# Definition of a "Group" when target shooting



## Dsig1 (Dec 23, 2007)

I'm looking for the definition of "Group" when someone posts or says that they've shot a 3" group...

Is this a measurement from a center point on the target outward to determine the proximity of the furthest shot to the center point with all other shots in the group falling within a radius of that shot?

Or, is the "Group" an entity on its own, unrelated to a "bullseye" point, and the size of the group measures from the two furthest shots within that group regardless of where it is on the target?

Or, like someone I ran into at a range session today, who measures the "Group" based on the deviation of shots away from the first shot in the group?


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## BeefyBeefo (Jan 30, 2008)

Dsig1 said:


> Or, is the "Group" an entity on its own, unrelated to a "bullseye" point, and the size of the group measures from the two furthest shots within that group regardless of where it is on the target?


That would be my definition of a group. If you shoot a sequence of shots, aiming at the same spot on the target every shot, you should end up with a group on the target in a certain area. This would pertain to the consistency of the shooter (and/or the gun) to place the shoots in a close proximity. I may be wrong, but this is what I view as a group, measured like the diameter of a circle which passes through the two furthers points of that group of shots.

-Jeff-


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## Dsig1 (Dec 23, 2007)

BeefyBeefo said:


> That would be my definition of a group. If you shoot a sequence of shots, aiming at the same spot on the target every shot, you should end up with a group on the target in a certain area. This would pertain to the consistency of the shooter (and/or the gun) to place the shoots in a close proximity. I may be wrong, but this is what I view as a group, measured like the diameter of a circle which passes through the two furthers points of that group of shots.
> 
> -Jeff-


So, essentially, it's possible to shoot a 1" group and miss the intended target by multiple inches and thus measuring consistency of the shooter and gun combination.


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## BeefyBeefo (Jan 30, 2008)

Dsig1 said:


> So, essentially, it's possible to shoot a 1" group and miss the intended target by multiple inches and thus measuring consistency of the shooter and gun combination.


Of what I view as a group, that is correct. Although, if this was the case you might want to evaluate how you're aligning the sights or having them adjusted :smt082

-Jeff-


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## BeefyBeefo (Jan 30, 2008)

Deleted...somehow it posted twice


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## 69Roadrunner (Nov 17, 2007)

Its kind of hard to explain it without illustrations. However, group size is usually measured from center of the outside hole to the center of the farthest opposite hole.


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## TOF (Sep 7, 2006)

Group count is typicaly stated with the greater number of shots being harder to obtain a small group.

A 1 inch 5 shot group would equal a set of 5 holes with the greatest center to center distance being 1 inch. Distance to target and standing offhand vs. bench rest help define level of dificulty.


You may see comments about clover leaf groups. That is a group with all hole edges touching.

:smt1099


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## Mike Barham (Mar 30, 2006)

The relationship of the group to the point of aim doesn't change the size of the group, nor the "accuracy" of the gun. Sometimes very accurate guns need a sight adjustment.


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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

Dsig1 said:


> ...
> 
> Or, is the "Group" an entity on its own, unrelated to a "bullseye" point, and the size of the group measures from the two furthest shots within that group regardless of where it is on the target?
> 
> ...


This is the definition I use.



Dsig1 said:


> So, essentially, it's possible to shoot a 1" group and miss the intended target by multiple inches and thus measuring consistency of the shooter and gun combination.


On occasion, I've done that on purpose, when I needed to shoot several groups of different ammo brands/types on a single target. I would adjust the sights to print the first group high-and-left, then re-adjust the sights for high-and-right on the second group, and so on. You get to use the same highly defined aiming point (the center of a clean, non-shot-up target), and still have several separate, clearly-defined groups to evaluate for consistency, size, stringing, etc.

If a person wants to evaluate the size _AND_ location of a group at the same time, they usually use a target with scoring rings. On this type of target, you are rewarded for having both a tiny group, and having that group closely centered on the target. If all the shots regularly end up in the center scoring ring, shooters have the options of increasing the distance to the target, decreasing the size of the scoring rings (or the entire target), shortening the amount of time allotted to shoot all shots, or moving to a less-supported shooting position, any/all of which will increase the difficulty of achieving a high score.


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