# Best handgun to open carry?



## Evongelo

I'm not yet 21, which is what you need to be in Arizona to conceal carry. I can, however, open carry. I'm 21 in a few months but if I can I would like to arm myself before then. So I want to know what you think is the best open carry pistol. I want it to be a 9mm. So use that as your starting point.


----------



## pic

Evongelo said:


> I'm not yet 21, which is what you need to be in Arizona to conceal carry. I can, however, open carry. I'm 21 in a few months but if I can I would like to arm myself before then. So I want to know what you think is the best open carry pistol. I want it to be a 9mm. So use that as your starting point.


What is the open carry to be used for? snakes, self defense, shooting cactus. Will the open carry be exposed to dusty desert like conditions.:smt066


----------



## Evongelo

Self defense only. I do not intend to take this gun anywhere outside urban areas on a regular basis. Might I take it hiking or camping in the desert, maybe, but it's primary use will be as a self defense weapon kept in a holster. I do live in the Sonoran though, but I also live in the city which keeps dust down.


----------



## TAPnRACK

If you intend to open carry you may want to consider learning handgun retention techniques... and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out... so be prepared for that.


----------



## pic

Evongelo said:


> Self defense only. I do not intend to take this gun anywhere outside urban areas on a regular basis. Might I take it hiking or camping in the desert, maybe, but it's primary use will be as a self defense weapon kept in a holster. I do live in the Sonoran though, but I also live in the city which keeps dust down.


One option to think about would be to buy an open carry that you would later possibly convert to conceal carry or just buy another gun.
Be very careful open carrying in the city, any city. Being 21 years old with an exposed open carry will invite trouble, you will be exposed to possible confrontations from private individuals, hostile possibly and law enforcement.You need to practice situation avoidance.
You should be trained and educated for what comes your way, and it will come. My opinion would be to conceal carry in the city, and never expose that you are carrying, do not even tell your friends.


----------



## pic

TAPnRACK said:


> If you intend to open carry you may want to consider learning handgun retention techniques... and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out... so be prepared for that.


hello Tapnrack didn't see your post must have been typing at the same time,lol, sorry for any redundancy


----------



## TAPnRACK

No problem, lol.

If Open Carry was a good idea there would be no need for concealed carry. Good points have been made in this thread though.


----------



## high pockets

IMO the best weapon for open carry is the weapon with which you are most proficient. I would recommend you become most proficient with one weapon and switch to CC with THAT weapon when you are able.

There is no BEST firearm for open, or concealed carry. There is only the best firearm for you.


----------



## Evongelo

Thanks for the advice, I know I may invite suspicion. I know how to fire a gun too, though I don't claim to be any crack shot; and I also know gun safety. I will of course practice a lot. This will be my first hand gun, any I've fired before were my fathers or friends. I'm on my own now though and I need to start building my own collection. I want to have a weapon for every situation, if possible. I FULLY intend to conceal carry but that is 8 months away before it's legal. I don't want to go any longer than I have to before I start to carry, which is why I will open carry for now. So what do you think is the best gun for this perpose? Since I fully intend to conceal carry once I can, should I just go with a pistol best suited for this task? If so, tell me what you like. 
FYI, ive been considering a CZ Duty.


----------



## Gunners_Mate

I love the cz line of pistols, but if I were you I would also look into glocks, or the xdm line of pistols from Springfield armory, both of which are excellent guns, come in all shapes and sizes to accommodate the (great) idea of being both an open and conceal carry (once you reach the appropriate age). Keep in mind xd's will come with a holster that is great for open carry. No matter what, be smart, be safe.


----------



## JMessmer

Can't go wrong with CZ's. But for open carry, you might as well get the biggest most badass gun you can afford because you won't have to conceal it, and they're more intimidating.


----------



## berettabone

I like my Ruger speed six in 9mm................


----------



## SouthernBoy

At the risk of sounding dismissive, the best handgun for this purpose is what best works for you. Issues such as size, weight, shape, and the proper holster for this use come into play not to mention how well you can shoot and deploy your sidearm.


