# Question about permitless states that have constitutional carry



## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

As most of you guys know, Oklahoma- come November first, will join the other 15 states that have free right to carry firearms. My question is, if anybody knows or not, is how that will work with reciprocity once this passes? I’m pretty sure we have reciprocity with pretty much every free state but does that mean we can carry permitless in those states as well? What about north Dakota, Idaho and Wyoming that state “residents only”? I’m assuming this means that only the residents of those states can carry permitless? Are they going to require we have a permit even though we no longer require one? And I guess the same goes for states like Florida, South Carolina, Colorado, Michigan and Pennsylvania to name a few that state Oklahoma residential license only? What’s the difference between the blue states and the yellow states? 

And well I guess lastly, once we get closer to November, I’m assuming there’s probably still gonna be some last minute reciprocity agreements probably still being worked out between us and other states who charge their residents to exorcise their gun rights. 

I’m just wondering if we’ll still need to have a permit for out-of-state travel which I guess as long as we weren’t charged for it, that’d be alright I suppose. 




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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

I can't say for any other state but you would be required to have a permit from your home state that is honored by N.C.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

tony pasley said:


> I can't say for any other state but you would be required to have a permit from your home state that is honored by N.C.


Same with Virginia, unless you choose to open carry, which doesn't require a permit of any kind.


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

tony pasley said:


> I can't say for any other state but you would be required to have a permit from your home state that is honored by N.C.


But what about when we go permit-less? I would think our drivers license showing proof of our residence would be considered our permit...

But then again as I said in the last part of my OP- since we're still a little over 8 weeks away, they're might be reciprocity changes coming for us and.... are you sure it's North Carolina? Our reciprocity map below shows South Carolina to be that way.... anyway, and the rest those states that say they need our permit I order to be honored....










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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

SouthernBoy said:


> Same with Virginia, unless you choose to open carry, which doesn't require a permit of any kind.


Well that's confusing because on that map, Virginia is a blue state that just says Oklahoma license honored.

So what's the difference between the two types of states where one says Oklahoma license honored, and the others say Oklahoma residential license only??

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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

corneileous said:


> So what's the difference between the two types of states where one says Oklahoma license honored, and the others say Oklahoma residential license only??


Some states will honor any valid permit issued to the holder (for instance, a NJ resident could get a non-resident FL permit and use that to carry).

Other states will only honor a permit issued to the holder by the state s/he is a resident of (the NJ resident would only be allowed to carry if they had a NJ permit).

It depends on any reciprocity agreement your state has with certain other states, and how your state law says to handle permit holders that have a permit from a state other than their state of residence.

I'd start by finding the Carry laws for your state, and see if reciprocity is addressed in those laws. Check whatever info your state may have online addressing these questions; in some states the State Police has a web page for it. In my state(ND), the Attorney General is the one who has a page explaining how it works. Our web page explains that ND Constitutional Carry is only allowed for residents, and even residents have restrictions (must have lived in the state for at least a year, must have a state-issued ID/DL when carrying).


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

DJ Niner said:


> Some states will honor any valid permit issued to the holder (for instance, a NJ resident could get a non-resident FL permit and use that to carry).
> 
> Other states will only honor a permit issued to the holder by the state s/he is a resident of (the NJ resident would only be allowed to carry if they had a NJ permit).
> 
> ...


Well see, that's just it, since the law hasn't technically gone into effect yet, I don't think anybody's really said anything about what kind of changes are going to come about until closer to the first of November, or at least as far as anything I can find.

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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

Other states that require a permit for carry are still going to require you to have an OK permit to carry in those states. Simply because Ok went permitless doesn’t mean every other state will allow it if they require residents to have a permit. Most permitless states still issue permits to allow for reciprocity.


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

RK3369 said:


> Other states that require a permit for carry are still going to require you to have an OK permit to carry in those states. Simply because Ok went permitless doesn't mean every other state will allow it if they require residents to have a permit. Most permitless states still issue permits to allow for reciprocity.


Are they charging for _those_ permits?

I get that agreements might get changed after this goes into affect. It wouldn't be so bad if Oklahoma wouldn't charge for for a permit just to make another state happy. That doesn't make any sense to charge for a permit like the state still requires for carry period when they just changed the law for everyone else who doesn't leave the state with a gun.

I guess I'm just gonna have to either call or email the OSBI and see if they'll give me any heads up about what's going to happen when this all goes into effect.

