# My Top 6 Lists by AUTO Handgun category for 380Auto and 9mm handguns



## cclaxton

I have been considering the purchase of more handguns and decided to put them in a spreadsheet so I could rank them. This is the result of my research. Revolvers don't interest me so I don't research them.

This is a personal opinion and based on my preferences for DA/SA and DA Only, although Strikers are included. I admit to a prejudice against SAO auto firearms, and although I considered and ranked some of them, none made it into the top six lists. I have not shot all these guns, but have picked them up at the gun shows and inspected them and read a lot of comments on forums and talked to people at the ranges.

The primary selection criteria were gun weight and length, but other criteria were included based on my own experience and reports from those who have shot these firearms and research I have done. For instance, sometimes accuracy and handling would overrule the weight and size, when the margins are close. Those with *asterisks* are guns I own. Cost was considered, but not a primary factor. Those with #Poundsigns# are ones I have shot by rental or friends letting me try them.

I don't want to upset any manufacturer reps, so take this as just my own personal assessment and not very scientific, and somewhat biased.

*380 Pocket Pistols*
S&W Bodyguard 380* 
Ruger LCP (380)#
Kel-Tec P3-AT
Kahr P380
Seecamp LWS 380
Micro Desert Eagle#

*380 Concealed Carry Pistols*
Walther PPK 380#
Bersa Thunder380CC*
Taurus Millenium Pro
Walther PK380
Glock 28 (380)#
SigSauer P232

*9mm Pocket Carry*
Kahr PM9*/CM9
SigSauer P290
Kel-Tec PF-11#
SCCY Gen-2 9mm
Kimber Solo
(No sixth place)

*9mm Concealed Carry*
Cz 2075 RAMI P 9mm#
Ruger LC9
Walther PPS#
Kel-Tec PF-9
SigSauer P250 SubCompact#
Beretta PX4 Subcompact

*9mm Range and Home Pistol*
FN Hernstal FNX-9*
Walther P99Full
Beretta PX4 Compact#
Cz SP01 Phantom
Cz P07 9mm#
SigSauer P20229


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## Packard

Pocket carry: S & W 340PD, .357 magnum, @ 11.4 ounces.

Its lighter and more powerful than any of the 9mm suggestions--almost as light as the .380s


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## recoilguy

Interesting.........weight and length are some of my normal criteria but not the main criteria for me so i can't relate.

handguns are such personal things your lists of 6 contain maybe 2 on each I would put on mine. They all contain 2 or 3 I would not even consider too. 

Good luck if you do decide to get a new gun.

RCG


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## TedDeBearFrmHell

weight and length are not an issue for me as well.... i am a big guy and i usually carry my p6 open or concealed, but i have no problem carrying my pt92 or pt100 concealed either....


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## denner

Hard to say, I'm a Beretta fan, so I only own Beretta's. I have PX4 Compact 15+1, and PX4 Subcompact 13+1 flush mags, both 9mm. Both excellent carry firearms with more than ample fire power with one flush mag. I haven't shot or carried the other pistols on your list so I have nothing to compare them with. However, I'd like to give them a try.


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## Cat

Yep-Denner the BG380 is the very best one. Funny I just showing my bg off to my neighbors to day. Put it in your pock it. And a small pock it to. And you can not tell their is a pistol there.

For a small pistol, And the way it is set up. Very nice pistol. 

And for 9mm, Go to .40 cal and drop the 9mm. Same size pistol,And more kick with a .40cal. I love my size of my g27 holds 8+1. This is my Concealed pistol, Using Hornady Critical Defense ammunition is the pinnacle in self defense ammunition.
And won all the nra testing.FTX are bad boys. And I did my own testing at my gun club. So at gateway pistol and rifle club here in Jacksonville Fla. Me and the rangers did a lot of testing with the FTX.

They do what they say they do,And more.Just like go in heavy clothing, And not turning in to a FMJ. Like most do with heavy clothing on. For me,I love The FTX'S


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## Shipwreck

denner said:


> Hard to say, I'm a Beretta fan, so I only own Beretta's. I have PX4 Compact 15+1, and PX4 Subcompact 13+1 flush mags, both 9mm. Both excellent carry firearms with more than ample fire power with one flush mag. I haven't shot or carried the other pistols on your list so I have nothing to compare them with. However, I'd like to give them a try.


U da man!

I have 9 Berettas... eight 92 variants and one PX4 fullsize. 3/4 of my handgun collection are Berettas.

For pocket carry 9mm, however - the Kahr PM9 is probably the best.

But, I rarely use mine. I carry a Beretta 92 or 92 compact everyday for my concealed carry.


