# The Science of the Draw Stroke



## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

In this thread we see how a professional teaches the science of the draw stroke to someone who has done and taught the draw stroke all wrong.

Below is the pupil teaching the draw stroke wrongly:






Notice how confident the true professional is in his teachings vs how the pupil sort of stuttered his way through teaching something it becomes clear he's never really done. I find this kind of stuff very interesting.


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## neorebel (Dec 25, 2013)

Great video. Just make sure you don't cock it after the first shot in REAL life.


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

Ron Avery is awesome... one of the best out there with a wealth of knowledge and years of experience. Shootings like breathing for him.

Cory "stolen valor" is a guy who went AWOL before entering the Army, claims he served in "the sandbox" and has taken some classes from guys like Ron... then makes money off training others and making videos with his wife (used to distract audience). After his false claims were realized and made public, he stopped putting out videos and has layed low trying to salvage his training buisiness. Friends with Yeager too if that tells ya anything.

Check out Travis Haley videos if you've never heard of him or seen his stuff. Best of the modern instructors imo.


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

neorebel said:


> Great video. Just make sure you don't cock it after the first shot in REAL life.


Yeah, I think they were doing that for the purpose of dry fire.


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

TAPnRACK said:


> Ron Avery is awesome... one of the best out there with a wealth of knowledge and years of experience. Shootings like breathing for him.
> 
> Cory "stolen valor" is a guy who went AWOL before entering the Army, claims he served in "the sandbox" and has taken some classes from guys like Ron... then makes money off training others and making videos with his wife (used to distract audience). After his false claims were realized and made public, he stopped putting out videos and has layed low trying to salvage his training buisiness. Friends with Yeager too if that tells ya anything.
> 
> Check out Travis Haley videos if you've never heard of him or seen his stuff. Best of the modern instructors imo.


Yeah, I watched a video where Cory apologized about all that stating that he was at basic when he was medically discharged. Yeager is definitely a character for sure, but at least what I've heard from him makes some sense as opposed to anything I heard from Cory. Perhaps he is getting aligned with good people and trying to get straightened out now, but I really like Ron Avery's way of teaching in what I've seen thus far.


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## TAPnRACK (Jan 30, 2013)

Can't go wrong with Ron Avery... classy guy. Lots of guys out there competing for a piece of the "training pie". Some are phonies and some are the real deal.... usually easy to spot the guys who know their stuff. 

I just dislike the ones who pad their resume (lie) or claim service to gain respect or validation of their curriculum. Lot of those clowns out there... it's a slap in the face to anyone who ever served honorably in ANY branch of the military. I find it offensive that some try to claim service. There are plenty of great instructors who never served or saw combat... being a veteran by itself does not make one a great instructor. 

Just my 2 Cents.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

"Economy of effort...and a few million [repetitions]..."
Yup. I agree.

And it's interesting that you cannot coach yourself to your own utmost, efficient speed.
It requires the input of someone who is watching your technique dispassionately, and who can then clearly describe to you what it is that you're doing inefficiently.

You need that input because it is all too easy to practice something that is, unknown to yourself, even slightly inefficient.
Your solo, unsupervised practice can even make you slower and less effective.

I can teach someone to use a defensive pistol quickly and effectively, well enough to save lives.
But I am not competent to analyze anyone's relative efficiency, and to guide that person to his greatest efficient speed.
To do that requires a special talent for both analysis and teaching.

The finest shooting coach I've ever known was able to easily express himself in any student's personal mode-of-speech, and make himself clearly understood to anyone.
Believe me: That is a talent which few people possess.


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## neorebel (Dec 25, 2013)

It was a great video! I like the part where they clap their hands to show when you release and form your grip. I noticed his student went back to his hand against his chest still.


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## neorebel (Dec 25, 2013)

GCBHM said:


> Yeah, I think they were doing that for the purpose of dry fire.


Yep but sometimes when you practice something like this, it makes it's way into real life situations.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

I frequently practice draw and fire exercises at the range I use. There are two ranges in my area which allow this with live ammo on their firing lines. The only real downside is that you can never practice quick shots when doing this because these are indoor ranges and you must make sure your shots go into the backstop and not the ceiling, floor, or walls. This means you must take the little bit of time necessary to get something of a sight picture before you fire your sidearm.

These folks in these videos have the luxury of a close berm-style outdoor backstop so they can press that gun out and fire right away. The only way I can practice this is to dry fire in my home when doing draw and fire practice. For what it's worth, my movements are closer to what Avery is demonstrating here than what Cory did in his video. Not 100% there to Avery's method but pretty close.

Thanks for posting Avery's video. The man's damned good.


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

I really like Avery's style. He's clearly a professional, and I like his methods. Cory is just a kid trying to be tacticool, which you can see in his methods and movements, but hey...at least he has gotten some instruction from a pro like Ron Avery. That says something good!


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## GCBHM (Mar 24, 2014)

neorebel said:


> Yep but sometimes when you practice something like this, it makes it's way into real life situations.


Well, I think we see this in Cory's movements. It seems to me everything he does is done to look the part rather than to actually have a real reason for doing it, where as with Avery, not so much. It is so easy to spot someone who knows what they're doing...and someone who doesn't.


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