----------



## CrackEfron

A gold Desert Eagle, it will scare the shit out of everybody! Just kidding.. If I was to OC I'd probably have M&P9 S&W or HK45C/USPC by H&K. Maybe a Beretta 92 or Sig P226.. Or 1911 but having 1 in the chamber isn't safe I hear lol


----------



## Broondog

to open carry is a BIG decision and not one to take lightly. increasing you situational awareness is paramount along with knowing how to deal with an attempted gun grab. those are things that are best learned first hand. consult with some local trainers on those things.

that all being said, i would suggest getting at minimum a good level 2 retention holster. when i OC i use a Blackhawk CQC Serpa level 2 holster on a paddle mount. using the paddle mount vs belt loop gives it a lot of stability and firmness for all day carry. and the retention system, unlike a thumbreak holster, is not as easy to bypass. it is not impossible but a lot of regular folks don't know the "secret". they also make a level 3 retention system too if that is a route you wish to take.

another retention holster option is the Safariland system. while i have no experience with it, there are those who swear by it. but please stay away from a passive retention system like Fobus sells. Fobus holsters are not bad but they have a place, and it's NOT with OC. just remember, positive retention in your holster is your second line of defense against losing your firearm. situational awareness is first.

now here's on odd tidbit for you when considering an OC firearm. the more low key it is, the less "looks" you will get. i draw a lot less attention when i OC a plain black Glock than when i carry a two-tone Sig. maybe the black Glock with a black t-shirt behind it is camouflaged or something and the stainless slide on the Sig says bling. :smt102


----------



## paratrooper

TAPnRACK said:


> If you intend to open carry you may want to consider learning handgun retention techniques... and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out... so be prepared for that.


+1 to that.

Open carry will most likely cause you some grief. You sound like you're itching to carry, just because you can.......not because you need to.

And yes......there is a difference.


----------



## SMann

You are focusing more on the hardware instead of your software. If you don't understand that statement, please leave your gun at home until you figure it out. You sound like a kid that is begging for a responsibility that he isn't at all ready for. If this post offends you, that means it is accurate. Please seek education and training and the gun culture will be more than happy to have you join it's ranks. Stick around and do many searches and much more reading. Lots of good knowledge and experience on this forum. Good luck.


----------



## Old11Bravo

As said above, you will draw A LOT of attention and could set yourself up for a real confrontation. Believe me, as a Vietnam combat vet with 8 confirmed & 12 unconfirmed kills (Combat kills are VERY DIFFERENT from civilian shootings). Shooting a man WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE FOREVER, legal shooting or not.
If you are going to carry, get training (lots of it), a license and REALIZE that you are putting yourself and anybody with you in a possible deadly situation just because you are carrying & be VERY PREPARED to pull the trigger OR DIE!


----------



## neorebel

TAPnRACK said:


> If you intend to open carry you may want to consider learning handgun retention techniques... and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out... so be prepared for that.


I here you brother....I hate people wasting my time on something that is perfectly legal to do. I have yet to get a call for an open carry around where I live in Missouri.


----------



## desertman

I have to agree that open carry in public may not be a good idea, you give up your element of surprise and some one could take it from you. Others mentioned weapon retention, if it's difficult for an unauthorized person to take it from you, you might have trouble getting to it yourself and at the worst time. If you live in a state that allows for open carry, such as Arizona where I also live, I don't think you will draw too much attention to yourself, I have seen people doing it in public going about their daily business even in the presence of law enforcement, and hardly anyone bats an eye. Thank God for Arizona! Try doing that in states that don't allow it! I would also recommend, even though it's not required in Arizona, to attend a course and obtain a concealed carry permit.


----------



## Robinson

I too agree with @desertman that open carry in public is not a good idea. However, in case you open carry consider weapon retention training and a true retention holster will also be a good idea. 

When and if someone tries to grab your weapon, you may get only one chance to defend yourself. Practicing retention will help you in such situations. – carrydefense.


----------



## SouthernBoy

The element of surprise being given up when open carrying is a myth. Think about it. When you conceal your gun properly you look just like anyone else, which means you look like any other potential victim. And attacks can come VERY quickly. How fast can you get your gun into action when concealing it? The element of surprise is nearly always in the camp of the attacker.

Another myth about open carry is that you'll be the first one to be shot when caught up in a criminal activity. If this were so, you can bet you'd see it plastered all over the news since you can bet the anti-gun media would just love to use jump on that one. So I would say to those who believe this, please offer up cites to prove your statement. I do know of one incident like this in my state.... one.