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## hideit

why the S&W bodyguard 380 - just don't understand that one
why the PPK - i thought the trigger pull was too hard compared to others and bigger


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## cclaxton

hideit said:


> why the S&W bodyguard 380 - just don't understand that one
> why the PPK - i thought the trigger pull was too hard compared to others and bigger


on the 380BG: The integrated laser, very accurate, can handle almost any ammo, is small and easily concealable. 
My nephew says he thinks the LCP with Crimson Laser is the best because the laser comes on automatically. And he might be right. I have listed the analysis I did recently for my favorite lists:

Here is my complete list ranked in priority:
380 Pocket Pistols
S&W Bodyguard 380
Ruger LCP (380)
Kel-Tec P3-AT
Kahr P380
Seecamp LWS 380
Micro Desert Eagle
SigSauer P238
Taurus TCP 380
NAA Guardian
Diamondback DB380

The PPK just has the best finish and feel and is an elegant weapon. It is accurate, low recoil, DA/SA, and good SA trigger
Here is the list of runners-up. I own a Bersa 380CC, which has a better trigger, but not as nice a finish..nickle coated. I almost rated it the top.

380 Concealed Carry Pistols
Walther PPK 380
Bersa Thunder380CC
Taurus Millenium Pro
Walther PK380
Glock 28 (380)
SigSauer P232
Bersa Thunder 380 or Plus
Browning BDA
Llama Micromax
Beretta 85F
HK Compact
Cz 82/83

Your thoughts?


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## Packard

cclaxton said:


> ...The PPK just has the best finish and feel and is an elegant weapon. It is accurate, low recoil, DA/SA, and good SA trigger...


Better than average sights and a longish sight radius. Good ergonomics and an 80 year history of reliability and durability.

It is my first choice for someone with recoil aversion. Compact and flat enough to conceal on the belt or in a purse.

Mine was stainless steel and it is my recommendation that any buyer choose stainless steel too.


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## Steve M1911A1

What's wrong with the Walther PP, PPK, and PPKS:
• The DA trigger action is absolutely horrible: long, hard; indistinct break.
• The SA trigger action is pretty bad as well: hard; mushy.
• The safety is in the wrong place, and it drops the pistol's hammer, which always puts you back in DA mode.
• The magazine release button is in the wrong place, which decreases your leverage on it.
• Straight-blowback pistols need strong recoil springs, making it difficult for some people (particularly women) to rack the slide.
But they are beautifully made.


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## group17

Steve M1911A1 said:


> What's wrong with the Walther PP, PPK, and PPKS:
> • The DA trigger action is absolutely horrible: long, hard; indistinct break.
> • The SA trigger action is pretty bad as well: hard; mushy.
> • The safety is in the wrong place, and it drops the pistol's hammer, which always puts you back in DA mode.
> • The magazine release button is in the wrong place, which decreases your leverage on it.
> • Straight-blowback pistols need strong recoil springs, making it difficult for some people (particularly women) to rack the slide.
> But they are beautifully made.


Thats why I have one of these. Astra A-60/380
• Looks like a PPK clone
• Double stack
• Ambi controls
• Nicer trigger
• Magazine release button in right place and can be put in lefty.
• Costs less
Bad:
• Not made anymore
• Parts and mags hard to find


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## dondavis3

I use a Ruger LC9 for pocket carry.










But usually carry on my hip.

Usually a Sig P239 in 9mm










I sometimes carry on my hip a Kimber .45 or other larger guns.

:smt1099


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## 1jimmy

i had a bodyguard 380 and sold it the day after i shot it, worse trigger i have ever seen. also had lcp, tough trigger but do-able, now have a sig p238 which is absolutely great. imo the best mouse gun!


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## recoilguy

Yeah but it doesn't get much magazine or internet play so it is hard for it to make most guys list. 
Lists like these tend show the ability of someone to make a list. 
Everyone has opinions and it is kind of interesting to see what others think of certian things. Not many folks consider so many categories of weapons simutanously. Normally I consider what I am in the market for and consider the rest too much info. Thats just me, some folks like to see if what they have read is what others actually think before they decide. I liked the P238 the one time I shot it. I could hit the target pretty consitantly with it.

RCG


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## cclaxton

I like everything about the Sig238 except two things:
SA Only;
Expensive.

I would probably own one if I didn't have to pay at least $500 new and at least $400 used...if you are lucky.

I agree with you on the S&W Bodyguard trigger, but I got used to it....and it is double-strike capable....and it is great for dry fire exercise. 

I did have a problem with laser, but S&W replaced it.

I may get a Sig238 when I find a used one at the right price. 

Good 380 Hollow points are adequate IMHO.

Thanks,


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## Steve M1911A1

A couple of you guys seem to be missing the point of the "Double-Action Only" semi-auto trigger.
(I have not found them to be particularly bad, compared to, say, a DA revolver's.)

