# .45 ACP Suggestions for my uses, any suggestions appreciated



## SouthPhilly (Nov 11, 2010)

After having used several calibers and models of pistols at the range;
.38, 9mm, .40 and .45 acp

I haven't shot the .357 and I'm not too sure if it's over powering, can anyone comment on how it compares to the .45?

I really like the side stacking pistols because of the .45 power, I like having more grip surface area and the kick from the glock 21 looked as if I was shooting a 9mm. The clip size is also a plus, but not when it comes to concealed carry if it's going to be a discomfort.

*My Use of a Handgun*
As far as sport shooting, I wouldn't be doing anything beyond general target and range shooting.
Concealed Carry, more often in my waist than outside on hip. I'm from Philadelphia and although I live in a good area, you can travel 5 blocks in any direction and be in a HORRIBLE gun infested neighborhood.

*Concealed Carry Comfort*
My biggest question is what do you guys find to be most comfortable, what do you think may depend on each person, and what do you think is completely uncomfortable- for example is a full size uncomfortable? Most of my concealed carry would be in my waist and not on the exterior hip.

My price range is around the $750 range


----------



## Kharuger (Jun 19, 2010)

.357 is a little snappier than .45 and is louder and has more muzzle blast. Full-size double-stacks are, of course, more uncomfortable and more challenging to conceal than single-stacks. Since you've tried a variety already at the range... What are YOU thinking now? Which ones that you've tried so far serve your needs best? Do you like heavy or light? Metal or polymer? Sounds like you're primarily interested in .45 autos, is that right? But you asked about .357 so that kind of threw me...


----------



## SouthPhilly (Nov 11, 2010)

Kharuger said:


> .357 is a little snappier than .45 and is louder and has more muzzle blast. Full-size double-stacks are, of course, more uncomfortable and more challenging to conceal than single-stacks. Since you've tried a variety already at the range... What are YOU thinking now? Which ones that you've tried so far serve your needs best? Do you like heavy or light? Metal or polymer? Sounds like you're primarily interested in .45 autos, is that right? But you asked about .357 so that kind of threw me...


I threw the .357 question in the just to see what you guys said about shooting comparison. Like if it was different in the sense of throwing a baseball and a softball or a baseball jumping to throwing a basketball.

I never tried any for carrying comfort. I know I don't want to be at anything under a .45 because I could handle it perfectly to defend myself and have all that power so I wouldn't think of a lower caliber. I like shooting both, if I had to choose I like shooting double stacks for the surface area, but I guess it comes down to carrying comfort and I'm not sure if a double stack is ideal.

Are doublestacks decent to carry in the compact form or does it still come down to the width?


----------



## Thanatos (Oct 9, 2009)

Guns that use doublestack mags are fine to concealed carry...I would recommend you check out the Glock 30. Subcompact (very easy to conceal), .45 ACP, 10+1 capacity. I would also suggest if you go this route, get a grip extension for the magazine. Check out the link for Pearce that I provided and you'll see what I'm talking about, gives your pinky somewhere to rest when using the subcompacts...they work great. 

http://www.pearcegrip.com/glock.htm


----------



## SouthPhilly (Nov 11, 2010)

Thanatos said:


> Guns that use doublestack mags are fine to concealed carry...I would recommend you check out the Glock 30. Subcompact (very easy to conceal), .45 ACP, 10+1 capacity. I would also suggest if you go this route, get a grip extension for the magazine. Check out the link for Pearce that I provided and you'll see what I'm talking about, gives your pinky somewhere to rest when using the subcompacts...they work great.
> 
> http://www.pearcegrip.com/glock.htm


What's the consensus on the single stack like a 1911. Are they commonly concealed full size because of the thinner body or does it come down to the length and height dimensions?


