# Opinions on a laser?



## heefageLA (Jul 2, 2012)

Im looking into getting a laser for my M9A1 and wanted yalls opinions... What do yall use or want to use?
I don't want to spend over $150-200.

Ill also be using the laser on a CX4 Storm carbine so that will factor into my purchase.
Thanks fellas


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

No laser will help you to shoot better.
In fact, without lots of practice, a laser can make things worse, since the dot seems to waver all over the target at which you've pointed it.

Most lasers are not particularly useful in full daylight.
They are most useful in low light.
However, in low light, you still need to fully identify your target. It would not do to shoot your daughter, as she returns quite late from a date.
In that case, a flashlight is much more valuable. And, no, don't attach it to the gun.

Some people are intimidated by the laser dot, if it's shining on them.
Some other people just get really angry at the person pointing the laser.
So be aware that a laser could seriously escalate the fight that you really wish hadn't started in the first place.

But your mileage may vary...


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## heefageLA (Jul 2, 2012)

Thats some great insight on things I haven't thought too much about...


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## Haas (Jun 24, 2009)

Steve had all excellent points. I'll also add, that some say when training with a laser, it teaches you to look for that laser dot. You should really be training to draw, aim, and shoot. No "searching" for a dot should be in between there.


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## TRANE (Sep 10, 2013)

Most definately agree with steve. Lasers just look cool, but will not help with aiming. I wouldnt attach a light because if you are gonna conceal carry most comfortable holsters dont accomadate for any attachments


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Lasers have their place in LE and tactical situations. But, for the most part, in civilian use, they aren't necessary or advantageous. 

Just like any firearm supplemental tool or accessory, they require proper instruction in use and application.


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## BigCityChief (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm not a fan of lasers on firearms. Use the money to buy some good ammunition and enjoy yourself at the range.


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## Cait43 (Apr 4, 2013)

Laser sights do have some uses...... However as has been stated one needs to perfect their shooting skills using the iron sights as there is no substitute for them..... The opinions on using a laser or not is much like which self defense ammunition is the best....... I personally think Crimson Trace laser are way over priced......
Laser Sights on Firearms: Are they For You? - USA Carry


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## heefageLA (Jul 2, 2012)

Thanks fellas. No laser will be in my future. As said, that money will to go to more ammo or spare mags.


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## Pistol Pete (Jan 8, 2010)

You can have a lot of fun with your cat with a laser. Gimmick on a gun.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Pistol Pete said:


> You can have a lot of fun with your cat with a laser. Gimmick on a gun.


You shoot at your cat? :? :anim_lol:


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## Sgt45 (Jun 8, 2012)

I had a cat that came close several times. As for lasers I'm still torn except on the LCP there it's a must have. On my M&P9c I don't know. I do know that I shoot better without it, at night I think it has it uses.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Pistol Pete said:


> You can have a lot of fun with your cat with a laser. Gimmick on a gun.


That's a pretty broad brush you're painting with.

Lasers can be and are useful. It depends upon your particular situation, training, and needs. Same goes for a light mounted on a firearm. Same stipulations as a laser.

You wanna know what's really gimmicky on a firearm, IMHO? Engraving!! It does nothing to enhance the overall quality of the firearm, other than to try and turn it into a piece of jewelry. Now _*that's*_ gimmicky.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

paratrooper said:


> ...You wanna know what's really gimmicky on a firearm, IMHO? Engraving!! It does nothing to enhance the overall quality of the firearm, other than to try and turn it into a piece of jewelry. Now _*that's*_ gimmicky.


Well, as the extremely pleased recipient of some beautiful gun engraving for my (past) 75th birthday, I respectfully-but very strongly-disagree.

And as a long-time practical defensive shooter, I can tell you that I'd much rather have the engraving than either a laser or an attached light.

A laser has minimal usefulness, only under a few, very specific circumstances.
And while a light is an absolutely-essential accessory, an _attached_ light is more a liability than a benefit.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Well, as the extremely pleased recipient of some beautiful gun engraving for my (past) 75th birthday, I respectfully-but very strongly-disagree.
> 
> And as a long-time practical defensive shooter, I can tell you that I'd much rather have the engraving than either a laser or an attached light.
> 
> ...


