# FBI and the switch to 9mm.



## crewchief (Jul 25, 2018)

A week ago or so I saw on my tablet news feed that the FBI has ordered 1.8 million 40sw bullets. They re saying the change to the nine is going slower than expected. I'll bet that someone in the Gov is resisting the handgun changes $$$$$$$...Police friiends I've talked to at the range say more agency's are now not so sure of killing the 40..


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## Tangof (Jan 26, 2014)

I'm getting a lot of advertisements from AIM,SOG, etc. for police .40 trade-ins. Really cheap Glocks and others. It appears a lot of departments already switched. .40's aren't my cup of tea, if they were I'd be snatching some of these up.


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## pblanc (Mar 3, 2015)

Those agents who have qualified with and currently carry .40 S&W pistols are allowed to stick with them.


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## Pandaz3 (Aug 23, 2018)

It depends on the agency, a while back my son (ICE) wanted a G-22 as he was very familiar and accurate with it. It was not on the approved list and a G-17 was, so that is what he bought. I myself am going to subscribe to AIM and look for those deals. several years ago I only had two 40's and one was a revolver. Now I have seven.


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

I still don't understand all this nonsense about the .40 being too hard to qualify/shoot well, by some people in the police. If they can't handle the recoil of the .40, which I don't feel is that bad anyways, how are they gonna "man-handle" the bad guys?


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## TheReaper (Nov 14, 2008)

I have 3 .40's and love the way they shoot.


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## crewchief (Jul 25, 2018)

Berettatoter,,, you nailed it brother!!!! I've been shooting 40s also since the birth of the 40, it's an awesome cal. I'm betting a lot of police aren't happy with this 9mm bullshit that it's the best cal now. Anything the 9 can do, the 40 can do better!!!!!


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## pblanc (Mar 3, 2015)

A lot of FBI personnel are not field agents. They work from behind a desk day in and day out. I suspect a lot of them never shoot their issued handguns except to qualify. And this type is unlikely to be wrestling with bad guys except in a virtual sense.


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## berettatoter (Sep 1, 2011)

pblanc said:


> A lot of FBI personnel are not field agents. They work from behind a desk day in and day out. I suspect a lot of them never shoot their issued handguns except to qualify. And this type is unlikely to be wrestling with bad guys except in a virtual sense.


Yeah, I can see that, but if I were a police officer, I would still opt for the harder hitting .40 S&W. I was reading some emergency room surgeons reports on the subject of gunshot wounds they have to deal with...a few of them must have been shooters themselves, because you could tell the difference between the ones who "knew" guns and the ones who did not. They all said, pretty much anyways, the the wound channel and damage done by the .40 and .45 was "usually" worse than those caused by the 9mm Luger.

I don't know for sure myself, but when I shoot a caliber that not only has a bigger/heavier bullet, and I can physically feel the difference in the pressure and recoil of that round versus another with a lighter bullet, then I am pretty sure the receiving end is gonna feel it as well. Anyways, I still like the "snorty" forty...and the 9mm as well.


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## LostinTexas (Oct 1, 2018)

Certain topics become long in the tooth.
I don't like 9MM. LostWife. all 2 bits and a dollar worth of her, had difficulty with 45. The capacity was not acceptable either. She says 40 feels like it has Brass and chases range balls all over the place, shoots a light switch size hole in the middle of her "man" targets and runs the stuff like a champ. Slow or fast fire, doesn't seem to matter to her.
I feel if she can do it, and do it well, there aren't any excuses to whine about the caliber. The hype about 9MM and the effectiveness, power, utility, and shootability are mostly BS. It is adequate and that seems to be the standard of the day.


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## pic (Nov 14, 2009)

It's basically all relative to the object, animal or person we are shooting to affect a certain outcome.
s
Does size matter ? Of course . 
We can start with an elephant or grizzly bear. Take in mind shot placement is a very good argument, but very risky when it's life or death. 
Animals don't have the same human fear factor when they see their own blood. They'll keep charging at you if that's the initial reason to shoot the grizzly. 
Humans are becoming like animals. Lol. I want the the biggest round when shot placement failed. 
Shoot an arm off , shatter a knee cap, open up their abdomen. Bigger the better. You only get two shots, if lucky.


