough, most people will give up working and go on the dole also. And then, guess what? That is exactly why Communism failed in Russia. People eventually figure out that there's no sense in working and trying to do the right thing financially when the lazy sob right next to you on welfare has as much as you do and doesn't have to lift a finger to get it. Unfortunately, unless we can throw the libtards out of government, I fear eventually we will drown in our own social safety net.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

denner said:


> I'm not understanding you're reasoning here? Oh, national and international debt at the present time shouldn't be a concern? It's all relevant? Time is just marching on? Let's just raise the debt ceiling every six months and print new money to pay debt and spend w/o cutting spending. The national government is in huge trouble as it stands. Our national debt and international debt has increased more under this Socialist President than all presidents combined. When Bush left office our national debt was $5,662,216,013,697, currently it's almost 17 trillion. Blame it on the GOP? Thank goodness someone had the balls to shut this bankrupt government down and attempt to cut the fat. The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much.


I absolutely agree. This president and the Democrat Party are out to break this economy and turn us into the Soviet Union - a ruling elite, with everyone else being equal...equally poor, that is.

Cash is not the way to go, but all of the alternatives are iffy, too. Gold and silver are a little better, as they will always have a market value. However, they are so high that if we have a major crash, they will lose a great deal of value, but, they still won't be worthless, even if cash is. If I did buy some, I wouldn't think of it as investment, since you'll likely buy high and sell low, but maybe as a catastrophic insurance policy.


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## KampfJaeger (Sep 25, 2013)

Two books every American should be required to read in school: 
"An Inquiry into the Nature and Causes of the Wealth of Nations" (The Wealth of Nations), by Adam Smith (circa 1776), which has described and predicted every single financial event in free countries since it was published... 
"The Road to Serfdom", by Friedrich von Hayek (circa 1940), which has also been as accurate and prescient, though not for centuries as the former work has been

You can believe whatever new age/gobeldygook/junk economics you want to believe in that tickles your ears, but between those two books you cannot offer any proof that your theory is at all how human beings and markets behave, while these two simply reflect all of human history before and after their publication. 

In fact, many leftist economists understand and adhere to the very same principals, but they just actively seek the diametric opposite policies because they don't WANT prosperity and plenty. Or, rather they don't want it if it isn't distributed equally. The wealth and plenty that capitalism produces makes their own political ideology extremely unattractive to wealthy and poor alike. They want to destroy and eliminate wealth and redistribute it equally, because in their mind you did not earn any of it, but were rather unjustly given a portion of it that was not exactly like everyone else's. A detailed example of this can be read in "The Weight of the Poor: A Strategy to End Poverty", by Richard Cloward and Francis Fox Piven. Inciddently these are university professors who had a strong impact on one, young Barak Hussein Obama Jr. 

You are absolutely right to be very afraid, because according to both Smith and von Hayek what we are doing and how we are running the country can only end in total economic disaster. The currency will become worthless, trade will collapse, and the limited socialist policies of the government will become completely unsustainable (as if this wasn't plainly obvious already). I don't know what to tell you other than the very wealthy have been putting a lot of money into negotiable commodities that retain value, like gold, and the less wealthy have been buying ammunition at a truly astounding rate, almost as if they know something that all those brilliant rulers in DC don't. 

Getting financial advice on a chat room is about as useful as legal advice. I would tell you to go to a financial planner, and explain that you want a strategy that preserves what you have in the unlikely event that we experience hyperinflation (i.e. our dollars become of little value). I am sure you are not the first person to come to them wanting such an investment strategy. As part of your interview for the job I would definitely ask them if they have read the first two books, and ask their opinion of them, because this will tell you quite a bit about how they advise people. 

You will note, all of this neither means a socialist revolution (as Cloward/Piven predict, which is totally fanciful IMO), nor some sort of actual Mad Max style apocalypse. Mexico, Argentina, and a huge number of other countries have run their economies into ruin, instituted a new currency backed by more than “The Full Faith and Credit” (i.e. their currency has inherent value rather that perceived value), and come out of collapses fine. It’s been a long time for us, but we have too.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

I afraid, when push comes to shove and people can't find enough food to eat, ammunition will be more valuable than currency. To protect what you have, that is.


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## GUNMAN1947 (Jun 7, 2013)

denner said:


> I'm not understanding you're reasoning here? Oh, national and international debt at the present time shouldn't be a concern? It's all relevant? Time is just marching on? Let's just raise the debt ceiling every six months and print new money to pay debt and spend w/o cutting spending. The national government is in huge trouble as it stands. Our national debt and international debt has increased more under this Socialist President than all presidents combined. When Bush left office our national debt was $5,662,216,013,697, currently it's almost 17 trillion. Blame it on the GOP? Thank goodness someone had the balls to shut this bankrupt government down and attempt to cut the fat. The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much.


I totally agree with what you said, but I would like to qualify one thing. In 2007 the Democraps took over BOTH houses of congress with a majority. The spending went thru the roof from Jan. 2007 thru Dec. 2008 along with more fiddling with the housing so "poor people" could buy a house WITHOUT A JOB, ASSETS OR INCOME. I really hate the fact that Bush gets blamed for those last two years when the debt wasn't nearly as large at the end of 2006 !! The Dems simply attached their spending to bills Bush HAD to sign to fund the war and SS, etc.