I do both. Most of the time, I OC, but there are times and places when and where I deem it to be in my better interests to conceal my sidearm. And I very good and solid reasons why I choose to OC. As far as I see it, we should be celebrating both modes of carry since we are all in the same boat anyway. I wrote what follows yesterday on another thread on this site. I am including it here to show my view of OC and why I choose to do this. Perhaps you good people will see from this that not all who OC are attention seekers or YouTube selfie fanatics looking for their 15 minutes of glory, but rather just normal people going about their daily activities.


"I am not flamboyant in my carry gear (no thigh holsters or overtly large sidearm - a simple gen3 Glock 23), no unusual clothing, no long or unkept hair, or anything out of the ordinary for me. And just for the record why I choose to OC most of the time. I have a few medical conditions. Fifteen months ago I had a total knee replacement and am getting my second one done in March. Last June I had open back decompression and fusion surgery. And in September my prostate was removed as it was found to be cancerous. With all of this, I can no longer run or fight as I was once capable of doing. I am a perfect target. I choose to OC most of the time and let my sidearm be my wolf's teeth. I'd much prefer a BG see my gun and turn his attention to some other victim, preferably just leave, than have to draw from concealment when under attack (assuming the time and opportunity allows this). Yes I've heard the arguments against OC and even those against CC. I ignore these since as I said, I adjust my preference for specific conditions and/or situations.

I don't OC to make some sort of political or social statement, to advance the cause of the Second Amendment (though that is always a nice side effect), or to get a thrill when someone reacts when seeing my arm. I am not out there doing this so that I can record an incident and put it on YouTube (don't even carry a video device) and I am not trying to get a rise out of the police. I am your normal carrier who just wants to be left alone.

Don't know if I have ever laid this out but there it is. My carry rig is nondescript and subtle, which is the way I like it. Hell, it took several years going to one of the local grocery stores before two of the ladies there even noticed my visible sidearm. Now you might say if they didn't notice it then neither would a BG. I suggest a BG is going to be a little more observant just before he attempts to attack than a grocery store worker. And I am VERY observant of my surroundings when out and about, open or concealed, armed or not."


----------



## Glock Doctor

TAPnRACK said:


> If you intend to open carry you may want to consider learning handgun retention techniques ... and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out ... so be prepared for that.


Ain't THAT the truth!



pic said:


> One option to think about would be to buy an open carry that you would later possibly convert to conceal carry or just buy another gun.
> 
> Be very careful open carrying in the city, any city. Being (less than)(Ed.) 21 years old with an exposed open carry will invite trouble. You will be exposed to possible confrontations from private individuals (possibly hostile)(Ed.), and law enforcement. You need to practice situation avoidance.
> 
> You should be trained and educated for what comes your way, and it will come. My opinion would be to conceal carry in the city, and never expose that you are carrying, do not even tell your friends.


Not particularly well stated; but, nevertheless, very good advice that this older gunman would, also, suggest you follow.



Evongelo said:


> Thanks for the advice. I know I may invite suspicion. I know how to fire a gun too, though I don't claim to be any crack shot; and I also know gun safety. I will of course practice a lot.


It's NOT suspicion that you really have to worry about. It's other things like: undue attention, and the fact that you will be broadcasting you have a pistol - AN AVAILABLE PISTOL - to the entire surrounding community; AND, in today's world, there's no way that can be a good thing!

Who cares that you know how to shoot! The real question is, '_Are you a savvy CQB pistol gunfighter?_' (I absolutely do not mean to insult you; but, I doubt that you are; so all this, 'extra advertising' you're planning on doing, as well as all of the unwanted attention it's sure to garner might not be such a good idea. It doesn't really serve a constructive purpose - Understand?)

Finally, every, 'gun dufus' I've ever: seen, read about, or actually known, 'knew gun safety' BEFORE he ended up shooting himself, or (worse) someone else. The only valid way to, 'know' gun safety is to have thoroughly inculcated Cooper's Four Rules into your habitual muscle reflex and personal habit patterns. If all a person has is gun safety rules and regulations inside his head then, for a fact, that person does NOT, 'know' gun safety.



