# AR before Clinton???



## JeffWard (Aug 24, 2007)

Need some help guys... I'm considering buying a black rifle... first one... before the Clinton Regime makes it nearly impossible.

I want a reliable gun I will own for 20yrs+.
I want to keep the $ reasonable... but I'm willing to pay some for quality.

I will be using it MOSTLY for target shooting, with a defense and/or hunting application. Does not have to be 20" long... I own an 870...

I'm looking hardest at .223 for cost of ammo??? Am I right?

I'm a non-noobie handgun owner, but a rank amateur when it comes to AR clones. Point my head!

1) What brands are established?
2) Price ranges?
3) Must-have add-ons (optics)?
4) Colapsable or fixed? (I'm in FL where we can own full-auto/suppressed if we want)
5) I like toys... so I want to add fun stuff later (lights, lasers, grenade launchers... etc.)

JeffWard


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

JeffWard said:


> I want a reliable gun I will own for 20yrs+.
> I want to keep the $ reasonable... but I'm willing to pay some for quality.


As with most things, you get what you pay for. The Colt M4s my unit uses have been simply excellent, but they aren't cheap. That said, I was VERY happy with my Stag M4gery. I sold it for reasons unrelated to its quality/reliability.



> I will be using it MOSTLY for target shooting, with a defense and/or hunting application. Does not have to be 20" long... I own an 870...


For defense, 16" is the best, and it will also work okay for three-gun. For varmints, I'd choose a 24" heavy barrel. For formal CMP/NRA type stuff, the 20" is required. A 20" H-BAR might be the best compromise if you'll only have one upper.



> 1) What brands are established?


Tons. There are several tiers of ARs, though the lines get blurry. Colt and LMT are top tier examples. One notch down might be Bushmaster, Armalite, Stag, and S&W. In the lower tier are DPMS and Olympic.

There are over a dozen AR makers, and even some of the lower tier guns can give good service. I used to own a DPMS that ran perfectly, for example.



> 2) Price ranges?


You can build one yourself for $600 or so, according to the internet. Few guns built by amateurs seem to run perfectly under hard use, at least in my experience. But some do.

As in pistols, you can go all the way up to semi-custom stuff like Baers and Wilsons, for over $2000. Colts are around $1500, I think. The Stag runs around $800.



> 3) Must-have add-ons (optics)?


"Must have?" A sling and a bunch of magazines. That's all.

But it's really mission-specific. A hunting gun calls for optics different from a fighting rifle. I know more about fighting rifles than hunting guns, so I'll just say that for defense, I'd want a red dot sight like an Aimpoint or EOTech.



> 4) Colapsable or fixed? (I'm in FL where we can own full-auto/suppressed if we want)


I like the collapsible because it can be adjusted for shooters of varying size, different clothes, body armor, etc. I actually collapse the stock completely when shooting from the squared-up fighting stance. However, it is not as stiff as a solid stock, and hence slightly more difficult to shoot at distance.



> 5) I like toys... so I want to add fun stuff later (lights, lasers, grenade launchers... etc.)


You'll need a railed forend. There are many good ones. I have experience with the KAC and Surefire. The KAC is super robust.


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## JeffWard (Aug 24, 2007)

Mike,
As usual... excellent response/info.

I'm printing this out!

Thanks,
Jeff


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## Snowman (Jan 2, 2007)

JeffWard said:


> ...I'm considering buying a black rifle... first one... before the Clinton Regime makes it nearly impossible.


I had this exact thought no more than an hour ago while watching the news. I think I'll check 'em out at the next gun show.


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