# Advice on a new AR,



## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

There are many out there,, don't know what's what, and what to look for. I'm fine with iron sights.
Quality, reliability , thanks


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## Blackhawkman (Apr 9, 2014)

I would research well and then decide what you want to do with a new AR. There are also many options as far as Optics, rail mounts, barrel config? I like Rock River Arms & Ruger. I have an HK556 that I really like ALOT, too. Good luck in your search. Let us know what you decide?


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## pblanc (Mar 3, 2015)

It would help if you could give an idea of your price range and how you plan to use it.

I am no expert on ARs but having researched the issue and having recently purchased one, I do have some opinions. 

I think the majority of new AR 15 owners would be well-served by a good quality, entry-level rifle such as the Smith and Wesson M&P15 Sport II, or the Ruger AR556. Such a rifle provides a good platform for learning the AR 15 design, structure, and function without sinking a ton of money. These are widely available for around $600, or sometimes less on sale.

If you anticipate very heavy use and plan to shoot many thousands of rounds through the rifle, then features such as a chrome-lined 4150 chrome-moly barrel might be worth the additional expense. In that case if you are willing to spend a few hundred dollars more you might look at a carbine like the Colt LE6920. 

Keep in mind that virtually every part on a mil-spec AR carbine can be replaced, so unless you buy a real piece of junk, it is hard to make a fatal mistake.


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

I have a Colt "Sporter" that I bought in 1980 with triangular hand guards and no forward assist. I later on bought a Bushmaster carbine with a collapsible stock, I believe 16.5 inch barrel w/forward assist. They both go "bang" when fired without any issues.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

Assuming that you simply want a decent quality semi-auto rifle in .223/5.56 with a high capacity magazine for plinking and possibly home defense, there are a lot of budget options available that are more than adequate. For a good quality complete rifle, DPMS is good for a fair price. Also, if you are willing to buy the upper and lower and snap it together yourself, you can mix and match at Palmetto State Armory, to suit yourself. I also helped my 15 yo grandson build one, and he easily assembled the lower under my guidance and it turned out well.

I started out with my first one by buying a Rock River complete lower and a DPMS complete upper that took 30 seconds to combine and has been a great accurate hunting rifle. I configured it with a 20" heavy barrel for a varmint gun, and it will consistency place my hand loads into a half-inch circle at one hundred yards and is very accurate to well beyond 300 yards. I liked it, a lot, and afterwards decided to build a budget model, by assembling a PSA lower receiver and buying a complete upper from PSA. It was a good rifle that I consider a suitable home defense weapon for ~100 yards, and is fun to plink with. It easily places multiple shots within a 2" circle at 100 yards, using a 1-4x shotgun scope with a crude field rest, and will obliterate the bulls eye at 50 yards, rapid fire.

You can buy top quality, if that is your thing, but for the average plinker, many of the 'budget models' fit the bill quite nicely. They are not professional battle rifles, but emulate them pretty well, if used in normal civilian conditions.


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## Cait43 (Apr 4, 2013)

You can't go wrong with the Colt M4.......
Colt LE6920 AR15 M4 Carbine 5.56mm, 16" Barrel, 1 In 7 Twist, 30rd Mag - Impact Guns

Hickok review...


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## rustygun (Apr 8, 2013)

I bought a S&W M&P15 sport that has been 100% reliable shooter. IMO for the price it is hard to go wrong with the sport. The sport II is even a little better having a forward assist and dust cover. I did put magpul furniture on it. Might have been cheaper to buy the magpul version but not by much. So many options it can make your head spin.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Thanks , I never owned an AR, my wife is forcing me to purchase this fine piece,,,what type of barrel would I prefer for repetitive defensive shooting


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## pblanc (Mar 3, 2015)

Genuine AR 15 and M4 carbines as used by the military have 14.5" carbine length barrels. But a barrel that short for civilian use would require a short barrel rifle tax stamp, so civilian AR and M4 clones typical have 16" or slightly longer barrels. Unless you are involved in a true combat situation in which you might need to fire hundreds of rounds within minutes, you are unlikely to heat up a barrel to the point accuracy would be impacted. The more expensive barrels tend to be made of cold hammer-forged 4150 chrome-moly-vanadium steel with chromium lining. The chrome lining renders the barrel less susceptible to corrosion caused by adverse conditions. Probably worthwhile if you are crawling around in rice paddies. For civilian use you must decide for yourself if the additional expense is merited. 