Evongelo said:


> This will be my first hand gun, any I've fired before were my fathers or friends. I'm on my own now though; and I need to start building my own collection.
> 
> I want to have a weapon for every situation, if possible. I FULLY intend to conceal carry but that is 8 months away before it's legal. I don't want to go any longer than I have to before I start to carry, which is why I will open carry for now. So what do you think is the best gun for this purpose? Since I fully intend to conceal carry once I can, should I just go with a pistol best suited for this task? If so, tell me what you like.
> 
> FYI, I've been considering a CZ Duty.


Rather than emphasize building a collection I think you should be making plans to spend a lot of time at the pistol range. Two or three hundred rounds a week would not be too much, or too often, for you to practice. More than a selection of pistols, what you need is a regular pistol training regimen.

If I had my (somewhat prodigal) life to live over again, instead of the dozens and dozens of guns I've owned, I'd have two or three rifles, and one or two shotguns for hunting. That would be it! Pistols would be slightly different: I would want a selection of pistols in: 22 LR, 32 ACP, 380 Auto, 9mm Luger, 357 Magnum, (Ain't never used 38 Special; instead I've always downloaded the longer 357's to 38 velocities.) 45 ACP/Super, and - perhaps my favorite shooter - 44 Magnum. (I've never used 44 Special, either; again I simply downloaded the longer 44 Magnum brass.)

If I were to start out pistol shooting, again today, I'd get myself a 9mm Parabellum pistol with, at least, a 4 inch barrel and start banging away. The next time I had some spare change I'd get myself a long barreled, Ruger Mark III; and these two pistols would keep me going for awhile.

I like your choice of a CZ. Personally I, most often, carry a huge Glock Model 21. (Which I would NOT recommend to you.) I can get away with easily concealing a pistol of this size. If you're able to conceal it reasonably well, I'd recommend a CZ 75, SP-01 in 9mm as your first pistol. I'm a pistol instructor; I've been a pistol instructor for a lot of years. What is the most frequent mistake I've seen new pistol shooters make? They show up at the range with either too small a pistol, or one with too short a barrel in order to effectively (and more easily) learn with.

When you say, 'CZ Duty' I assume you're referring to the, 'CZ P-07 Duty' - Correct? The P-07 Duty, with its slightly smaller frame, will work too. You're just going to have to concentrate more while you're learning how to use it. Try to get, at least, three magazines; you're going to need them. (I keep six to eight magazines for every primary pistol that I own.) When you're ready look into IDPA shooting. The training courses are, themselves, well worth attending.

Good luck to you!


----------



## hughes8

it is not a good idea


----------



## TurboHonda

Since you'll be drawing attention to yourself, by all means do it right. A 1911 in condition 1 is the only way to go.


----------



## Richg

If your in a bad situation guess who the bad guys r going to shoot first?
I carry concealed to protect my self and family.
I would never draw to protect Wal Mart,Best Buy,etc


----------



## n4aof

TAPnRACK said:


> If you intend to open carry you may want to consider learning handgun retention techniques... and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out... so be prepared for that.


There is a way to generally avoid excessive attention while openly carrying a pistol. It involves several steps, some of these steps may be more than an individual is willing to do.

1) You need to look like a clean-cut, respectable, adult
2) Be well groomed
3) Dress neatly -- typically business casual: dress slacks, a dress shirt (tie optional, but a good idea) (possibly a clean, plain solid color polo shirt in summer)
4) Use a quality strong side leather belt holster or strong side IWB holster of the type usually meant for concealed carry, but be sure you don't have anything covering it
5) Carry a quality, duty-grade, pistol such as a mid-size Glock, Sig P229, etc
6) NEVER touch the gun (this is the hardest part for anyone new to carrying)

Nothing will keep an occasional idiot from having a panic attack and calling the police, but if you manage to do the above steps correctly most people won't pay any attention because without even realizing it they will subconsciously assume you are a plain clothes or off-duty LEO (NEVER try to pretend that you are!)

Of course, everything varies somewhat from place to place, but if you look respectable, you have a good chance that even when some idiot calls the police about a "man with a gun" you may get through the encounter without being knocked to the ground and handcuffed before the police even ask for your ID.