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## desertman (Aug 29, 2013)

corneileous said:


> As most of you guys know, Oklahoma- come November first, will join the other 15 states that have free right to carry firearms. My question is, if anybody knows or not, is how that will work with reciprocity once this passes? I'm pretty sure we have reciprocity with pretty much every free state but does that mean we can carry permitless in those states as well? What about north Dakota, Idaho and Wyoming that state "residents only"? I'm assuming this means that only the residents of those states can carry permitless? Are they going to require we have a permit even though we no longer require one? And I guess the same goes for states like Florida, South Carolina, Colorado, Michigan and Pennsylvania to name a few that state Oklahoma residential license only? What's the difference between the blue states and the yellow states?
> 
> And well I guess lastly, once we get closer to November, I'm assuming there's probably still gonna be some last minute reciprocity agreements probably still being worked out between us and other states who charge their residents to exorcise their gun rights.
> 
> ...


At least in Arizona as long as you meet all of the legal requirements of your home state you can carry either open or concealed while visiting here. The only exception is that you may not enter ANY establishment that serves alcoholic beverages including restaurants. For that you'll need an Arizona concealed weapons permit. However it is illegal to consume alcoholic beverages while carrying a gun on those premises.


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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

The fees are to cover the cost of processing the permit


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

desertman said:


> At least in Arizona as long as you meet all of the legal requirements of your home state you can carry either open or concealed while visiting here. The only exception is that you may not enter ANY establishment that serves alcoholic beverages including restaurants. For that you'll need an Arizona concealed weapons permit. However it is illegal to consume alcoholic beverages while carrying a gun on those premises.


But are they gonna require us Okie's to have a permit issued from our own state?

I would hope that since we're buddies with all the other constitutional carry states and that since we let them carry permitless here, that they'll hopefully show us the same respect we show them.

But all the other states we have agreements with who still require their own residents to pay for permission slips will either be a state that will make our new legislation useless if we choose to travel there and carry at the same time, or they'll be one of the states that honors our permitless system and not make us have to keep an Oklahoma permit just to go there.

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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

tony pasley said:


> The fees are to cover the cost of processing the permit


Well from what it sounds like, it's gonna be for a lot more than that. Matter of fact if it's a state like... yours.... that still requires we have our own permit to keep reciprocity agreements, then it'll be like nothing changed. In two years when my permit expires, I'd have to renew it and pay the renewal price and someone who doesn't have a permit will still have to go through all the fingerprinting, SDA class and the 3 to 4 month long background check wait through our central investigation bureau.

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## MoMan (Dec 27, 2010)

Down here in Kentucky, we went Constitutional Carry back in June. Permits will still be available for those who wish to have one for state reciprocity. I have my permit, and will be renewing it when it is due (every 5 years!), so I can travel to the states that we share reciprocity with. I understand why some states require a permit for reciprocity to take place, it's their state, their laws. 

Just because a 'home' state goes to Constitutional Carry, doesn't mean that that state's residents now can carry in other states.


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## tony pasley (May 6, 2006)

Your right it changes nothing when you leave the boundaries of your state. Your state legislature only controls the laws in your state. Be thankful that you don't have to have a permit with in your state.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

Right. No state cares about the laws in another state. If they say you need a permit there, resident or reciprocal, you need a permit there. They don’t care where you come from. How would a LEO know if you were truthful or not if you had no permit and said you came from a permitless state? He wouldn’t care, he’d just say he didn’t care where you came from, put your arms out for the cuffs because you need a permit to carry here.


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## RK3369 (Aug 12, 2013)

corneileous said:


> Well from what it sounds like, it's gonna be for a lot more than that. Matter of fact if it's a state like... yours.... that still requires we have our own permit to keep reciprocity agreements, then it'll be like nothing changed. In two years when my permit expires, I'd have to renew it and pay the renewal price and someone who doesn't have a permit will still have to go through all the fingerprinting, SDA class and the 3 to 4 month long background check wait through our central investigation bureau.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


What changed is you don't need a permit if you don't leave the state. Nobody's forcing you to go anywhere but if you do, another state says you need a permit to go there.


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

MoMan said:


> Down here in Kentucky, we went Constitutional Carry back in June. Permits will still be available for those who wish to have one for state reciprocity. I have my permit, and will be renewing it when it is due (every 5 years!), so I can travel to the states that we share reciprocity with.


So even though you no longer need a permit within their borders, you still have to pay for a permit if you wish to travel armed outside of Kentucky?



> Just because a 'home' state goes to Constitutional Carry, doesn't mean that that state's residents now can carry in other states.


