# Is this trade too lop-sided?



## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

I am the owner of (one of my guns) a Ruger SP101 - which I love. It may become my wife's gun, when her permit comes in. As I would want another .357 revolver, I am focused on the Ruger GP100. It so happens that a local gun store got in a used GP100 Match Champion version, which looked every bit of 'New'. It didn't look as if it had ever been fired. Cash is very limited, right now, so - after getting the call, on it - I packed up some guns, to see what kind of trade I could get.

One, was a S&W .38Spl SS (or Nickle) revolver, with Pachmar grips. The 2nd was another S&W .38Spl revolver (blued). And the 3rd was a blued, Junior Colt. 

That GP100 Match Champion was selling for $659, and they offered to take my three guns, with a remaining cash balance of $125. I know that some guns don't hold up in value, as good as some others, but I really thought that the three of these should have easily transacted into a clean trade on that GP100. 

I have more guns than I care to have, owing to the acquisitions from my father-in-law's estate, and surely don't need too many duplicate calibers residing in my safe. I am not a collector, and don't really want to be saddled with the hassle of selling, outright. At the same time, though, I don't want to be taken advantage of.

So, please share your thoughts on this matter.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

all depends on whether or not you are willing to pay $125 for the Ruger. You've already paid for the others so that money is gone, unless you wanted to try to buy the Ruger outright and sell the other three on Armslist or some way like that. If you don't need the cash right away, that might be the best way to go if you're willing to fool around with the time involved with responding to inquiries, etc. Also, I've listed a few on Armslist in the past always saying something to the effect of "CWP holder only" but always get inquiries from folks who say they are legitimate but don't have a CWP. Well in my state, that transfer is legal but it makes me wonder if the buyer is really someone who can purchase a handgun or is a prohibited buyer, and I don't much care to deal with someone I don't know who also does not have a CWP. I figure at least if they have that, they have been checked out by the FBI and state police as to their background. I'm kinda picky who I sell to since I don't want to end up having sold a gun to a criminal or straw buyer..


Take a look on GB and see what they are selling for now and price your own also. That should give you an idea of what the open market is doing for the guns involved in the deal.


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## CW (Mar 20, 2015)

S&W and Colts tend to have better value. I agree with RK.... check out Gunbroker and other online sales and see where the retail/re-sell prices are falling.

If your pistols are really nice I'd use 60-70% of those re-sell prices to figure out your wholesale then work from there.

You may do best selling them outright or on consignment through a trustworthy LGS.


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## wirenut (Dec 16, 2015)

IMO you need to check out other sites for prices, S&W and Colt hold their value quite well.
Not knowing your model numbers I have seen worn revolvers selling between $300 to $400.
Do a little homework, because you may get the firearm you want, but you also may leave a lot on the table.
Good Luck!!


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

RK3369 said:


> all depends on whether or not you are willing to pay $125 for the Ruger. You've already paid for the others so that money is gone, unless you wanted to try to buy the Ruger outright and sell the other three on Armslist or some way like that. If you don't need the cash right away, that might be the best way to go if you're willing to fool around with the time involved with responding to inquiries, etc. Also, I've listed a few on Armslist in the past always saying something to the effect of "CWP holder only" but always get inquiries from folks who say they are legitimate but don't have a CWP. Well in my state, that transfer is legal but it makes me wonder if the buyer is really someone who can purchase a handgun or is a prohibited buyer, and I don't much care to deal with someone I don't know who also does not have a CWP. I figure at least if they have that, they have been checked out by the FBI and state police as to their background. *I'm kinda picky who I sell to since I don't want to end up having sold a gun to a criminal or straw buyer..*
> 
> Take a look on GB and see what they are selling for now and price your own also. That should give you an idea of what the open market is doing for the guns involved in the deal.


Right on there brother! Me too. God forbid should it be used later on in a crime. It will come right back to the original purchaser. Not only that but who the hell would want that on their conscience? At least no one in their right mind. In some states you can sell to just about anybody as long as they are a legal resident of your home state. I see ads all the time for people selling guns. Some ask for a state ID usually a drivers license, some don't. I've seen a few requests for a "CWP". When selling privately that's about the only way you can be assured that the purchaser is not a prohibited possessor. It would also be wise to keep a record of who you sold the gun to.