Different strokes for different folks. Attached light or not, bottom line, is that it's the user's decision. Me.....I like having my left hand free of anything in it. I'd never recommend that someone go out, buy a light, and stick it on their handgun.......without proper training in the use of a mounted light. Just like I'd never tell someone to go out buy a gun and don't worry about learning how to use it.

I've had extensive training in the proper and correct use of a gun-mounted laser and light. While still working, I had reason(s) for the use of both (not necessarily at the same time though).

As far as engraving goes, if it means something personally, then it's emotion based and not functionality based. I've yet to see any engraving that improves accuracy or ease of use.

But then again, I'm *NOT* a fan of jewelry or fancy watches. I have a friend that has a $5000.00 Rolex. My $150.00 Swiss Army (Wenger) watch is more accurate than his is. But, mine isn't a chick magnet nor a conversation piece.

I suppose firearms engraving has it's place in the world. But, in my world, there's no place for it. I say that with respect and am in no way, judging you or your reasons for liking it.

To each his own............


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## Haas (Jun 24, 2009)

Ok, my curiosity has peaked on this light issue.



> an attached light is more a liability than a benefit.


Why would a light be considered a liability? When I think of a liability, I think of someone who's liable as in "responsible" for causing unintended harm to someone.



> I'd never recommend that someone go out, buy a light, and stick it on their handgun.......without proper training in the use of a mounted light.


What kind of training is needed for a light on your gun?
I'm not challenging your statements here, I'm just naive to it. Looking for answers out of curiosity and interest.


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Haas said:


> Ok, my curiosity has peaked on this light issue.
> 
> Why would a light be considered a liability? When I think of a liability, I think of someone who's liable as in "responsible" for causing unintended harm to someone.
> 
> ...


A light, either hand-held or mounted on a firearm, is like any tool specific to it's needs. There are situations, conditions, or circumstances, where a light may or may not be appropriate. Location (house, bldg. vehicle, etc.) and duration of light activation is also a consideration. I could go on and on, and that's why proper training is necessary.

I like hand-held lights, just as much as firearm mounted lights. Both have their distinct advantages and can compliment each other at times, depending upon the circumstances.

All of my training was LE sponsored. I suppose there are shooting classes that cover firearm lights, but I would think it would be a minimal, introductory type of class. I just don't see a civilian type of class spending the time or money, to provide a life-like environment with numerous scenarios and situations. One of my very first introductory firearms mounted light course, was right at 8 hrs. long, and involved six different buildings / locations, and a handful of different vehicles. From there on, the training only became more specific and situational-based.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

Why not have a light attached to your gun?
Well, lessee...

Remember the gun-law that says, "Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to destroy"?
You'd better find out whether it's a burglar, or just your daughter sneaking in from a late date, before you point a gun at it.

If you find out that it's a burglar, don't you think that your gun-mounted light gives him a clear sighting path right back to your own center-of-mass?

Do you believe that it's tactically a good idea to lead with your pistol, as you quickly round a corner? I'd rather lead with my flashlight, just in case someone grabs for it.

There's more, but that's a good beginning. Use this forum's "search" function, and find previous discussions on this subject.



And, oh, by the way: My engraved pistol certainly is a "chick magnet"—at least, it's a magnet for the "chick" who gave it to me, anyway.


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## SouthernBoy (Jun 27, 2007)

No lasers or attached lights for me. My house is not that dark at night for one thing, and I do not want a laser distracting me if I have to use that gun. As has been noted already, a light can give away your position and offers a great target for your opposition should he be armed. Lastly, if someone breaks into my home, I am not going to try to hunt them and confront them. That violates our plan and puts me at greater risk.

But if these implements work for others, that's fine. Just not for me.


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## Glock Doctor (Mar 14, 2011)

OK! I agree that an attached light is USUALLY a liability on a gun; but, NOT when the attached light's user is supported by additional members of an, 'assault' or, 'entry' team. What are the problems with an unsupported shooter?