The average shooter is unlikely to "shoot out" an AR barrel regardless of material, and barrels can be replaced. By the time you would get to the point at which accuracy started to suffer as a result of barrel wear, you would probably have invested the initial cost of an entry-level carbine many times over in ammunition.

You definitely want a barrel chambered for 5.56 x 45 NATO ammunition, which will allow you to shoot both 5.56 and .223 Remington ammunition safely. But nearly all ARs are chambered that way. Some other considerations are rifling twist rate and length of the gas system. Military M4 carbines with the shorter 14.5" barrels have "carbine length" gas systems as do many civilian AR variants. But the longer barrel of the civilian versions allow the option of a so-called "mid-length" gas system with a longer gas tube. These allow a longer sight radius when the gas block incorporates the front sight post, and the mid-length gas system is said to be a little less "dirty" and is said to reduce recoil a bit compared to the carbine length systems. But the recoil of 5.56 mm and .223 Remington is really pretty mild, and so long as you periodically clean your barrel and bolt carrier group the length of the gas system is unlikely to be a major factor.

Military carbines typically have a very "fast" rifling twist rate of 1:7" which will stabilize very heavy and long tracer projectiles. But very fast twist rates can actually over-spin some very light "varmint" projectiles and cause them to fragment in flight. A 1:8 twist rate might be the best if you plan to shoot the heavier projectiles favored by long-distance target shooters. Either a 1:8 or a 1:9 twist rate should do fine with the most commonly available 55 and 62 grain 5.56mm and .223 caliber ammunition.

It is easy to get caught up in arguing the merits of the various specs, but my feeling is that most of these differences are going to have a significant impact for only a small minority of civilian AR shooters.

I wound up buying a Ruger AR 556 and have been very happy with it. I suspect I would have been just as happy with an M&P15 Sport II or a comparably priced Rock River. I considered going with a more expensive Colt LE6920 but the price difference between the two would cover the cost of a very, very nice optic which would probably be of much greater value to me than any of the "advantages" offered by the more expensive Colt carbine.


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## rustygun (Apr 8, 2013)

Along with chrome lined barrels there is also melonite which some say is as good or better than chrome. Armornite is S&W version of melonite. I don't think I will ever put enough rounds though mine to know the difference.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

When it comes to the question of whether to buy high quality, or go the budget route, here's how I look at it:

You can easily spend over $2000 for an AR-15 with high quality components. If you are going to use it hard in all types of conditions and fire thousands of rounds through it, it will be worth it, and the cost of the rifle will be insignificant when you figure in the cost of the ammo you will be expending - I mean, you can joyfully expend a twenty round magazine in a few seconds, and you've spent 10-15 dollars to kill a milk jug. Or, if you just like to own top quality, and don't mind the initial outlay, that's fine, too.

On the other hand, if you just want a really good shooting and fun semi-auto rifle that hits where you aim, and has the capability for quick follow up shots, you can spend 5 - 6 hundred dollars and have a rifle that will probably last you forever and shoot just as accurately as the $2000 rifle. If something does break, you can buy the part and fix it yourself. Or you can upgrade everything on it, change the barrel yourself, change the stock, add or remove iron sights, scopes, flashlights, lasers, whatever, any time you want.

The latter of these two choices is the way I chose, because I hand load and prefer to hit my targets with the first shot, and occasionally like to shoot semi-rapid fire at longer ranges, because it is just fun to do. But I never just blow through an entire magazine. I agree with the old gun writer who said that only accurate rifles are interesting, and many of the cheap rifles are just as accurate as many of the expensive rifles...so, they interest me. 

Sure, I really do admire the expensive rifles, but I'd rather spend those extra dollars on ammo.


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## CW (Mar 20, 2015)

Perhaps the tougher question is do I want a Piston or DI?

Of course you can buy cheaper - M&P or Ruger, then just get a new upper when your fancies change.


My choice was to watch the used racks and picked up an SR556c and saved a few $$$.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

Great answers, very sensible , thank you.

I learned quite a bit. I could have google researched the material, but I honestly trust this question more from the members here at the forum.