----------



## n4aof

TurboHonda said:


> Since you'll be drawing attention to yourself, by all means do it right. A 1911 in condition 1 is the only way to go.


And while you are at it, make a donation to the Brady Campaign, then go participate in a few so-called Open Carry demonstrations, just to make sure that your local stores will all ban open carry.

Regardless of whether you are carrying open or concealed, the 1911 is NOT a suitable gun for any novice or even intermediate shooter -- the 1911 as a carry pistol is strictly an expert's gun that requires years of practice and experience to carry safely and effectively.


----------



## dondavis3

+1 to what he said ^^^

I happen to be in Oklahoma for the holidays - it's a "Open Carry" state - I've never seen anyone carry openly - ever.

I've been in AZ hundreds of times (son lived there) - I've seen one guy open carrying - one.

Lots of talk about it - seldom done.

As you gain more gun experience you'll probably agree.

Those open carry guys in Texas are idiots and their actions have set us "gun rights" guys back 50 years.

Open Carry makes others uncomfortable and are always the 1st to get shot.

JMHO

:smt1099


----------



## SouthernBoy

dondavis3 said:


> +1 to what he said ^^^
> 
> I happen to be in Oklahoma for the holidays - it's a "Open Carry" state - I've never seen anyone carry openly - ever.
> 
> I've been in AZ hundreds of times (son lived there) - I've seen one guy open carrying - one.
> 
> Lots of talk about it - seldom done.
> 
> As you gain more gun experience you'll probably agree.
> 
> Those open carry guys in Texas are idiots and their actions have set us "gun rights" guys back 50 years.
> 
> Open Carry makes others uncomfortable and are always the 1st to get shot.
> 
> JMHO
> 
> :smt1099


*"Lots of talk about it - seldom done."*
In my state, there is more of this than you may realize.

*"..always the 1st to get shot"*
Cites, please. I know of one incidence of this in my state in the entire time I have been OC'ing (seven years). One. And the fellow kinda broadcast it and brought it upon himself.


----------



## SouthernBoy

n4aof said:


> There is a way to generally avoid excessive attention while openly carrying a pistol. It involves several steps, some of these steps may be more than an individual is willing to do.
> 
> 1) You need to look like a clean-cut, respectable, adult
> 2) Be well groomed
> 3) Dress neatly -- typically business casual: dress slacks, a dress shirt (tie optional, but a good idea) (possibly a clean, plain solid color polo shirt in summer)
> 4) Use a quality strong side leather belt holster or strong side IWB holster of the type usually meant for concealed carry, but be sure you don't have anything covering it
> 5) Carry a quality, duty-grade, pistol such as a mid-size Glock, Sig P229, etc
> 6) NEVER touch the gun (this is the hardest part for anyone new to carrying)
> 
> Nothing will keep an occasional idiot from having a panic attack and calling the police, but if you manage to do the above steps correctly most people won't pay any attention because without even realizing it they will subconsciously assume you are a plain clothes or off-duty LEO (NEVER try to pretend that you are!)
> 
> Of course, everything varies somewhat from place to place, but if you look respectable, you have a good chance that even when some idiot calls the police about a "man with a gun" *you may get through the encounter without being knocked to the ground and handcuffed before the police even ask for your ID.*


Boy, I wouldn't want to live in your state. Don't see this happening in mine. I have had one MWAG call on me (December 2010) and the responding officer was embarrassed to even approach me. It lasted about 90 seconds with three or four questions asked. No request for ID, no threats, no detainment, and no harassment. We kidding around for a moment or two, had a couple of laughs, then went our separate ways. This happened in an upscale grocery store (Wegman's) based out of New York state. We have quite a few people in my area from both New York and New Jersey and many frequent this store. It is my guess that one of them made the call. The dispatcher tried to explain to the caller that open carry was legal in Virginia but the caller claimed that I was acting suspicious and that was why the officer approached and also why he thought this whole thing was ludicrous. He apologized for wasting my time.

I have been in numerous stores (ones with "No Guns" signs are rare - haven't seen any in seven years), restaurants (yes, even those which serve alcohol for consumption on the premises), my local bank, barber shops, jewelry stores, large box stores (Costco, Walmart, Target, Lowes, Home Depot), police stations and precincts, and even state capital government offices, all while carrying openly. Not one problem with any of this. The only negative response I have ever received was in August 2009 at a McDonald's. A man who claimed he was a retired LEO gave me some grief. Judging by his accent he was not a native of Virginia but most likely from somewhere up in the northeast.