For a purchaser they too should be wary of who they are purchasing from. What assurance do they have that the gun they are purchasing was not involved in a crime? As for me I've never bought a gun in a private sale. I'd much rather buy from a licensed gun dealer. I really don't give a shit about the extra cost. I'd rather have that piece of mind.

Most of this applies to handguns, rifles and shotguns are not so much of an issue as they are not used as often in the commission of a crime. But even then I'd want some assurance that the buyer is not a prohibited possessor.

Obviously someone could buy a vehicle from you, get drunk and go out and kill someone with it. Or the vehicle could be used to get to and from a crime. But you can be assured that the headaches wouldn't be the same. More than likely you will be sued if a gun you sold to a criminal was later on used in a crime. Whether you knew that the individual was a criminal or not you can count on being sued.

Same goes for individuals who leave guns laying around where unauthorized people can get ahold of them. Some of us can be our own worst enemies in that regard. Leaving them in unattended vehicles, in drawers around the house, under the bed etc. For Christ's sake if you are not carrying them they should be locked up. The handgun that you keep for self protection is not that hard to carry on your person there's no need to leave it anywhere but there. You can also count on being sued for not securing unattended firearms if a criminal easily got ahold of one such as being left in your vehicle in a Walmart's parking lot. Or God forbid a child finds one laying about the house.

I'm hoping that most people who own guns feel the same as we do with regard to selling and storing them? If not then we can be our own worst enemies. Any type of negligence on the part of lawful gun owners can only result in more restrictive legislation especially from politicians who are seeking to abolish the 2nd Amendment altogether. In some states they have been very successful in achieving that goal albeit incrementally.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Thanks to all who have responded.

The first replier mentioned (I think) as to how I should weigh the costs, of my guns, against what has been offered for trade in values. Well, I didn't pay for these guns I the sense that most purchasers paid for theirs. My father-in-law, (before his passing), and I, had a mutual agreement. In the event that something happened to me, before him, he would get my gun. With such a situation being reversed, I would get his guns. When he passed there was a total of eleven guns that he had, and certain members of his family didn't want me to get them. There was really nothing that they could, legally do - to prevent my obtaining them (I was the ONLY one with a permit), but it was determined that I should pay fair market value for them. I went to a gun store, for written valuation, and the worker (being sympathetic to my situation) low-balled that cost factor, for me. He wrote me a cost of $800 for the eleven guns, which (if my math serves me correct) amounted to about $73 per gun. So, it wasn't as if I paid a small fortune for them. Even so, though, I didn't want to partake in an insensible transaction of trade.

I did go to Gander Mountain, this evening, to get another estimation on the value on the three guns - and left there a bit shocked. They would offer $110 for the Junior Colt, and $100 (each) for both S$W revolvers. Just $310? That seemed such a joke. The other gun store were going to give me $550. 

Selling outright is not something that I m particularly keen on. New York State (where I live) is known for its very strict parameters, with gun buying/ownership is concerned. But not every state is held to such limiting, and difficult factors. Like some have mentioned, in this thread, there should always be concerns on the possibility of someone purchasing your gun, and using it in the commission of a crime. For that reason, alone, I refuse to sell the way that some people might choose to. 

So, I'm thinking that I just might make that deal - for the GP100 Match Champion, or wait for a nice, clean GP100 (with full lug) to show up (that Match Champion only sports a half lug, and it seems like some of the frame has been reduced; two things that I'm not liking, much). But it sure was a mighty sharp looking piece .

I want another magnum. My SP101 is super, but I may leave it to eat the .38+p ammo. The GP100? Well, that baby will have a steady diet of .357 rounds going through it.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

desertman said:


> I'm hoping that most people who own guns feel the same as we do with regard to selling and storing them? If not then we can be our own worst enemies. Any type of negligence on the part of lawful gun owners can only result in more restrictive legislation especially from politicians who are seeking to abolish the 2nd Amendment altogether. In some states they have been very successful in achieving that goal albeit incrementally.