Barack Obama was there voting for that spending and then blamed it on Bush when he ran for President !!

As for taking money out of the bank, if you really wish to do that convert it to SILVER COINS (junk silver) such as Mercury dimes. If you buy silver ingots they must be tested (assayed) each time they change hands. Coins are a known weight. Dimes are about one tenth of an ounce. Gold would have to be broken down to purchase things if our money became worthless. Silver dimes would be easier to use.

I bought my dimes before 2000 at under $2/ounce. Right now silver is around $22+/- an ounce. It had reached $43+/- a couple years ago and has been going up as of late.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

For the time being, we'll leave our savings in the bank. As far as a financial planner goes, I'm a bit leery, but I will give it some thought. 

We do have some gold and silver, but not so much that it makes a big difference in our financial standing.

In regards to copper and lead, we're good to go, and have been for many years. :mrgreen:


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

Approximately 48 million Americans(probably illegals aliens too) are currently on perpetual issuance of government food stamps.


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## BigCityChief (Jan 2, 2013)

Leave your money in the bank.


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## Holly (Oct 15, 2011)

I'm pretty terrified. All of our income is VA Disability and GI Bill... No money in the bank. :smt086 If there was, to answer your question, I'd leave it in the bank.


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## rustygun (Apr 8, 2013)

Cash is just printed paper if not backed by government.


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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Good old fashion dirt is your best investment, you can grow your own food and more to trade for what ever else you need. I don't trust the gov't but I do know how to survive off the land and that is what will make the difference. My grand father did it through the 1930s I figure I can do it if it comes again. Low tech will remain.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I talked to my wife about removing the majority of our savings from the bank. I explained to her what I had read on this forum and the replies I received. 

After explaining some things to her, we're now both on the same page. I just hope to hell that this once great nation of ours, gets it's shit together and we start taking back our nation and making sense of things once again. 

Pipe dream maybe?


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## goNYG (Apr 4, 2012)

I haven't read any of the response yet, so this might be repetitive. Here is my background: I run an investment partnership modeled on the one that Warren Buffett started in the 1950s and I give financial planning advice to a small group of modestly wealthy clients.

Here is my view: Money is safe in banks. You should have money spread in at least two banks of differing size (large and mid, or mid and small, or large and small). The problem is that money is "safe" but cash is going to lose value. We are in the beginning stages of inflation where prices are flat but portions and quality are down. Next up is outright prices increases. Holding your money in cash will mean you will have less purchasing power. You are somewhat OK, if your pension and SS are indexed to inflation but not thoroughly protected. Real actual inflation will exceed the CPI or other index by which they adjust your payments. Furthermore, government at all levels is broke (not _going_ broke, _is_ broke) and will attempt to lessen their burdens by reducing pension payments outright or eroding them by not allowing them to keep up with inflation. This will play out over the next 25 years, so you may not be too affected, since you are already retired. Keep your fingers crossed that your pension payments keep coming and keeping increasing - that is out of your control. (Investments is a whole other discussion, you're not there yet, BWIW people should be investing today to prepare for intense inflation, government bankruptcy, and attempted theft of assets by government, Argentina-style.) With your savings, cash in the mattress is the worst option in my view - it's not safe and its value will waste away. In a bank, it's safe and it wastes away less.

Hope that helps.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

goNYG said:


> I haven't read any of the response yet, so this might be repetitive. Here is my background: I run an investment partnership modeled on the one that Warren Buffett started in the 1950s and I give financial planning advice to a small group of modestly wealthy clients.
> 
> Here is my view: BWIW people should be investing today to prepare for intense inflation, government bankruptcy, and attempted theft of assets by government, Argentina-style.) With your savings, cash in the mattress is the worst option in my view - it's not safe and its value will waste away. In a bank, it's safe and it wastes away less.
> 
> Hope that helps.


You are a financial planner and you do actually see through all the government smoke and mirrors. Good for you. I believe that future government burden will be lessened by either restricting access to who can become eligible for benefits (politically unpopular) or by reducing benefit levels (hugely popular with the government because it makes the system solvent longer) and by government confiscation of your retirement assets, either through outright confiscation, or by imposition of means testing to determine eligibility for programs such as Social Security and Medicare. There is no other way to keep kicking the can down the road, and the Congress and President have continually shown how masterful they are at continuing to kick the can down the road. We should not fool ourselves into thinking that our system is immune from all the problems that have turned up in the social systems in Europe, it's just that we're a little further away from those problems because our country has not been as socialistic as the European countries like France and Spain and Greece have been for so long. We'll get there eventually, it's only a matter of time. There's only so much pie, and you can't make more to go around when more people show up at the table for a slice. Keeping cash in the bank, other than for security, is a waste of assets. Precious metals will go up along with inflation and are the most viable option, imo. Precious metals, ammo, and MRE's.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Once again, I do thank all of you for your replies and information. Our money will remain in the bank(s).


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