# Can Dry Firing Break a Firing Pin?



## 569JRB (Nov 6, 2013)

My bad.... I was watching TV and on commercials I was practicing my aim and dry firing my model 950, .25 cal. After a few firings, I heard something hit the wall about 6 or 8 feet away. Walked over and picked up a small piece of what looks like the end of the firing pin (approx. 1/8" long & 1/16" diameter, with a clean metal shear on the non-rounded end). I'll try and get a closer look after I figure out how to take the slide off (having never taken this gun apart, it's not entirely clear to me right now how the slide comes off). So I have a couple of questions: (1) In general, should guns (modern or not), not be dry fired? (2) Has anybody heard of this happening before? (3) Would this possibly be a Warranty item? Thanks for any guidance -


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## kidcom (Oct 17, 2012)

569JRB said:


> My bad.... I was watching TV and on commercials I was practicing my aim and dry firing my model 950, .25 cal. After a few firings, I heard something hit the wall about 6 or 8 feet away. Walked over and picked up a small piece of what looks like the end of the firing pin (approx. 1/8" long & 1/16" diameter, with a clean metal shear on the non-rounded end). I'll try and get a closer look after I figure out how to take the slide off (having never taken this gun apart, it's not entirely clear to me right now how the slide comes off). So I have a couple of questions: (1) In general, should guns (modern or not), not be dry fired? (2) Has anybody heard of this happening before? (3) Would this possibly be a Warranty item? Thanks for any guidance -


It's my understanding that most (not all) center fire pistols can be dry fired. It's a definite no no for rim fire pistols (22lr) as you can easily damage the firing pin. Glock for example, states plainly in the users guide that dry firing their pistols is OK as a method for testing and practicing.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

I believe that you've broken your firing pin.

Some centerfire pistols should not be dry fired without a snap-cap in the chamber.
I advocate _always_ using snap-caps, since they are very cheap insurance. (Six of them cost less than one new firing pin.)

It may be a warranty item: it wouldn't hurt to ask.
The firing pin may have been heat-treated to greater hardness than normal. It crystallized, and it shattered.


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## 569JRB (Nov 6, 2013)

Thanks guys; I just took the slide off (even with it still in place and tipping the barrel), I can see (and feel) that the end of where the firing pin should protrude out and strike the cartridge does not poke out after pulling the trigger. I'll contact Beretta and see what they say (I'll post my results). Thanks again -


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## denner (Jun 3, 2011)

You just proved it. I'd follow Steve's advice.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

kidcom said:


> It's my understanding that most (not all) center fire pistols can be dry fired. It's a definite no no for rim fire pistols (22lr) as you can easily damage the firing pin. Glock for example, states plainly in the users guide that dry firing their pistols is OK as a method for testing and practicing.


Glock, GmbH/Inc. reversed their position on dry firing their pistols almost two years ago, now. The factory does NOT recommend dry firing a Glock pistol, anymore. (Which in light of the fact that Glock has been dickering around with MIM strikers, of late, makes a whole lot of sense!)

NOTE: Back in 2003 when I purchased my first Glock an extra striker cost $15.00. Today, a striker costs more than $50.00; and the steel doesn't appear to be anywhere near as hard as it used to be.


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## Bhoffman (Nov 10, 2013)

From a safety and a wear and tear standpoint, I don't think dry firing a weapon is ever a good practice, except with "Snap Caps".

How many times have we read/heard about an unintentional/negligent discharge where someone said they were just "dry firing" their weapon?

As You have learned, the hard way, dry firing a center fire weapon can break the firing pin.

Dry firing a rimfire weapon can damage the chamber, firing pin stricking the chamber where the rim seats, and/or damaging the firing pin.

Better safe than sorry.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

I'm sure that it's just me, but I've never found the need to dry fire any firearm. 

Yes, I know some say that you can w/o any issues, and some say that you should as a way to become familiar with the firearm. 

I just go to the range and shoot it. Enough said.............:watching:


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## OGCJason (Nov 4, 2013)

A six pack of practically any caliber snap caps is like $15. Why dry fire machined parts against one another needlessly?


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

No offense intended. I just bought two brand new Glocks a G30 Gen3 and a G26 Gen 4 about 3 months ago, and in order to dis-assemble the pistol it is necessary to dry fire the pistol, before removing the slide. I haven't read anywhere in my owners manual where it said that it was not safe to do so, or to use a snap cap for this procedure?


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

But that's only one dry-fire, probably less often than once-a-day.

Dry-fire practice involves at least 10 minutes straight of frequently-repeated dry firing.
That's quite a different animal.


Also: Some people are not particularly comfortable with the need to "fire" a Glock, in order to field-strip it.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

desertman said:


> No offense intended. I just bought two brand new Glocks a G30 Gen3 and a G26 Gen 4 about 3 months ago, and in order to dis-assemble the pistol it is necessary to dry fire the pistol, before removing the slide. I haven't read anywhere in my owners manual where it said that it was not safe to do so, or to use a snap cap for this procedure?