----------



## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

You seem inexperienced, generally speaking, so instead of leading you to a particular gun or caliber, I offer you some general comments.
• In my long years of experience, I have found that it is easier to learn to shoot well with a full-size, full-weight, .45 ACP semi-auto pistol than with anything else. The best of these is probably the M1911-type Government Model in its many guises and clones. In a full-size pistol, the .45 has the gentlest recoil, so it is the easiest to control, and a single-action trigger is also the easiest to learn to use well. However, a full-size, full-weight pistol is the very hardest gun to carry concealed. That gives you two options: First is Clint Smith's observation that a carry gun need not be comfortable, but it does need to be comforting. The second is that you may eventually need two different guns, a "learning pistol," and a carrying pistol. (See the next item.)
• Any pistol smaller than full-size is difficult to shoot well. The smaller it is, the more difficult it becomes, to be effective with it. This rule is true, independent of the perceived power of a pistol's cartridge. A small .380 semi-auto is as difficult to shoot well as a tiny .357 Magnum revolver.
• Avoid the "traditional double-action" (TDA) semi-auto. That's the kind that requires a double-action (DA) trigger pull for the first shot, and a single-action (SA) pull for succeeding shots. It is difficult enough to learn trigger control. It is, therefore, counter-productive to have to switch from one form of trigger-control to the other, in mid-stream, mid-practice, and mid-fight. Pick either a double-action-only (DAO) or a single-action pistol, and stick with your choice.
• A long barrel is not difficult to conceal. In an inside-the-waistband (IWB) holster, it just dives that much deeper into your pants. The hard part to conceal is the grip or handle. Further, revolvers are more difficult to conceal well than are semi-autos of similar size. The cylinder is the culprit; and also revolver reloads either bulge or are slow to use.
• The thicker grip of a large-capacity semi-auto pistol may be a bad fit to your hand. However, there is no tradeoff or compromise in the matter: The primary consideration is that the pistol must fit your hand, and magazine capacity pales in comparative importance. It's easier to learn to shoot accurately and reload quickly, than it is to overcome a bad fit with your hand. And, thick grips are hard to conceal.
• Do not buy an expensive pistol, only to carry it in a cheap holster on a flimsy belt. Expect to spend at least $150.00 on the holster-and-belt combination, and $250.00 is even closer to the most appropriate reality. Don't forget to buy a reload carrier of some kind, and to practice its use.
• It is easier to learn defensive shooting and defensive tactics, both of which are equally important, from an experienced and adept teacher, than it is to try to learn these skills on your own. Good training is worth every cent that it costs.
• And, finally, set your mind to putting in lots and lots of practice time, both dry-firing and live. Skill and speed with a pistol comes only after a whole lot of slow, smooth practice. Do not go fast. Be smooth instead, and speed will come to you in time.

Good luck.


----------



## Kharuger (Jun 19, 2010)

Sounds like you're kinda set on a .45 auto... so ... The Glock 30 (24 oz.) suggestion from Thanatos IMHO is a good solid one if you're going double-stack. Many ranges will have that gun as a rental so if you can try one out, that'd be great. Since you've shot a Glock 21 and were fine with the recoil, the smaller G30 will probably be OK too... it's only 2+oz. lighter. It'll carry and conceal better than the 21. 
You probably oughtta rent or borrow a 1911 before you buy, just so you can make a better decision, (but know that they come in a lot of different sizes and weights). I personally don't like heavy guns, and I don't mind recoil ('cause I have strong carpenter hands I guess)... So lightness and ease of carry are primary considerations for me. A Kahr CW45 w/Crimson Trace (single-stack 6+1, 20 0z.) is the only .45 I ever carry (and not very often). But I like the CW45 a lot... FWIW, if I WAS set on carrying a .45 regularly, that would be MY choice... I'm old and don't like lugging big guns around... I'm just sayin'...


----------



## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

I have added a short note about trigger actions, to my previous post of general recommendations.
I should have discussed that issue when I first wrote the post.
Sorry.


----------



## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

I, too, prefer .45 ACP for a concealed carry handgun. The 1911 clones, in all their various sizes, are the easiest full-sized .45's to carry, but even they require slightly larger pants and shirts to conceal comfortably. When I carry mine, it is in a Cross-Breed hybrid (leather and kydex) IWB holster on a thick strong belt, and it is fairly comfortable (none will be very comfortable, but you will adapt, or you will leave it at home).

