# Possible Kimber issue



## js

Well, I spent some quality time at the range Saturday afternoon. I shot about 100 rds... Out of those hundred rounds, about half of the ejected spent casings hit me in the forhead... It got to be pretty annoying, so I stopped shooting and packed everything up. One of the guys who works at the range even said something... He noticed little marks on my forhead, which I saw for myself after looking in the mirror. My Kimber has the external extractor, which I've read on a few forums about owners having problems with. I'm going to go again today to see if it happens again, if so then I'll be calling Kimber first thing Monday morning.

It hasn't been a very good "gun" weekend for me... first was an issue with my new AR (long story) now the Kimber acting up... :smt011


----------



## Charlie

Sorry to hear 'bout your "noggin' knocker" ejection problem. Has it always ejected them like that or is it a new thing? If this is not normal for that gun, check your extractor VERY close. It may just need cleaning....or may need removal and cleaning, or maybe a spring. Whatever it takes will most likely be cheap. Get some advice from Kimber but keep in mind that removal is very simple and a lot cheaper that boxing that thing up and sending it off. Keep us informed as to the issue. What's happening with your new AR? I haven't been keeping up here on the forum so I may have missed something.
Charlie :smt028


----------



## Shipwreck

I have always heard that a little tweaking of the extractor fixes this right away - but I have no idea how to start screwing with the spring.

1st, easiest option - try a different brand of ammo and see if that helps. Seriously - It could make a difference. I've seen different brands eject to different places sometimes.

Did U try CCI Blazer? With the aluminum cases, they tend to eject in a different patterm than the brass.


----------



## jwkimber45

If its not done it before, and you're using the same ammo as usuall there is prolly just some gunk that needs scrubbed out. A little hoppes and scrub brush will have you fixed up in no time


----------



## scooter

If its pulling the cases out of the pipe it probably isnt the extractor,it needs the angle on the ejector filed slightly more to the vertical to kick the brass more sideways than up.


----------



## js

Charlie said:


> Sorry to hear 'bout your "noggin' knocker" ejection problem. Has it always ejected them like that or is it a new thing? If this is not normal for that gun, check your extractor VERY close. It may just need cleaning....or may need removal and cleaning, or maybe a spring. Whatever it takes will most likely be cheap. Get some advice from Kimber but keep in mind that removal is very simple and a lot cheaper that boxing that thing up and sending it off. Keep us informed as to the issue. What's happening with your new AR? I haven't been keeping up here on the forum so I may have missed something.
> Charlie :smt028


Yesterday was the first time that it consistently hit me in the forhead, before that is was random...

As for my AR... I was installing a new trigger guard and the tool I was using to knock one the pins out slipped. So now there is a "new" ding with the "new" trigger guard. I know it's no big deal, but I'm pretty anal. If it would have happened a year from now I wouldn't be as anal, but it's brand new...and I haven't even shot it yet! :smt011



Shipwreck said:


> I have always heard that a little tweaking of the extractor fixes this right away - but I have no idea how to start screwing with the spring.
> 
> 1st, easiest option - try a different brand of ammo and see if that helps. Seriously - It could make a difference. I've seen different brands eject to different places sometimes.
> 
> Did U try CCI Blazer? With the aluminum cases, they tend to eject in a different patterm than the brass.


I'm using CCI Blazer, have been for months... I think i'll buy some federal today at the range and see what happens....



jwkimber45 said:


> If its not done it before, and you're using the same ammo as usuall there is prolly just some gunk that needs scrubbed out. A little hoppes and scrub brush will have you fixed up in no time


Oh, I'll clean the hell out of it tonight... I'd do it right now, but I'm leaving for the range in about 5 mins....

I give a range report when I get back... I really do hope it's something simple, I don't want to ship it back to New York.


----------



## Wandering Man

Is it time to start a "hit in the face with hot brass" support group?

WM


----------



## js

Wandering Man said:


> Is it time to start a "hit in the face with hot brass" support group?
> 
> WM


That's a great idea! :smt082

Well, another 100rds today, with about half of the spent casings beaming me in the forehead...this time I actually have a little burn mark right above my right eye, glad I was wearing eye protection... :smt011 I'm going to clean the hell out of the gun later tonight, go back to the range on tuesday and try it again. THe range is is closed on Mondays...

Should I take the extractor out and clean it, if so... how do you get the thing out..? All I can do at this point is just clean around it the best I can...