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## HogHunter (Mar 13, 2018)

Go back and look at history. The US became involved in several small jungle conflicts in the early 1900s. The tribesmen would drink medicated tea (dope in today's language) before combat. The Army's sidearm was a 38 revolver. The tribesmen would jump out of the undergrowth and start hacking, stabbing, and slicing with machetes, short swords, and knives. The soldiers would shoot them with the 38 revolver with very little effect. The tribesmen would just keep on hacking, stabbing, slicing, killing soldiers. The Army quickly realized it needed a sidearm that would knock a drug crazed person down. Hence Mr. Browning gave them the 1911, one of the greatest handguns ever made. 

I am not saying the FBI or police forces should use 1911s, but I am saying that I can see no reason for them to go back to a 38 size projectile, even if it is a few feet per second faster. And for the record, I think they are going to 9mm because ammunition is cheaper and they purchase a lot of ammunition. Just my opinion.


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## Bisley (Aug 24, 2008)

When the CCW craze hit my area, a lot of folks who knew nothing about guns rushed out and bought pistols, often upon recommendations from gun shop clerks, whom they believed were their buddies. The horror stories about the 'Glock 40' were widespread, mostly claiming wild muzzle flip, gashed hands from the slide, and jamming (due to limp-wristing, I imagine). This is Texas, so everybody's dad was a gun 'expert,' to the point that it seemed to a lot of folks that they should have hereditary gun abilities, I guess. 

A lot of these folks quit shooting altogether and continued to tell their horror stories. Some swapped their .40's for something weaker, and continued to bad-mouth the .40. Most of them sought out help and learned proper (or at least better) grip technique, but the negative stories still circulate. So do the "9mm is too weak" stories still circulate, despite improvements in bullet technology that corrected the problem that cops experienced during the Miami shoot-out, decades ago.


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## Babbalou1956 (Sep 2, 2014)

There must be something to the one-size-fits-all decision. Maybe cheaper. If not, I'm all for letting them shoot 9mm, 40 & 45 enough to see what they shoot best with. As for me, I don't know if I can quickly shoot tight groups with my 45 because my gun range doesn't allow rapid firing. Not a problem in the FBI.


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## Pandaz3 (Aug 23, 2018)

I keep going backwards, I have added another 10MM to my fleet/stable/pile a XDM10 5.25" Shot it and my still new G-20. 90 rounds each. The XDM Needed sights adjusted (Already done) and the G-20 shot 45 okay and 45 single shot as it failed to return to battery. I have cleaned and re-lubed it and will try to shoot both this week and see if my sights are better and if the G-20 functions right. I had a little health glitch or the re-check would be done. I need to shoot a lot of guns including a couple of 40's.


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## hillman (Jul 27, 2014)

I've owned a couple 40s, still do have an SR40c. I don't really understand why cops have more difficulty qualifying with them than with a 9. I do know that I don't want to touch off even one round out of a 40 indoors without hearing protection. Damn thing is loud.


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## Pandaz3 (Aug 23, 2018)

hillman said:


> I've owned a couple 40s, still do have an SR40c. I don't really understand why cops have more difficulty qualifying with them than with a 9. I do know that I don't want to touch off even one round out of a 40 indoors without hearing protection. Damn thing is loud.


So is a 22 Mag, I don't know why some calibers seem to hit the Loud-O-Meter more aggressively than others, but they do.


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## hillman (Jul 27, 2014)

Pandaz3 said:


> So is a 22 Mag, I don't know why some calibers seem to hit the Loud-O-Meter more aggressively than others, but they do.


Mmm, you're right. The charge is still 'working', with no more barrel left to work with. I think every 'gunnie' knows that the 22 Mag does good work in a long gun; maybe not so many know that the 40S&W reaches out quite well out of an 18" barrel. "Point blank" to well beyond 100 yards.


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## Pandaz3 (Aug 23, 2018)

I'd like to get a Kel-Tec SU-2000 in 40 (I have one in 9 MM) they have a 16" barrel and I've thought 40 to be a better choice from a ballistics standpoint anyway


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