I have been around police many times while OC'ing, have approached them while they were in their vehicles to ask questions about things, and have sat by them while having a meal in a restaurant. One pointed to my visible sidearm and said, "Now there's a real American". He, his lady, and myself then had a pleasant conversation as we ate our meals. I have also been part of a lobbying effort in my state capital that saw over 1000 armed citizens (yes, openly armed) lobbying their public servants (representatives) for passage or rejection of bills.

Aside from my one negative encounter, every comment I have ever received has ranged from questions about state law to general questions of curiosity to positive congratulations types of comments from both men and women; the most recent one coming from a young lady yesterday afternoon.

This is Virginia and the open carry of a sidearm is the normal mode of carrying that arm (standard/default). To conceal it is the abnormal mode of carry which does require a permit. We have managed to "educate" our police forces to understand this and to act accordingly. Are we guaranteed that we will not encounter an LEO who has an ax to grind? Of course not, but the chance of this is pretty darned small. And I can tell you that when things like this have happened in the past, we have gone after the offending departments and officers with a vengeance. In one incident that happened in early 2007, we flooded the city council meeting with around 150 armed citizens demanding that corrections be made and the offending parties be disciplined. Necessary corrections were made and nothing has happened since.

The problem with so many people on these and other gun website forums is that they cannot seem to see beyond their own borders. They believe what may happen in their states will happen in every other state in the same way. But that's just not the case. While someone may run into problems OC'ing in Ohio or Illinois, it pretty much ain't going to happen here. You people have got to understand that what doesn't work in state A may very well work just fine in state C.

Oh, and BTW... I very rarely wear "business casual" even when I was employed, and there's no way you'll fine me in a tie. Jeans and a T-shirt, golf shirt, or rugby with boat shoes is my attire. In the summer, the jeans get replaced with cargo shorts. Same gun, same holster is used in both cases.


----------



## Ratpacker

A SIG 227 Nitron Carry....( short Bbl.) Would be a good pick.
Da/Sa trigger..... hammer drop decocker. 10 rd. Mag. & one in the pipe.Nice size and shape on the mono- grip.
★★★★ No wonder State Police consider it better than the old choice.


----------



## Ratpacker

Now....OP wants a 9....not a .45 ACP★★★★

Get a hold of 10 nines and get the most comforable one.


----------



## BigT

I wouldnt discount the idea of a jug of pepper spray.
Very effective stuff for self defense, it stops bears
and once a pervert in new jersey stroking himself to kids
walking to school.

Goes over better than a pistol in plane view.
I cant imagine open carry where i live.


----------



## Cait43

Actually there is no "best weapon" for all...... The "best weapon" is a personal choice by each and every weapon owner.....

Pepsi or Coke

Chevy or Ford

McDonald's or Burger King

Walgreens or CVS

Etc., or etc.............


----------



## SouthernBoy

Cait43 said:


> Actually there is no "best weapon" for all...... The "best weapon" is a personal choice by each and every weapon owner....


This is true.

While there are better handguns for carrying and there are ones not so great for this purpose, in the final analysis (now there's a phrase I rarely use), it all comes down to what's right for the individual.


----------



## BigT

If my wife asked this question
i would recomend one that didnt make her butt look fat.

Just sayin


----------



## Scorpion8

The best/only weapon worth open-carrying is a Jedi light-sabre, and you better have the Jedi mind tricks to support it. Open carry may be a right, but it also advertises "shoot me first", so be prepared to endanger everyone around you just to feed your need to prove that you can. Even in Alaska where bears come into town to root thru garbage you see very few instances of open-carry. Besides, in my mind, the whole point of carrying is to have an advantage when you need it. Advertising your advantage makes it moot.


----------



## TurboHonda

n4aof said:


> And while you are at it, make a donation to the Brady Campaign, then go participate in a few so-called Open Carry demonstrations, just to make sure that your local stores will all ban open carry.
> 
> Regardless of whether you are carrying open or concealed, the 1911 is NOT a suitable gun for any novice or even intermediate shooter -- the 1911 as a carry pistol is strictly an expert's gun that requires years of practice and experience to carry safely and effectively.