The reason for that long, relatively heavy pull is to make the gun safer to carry in a pocket (in a holster, of course) and simpler to get into action.
It is not unknown for a SA semi-auto's safety lever to be wiped into "off," without the carrier knowing it. But the long DA-style pull requires no separate safety—other than the one between your ears, of course.
It's quicker and less complicated to get a DA-style, safety-less semi-auto into action when it's necessary. It gives the user one less thing to think about and control.

At save-your-life distances, the long DA-style trigger is no impediment to good, effective shooting.
And you probably shouldn't be trying long-range shots with a pocket-size pistol anyway.


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## cclaxton

Steve,
Do you know of any small, lightweight triggered DAO guns?
I like the Kahr PM9 trigger...long but relatively light.
Any DAO that get down below 5 pounds?


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## Steve M1911A1

You're gonna laugh...
The best DAO trigger I've recently found is on our Kel-Tec P3AT!
I think it's at about eight pounds.

For anything lighter, maybe look at Glocks, and the other pistols with Glock-like triggers.
Their triggers aren't true DA-style, really, but the function is the same.


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## Packard

Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...The reason for that long, relatively heavy pull is to make the gun safer to carry in a pocket (in a holster, of course) and simpler to get into action.
> It is not unknown for a SA semi-auto's safety lever to be wiped into "off," without the carrier knowing it...


I agree. And I will illustrate it with a personal experience.

I had just gotten my new Colt Gold Cup in stainless steel and I wanted to try a shoulder holster. This was back in the late 1970s, and although DeSantis was not distributed nation-wide at that time it was a big name on Long Island because it was produced there. I got a right hand shoulder rig with a carrier under my right side that held two spare magazines. It was nicely constructed.

I've always carried my .45s the way they were designed to be carried: Cocked and Locked. As an added safety the holster allowed the snap to be closed between the hammer and the slide. But when I removed the gun I discovered that the safety was "off". I could not understand that at all as I was always very careful about applying the safety. But it happened again the next day and I discovered that pressing the snap closed automatically disengaged the safety each time.

I drove over to the DeSantis shop in Williston Park (second floor over a deli or something like that) and showed him the holster and the problem I was having with it.

The conversation went like this:

Packard: Each time I snap the retention strap it disengages the safety.

Gene D.: Don't carry it cocked and locked. I don't make holsters for cocked and locked.

Packard: If it is not for cocked and locked, then the package should say "for hammer down carry only".

Gene D.: Cocked and locked is irresponsible; I won't make holsters for cocked and locked carry.

After that statement he walked away and left me standing with an unusable holster that was apparently my problem.

In any event it is very easy to end up with a disengaged safety even if you take care to engage it properly and it is functioning properly.


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## Steve M1911A1

...Well, now I have yet another reason to dislike DeSantis holsters. They're second-rate in quality, too.

Thanks, *Packard*!


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## Packard

Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...Well, now I have yet another reason to dislike DeSantis holsters. They're second-rate in quality, too.
> 
> Thanks, *Packard*!


I had earlier bought a "shoot through" wallet holster from him and the design caused the magazine to pop loose from the gun. So I was left with a single shot from a .25 caliber Beretta. Not too good.

I went back to him and he added a relief for the magazine release and that solved the problem for me, but he continued to sell the wallet as it had been when I bought it.

He fails to test his designs. He designs it, and looks it over and decides it is good. Wearing and testing are very important for holster designers.

I won't buy and DeSantis holsters.


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## dondavis3

That's not a very good story for DeSantis Holsters.

But I own 3 of them and mine have all been perfect.

:smt1099


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## Packard

dondavis3 said:


> That's not a very good story for DeSantis Holsters.
> 
> But I own 3 of them and mine have all been perfect.
> 
> :smt1099


My experience with DeSantis is over 30 years ago. He might have learned a few lessons over the years. His workmanship has always been first rate. It was the rest of the process that was not.


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## Russ

A semi auto 9mm single stack is going to be thinner and can be less expensive than the 357 S & W 340PD and hold 7 rounds instead of 5. Yes, the 357 has a bigger punch over the 9mm but I would rather have 2 more rounds of 9mm with plenty of knock down power and the ability to reload much faster if necessary. The weight is only one factor. If you pocket carry a revolver it will be more noticeable over a single stack semi auto. Russ


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## Packard

Russ said:


> A semi auto 9mm single stack is going to be thinner and can be less expensive than the 357 S & W 340PD and hold 7 rounds instead of 5. Yes, the 357 has a bigger punch over the 9mm but I would rather have 2 more rounds of 9mm with plenty of knock down power and the ability to reload much faster if necessary. The weight is only one factor. If you pocket carry a revolver it will be more noticeable over a single stack semi auto. Russ


Faith (non-religious faith) comes into play here too. I have never had a revolver fail to fire. Ever.

