# +P+ ammo and M&P



## E46SC3

Is the M&P line of firearms able to handle +P+ ammo?


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## TedDeBearFrmHell

from the manual (a good source of information about guns in question) 

“Plus-P-Plus (+P+) ammunition must not be used in Smith &
Wesson firearms."


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## E46SC3

TedDeBearFrmHell said:


> from the manual (a good source of information about guns in question)
> 
> "Plus-P-Plus (+P+) ammunition must not be used in Smith &
> Wesson firearms."


Thanks for the quick reply ...

I am thinking about buying a M&P 40 and wanted to see if +P+ ammo is okay to use.


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## VAMarine

E46SC3 said:


> Thanks for the quick reply ...
> 
> I am thinking about buying a M&P *40* and wanted to see if +P+ ammo is okay to use.


There is no +p or +P+ in .40 caliber.


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## TedDeBearFrmHell

VAMarine said:


> There is no +p or +P+ in .40 caliber.


but IF there was, you shouldnt use it.


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## Gunners_Mate

"must not" lol


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## manta

I would not use +P+ ammo in any pistol regularly poss load a mag for self defence. Other than that whats the point.


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## Packard

VAMarine said:


> There is no +p or +P+ in .40 caliber.


You are correct. I would just add that I just recently looked at the SAAMI website. They only list +P for 9mm and .38. They don't show +P+ in any caliber. It can mean anything the ammo company wants it to mean. It could make a loud bang, or a really loud bang, or maybe something really, really loud--perhaps louder than you might want.


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## chessail77

There is no reason to use +P+ in .40


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## SouthernBoy

chessail77 said:


> There is no reason to use +P+ in .40


No such thing.

As for using +P+ 9mm in the M&P, as was previously stated, the manual specifically says do not do this. But the reason they make this statement is because there is no SAAMI specification for +P+ 9mm loads. So there are no pressure standards by which the loads can be gauged. You could most likely use a +P+ load, such as the Winchester Ranger RA9TA (127gr +P+), if you wanted but were something to happen the gun or you, you would have no legal recourse since S&W covered themselves with their statement regarding such loads. S&W is protecting themselves by making those statements in their manuals against the use of +P+ ammunition.

FWIW, the above mentioned load by Winchester generates 42,000 psi which is quite high for a 9mm load. As I recall, NATO specs call for pressures of 38,500 psi.

There are some excellent 9mm loads in standard and +P from which you could easily find something that works for you. Take a look at Gold Dot 124gr +P (53617) and Federal's HST offerings for starters.


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## E46SC3

Hey guys, thanks for all of the replies .... As it turns out, I meant M&P 9. However, since I first posted this question I have now decide to go with a .40s&w. Either the M&P 40c, Glock 22 ... Or maybe Glock 23.


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## SouthernBoy

If you are willing to go to a G22 but still like the M&P, skip the M&P 40c and get the standard M&P 40. You'll be happier. Then install an Apex USB (Ultimate Safety Block) to completely remove the gritty trigger.


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## Bulldog

SouthernBoy said:


> If you are willing to go to a G22 but still like the M&P, skip the M&P 40c and get the standard M&P 40. You'll be happier. Then install an Apex USB (Ultimate Safety Block) to completely remove the gritty trigger.


I'm not so sure about that. I like my .40c alot better than my full sized .40. Also I don't find the stock trigger that bad. In fact I never noticed it until a few people started whining about it. Even then I didn't find neither one of the triggers to be that bad. Especially not bad enough to drop money to "upgrade" something that didn't need it IMO.


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## Brevard13

I don't find my trigger bad on my M&P either.


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## SouthernBoy

Anything can be improved upon. I have three M&P's and have installed the Apex USB in all of them. M&P's are famous for having gritty/sandy triggers (in their pre-travel) out of the box. It's easy to see why when you field strip and examine them. The Apex USB completely eliminates this and returns a nice trigger. Both my M&P 9 Pro Series and my M&P 40 come in at under five pounds (the Pro averages 4 pounds 12 ounces).