----------



## scooter

js said:


> That's a great idea! :smt082
> 
> Well, another 100rds today, with about half of the spent casings beaming me in the forehead...this time I actually have a little burn mark right above my right eye, glad I was wearing eye protection... :smt011 I'm going to clean the hell out of the gun later tonight, go back to the range on tuesday and try it again. THe range is is closed on Mondays...
> 
> Should I take the extractor out and clean it, if so... how do you get the thing out..? All I can do at this point is just clean around it the best I can...


At the risk of sounding obstinate,(and mebbe ya missed my previous post) If its yankin the brass its not the EXTRACTOR. the EJECTOR angle is what determines(mostly) which direction the brass flies.


----------



## js

scooter said:


> At the risk of sounding obstinate,(and mebbe ya missed my previous post) If its yankin the brass its not the EXTRACTOR. the EJECTOR angle is what determines(mostly) which direction the brass flies.


oops, yes I did see your post...

So how would I adjust it to make the spent casing fling out to the right, instead of straight back...thus making contact with my forehead...?


----------



## scooter

I just posted an attachment to my last post with the ejector circled and an arrow pointint to the edge that needs to be filed slightly more vertical(or flat if you will) to push the brass sideways more.right now it should have a fair angle to it being longer closer to the frame,that hits the brass low and makes it flip UP instead of out the side ...are ya totally confused yet?:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


----------



## js

scooter said:


> I just posted an attachment to my last post with the ejector circled and an arrow pointint to the edge that needs to be filed slightly more vertical(or flat if you will) to push the brass sideways more.right now it should have a fair angle to it being longer closer to the frame,that hits the brass low and makes it flip UP instead of out the side ...are ya totally confused yet?:mrgreen: :mrgreen:


Thanks for the image, now it makes a little more sense...  I was getting confused on the whole extracting process... Do the "ejector" and "extractor" actually work in harmony with each other...? It just started doing it, can the "ejector get worn after a period of time or rds...? Of course I'm sure it can, but at what point is normal wear...?


----------



## scooter

js said:


> Thanks for the image, now it makes a little more sense...  I was getting confused on the whole extracting process... Do the "ejector" and "extractor" actually work in harmony with each other...?


Yup,if the extractor is holding the shell tight it pulls it all the way back till it hits the ejector and that flips it out the port.Is yours an internal or external extractor?
I just re read you first post duh,ext. extractor, It may have a weak spring and is not pulling the brass all the way back to the ejector too. And unless your good with LEEEEEEEEETLE bitty parts and have 3 hands its probably best to let a "smith" or the factory replace that.


----------



## scooter

Quick test of extractor spring for External Extractor
1 load mag to specified rds
2 run 1 into the pipe
3 slowly pull the slide back with the mag still in
4 round in the chamber should come all the way back till the ejector pushes it out(not the next round in the mag)
If it doesnt do that then Im fulla poop and it IS your ectractor and not the ejector:mrgreen:


----------



## scooter

Also I guess if its been fired a lot and you havent cleaned the extractor area it COULD have a cabon buildup dragging on the extractor.You could try what worked for my friend , instead of trying to dis-assemble that area just put as much solvent into it as you can,let it soak and then use HIGH pressure air(90psi or so) and blow out the carbon.It got his TLE going good again.


----------



## js

scooter said:


> Quick test of extractor spring for External Extractor
> 1 load mag to specified rds
> 2 run 1 into the pipe
> 3 slowly pull the slide back with the mag still in
> 4 round in the chamber should come all the way back till the ejector pushes it out(not the next round in the mag)
> If it doesnt do that then Im fulla poop and it IS your ectractor and not the ejector:mrgreen:


Well, I'm doing the test right now and the ejector is pushing it out. I'm pulling back the slide extremely slow and watching the round hit the ejector, then the round is being spit out...


----------



## scooter

Oke dokee, next test load the mag and hand cycle it (rapidly) to slide lock and watch the brass eject,if its ejecting approximately 45 degrees up and out and about 45 degrees backwards it is doing what its supposed to and Im outta ideas.I would try cleaning the extractor and try shooting it again to see if that helps first and if it doesnt it would be best to talk to kimber
if you bought it NIB and its sill under warranty?


----------



## Blastard

You may want to consider sending it New York. Chances are you will get back a new slide with an internal ejector. It sucks to send it in, but in the long run you will be better off.