It can. Oklahoma hasn't even gone full constitutional carry yet but every state that already has constitutional carry(including yours) can carry here without a permit even though I still have to have one up until the end of October. lol.

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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

RK3369 said:


> What changed is you don't need a permit if you don't leave the state. Nobody's forcing you to go anywhere but if you do, another state says you need a permit to go there.


We'll just have to wait and see what happens in the next 6, 7 months when they get this all sorted out to see what states will force me to keep a permit and if I decide who's worth paying money and renewing my permit for.

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## MoMan (Dec 27, 2010)

corneileous said:


> So even though you no longer need a permit within their borders, you still have to pay for a permit if you wish to travel armed outside of Kentucky?
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


That is correct in the states that require it. The difference down here is that; to get the permit there are certain requirements, including classroom, and a live range shooting proficiency test. Constitutional Carry doesn't require it. So for the states that require a permit, it makes sense to them. Like I said; 'their state, their rules'!

Kentucky law states the following:
"Kentucky concealed carry also allows for _reciprocity. _The state honors *all* concealed carry licenses from other states. But a Kentucky concealed carry license is only honored in 37 states." (SOURCE: https://www.concealedcarrystates.org/kentucky-concealed-carry-gun-laws/ )

So as you can see above; KY ONLY honors concealed carry permits from other states, AND 37 other states honor a KY concealed carry permit!!


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

MoMan said:


> That is correct in the states that require it. The difference down here is that; to get the permit there are certain requirements, including classroom, and a live range shooting proficiency test. Constitutional Carry doesn't require it. So for the states that require a permit, it makes sense to them. Like I said; 'their state, their rules'!
> 
> Kentucky law states the following:
> "Kentucky concealed carry also allows for _reciprocity. _The state honors *all* concealed carry licenses from other states. But a Kentucky concealed carry license is only honored in 37 states." (SOURCE: https://www.concealedcarrystates.org/kentucky-concealed-carry-gun-laws/ )
> ...


I figured as much. Yeah I know- their state, their goofy rules but still- it's still silly in more ways than one to make people go through all the bullshit _and_ pay money to boot, to get a permission slip to pretty much carry _in somebody else's_ state when so many other people will probably say screw it and choose to avoid all that infringing crap and only carry for free in their own state and just go unarmed when they travel, just to save money and/or not do it in spite of principle...lol.

But I guess with all that said, if I ever wanna travel to Kentucky someday and do it armed... legally, then your state's going to be one of the hopefully very few states that will require me to go through all the crap just to get a reciprocity permit in Oklahoma to do it&#8230; LOL.

I'm not really upset, even if it appears that way, I just think it's funnier than hell that this is how they choose to do things.

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## DJ Niner (Oct 3, 2006)

desertman said:


> At least in Arizona as long as you meet all of the legal requirements of your home state you can carry either open or concealed while visiting here. The only exception is that you may not enter ANY establishment that serves alcoholic beverages including restaurants.


That's not the ONLY exception. ND issues Class 2 carry licenses to persons who are 18-20 years old, and AZ does not allow carry by anyone under 21 years old.

https://www.azdps.gov/services/public/cwp?qt-cwp_menu_=10#qt-cwp_menu_

"Notwithstanding the provisions of this section, a person with a concealed weapons permit from another state may not carry a concealed weapon in this state if the person is under twenty-one years of age..."

This is reflected in the ND reciprocity list, which shows reciprocity with AZ for ND Class 1 license holders, but not ND Class 2 (you must be 21 or over to apply for a ND Class 1 license):

https://attorneygeneral.nd.gov/public-safety/concealed-weapons-licenses/reciprocity-other-states

.


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## corneileous (Feb 17, 2018)

Well, after a few exchanges of emails trying to get the exact information I was looking for, you guys are right- the OSBI permit thing is still going to be the same as it always has been, just hopefully only for those states we have reciprocity with who won’t honor our constitutional carry directly. 

If you still wish to carry in these states that want that almighty permit, then nothing virtually will change if you insist on carrying to these states and what to do it legally. You’ll still have to maintain a permit, or if you’re one of the many who has never gotten a permit, you’ll still have to pay the on average 60 to 80 bucks to take the redundant SDA class, pay the 25 bucks to your county’s sheriff department for the fingerprinting and initial background check and then have all your application stuff sent to the OSBI for the usually three month long background check along with your 100 or 200 dollar check for the 5 year or ten year permit. 

Hopefully the majority of states who still require their residents to have an infringing permission slip will honor our constitutional carry rights just the same as we have all along to the majority of other constitutional carry states. 


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