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## Brevard13

I like a heavy trigger...but that is just me


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## dagored

Bulldog said:


> I'm not so sure about that. I like my .40c alot better than my full sized .40. Also I don't find the stock trigger that bad. In fact I never noticed it until a few people started whining about it. Even then I didn't find neither one of the triggers to be that bad. Especially not bad enough to drop money to "upgrade" something that didn't need it IMO.


DITTO Have had a 40c for two years. Never a problem, feels great in my hand, and the trigger is just fine.

EDIT: To the OP, the only M&P I use +P in is the 340. Much nicer on the hands than a .357.


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## coclimber

The several triggers I tried seemed ok to me, and better than the XDm. I can't see putting in $100 of new trigger parts into a $500 gun that I will use mostly for self-defense. Certainly for that purpose, the stock trigger is fine.


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## Brevard13

I know one guy who is just so picky it isn't even funny when it comes to little stuff like that. I am pretty dang accurate and have the tightest grouping I have ever had out of any of my other pistols with the M&P. One thing I would recommend is putting about 500 roudns through it to break it in. Alot of people said after 400-600 rounds the trigger started feeling alot better.

I guess it really is just personal preference. To me it has one of the nicest triggers I have ever felt. But that is for my feel.


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## Golfsuper

Better let Buffalo Bore know there is no +p in .40 caliber they are making it. Ammo .40 S&W +P Heavy Buffalo Bore Ammunition 180 Grains FMJ-FN 1100 fps 20 Rounds 23C/20


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## VAMarine

Yeah well three years ago it was a different story. Now jump back in the Delorean and go back to the future.


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## SouthernBoy

Golfsuper said:


> Better let Buffalo Bore know there is no +p in .40 caliber they are making it. Ammo .40 S&W +P Heavy Buffalo Bore Ammunition 180 Grains FMJ-FN 1100 fps 20 Rounds 23C/20


Several specialty loaders do offer the .40S&W in loads which are a bit hotter than the standard loading, which is already a high pressure load. Speer Gold Dot has a 165gr load, #53970, that is quite a bit hotter than their "stock" load (that one is my primary carry load in this caliber) and Double Tap has some hot loads as does Underwood.


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## PT111Pro

Huummmm
A 3 year old treat?
Hu?mmmm You guys had back in 2012 already established that there are no 40 S&W +P+ ammo around.

Hu?mmm did I miss the e-mail and that was recently changed?


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## oldfart64

chessail77 said:


> There is no reason to use +P+ in .40


other than if you really enjoy pain! IMHO


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## Bisley

.40 S&W is a round that is already pushing the pressure limits, having been downsized from 10mm. If you want '+P+ power,' jump on up to 10mm and be done with it. It is a great round that can be had in a wider range of power, and adapted for a lot of different uses by simply switching ammo.

Personally, 10mm would be a great round for battle conditions, but less appropriate for 'normal' self defense uses - .45 ACP is preferable in a carry pistol...in my opinion, of course. If my fears of attack were veering in the direction of resisting terrorists with long guns, I would choose the Glock 20 10mm. But, for just the 'in general' type of self defense against attackers of unknown armament and abilities, I'll have a .45 ACP, or 9mm with quality SD ammo. If I feel like a revolver, for some reason, the .357 magnum has proven itself over the last 6-7 decades.


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## TheReaper

Bisley said:


> .40 S&W is a round that is already pushing the pressure limits, having been downsized from 10mm. If you want '+P+ power,' jump on up to 10mm and be done with it. It is a great round that can be had in a wider range of power, and adapted for a lot of different uses by simply switching ammo.
> 
> Personally, 10mm would be a great round for battle conditions, but less appropriate for 'normal' self defense uses - .45 ACP is preferable in a carry pistol...in my opinion, of course. If my fears of attack were veering in the direction of resisting terrorists with long guns, I would choose the Glock 20 10mm. But, for just the 'in general' type of self defense against attackers of unknown armament and abilities, I'll have a .45 ACP, or 9mm with quality SD ammo. If I feel like a revolver, for some reason, the .357 magnum has proven itself over the last 6-7 decades.


The 357 is hard to beat.


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