----------



## john doe.

Just make sure to keep your mouth closed in case the start hitting lower.


----------



## js

Blastard said:


> You may want to consider sending it New York. Chances are you will get back a new slide with an internal ejector. It sucks to send it in, but in the long run you will be better off.


I called Kimber today and told them about what it's doing... They said to send it back to them, so I'll box it up tonight and ship it out via UPS tomorrow morning. :smt022


----------



## Shipwreck

I hate that damn shipping bill when ya gotta send a gun in....


----------



## scooter

Hope they do ya right,Ive heard of people getting their guns back with new mags in the pkg too. I hope they do something to make ya feel right,but whatcha gonna do for a CCW while kimmies away? That AR might print a little too much:mrgreen:


----------



## js

Shipwreck said:


> I hate that damn shipping bill when ya gotta send a gun in....


I'm not very happy about it, that's for sure...



scooter said:


> Hope they do ya right,Ive heard of people getting their guns back with new mags in the pkg too. I hope they do something to make ya feel right,but whatcha gonna do for a CCW while kimmies away? That AR might print a little too much:mrgreen:


Yeah, I'm hoping they come through for me...I'm sure they will, I've heard and read nothing but great things about their service...so we'll see.

They said it would take no longer than 10 days to repair, so I won't be carrying during that time. At least I have my AR for home protection.


----------



## Shipwreck

Have U shot the AR yet? (I don't remember U saying U have...)


----------



## js

Shipwreck said:


> Have U shot the AR yet? (I don't remember U saying U have...)


Nope, not yet... The owner of the indoor range that I go to invited me to go with him and his son next week (Monday) to an outdoor range that they're members of. I talked to his son today and it's still on...depending on the weather. I can't wait... I bought some ammo for the AR yesterday, so I'm ready to go!


----------



## Wandering Man

js said:


> They said it would take no longer than 10 days to repair, so I won't be carrying during that time. At least I have my AR for home protection.


Take a deep breath and hold it ... hold it ... Now let it go. Think calm relaxing thoughts. Its going to be OK.

You might consider an air soft gun for a few days. Or even a squirt gun, just to help you get through the withdrawal.

We have treatment for this.

Its going to be OK.

... really!

WM


----------



## js

scooter said:


> but whatcha gonna do for a CCW while kimmies away? That AR might print a little too much:mrgreen:


No problem... I'll just wear a reeeaaalllyyy baggy shirt and if someone ask I'll just tell them it's my cell phone. :mrgreen:



Wandering Man said:


> Take a deep breath and hold it ... hold it ... Now let it go. Think calm relaxing thoughts. Its going to be OK.
> 
> You might consider an air soft gun for a few days. Or even a squirt gun, just to help you get through the withdrawal.
> 
> We have treatment for this.
> 
> Its going to be OK.
> 
> ... really!
> 
> WM


I'm already having withdraws...and it's just packed up in a box across the room, ready to be shipped. :smt022


----------



## Mike Barham

js said:


> I'm not very happy about it, that's for sure...
> 
> Yeah, I'm hoping they come through for me...I'm sure they will, I've heard and read nothing but great things about their service...so we'll see.
> 
> They said it would take no longer than 10 days to repair, so I won't be carrying during that time. At least I have my AR for home protection.


A guy who works for me at Galco had to send his Kimber Pro CDP back three times, and they never got it right. Three trips to Yonkers and it still refused to go into battery about once every 2-3 mags, despite an extensive break-in. He even tried Wolff springs, but no joy. So Kimber gave him a new gun - which did the same thing. It made for a very interesting conversation in the Kimber booth at SHOT Show this year. He ended up trading the CDP for two Glocks. I hope they do better on yours.

I am shocked that you don't have a backup carry gun, JS! Now you know what to buy next, though.


----------



## 2400

Mike Barham at Galco said:


> I am shocked that you don't have a backup carry gun, JS! Now you know what to buy next, though.


+1

Looks like it's time to go shopping. :mrgreen:

PS, did they send you a call tag or offer to reimburse you for shipping?


----------



## js

2400 said:


> +1
> 
> Looks like it's time to go shopping. :mrgreen:
> 
> PS, did they send you a call tag or offer to reimburse you for shipping?