As long as an attached light remains fixed to his gun, an unsupported shooter is forced to move at a disadvantage, and faces a higher risk of being effectively snookered in a sudden ambush. If an unsupported shooter doesn't spot the bad guy BEFORE the bad guy is ready to engage him then he runs a greater risk of becoming A TARGET, himself.

So, what about a laser? It has its valid uses, too. Lasers are excellent training tools; and, as already pointed out, really come into, 'their own' in dim light (IMO, better than, 'night sights'). Most people screw up while using a laser because they attempt to aim the laser in the same way that they aim conventional pistol sights.

*When using a laser what should be aimed is the dot, itself, instead of the sights.*

All pistol sights, 'wobble'. In order to hit well with a pistol one of the first things a shooter has to do is learn, 'How' to control that wobble. It's no different with a laser; it's just that the wobble is a lot more discernible. I've shot in dimly lit rooms with other gunmen who were using lasers. I remember two shooters who were very good with their lasers. For a shooter who's used to working with one, a laser can be a highly effective aiming device - Better, IMO, than ordinary iron sights.

I, also, think that a new pistol shooter can be trained in the principles of aiming a gun, and brought along a lot quicker with a laser than without.



paratrooper said:


> A light, either hand-held or mounted on a firearm, is like any tool specific to it's needs. There are situations, conditions, or circumstances, where a light may or may not be appropriate. &#8230;&#8230;


:smt023 Very true!



Steve M1911A1 said:


> Why not have a light attached to your gun? Well, lessee...
> 
> Remember the gun-law that says, '_Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to see destroyed'_?
> 
> ...


Congratulations! You are the very first person (other than myself)  whom I've ever seen post this observation on anybody's internet gun forum.

*It's true!*

When I was learning these things I was taught to keep my pistol tucked in tight to my side and, then, thrust it out and into the target at the moment of engagement. Which always causes me to snicker to myself whenever I'm watching one of these action cop or gun movies - Those shows where the heroes move forward with their arms outstretched, 'professionally' thrusting their pistols ahead of them, and just begging to be either diverted or disarmed!

If you have the clearance and the room then go ahead and, 'split-the-pie' with an outstretched gun in your hands; otherwise, keep your pistol tucked in tight to your side. (Bruce Willis sure does look cool whenever he does this, though; doesn't he!) :mrgreen:

NOTE: By the way, when your daughter sneaks into the house after a late night date, isn't it usually the boyfriend who ends up getting shot? :smt002


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## Haas (Jun 24, 2009)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Why not have a light attached to your gun?
> Well, lessee...
> 
> Remember the gun-law that says, "Never point a gun at anything you are not willing to destroy"?
> ...


All good points. Thanks, I never thought of any of these. :smt1099


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Just because you have a light mounted on a gun, doesn't mean you have to use it in an inappropriate situation. That's one of the very first things you learn in training. 

Clearing a room, a house, or a large building, all needs to be done correctly. That's why police depts. provide training. You don't round a corner quickly, or in such a manner, that you provide an opportunity for a bad guy to make contact with you. 

I have a light mounted on my handgun. I also have a light that I can carry in my left hand if needed. As stated earlier, I prefer to leave my left hand empty and available for use if needed. I just feel more comfortable that way......if push turns to shove.....literally. 

We don't have kids in the house. That simplifies things quite a bit. If someone breaks into our home and I'm aware of it, I will not hole up in our bedroom. I will use my tools and training and secure my home as best I can. 

It's probably just me, but I don't like commemorative firearms, or fancy engraved / adorned knives of any kind, either. I'll take function over form any day of the week. Again, just my opinion, and I'm not passing judgment.


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

paratrooper said:


> ...I don't like commemorative firearms, or fancy engraved / adorned knives of any kind, either. I'll take function over form any day of the week. Again, just my opinion, and I'm not passing judgment.


Well, OK, but then why do you keep repeating it?


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## paratrooper (Feb 1, 2012)

Steve M1911A1 said:


> Well, OK, but then why do you keep repeating it?


Because you keep bringing it up............:goofy:


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## Steve M1911A1 (Feb 6, 2008)

...Point taken.


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