 I was kinda being sarcastic when I suggested the 1911, because it looks intimidating to the casual and uninformed. However, I disagree with your contention that only experts with years of practice can carry it safely. I believe the design of the 1911 makes it more accommodating for safe carry. A 1911 in condition 1 is obviously ready to fire when the thumb safety is disengaged and the grip safety is depressed. At that point a trigger squeeze is all that's left. Many handguns are carried in the same condition, one in the chamber and waiting for a trigger squeeze, only it's not so obvious. I frequently carry a 1911 concealed, but out of respect for George Carlin's average person I don't open carry it.


----------



## PT111Pro

I'll think you should look into the Smith&Wesson SD9VE. No joke.
The SD9VE is not the Sigma and is a very reliable firearm. If you don't like the trigger than wait about 200 rounds down the pipe and if it is still to heavy, get the APEX spring kit. Mine is with the APEX kit a just great gun that don't have to fear the guns in the shelve above with the more expensive price-tag. I'll think the SD9VE is a very affordable and reliable first full sized gun.

In stores you can buy this gun below $ 300.00. 
With open carry, the full sized gun shouldn't be a problem. I sometimes carry the SD9 even concealed IWB. 

So my favorite for a sidearm during camping, hunting, blinking in the desert and self defense when its goes dirty is definitely the Smith&Wesson SD9VE. They sell it in 40 S&W too for the same price-tag. 
Opinion off.


----------



## buckhorn_cortez

> ...and be prepared to draw a LOT of attention to yourself. I'm all for open carry rights, but as a police officer I know first hand that people will call the police to check you out... so be prepared for that.


You're in Michigan, I have no doubt that would be true. In most of the Western states, it's not uncommon for people to open carry. In fact, we had an incident earlier this week in Albuquerque where a report was made of an active shooter with a rifle that the PD could neither confirm nor find.

The response to media questions from the PD spokesperson was that they could not confirm that a crime had been committed since it was not illegal to walk down the street with a gun.

I have several friends who OC (mostly during summer months) with no problems. One uses an IWB holster with a Commander length 1911, the other carries an M&P Shield 9mm in an OWB holster. Both are NRA pistol instructors and certified by the State of NM to teach concealed carry classes. Neither is trying to make a statement - they just prefer OC in the summer because it's easier than trying to hide the gun under clothing - making it more comfortable (cooler) than wearing over shirts or having the holster next to the skin.

For the OP - if you're going to OC, my suggestion is to find a smaller sized pistol as they are easier to carry. I generally use a SIG P229 or a Springfield EMP as they are smaller in size and easier to deal with getting in-and-out of, and sitting in, vehicles.


----------



## EmperorMA

My state doesn't allow open carry but concealed carry permits are basically available over the counter. You have to wait a bit for the background check but no one who meets the basic requirements is denied and no tests or classes have to be taken. I would never consider open carrying here, even if it were legal. Too many possibilities for things to go wrong .... 

We are allowed to open carry when in engaged in outdoor activities such as hunting, fishing or hiking. Since I do these three things quite often, I have open carried a .22 for many years, mostly for plinking and to take take shots at occasional targets of opportunity like an unsuspecting coyote or bolting jackrabbit. Recently, due to misguided game management in our state that is being done more by legislators than by wildlife professionals, we now have an abundance of mountain lions and wolves in many of the areas I frequent. Accordingly, I've decided to up the horsepower of my sidearm a bit and have been shopping for a new OC/home defense gun.

My criteria for the pistol is pretty simple. It needs to hold a minimum of 10 rounds of 9mm Luger, needs a barrel of at least 3.5" in length, a rail so I can mount a light on it for the nightstand and it needs to be reliable so I can carry it for a week or more in the outdoors without having to schlep around a cleaning kit or other crap. The guns I considered and tried out were:

Beretta PX4 FS and Compact
Beretta 92 M9A1 Compact
CZ-75
FNH FNS
G19
G17
G26
HK VP9
Sig P320 FS
S&W M&P 9C
S&W M&P 9FS
Springfield XDm 3.8" Compact
Springfield XDm 3.8" and 4.5"
Walther PPQ M2

After spending nearly enough money on rentals and ammo to buy any one of these, I have narrowed it down to three: Beretta 92 M9A1 Compact, S&W M&P 9C and S&W M&P 9 FS. The HK VP9 was the last pistol eliminated from contention, although it may have been my favorite. I just didn't want to train with paddle magazine releases when all my other pistols have button releases. 