Even though we can sell resident to resident, I'm not interested in that unless I know the person, or they have a CWP. Don't need the hassle and the related bad press if something turns out bad later.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

Keep the other guns. Heck, you got them for virtually nothing. Buy the Ruger outright. When your governor eventually bans handguns in your state, you might be glad you got them, as long as they aren't on your permit, which I bet they probably already are anyhow. Sorry about that. nY is the worst possible place you could own a handgun, imo.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

I'd need to know the models and more about the condition of each revolver before being sure (I'm not asking for that info, as you didn't offer it, and it might not make much difference in this discussion, anyway), but it sounds to me like dealers in your state are taking advantage of the strict laws to drive rather low-sounding trade-in values. It's hard to say for sure, and if EVERY dealer is doing the same thing, then it's probably more accurate to say that this is a "regional pricing variation", but *dang*.

I'd recommend counter-offering a straight-across trade (your guns for the Match Champion, if you are happy with that), and see what they say.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

NY dealers,are going to low ball every trade because it is very difficult to sell person to person. You need to go to the county sheriff, get the SN of each gun you are buying added to your permit before you can get the gun. They make it next to impossible because they don't want handgun ownership there. Result, dealers know it's a pita so they low ball everything figuring most individuals won't go to the bother.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

Well, you could always try to take them to another state and sell them to a dealer there. It's legal for any Federally-licensed (FFL) dealer to buy firearms from residents of other states (unless there is a state law prohibiting it; I'm not aware of any, but that doesn't mean there AREN'T any). Transport across state lines can be tricky (don't drive them through NJ, for instance), but transport laws are easily researched.

I used to do a bit of that here in eastern ND, as handguns always seemed to be priced higher in western MN. Even using different stores in the same store chain (Scheels), I could get a quote from the ND store, then drive across the river, and get a higher offer from the MN store. If I wanted to trade on a firearm at the ND store, the MN store would give me a store credit (worth more than a cash purchase) that I could use at ANY Scheels store. I did this quite regularly in the late 90s and 2000s, until Scheels opened a superstore in ND and dropped the firearms from their local MN store (which kept its FFL license so Minnesotans could buy guns at the big ND store, and then have them couriered across the river to the MN store for pick-up in their state of residence).

When you're trying to sell or trade-in locally, tell them if you can't very much for the guns there, you have relatives that have said they'll buy them through their local dealer, if you bring the guns with you when you drop-in to see them for the Holidays. If the local dealer thinks you have other options that don't involve a local private sale, maybe they'll offer a bit more on trade.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

I love the GP-100, but there is no way I'm trading two S&W's and a Colt for a new one, much less a used one, and pay $125 to boot. Of course, you didn't give details on what you have, but Colt and S&W have a higher resale than Rugers, as a rule, so that makes it sound like a bad deal, at first glance.

It is very rare to get a decent trade from a gun dealer. They have to low-ball the guns they take in trade, because they need a good profit on something that may sit on the shelf for a long time, but most of them take that to extremes. Don't lock in on the gun you want, and keep looking - there are plenty out there, and an LGS clerk can sniff out when somebody has 'got the fever,' just as surely as a used car dealer can. 

I would buy on layaway, without the trade-ins, before I would take an insulting offer on one of my Smiths or Colts.


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## hillman (Jul 27, 2014)

Since you have a CWP in NY, You might consider taking the guns to a dealer in VT next door. Dealers here have a much easier procedure for selling guns, for what that's worth.


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## Craigh (Jul 29, 2016)

Bisley said:


> I love the GP-100, but there is no way I'm trading two S&W's and a Colt for a new one, much less a used one, and pay $125 to boot.
> I would buy on layaway, without the trade-ins, before I would take an insulting offer on one of my Smiths or Colts.