I cannot say the same about my semi-autos--some of which have been very reliable. But the smaller the pistol the harder it is to make it reliable. So the very smallest of the pistols will be among the least reliable (for the same quality of manufacture). I think you will find that the full size all steel Kimbers are more reliable than the subcompact alloy versions of the same weapon.

So I have greater faith in a 340 PD (a revolver) than I would in a small semi-auto. Also you can shoot through a coat pocket with the revolver and you can shoot with the barrel pressed hard against the assailant. Two things you cannot say for sure about a semi-auto.

Also the 340 is more versatile. You can load it with hot .357s or light shooting .38 wadcutters (target ammo) or anything in between. Semi-autos work well within a much smaller range of output.

I think there is a place for both. But if you want a gun you can move from your pants pocket and put in your overcoat pocket (and shoot through the coat), then the small revolver wins.

As for cost, with the .38 there are no extras to buy--no spare magazines, special sights, etc. Once you buy it, you are done spending money (oh, add one speed loader--$11.00).


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## cclaxton

Packard said:


> Faith (non-religious faith) comes into play here too. I have never had a revolver fail to fire. Ever.


Actually, a revolver failing to fire is more common than you think. Me and my brother were at a range together...I was trying out his .38 special revolver and he was trying out my 9mm auto.

I fired the second round and the tumbler would not turn. The recoil of the previous dishcharges had caused the remaining bullets to separate from the casing slightly and protruded beyond the end of the tumbler and into the frame of the gun, thus preventing the tumbler from turning to the next round. In fact, the gun was totally disabled until we found a rangemaster to force the bullet back into the casing with a small hammer....then the other three bullets had to be repaired in the same manner.

And, it turns out for some types of calibers this is more common...especially the higher pressured rounds because they cause more recoil.

I am not saying auto's are any more reliable....but I can recover from a failed round much more easily with an auto.

Handguns are mechanical devices and rely on the quality of ammo being fired in them and will fail from time to time....that is a fact.

I put the choice of revolver or auto into the personal preference column. I prefer auto's because they are thinner for IWB carry and I can carry more bullets.

Be safe.


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## daletime

*Diamondback 9mm pocket carry*



cclaxton said:


> Steve,
> Do you know of any small, lightweight triggered DAO guns?
> I like the Kahr PM9 trigger...long but relatively light.
> Any DAO that get down below 5 pounds?


I compared many of the smallest cc and settled on the db9
I really like the trigger pull and its so small 
I have a deposit on the kimber solo stainless but I could not wait.


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## sonja

carry .380 -- Sig 238.

9mm carry -- Glock 19

House 9mm -- Either Sig 226, Glock 17 or Beretta 92.

All those pistols have been very easy to shoot, accurate, and rock solid reliable.


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## cclaxton

I am starting to regret how I put this poll together. 

Sonja,
I think you have an excellent list, and based on more experience with handguns, I think your list is just as good if not better. 
But, the triggers on those guns look like they would be quite different, especially the Glock vs. Sig. How do you train so that you instinctively know which trigger you are pulling?

Also, why not the Glock 26 for carry...smaller, lighter weight, same Glock trigger?

The Sig 238 has a safety and the glock 19/17 doesn't. How do you train so you know whether to release the safety or not?

Just asking because I face the same questions for my guns.

Thanks,


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## jtguns

Just a new guy to the this, and find that alot of you love the glock and sig. Glock is a fine firearm, just not for me (not comfortable grip), own several sigs, 220, 225, 226, 229, 23 and 239. But the best I have for conceled cary is my detonics, great carry weapon. And if you carry and dont practice with what you carry there can be confustion with saftys ect. But at the range days i practice with a about 5-6 firearms, including my S&W 41 just for starters. Just remember to practice both strong and weak hand, and any other carry leather you might use. just a thought

just a new kid on the block
Shoot safe JT


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## Lateck

I voted none of the above. 
Not that the list is wrong, it's just wrong for ME!
For you, it will be different too.

My top six are the one's I own!

Lateck,


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## Cat

I'm a fan of all quality pistols, I'm not a fan of junk pistols. The more pistols I own,The happier I get.

You all know how it is.Start at buying one pistol,The next step is,You say just one more. And then you see the new type you won't now.And you say,Well just one more. And then a new color comes out.And you say,Well just one more.One more turns in to 5 Then 20 then 50.

Just can't say no to LOVE.:heart:


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## cluznar

*My .380 and 9mm*

 Carry a Bersa Thunder .380 with Corbon Pwrball 70 gr ammo
Also Carry a Ruger SR9c loaded with Hornady Critical Defense 115 gr ammo sometimes
For range and Home I have a Stoeger Cougar 9mm one very nice gun


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