# CCW for Ham Hocks



## dominic135 (Apr 13, 2016)

I'm new to handgun ownership and I would like to share a tip with other nubies.
I wanted a CCW that was small enough to be carried in a pocket liner holster. I read hundreds of reviews both personal and commercial, and still made a $400 mistake.
I chose the Kahr 4043, a subcompact .40 cal. semi that holds 5+1 rounds. The piece is remarkably well made and attractive in a Sponge Bob like fashion. Incredibly, the gun can be completely covered with my open palm. I can't find fault with the weapon... it works, every shot, every time no matter what I feed it. My problem? It is too small for my ham-hock sized fist! I just can't control it. I also bought 3 other pistols and can hit the mark rather well, so I know it's not me.
First of all, the grip has room for all of my index finger but only half of my ring finger. So, I bought a pair of extended 6 round clips (not cheap) and tried again. Better but still not accurate enough.
Still, the excess room in my palm tended to tilt the gun upwards leading into a limp wrist style kick. Even with a bowling wrist cuff, the results were only marginally better.
I don't think I would have had a problem if I'd bought the 9mm version. If you have a small hand and narrow fingers, it would work well. But, if a woman or any slender hand were used, would it be strong enough to control the recoil of a .40 round? Kahr claims their design reduces recoil but what I experienced (maybe due to the size of my hand), was a kick greater than any .45 cal. 1911 I've ever fired, and I was in the military when the Colt was the issued sidearm.
"So, here I sit broken hearted, paid for a Kahr, that will soon be departed." I bought this piece on the internet but even if I'd handled it in a gun store, I don't think it would have changed anything. Only some time on the range with this piece would have made a difference. 
Actually, my loss is larger than $400! I purchased a CZ75b for a range gun. I could have purchased a compact CZ that would have covered both the range and CCW requirement. Now I'll have to buy another piece for carry! That's a very expensive mistake I would like to make other new owners aware of!
One more point. If you grew up with Double Action firing systems, the Kahr has DA action and you should be fine. But, if you are not used to DA triggers, you will not like it. I'm used to that snap action trigger that give real time accuracy. By the time you're ready to fire, you still have almost an inch of resistant trigger travel. For those not used to DA, by the time the actual trigger release fires, you may not be on target anymore! I know that practice will help but for an old school shooter a lot can happen between the time your finger starts moving and the shot is fired. If you try to rush the trigger travel on a 6-9 lb. pull, it will definitely affect you aim! 
Dominic


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

I can agree, the dissatisfaction of a gun purchase can be very disappointing.


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## win231 (Aug 5, 2015)

One of the disadvantages of buying a gun without handling it. I don't think you would have purchased it if you see how it fit your hand first. I have the same hand-size problem; that's why I can't shoot a J-frame Smith unless I put large grips on it. I tried a Ruger LCR in the store & that works.


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## Cannon (May 1, 2016)

Dominic135, Your not alone most compact / sub compact pistols have a grip that's too small for large hands. And you nailed it without a good grip you don't have control, and accuracy usually suffers too and that's never good! At times I have to carry a LCP due to summer clothing, its pocket carry the LCP or nothing. a two finger grip doesn't instill confidence in any application other than up close work. My normal IWB CC gun is a Taurus PT-111 G2 and one of the reasons I bought the gun was I'm able to wrap my fingers around the grip. the longer grip makes it just a bit harder to CC but I'll take the trade off if it means better accuracy and control.


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## Cannon (May 1, 2016)

Dominic135, Your not alone most compact / sub compact pistols have a grip that's too small for large hands. And you nailed it without a good grip you don't have control, and accuracy usually suffers too and that's never good! At times I have to carry a LCP due to summer clothing, its pocket carry the LCP or nothing. a two finger grip doesn't instill confidence in any application other than up close work. My normal IWB CC gun is a Taurus PT-111 G2 and one of the reasons I bought the gun was I'm able to wrap my fingers around the grip. the longer grip makes it just a bit harder to CC but I'll take the trade off if it means better accuracy and control.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

If you want a pistol the size of a Kahr that will actually work properly with large hands, I have found two options, so far. The Springfield XDs works fine, right out of the box, for me, and XL gloves fit my hands tightly (2x would be more comfortable). I also have a S&W Shield that did not work well for me until I installed an Apex 'straight trigger' and an Apex sear kit. It now works for me just as well as the XDs works with no modification. I own, or have owned, Kahrs in PM-9, P-45, K-9, and K-40, and I agree that they are fine pistols, but they do not work well for large hands or long fingers. It's all about the way the trigger is set up, and you cannot tell by looking at them, side by side.


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## OldManMontgomery (Nov 2, 2013)

win231 said:


> One of the disadvantages of buying a gun without handling it. I don't think you would have purchased it if you see how it fit your hand first. I have the same hand-size problem; that's why I can't shoot a J-frame Smith unless I put large grips on it. I tried a Ruger LCR in the store & that works.


I'm going to quibble with that initial statement. This is a disadvantage of buying a gun without *shooting it at one's leisure*. Merely handling the arm at the counter may or may not reveal the odd bit that gouges one's hand when firing. Or, in the case of Dominic135, does not reveal the lack (or perceived lack) of control when firing.

However, this is the constant problem with concealed arms: The small and lighter the arm, the easier it is to carry constantly. The larger and heavier the arm the easier it is to shoot accurately and rapidly, if needed. And the opposite for each. It is a trade off which can only be determined on a personal basis. One size - either literal or metaphoric - does NOT fit all.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

^This^

I have done a lot of informal research, trying to determine the perfect subcompact pistol for concealed carry, for a person with large hands. You simply cannot tell without shooting a lot of rounds through one. A good shooter will quickly adjust to differences in grip or trigger pull to find the optimum way to shoot it. But, if the design is simply unacceptable, it takes a lot of rounds to actually come to the conclusion that it is never going to satisfy the need you had in mind when you purchased it. 

An expert who is watching out for specific key differences might figure it out quicker, but the average shooter does not identify the problem, right away.


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