I completely agree with my friend from East Texas on this. There is just no way I'd trade a couple of S&W's and a Colt revolver for a Ruger revolver, new or used; and to want extra cash on top of that, no way. Even without knowing the model numbers or condition of your two S&W's and Colt, it sounds like a bit of a ripoff to me, but that's just my opinion. In all fairness, maybe your three trade-ins are trashed, but I doubt it.

I wonder what they'd offer me on trade for my wonderful old S&W Model 19? :smt1099


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

I think the Colt Junior is a tiny .25 ACP pistol. They are not generally as revered or collected as most other Colt pistols, and really aren't worth all that much, unless it is mint-condition with the box and all accessories. If the .38s are something like well-worn police-trade Model 10s, then what they offered might be close to about the best he could expect for total trade-in value, in my experience.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

DJ Niner is right, of course, that circumstances could exist that would make this a decent trade. 

But from my vantage point, I am skeptical. Besides, I have a sweet Model 10 that I wouldn't swap for something of twice its value, so there is obviously some sentimentality involved in my opinion.


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## Blackhawkman (Apr 9, 2014)

TOO lop sided!? 3 guns in trade plus $125 cash! the sp101 is worth $200 at least? WALK away! jmho but you can sell your guns FTF and get more $$$$. Oh, can you do private sales in NY? Hmmm.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

RK3369 said:


> Keep the other guns. Heck, you got them for virtually nothing. Buy the Ruger outright. When your governor eventually bans handguns in your state, you might be glad you got them, as long as they aren't on your permit, which I bet they probably already are anyhow. Sorry about that. nY is the worst possible place you could own a handgun, imo.


Yes, they ARE already on my permit.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Blackhawkman said:


> TOO lop sided!? 3 guns in trade plus $125 cash! the sp101 is worth $200 at least? WALK away! jmho but you can sell your guns FTF and get more $$$$. Oh, can you do private sales in NY? Hmmm.


Oh no...the SP101 was, most certainly, NOT on my list for trading . That gun is a keeper, indeed. But I have decided to hop off of that 'magnum lust' wagon, for another gun. I WILL try to unload the two .25cal semi autos, and (quite possibly) hold on to the two .38spl revolvers. Since I want the GP100, I didn't see the need for keeping them, being that the SP101, and the GP100 can also fire .38's.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Bisley said:


> I love the GP-100, but there is no way I'm trading two S&W's and a Colt for a new one, much less a used one, and pay $125 to boot. Of course, you didn't give details on what you have, but Colt and S&W have a higher resale than Rugers, as a rule, so that makes it sound like a bad deal, at first glance.
> 
> It is very rare to get a decent trade from a gun dealer. They have to low-ball the guns they take in trade, because they need a good profit on something that may sit on the shelf for a long time, but most of them take that to extremes. Don't lock in on the gun you want, and keep looking - there are plenty out there, and an LGS clerk can sniff out when somebody has 'got the fever,' just as surely as a used car dealer can.
> 
> I would buy on layaway, without the trade-ins, before I would take an insulting offer on one of my Smiths or Colts.


Bisley, here is info on the guns I had offered for trade:

1). Junior Colt .25 semi auto Serial# 605XXX
2). S&W .38SP Revolver Serial# 25K9XXX (model 67-1)
3). S&W .38 Revolver Serial# C416XXX (model 10)

On the one revolver, there was no model number to be seen, and I had wondered if it might have been under the grip. But one of the gun shop employees took one look at it, and said that it was the model 10. I'll try to put up a picture of it, shortly.

But, as mentioned to another responder, I am not going through with that trade-in matter. I'll just hold off until such time as I've accumulated enough funds by which to buy a GP100, outright.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Any photos available,, I'm only in Rochester , ny,, my wife needs a carry piece,, the little 25 auto never did take off as far as value,,, but the condition like DJ NINER implied is very important. 

The ruger you should be able to find brand new at a cheaper price ,, you're not stuck wanting a matchtype..
You basically want the gp100,,,, what barrel length are you interested in. ? Blued or stainless ?