I just did 

As for the call tag... No. I just paid 71 bucks to ship it back... I'm calling Kimber right now about it. All I can say is...they better hook me up. Of course UPS is charging a higher fuel charge as well. The fuel charge alone was 8.75


----------



## 2400

js said:


> I just did
> 
> As for the call tag... No. I just paid 71 bucks to ship it back... I'm calling Kimber right now about it. All I can say is...they better hook me up. Of course UPS is charging a higher fuel charge as well. The fuel charge alone was 10.00


Good luck on the call tag.

My wife swapped a Glock for a Springfield 1911. It had some issues and she called Springfield about them. We shipped the gun to Springfield ($49) the begining of last week. The gun was back today with all the problems fixed and a note saying they would send a check for our shipping costs.


----------



## Shipwreck

$71!!!!!! good god. :smt107 :smt107 :smt107 :smt107 

In Jan 2006 when I shipped a $1200 1911 to Tripp Research (damn him for screwing it up), it was like $50 to ship it. There was no fuel surcharge at the time. I have heard people mention it since then, but I thought $2 or $3 for that. Damn.

Springfield will sometimes refund shipping AFTER the fact, if they are satisfied that the problem is theirs. But, most companies won't do it. Ive bought new guns with issues right away, and have complained on the phone - Why should I have to pay shipping for something that is brand new and defective. If UPS and Fedex didn't make U send the damn thing next day - shipping costs wouldn't be such a big deal.

Wow. That is a lot of $. I am shocked that it has gone up that much. Now I KNOW that if I NP3 my USPc, I'll only do the slide. They can do the internals of the frame to smooth the trigger more, but then ya gotta mail the frame of the gun and it costs so much. 

$71!!!!! :smt076 :smt076 :smt076 :smt013 :smt013 :smt013 :smt013


----------



## js

yep, 71 bucks... :smt011 When I sent my 92FS to beretta so they could refinish the slide it only cost me $53.00

Here's the detials from the receipt:

1DA Package: 53.00
Fuel Surcharge: 8.75
Insured Value Charge: 9.60

Total: 71.35

I insured it for 1,000... The last time I sent a gun overnight...UPS lost it for 5 days. So I insure now.

Anyway, I didn't have a chance to call them today because of work... but, you can bet your ass that they will be hearing from me tomorrow morning. So, we'll see...


----------



## 2400

js said:


> Anyway, I didn't have a chance to call them today because of work... but, you can bet your ass that they will be hearing from me tomorrow morning. So, we'll see...


What did you find out?


----------



## ApocalypseWoman

Hmm from what I've been reading on this forum, and on calguns.net, Kimber's don't seem to be that reliable, and always have issues.


----------



## Blastard

ApocalypseWoman said:


> Hmm from what I've been reading on this forum, and on calguns.net, Kimber's don't seem to be that reliable, and always have issues.


It would seem that way, but there are lots of Kimbers out there that run like Swiss watches. My Pro CDP is one of them. Had a few failures to return to battery and feed right out of the box, but after the 300 round count she's been perfect. Now has over 2000 consecutive trouble free rounds and counting.


----------



## Wandering Man

ApocalypseWoman said:


> Hmm from what I've been reading on this forum, and on calguns.net, Kimber's don't seem to be that reliable, and always have issues.


Read enough of these forums and you'll begin to think there isn't a gun out there that's worth having.

All brands have sold lemons.

WM


----------



## ApocalypseWoman

Wandering Man said:


> Read enough of these forums and you'll begin to think there isn't a gun out there that's worth having.
> 
> All brands have sold lemons.
> 
> WM


I understand that there are lemons out there, but the point of these forums is to learn and find out from others what they think etc. My statement refers to that fact. I heard away from this forum that the *Kimber Custom TLE/RL II* is a good cheaper alternative to the *Springfield Operator*. So when I saw the thread on _Possible Kimber Issue's_ I decided to have a look. Since then I have also seen many other threads on other forums which have had a lot of negative things said about them. I've also heard a few positives (although not as many).

Personally I'm a fan of Sig Sauer, Springfield and CZ guns (in general, not just 1911's). I'm just here to futher my knowledge on the topic - Pros or Cons.


----------



## Shipwreck

Well, I think Kimber is doing much better now that they have gone back to the internal extractor.

The thing about the Springfields - I hate their version of the novkak sights - be it their white dot or their night sights. It is my understanding that they are made by novak. But they must be seriously cheaping out. Compare them with Other Novak sights, and U can see the difference.