This topic has been discussed ad nauseam over the past two years on Glock Talk. Naturally some respondents have taken the time to call Glock Tech Support in order to ask. All of them were told that Glock, GmbH/Inc. doesn't want owners to dry fire their Glock pistols, anymore. This factory announcement originally came out as an addendum to the Armorer's Manual; and was, first, posted on Glock Talk as, 'a factory announcement'.

As Steve has already pointed out: Pulling the trigger on an empty chamber in order to dismantle a Glock is NOT considered to be, 'dry firing' Me, personally? I've been using A-Zoom, Tipton, and Pachmayr snap caps in ALL of my pistols for the past 30 or 40 years! In fact, as far back as I can remember, I've never dry fired any weapon without using snap caps.

(I was sick, today; so I stayed home; and, right now, I've got A-Zoom caps all over my desk as I type! Gee, I wonder what I might have been doing!) :mrgreen:

NOTE: Always make certain that you: (1) Drop the magazine, and (2) repeatedly check the chamber BEFORE you pull the trigger in preparation for disassembly. I know three people who failed to check their chambers before pulling the trigger; one of them is, now, dead; the fellow who shot him had his own life ruined; and the third guy had the stupidity to point his Model G-19 at me as he went to pull the trigger; and ....... I nearly broke his wrist as I deflected the muzzle away from my body, and disarmed him. (There WAS a live round in the chamber, too!)

That day was a shame for the both of us because I was unable to forgive him for his reckless stupidity; and a close ten year friendship suddenly came to an abrupt end. He still calls occasionally, or walks across the street in order to say, 'Hello'; but, something deep inside me just doesn't want to know him, anymore. (In some 50 odd years of using and being around firearms this is as close as I've ever come to, 'checking out early'; and the event happened with a guy I emphatically trusted to never do me any harm - Which just goes to show you that: IT ONLY TAKES ONE MISTAKE, JUST ONE!)


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

Thanks for the input! I too have always used snap caps, but mainly to function test after re-assembly after field stripping or after performing any work on a particular firearm. I was kind of under the impression that the firing pins on Glock pistols might be inherently weak. I usually clean my guns every week to get rid of the dirt and lint accumulation that comes from daily carry. I also have a Kahr MK40 and Kimber Solo Carry, both are striker fired pistols and also require you to "dry fire" on an empty chamber in order to remove the slide.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

desertman said:


> ....... I was kind of under the impression that the firing pins on Glock pistols might be inherently weak. I usually clean my guns every week to get rid of the dirt and lint accumulation that comes from daily carry. .......


I have no way of proving this; so it's just my opinion; but I think you're, probably, correct. It's been, what, something like a year and a half, now, since Glock, GmbH/Inc. stopped the progressively abbreviated Tenifer process they were originally using. (Way back when Glock used to do a full blown multi-step Tenifer process on their pistols; but, little by little, the heating and cooling processes were shortened; and, consequently, the final manganese-phosphate/polymer oil coating, also, had to be changed.)

Tenifer treatment was a large part of the time needed and the cost necessary to produce a Glock; and I'm not surprised the factory first abbreviated it; and, then, finally eliminated Tenfer treatment, altogether. With Glock anything it's always difficult to know for certain; but it appears that, of late, Glock has been dickering around with untreated much softer steel internal parts, along with more MIM components than I know I'd ever want to see in a gun.

There have been internet reports that one of these new MIM parts is Glock strikers; and, yes, peculiar striker tip damage has been reported. My own conclusion is (1) to scrupulously avoid dry firing any Glock, but, in particular all of the current Gen4's; and (2) to stop drinking, 'internet Kool-Aid' and stop buying new Glocks. (I'd love to have a, 'new' 3rd generation G-19; but the serial number would have to start with the letter, 'L' or below.)


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hmmm...
Just had a thought:
To field-strip a Glock, you need to pull its trigger and let its firing pin slam forward into nothing. That can damage the firing pin.
So, why not clear the Glock completely, and then _place a snap-cap in its chamber_, and only then pull the trigger?
Leave the snap cap in place, and strip the slide/barrel/spring off while it's still there in the chamber.
Finally, when you separate barrel from slide, the snap cap should just slide out of the chamber.

Glock owners: Will this work?


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Hmmm...
> Just had a thought:
> To field-strip a Glock, you need to pull its trigger and let its firing pin slam forward into nothing. That can damage the firing pin.
> So, why not clear the Glock completely, and then _place a snap-cap in its chamber_, and only then pull the trigger?
> ...