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

pic said:


> Any photos available,, I'm only in Rochester , ny,, my wife needs a carry piece,, the little 25 auto never did take off as far as value,,, but the condition like DJ NINER implied is very important.
> 
> The ruger you should be able to find brand new at a cheaper price ,, you're not stuck wanting a matchtype..
> You basically want the gp100,,,, what barrel length are you interested in. ? Blued or stainless ?


Wasn't able to take new pics, at this time, but you can see an earlier picture of this gun, along with three others that I recently got back, in a thread that I had previously started. The following link references that thread:
http://www.handgunforum.net/new-handguns-area/69802-four-guns-i-got-back.html

You are right in saying that I am not fixated on a Match Champion. I wouldn't mind having a Wiley Clapp SS GP100, with 3" barrel, but could suffice with a basic SS GP100/3" barrel.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

NLAlston said:


> Wasn't able to take new pics, at this time, but you can see an earlier picture of this gun, along with three others that I recently got back, in a thread that I had previously started. The following link references that thread:
> http://www.handgunforum.net/new-handguns-area/69802-four-guns-i-got-back.html
> 
> You are right in saying that I am not fixated on a Match Champion. I wouldn't mind having a Wiley Clapp SS GP100, with 3" barrel, but could suffice with a basic SS GP100/3" barrel.


Seen a nice Wiley Clapp on buds 5rounds,,,but I do realize pulling money out of your pocket is not the plan...either wait a little longer for a new piece that makes you happy,,
p
i would sell the smith revolver outright and or substitute the llama 45 (junk) on this current trade on the used match ruger.
Gun interest sometimes shifts quickly, you may want something else next week, lol. Catch your breath..
The only real value I see in your trade ins ,,is the smith revolver,, the llama 45 is crap, no insult intended. I have A llama 1911 9 mm UNFIRED with box and all original paperwork ,, the METAL is soft and the slide doesn't want to rack back everytime,,,lol.

if you really want the used ruger match, throw in the llama 45


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## Craigh (Jul 29, 2016)

*Model 67-1 Combat Masterpiece?*



NLAlston said:


> Bisley, here is info on the guns I had offered for trade:
> 2). S&W .38SP Revolver Serial# 25K9XXX (model 67-1)


If that Model 67-1 Combat Masterpiece is not a too beat up police trade-in, I'd maybe be a player for it, again, depending on the condition. I have no idea as to its worth because I don't follow such things, but if it's what I think it is and in excellent condition, I'd not trade it even for a used Ruger GP100. In fact, if it were like brand new looking, I'd not trade it for a new Ruger, but that's purely me and my opinion.

I almost wish I could afford to make you an offer right now. i have a long time love affair for K-Frame Smith and Wesson revolvers. I still have a pair of Model 65s, an excellent Model 19 and a couple of others here and there I've not distributed to family yet.

Unfortunately, your pictures of those four guns didn't seem to include this one, and in my humble opinion, it's the best of the batch by a fair margin.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

pic said:


> Seen a nice Wiley Clapp on buds 5rounds,,,but I do realize pulling money out of your pocket is not the plan...either wait a little longer for a new piece that makes you happy,,
> p
> i would sell the smith revolver outright and or substitute the llama 45 (junk) on this current trade on the used match ruger.
> Gun interest sometimes shifts quickly, you may want something else next week, lol. Catch your breath..
> ...


Pic...you make total sense. In fact, I had decided to cool down, a bit, and consider matters more sensibly. When it comes to hand guns I am like a little kid in a toy store . I just love them, but only interest myself in those firearms which would serve a practical purpose, for me. I truly enjoy firing off rounds, at the range, but (outside of my Ruger MKII) don't really care for guns that wouldn't be considered worthy enough for defensive concerns.

Ive decided to keep my S&W .38SP (model 67-1) revolver, and just (today) found a prospective buyer for my Llama .45. He says that he, also, wants me to hold on to the S&W .38 (model 10) revolver, for him. As mentioned before, I am not keen on selling guns to private parties, but I know this guy very well. He is licensed, and just a very sensible, and level-headed person. After I unload the two .25acp semi-autos, and the Jennings 22, I will be left only with calibered-strength guns which would be good enough for defensive concerns.