I love the sights on the KImbers, and they are accurate guns. It does seem like U do take a greater chance of having a problem compared to other brands. But, overall, the 5" guns are the most trouble. The smaller barrelled Kimbers are the real headaches. Granted, there are trouble free models, but as the 1911 gets smaller, the likelyhood of problems goes up (probably on all brands).

Unless I dropped a chunk of change on a custom gun, ID I ever got another 1911, it would either be a Kimber or a S&W.


----------



## kkramer673

As others have suggested, the "clocking" brass situation indicates an ejector problem, not a problem with your external extractor. If the shell casing comes out, the extractor is working.

I sent my Pro Raptor II back to Kimber to correct this situation after first speaking with Dennis in the Pro Shop. It's an adjustment issue with your ejector, nothing more. Has nothing to do with the external extractor.


----------



## js

*Update*

Well, I just got off the phone with the Kimber custom shop. They are giving me a new slide with the internal extractor and I should have the gun back anytime now. They said that the old slide was out of spec so they changed it out with the new slide.

When test firing the gun they (Kimber) were getting other issues as well...


----------



## Shipwreck

Hey, thats kewl 

Did ya ask for a 2nd kimber to make up for your trouble


----------



## jwkimber45

Sounds like Kimber has done you right!!!

Most people don't realize that no matter what line of work, or what product is being produced there WILL BE problems. Its how those problems are handled that seperates the good companies from the bad.

Trust me, being in the construction business, I know. Thats 99% of my job, problem solver/handler.


----------



## js

jwkimber45 said:


> Sounds like Kimber has done you right!!!
> 
> Most people don't realize that no matter what line of work, or what product is being produced there WILL BE problems. Its how those problems are handled that seperates the good companies from the bad.
> 
> Trust me, being in the construction business, I know. Thats 99% of my job, problem solver/handler.


Kick ass gun, Kick ass company...  I'm totally happy...


----------



## 2400

js said:


> Kick ass gun, Kick ass company...  I'm totally happy...


Did they pay for the shipping?


----------



## js

2400 said:


> Did they pay for the shipping?


Yep


----------



## js

Well, I got my Kimber back today...with a brand new slide and barrel! 

I talked to "John" at the Kimber custom shop today and he saidd they put 9 mags worth of ammo through it before sending it back to me. He said it functioned flawlessy.

Here's a pic with the new slide...


----------



## scooter

Lookin' good:smt023 :smt023


----------



## Shipwreck

Sweet deal


----------



## Wandering Man

WM


----------



## Blastard




----------



## Moe M.

js said:


> I called Kimber today and told them about what it's doing... They said to send it back to them, so I'll box it up tonight and ship it out via UPS tomorrow morning. :smt022


 Being from MA. I can't buy a new Kimber, I sold my almost new series 70 Gold Cup so I could buy a kimber and in the two weeks I took to decide which one to buy they changed the law on me, so this is a few years later and having little choice I bought a new Smith 1911, I belong to two clubs just over the state line in RI. and know quite a few shooters who own Kimbers and all of them have had issues, most of them Kimber said would go away after a five hundred round break in period, but some others have had to send in their guns to get them fixed, a couple of them are the shorty guns and they continue to have feed problems even after the trip back to kimber, it's eally too bad, they seem to be well built guns and good looking too.
Well good luck with yours, I'm sure they'll fix it for you, Kimber would not be where it's at if they didn't make a good product, everything manufactured gets a glitch once in a while.


----------



## noproblem5671

*Not just a Kimber issue*

I've got a dime sized burn above my eyebrow from a Les Baer that liked to land them right on my head. Unforutnately settling on top of my glasses on occasion. Let's hope ejector filing if the answer to our prayers.


----------



## 9x19

Removal of the external extractor isn't really difficult...

Depressing the firing pin safety (FPS), and firing pin allows the firing pin stop to come down and off the rear of the slide. This frees the firing pin and spring to be removed out the rear of the slide AND ALSO frees the rear extractor "plug" and spring to be removed from the rear of the slide. 

Once they are out, that frees the front extractor plunger and extractor to be removed from the ejection port. Just rotate the tip of the extractor out and lift it free of its recess, then slide the front plunger out. Be careful to note the position of the front plunger as it has a flat on one side and must be reinstalled in the same orientation. 

I don't know about spring life, but cleaning should be done at least every 1000 rounds, and I like every 500 better.


----------