I love the round, I did own a mini-14 Wooden stock back in the 80's. Why I sold it? I don't know . It's the one that got away,lol. Honestly I stayed away from the AR, because I didn't like the reputation of the Vietnam era M16.

I viewed the AR as I viewed the GLOCK, I think I would have considered myself more of a traditionalist Good thing I was able to open up my mind, lol. The guns started to evolve, but besides the major point here ,
I would have never gotten into computers, tablets* ,new cell phone every two years , sometimes every18 months
,( my wife would bring home the new cell phones) " Honey, I just learned how to use this #*%* bleeping phone ) ,lol.
* 
I remember seeing the Birth of the Glock Pistol. Never thought I would trust the glock, but i have grown very fond of the glocks reliability, especially its adaptability to the different environmental elements.

:smt1099


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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

pic said:


> Great answers, very sensible , thank you.
> 
> I learned quite a bit. I could have google researched the material, but I honestly trust this question more from the members here at the forum.
> 
> ...


Yeah me too. For me it wasn't an issue of trust. I just hated the looks of the damn things. Now I've got 6 of them! Two .45's, two .40's and two .9's all compacts. I kinda' like the looks of the compacts, not so much the full size guns.

I've got an all stainless Mini 14 with a folding stock. It reminds me of the toy M14 that I had as a kid.

The AR's? I've never had any issues with mine. I'm not much of a rifle guy but figured a couple of AR's along with a bunch of 40 round magazines are great if the shit ever hits the fan. I don't know? Just about everyone makes one nowadays. I guess you'll just have to take your pick. I agree with "Bisley" that you don't have to spend $2000 or more in order to get a good one. I've seen the the Colt SP1 that I bought in 1980 now going for around $2000 because it is a pre-ban model. Only because it's legal in states that have an (I hate to use the term) "assault weapons" ban and these weapons were "grandfathered" in. I guess that's what justifies the price? I paid $499 for it brand new. Even though it's got the name Colt on it. I like the Bushmaster XM-15 carbine better. It has a collapsable stock, and a removable carrying handle with adjustable sights. I think I paid around $800 for it. The quality as far as I can tell is just as good as the Colt. There are God only knows how many parts and accessories available for this platform making it a very good choice.


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## Craigh (Jul 29, 2016)

pic said:


> There are many out there,, don't know what's what, and what to look for. I'm fine with iron sights.
> Quality, reliability , thanks


If I were on a budget and wanted a direct impingement gun, I'd probably be looking at Spikes Tactical. They use top quality components which are hand assembled in their factory. These aren't really budget, but I think worth every dime. I've had the real budget models and you end up spending a lot on upgrades later. These tend to be around the $1000 range or a little more. You can read more about them here:

Spikes Tactical

What I'm personally looking at is slightly higher in price, but again, well worth it to me. It's a Barrett Rec7. This is a gas piston design for cleaner and cooler running. They don't pump heat and powder residue back into the receiver like DI guns do. These are extremely high quality rifles. You can read more about them here.

https://barrett.net/firearms/rec7/


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## CW (Mar 20, 2015)

If I go back in time.... an M1 Carbine....... I remember the Crosby military series in the school library...the gun even_ looked _cool.

Actually I had wanted an M-16 since my 3rd GI Joe (got a Vietnam uniform/gear set). Later the CAR would become the dream gun.

Eventually cost would place a Mini-14 in my collection and the wooden stock kinda disguised the fact that this potent semi-auto was more than just a critter-getter.

But the desire for one of those EBRs [evil black rifles] lingered. In time the CAR dream would yield to the likes of others like an HK93, Sig 556, even an old FNC...

But still the desire of getting an American AR remained. 
I remember when some of the crew I worked with started ordering Rhino Gas systems and the custom AR building phase seemed to start.

Eventually even the temptation of a BREN still couldn't shake the AR gremlin and when Ruger made their piston model, I decided to finally join the club.
Likely this SR will outlast me, but even if overbuilt, I'll have the utmost confidence in its ability to perform.

And now that I have learned PA is planning to allow semi-autos for hunting [2017 proposed], Perhaps I'll get a nice varmint upper and turn my EBR into an SoC - Scourge of 'Chucks.


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