I'll get myself a nice GP100, one day. But, for now, I can be happy with the guns that I have, thus far, been blessed with.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Craigh said:


> If that Model 67-1 Combat Masterpiece is not a too beat up police trade-in, I'd maybe be a player for it, again, depending on the condition. I have no idea as to its worth because I don't follow such things, but if it's what I think it is and in excellent condition, I'd not trade it even for a used Ruger GP100. In fact, if it were like brand new looking, I'd not trade it for a new Ruger, but that's purely me and my opinion.


Thanks Craigh.

I had decided to hold on to the 67-1. When I went to the gun store, the other day, the owner shot down the trade-in offer that one of his workers had given me, a few days before that. His opinion was that no one wanted a .38 with a 4" barrel (which is what both of my .38 revolvers sported). He went on to say that anyone interested in a 4" barreled revolver would want it in the caliber of .357. I felt that he was attempting to 'snow' me, so I thanked him for his time, packed up my guns and left. I KNOW that my guns (at least the revolvers) had more worth than what he cared to admit to. Yes, I knew that he (as with anyone, in his position) would low-ball me, somewhat. But, his explanation was flat out ridiculous (to me, anyway).

The condition of my 67-1 is not one of excellence. I mean, it doesn't look like it was beat up, but it does show signs of holstering activity. I'm going to see what I can do (if anything) to at least reduce those superficial signs of wear.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

NLAlston said:


> (snip)
> 
> The condition of my 67-1 is not one of excellence. I mean, it doesn't look like it was beat up, but it does show signs of holstering activity. I'm going to see what I can do (if anything) to at least reduce those superficial signs of wear.


Read through this thread over at a S&W-centric site. Lots of good info here:

How to polish stainless WITHOUT losing matte finish?


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

DJ Niner said:


> Read through this thread over at a S&W-centric site. Lots of good info here:
> 
> How to polish stainless WITHOUT losing matte finish?


DJ, Thank you SO MUCH.

Really great information provided, there, and I can't wait to see what the end result will be for my 67-1.


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## Craigh (Jul 29, 2016)

NLAlston said:


> DJ, Thank you SO MUCH.
> 
> Really great information provided, there, and I can't wait to see what the end result will be for my 67-1.


Hey, my friend. I'm glad you're keeping that Combat Masterpiece and a little envious. One thing to consider. The Model 67 Smiths are starting to become a little bit collectible, at least so it seems to me. Be careful of how much scrubbing and fixing up you do to it. With some collectibles like books, fixing a worn or broken spine can increase its value. With guns, it often hurts the value. If it were mine, I'd clean it up as a shooter, but just wanted you to be aware in case you wanted an heirloom to hand down over the generations. Again, a lot depends on the condition. Just make this part of your considerations. 

Take care and make it an adventure.


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## NLAlston (Nov 15, 2011)

Craigh said:


> Hey, my friend. I'm glad you're keeping that Combat Masterpiece and a little envious. One thing to consider. The Model 67 Smiths are starting to become a little bit collectible, at least so it seems to me. Be careful of how much scrubbing and fixing up you do to it. With some collectibles like books, fixing a worn or broken spine can increase its value. With guns, it often hurts the value. If it were mine, I'd clean it up as a shooter, but just wanted you to be aware in case you wanted an heirloom to hand down over the generations. Again, a lot depends on the condition. Just make this part of your considerations.
> 
> Take care and make it an adventure.


Thanks, Craigh.

As I've not done anything of this order, before, I believe that I will try it on another one of my guns, first. My father-in-law's favorite carry piece was his CZ-75 9mm clone (Tangfoglio Fratelli). It is a beefy, stainless steel model, which also sports some signs of superficial marring. I will try to clean that one up, as best I can, and see how I make out - before I might move on to my 67-1. I am not 'collectable' minded, at this point, but we've all adopted new mindsets, at some point, or another, in our lives. Right now, though, I just look upon all my guns as 'shooters' .

Ill keep you posted on how things fare, for me.


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