Most of the time, I carry an XD45 Compact, which is similar in size to the G30. Both are great striker-fired, high capacity polymer framed .45's. Likely, I would have chosen the G30 over the XD Compact, but I wanted the grip safety. I carry mine without a holster, so the grip safety actually has a function for me - keeping anything from working its way inside the trigger guard and causing an unexpected discharge. I use a Clip-Draw, which attaches to the frame with strong adhesive and clips to my belt. I have found it to be a good way for me to carry a double-stack .45, though most folks don't agree that it is safe. I believe it is, with the grip safety, and have had good results, so far.


----------



## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

The Clipdraw is, generally speaking, a pretty good idea. Jean likes hers, on her S&W snubbie.
I didn't like the M1911 version, though. I felt that the gun was unbalanced, hanging on it, and it rotated on my waistband too much.
No matter what anybody _thinks_, once you've actually tried the Clipdraw, you will find that it's perfectly safe, and just as proof against ADs and NDs as any "normal" holster.


----------



## Sniper6473 (Dec 14, 2010)

SouthPhilly said:


> After having used several calibers and models of pistols at the range;
> .38, 9mm, .40 and .45 acp
> 
> I haven't shot the .357 and I'm not too sure if it's over powering, can anyone comment on how it compares to the .45?
> ...


I'm a huge 357 Sig fan, the good thing about this round is it's ease of conversion.

Glock, HK, Sig, XD, M&P and many others is nothing more than a simple barrel swap between 40 S&W and 357 Sig.

For most of these pistols a 40 or 357 Barrel will run between 120 and 199.

If you go with 357 Sig, make sure and buy your ammo in bulk online, it is much cheaper and still lower than 45.


----------



## EliWolfe (Nov 20, 2010)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> First is Clint Smith's observation that a carry gun need not be comfortable, but it does need to be comforting.


Great overall post as usual Steve. I really like the Clint Smith advice.
Eli


----------



## RiverDog (Dec 7, 2010)

In my long years of experience, I have found that it is easier to learn to shoot well with a full-size, full-weight, .45 ACP semi-auto pistol than with anything else

(smile)


----------



## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hey, *RiverDog*;
If you quote me, I'd like you to include the attribution.
For instance, you might use one of the two following forms:
• As Steve wrote, "In my long years of experience, I have found that it is easier to learn to shoot well with a full-size, full-weight, .45 ACP semi-auto pistol than with anything else."
or
•


Steve M1911A1 said:


> ...In my long years of experience, I have found that it is easier to learn to shoot well with a full-size, full-weight, .45 ACP semi-auto pistol than with anything else...


Thanks.


----------



## RiverDog (Dec 7, 2010)

Steve:

No disrespect.

After posting it I did realize the same thing. I actually thought about the same thing. I wanted it to read like a reply, but it read like a statement. I know what you mean an I'm not like that. Forgive me? (smile) 

It was just a statement that I've been wanting to hear for a while.

• As Steve wrote, "In my long years of experience, I have found that it is easier to learn to shoot well with a full-size, full-weight, .45 ACP semi-auto

That's the way I did it. HK Veriant One .45 semi-auto. I liked that gun alot. It was a handful, but it was very reliable. The type of gun you could take out of a mud puddle and it would still go off. As learning to shoot well, I still think there are two ways to do that. Long range or short. I was never a fan for long range small handgun shooting. I am a fan for training for just what will ever happen. I can understand why most folks don't. 

But I do have to admit. The full-size, full-weight, .45 ACP was my best point and shot handgun. There was just a step up and in your face mantality that hit the targets. Not to say a .22 LR can't do the same. Or a .32. They all work the same. You just have to have a super sense of where the barrel is pointing. That is why you want an auto anyway. That simple hire trigger. The sping making it so much softer. (mags?) I don't understand all of the recoil gripes. The machine is going to do what the machine does...get over it. 

It is going to happen the same way over and over. That is the machine. Learn how to shoot that. It's not really that hard.


----------



## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Thank you, sir!

Yes, we are birds of a .45 feather...


----------