Are you suggesting that *GLOCKS* are supposed to be cleaned? :smt107


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Hmmm...
> Just had a thought: To field-strip a Glock, you need to pull its trigger and let its firing pin slam forward into nothing. That can damage the firing pin. So, why not clear the Glock completely, and then _place a snap-cap in its chamber_, and only then pull the trigger? Leave the snap cap in place, and strip the slide/barrel/spring off while it's still there in the chamber. Finally, when you separate barrel from slide, the snap cap should just slide out of the chamber.
> 
> Glock owners: Will this work?


Steve, your question is, something of, 'a can of worms'. If the pistol is empty and you have either: (1) an empty, or a spare, magazine to work with, or (2) know how to correctly lower the slide on a chambered round WITHOUT stressing the extractor claw then, yes, this would work.

There ARE potential problems, though. For instance: If you want to store your Glock loaded, but with a relaxed trigger spring, (trigger to the rear with benefit of a snap cap in the chamber) then depending upon which particular Glock model you use, or what particular type of cartridge you have in your Glock, this may or may not work. 'Why' is a very good question! For more than a decade, now, I have repeatedly advised other Glock owners NOT to load and carry their Glock pistols with a full magazine + an additional round in the chamber; but, I think, rather sadly nobody ever seems to listen.

My fired round count through Glock pistols is way up there - Like over 40 or 50 thousand rounds; (and this is just with my Glocks)! The salient point is that the only stoppages I've ever had with a Glock in my hands ALL OCCURRED when my pistol was loaded to full magazine capacity + 1; (but, like I said, nobody ever listens). For self-defense use people can get themselves killed with + 1 pistol loading; and this is especially true WITH A LOOSELY FITTED SLIDE-TO-FRAME ASSEMBLY LIKE THE GLOCK DESIGN.

What happens? First like all things, 'Glock', nothing is consistent. What is true of one generation is not true of another. What is true for one model is not necessarily true for another model. 9mm Glocks, however, always seem to work the best; and 3rd generation Glocks the best of all. It doesn't matter what cartridge I'm using; I can + 1 load my 3rd gen Model 19 all day long and never have the slide hang up. On the other hand, if I try to + 1 load one of my 3rd gen G-21's two things are liable to happen:

(1) Unless you have the hand strength of a gorilla it becomes next to impossible to manually rack the slide; consequently, forget about using a snap cap and a relaxed trigger over a full magazine. Why? Because that + 1 cartridge has a strong tendency to go into, 'rim lock' with the mouth of the top cartridge in a fully loaded magazine.

(2) The exact same thing will happen (or tend to happen) with a fired cartridge case as it begins to extract from the chamber - Voila, suddenly you've got a Type II, 'failure-to-extract'! If you don't fully load your magazines and then add an additional, '+1' chambered round YOU WILL NOT HAVE TO WORRY about being able to manually rack the slide, or have an extracting case lock onto the rim of a fully loaded magazine's top round - It's that simple!

NOTE: In light of my experience do I trust +1 loading a 9mm Glock pistol? No, I do not. Why? Because I know that shorter JHP bullets, also, have a tendency to, 'rim lock'; so, why push my luck? Even though I've never jammed a 9mm Glock, +1 loading is NOT a habit I would want to get into, and especially not for EDC use.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

Glock Doctor:
Great advice regarding +1 loading. I've never loaded mine to capacity as the spring is fully compressed and it can be quite difficult squeezing that last round in, an indication that something is bound to fail. It's a shame that gun manufacturers are beginning to cut corners with new firearms and in many cases you are better off buying used. I bought a used Berretta 92FS Inox which has all metal parts and compared it to the new ones, which have plastic triggers, guide rods, and slide safety assemblies. I was also disappointed that on two new S&W revolvers that I bought, they have plastic spring swivels which tend to get chewed up while placing a pin in the hammer strut in order to remove the hammer, I mean it's only a half of a sphere that's about 3/16ths in diameter with a hole in the center? I have quite a few handguns, and know how to completely dis-assemble them all and have, but never owned or even considered owning a Glock until recently, it took me a while to "warm up" to "tupperware" guns, but now I love 'em (Glocks) and learning about their intricacies and manufacturing processes. Owning and working on guns and antique cars are my obsession and are somewhat related especially when it comes to machining and metallurgy and find these subjects quite interesting.


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## olroy (Aug 29, 2013)

> Great advice regarding +1 loading.


Agreed! Took the "+1" out of my G23 as soon as I read this! However, I carried my BHP 13+1 for over 25 years with no issues at all, as did many of my fellow cops on my PD. But the BHP is a whole different ball game!


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

olroy said:


> Agreed! Took the "+1" out of my G23 as soon as I read this! However, I carried my BHP 13+1 for over 25 years with no issues at all, as did many of my fellow cops on my PD. But the BHP is a whole different ball game!


Wow! Aren't you the clever fellow! :smt002

I agree with what you've said; and I think the reason, 'Why' you've had no trouble with your BHP and +1 loading is because a Browning Hi-Power's barrel tilts only slightly during recoil and there's very little mechanical slop between the frame and the slide - NONE of which is true of the Glock design.


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