Again, I personally would never open carry in public settings. I just thought the list I made might help you with which guns to check out next time you head down to the LGS. Good luck!


----------



## GCBHM

For what it's worth, the paddle release is very easy to get used to. In fact, I prefer that type now. My EDC is the VP9, but I don't have a problem with any other button release pistols. For me, the VP9 feels better and shoots better than any other striker fire pistol, but the great thing about the gun market is that there are so many great guns available to suit all.


----------



## SouthernBoy

EmperorMA said:


> My state doesn't allow open carry but concealed carry permits are basically available over the counter. You have to wait a bit for the background check but no one who meets the basic requirements is denied and no tests or classes have to be taken. I would never consider open carrying here, even if it were legal. Too many possibilities for things to go wrong ....
> 
> We are allowed to open carry when in engaged in outdoor activities such as hunting, fishing or hiking. Since I do these three things quite often, I have open carried a .22 for many years, mostly for plinking and to take take shots at occasional targets of opportunity like an unsuspecting coyote or bolting jackrabbit. Recently, due to misguided game management in our state that is being done more by legislators than by wildlife professionals, we now have an abundance of mountain lions and wolves in many of the areas I frequent. Accordingly, I've decided to up the horsepower of my sidearm a bit and have been shopping for a new OC/home defense gun.
> 
> My criteria for the pistol is pretty simple. It needs to hold a minimum of 10 rounds of 9mm Luger, needs a barrel of at least 3.5" in length, a rail so I can mount a light on it for the nightstand and it needs to be reliable so I can carry it for a week or more in the outdoors without having to schlep around a cleaning kit or other crap. The guns I considered and tried out were:
> 
> Beretta PX4 FS and Compact
> Beretta 92 M9A1 Compact
> CZ-75
> FNH FNS
> G19
> G17
> G26
> HK VP9
> Sig P320 FS
> S&W M&P 9C
> S&W M&P 9FS
> Springfield XDm 3.8" Compact
> Springfield XDm 3.8" and 4.5"
> Walther PPQ M2
> 
> After spending nearly enough money on rentals and ammo to buy any one of these, I have narrowed it down to three: Beretta 92 M9A1 Compact, S&W M&P 9C and *S&W M&P 9 FS*. The HK VP9 was the last pistol eliminated from contention, although it may have been my favorite. I just didn't want to train with paddle magazine releases when all my other pistols have button releases.
> 
> Again, I personally would never open carry in public settings. I just thought the list I made might help you with which guns to check out next time you head down to the LGS. Good luck!


Instead of the M&P full size, why not take a look at the 4.25" barrel version with the full size frame. An excellent combination with great balance and handling characteristics. And very accurate to boot.


----------



## EmperorMA

SouthernBoy said:


> Instead of the M&P full size, why not take a look at the 4.25" barrel version with the full size frame. An excellent combination with great balance and handling characteristics. And very accurate to boot.


That's the one I'm looking closely at. It is the full size frame with 4.25" barrel. The long slide (5.0") version seemed a bit more than I wanted right now. Perhaps later if I decide to get into some competition shooting.


----------



## SouthernBoy

EmperorMA said:


> That's the one I'm looking closely at. It is the full size frame with 4.25" barrel. The long slide (5.0") version seemed a bit more than I wanted right now. Perhaps later if I decide to get into some competition shooting.


I have five M&P's, four of which are centerfire pieces. One is the M&P 9 Pro Series 4.25" barrel. I have over 4,000 rounds though it and it is a fine pistol. I did replace the striker safety block with an Apex Tactical USB to remove the grittiness in the trigger's first stage. Great shooter and consistently accurate. Only thing you have to be aware of is that their magazines do tend to get dirty from powder residue and this can cause james (failures to [fully] feed). Keep the mags clean and you will not have this problem.


----------

