# Workplace stupidity



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

at work today, my HR department called me into their office. so in i go and there's an older guy there that introduces himself as a company security man.

at my work, you have internet access and can access any site that is not block by the company's firewall. i choose to frequent this forum, along with other gun forums. (internet surfing is allowed when it is slow and does not interfere with your work)

this security guy starts asking me questions like "do you like this job", and advised me that in monitoring my internet surfing (which i knew they did), they found it "disturbing" that i choose to frequent sites like this one.

they said it makes people nervous, and requested that i avoid all gun sites in the future while at work. i said, sure no prob, even though i find it offensive that they would insinuate that i might come in shoot up the place just because i choose recreational target shooting as my hobby, and like to frequent gun forums.

has anyone else encountered this type of stupidity at work?




UPDATE 9-19-09:

my employer called me into the HR office again this morning about 5 minutes after i got in. that same security guy was there, and immediately said "we're going to place you on administrative leave while we investigate this".

as i did not go onto any more gun websites after they asked me not to, i'm not exactly sure what there is to investigate, or why they didn't do this initially. my friend suggested i contact the NRA, i wil, not sure if they can do anything. i sure do get the feeling they are going to can me.


----------



## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

It sounds like you got a friendly warning not to goof off too much at work. Anything you do at work reflects back upon the company, so if they would prefer you don't look at gun or shooting related sites that's what you've got to do if you want to keep getting a pay check.

You are very fortunate they let you use internet access for personal use at all. Most companies prohibit it, but choose to turn a blind eye most of the time... until they want to get rid of you. Then you'll be confronted with a stack of printouts documenting every second of your on the job internet usage along with a copy of the company's Internet Usage Policy that you've likely signed when you were hired. Then they can fire you "with cause" which can effect your access to unemployment benefits as well as future employment.


----------



## MLB (Oct 4, 2006)

Well, their reasons may be goofy, but as Kev said, it's their time.


----------



## cupsz71 (Nov 19, 2007)

Ah crap...that means I better get back to work...........:smt017:smt023


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

lol there's no "goofing off" going on here guys. like my original post says, my company does in fact allow allow net surfing. they never told me it was interfering with my work either, just that they didn't like the gun sites that i was going to.


----------



## falchunt (May 8, 2009)

just use a proxy site so they can't tell what web sites you have been going to....


----------



## Mr.clean (Jul 30, 2009)

I would avoid those sites while your @ work.Im thankful to have a job now.Can you imagine explaining to another company(Fututre interview) why you were fired from there?They here that and goodbye to your shot @ that job.Its unfair but thats the way it is!


----------



## jc27310 (Dec 14, 2008)

*at least you can surf!*



dances with guns said:


> at work today, my HR department called me into their office....
> 
> ... and advised me that in monitoring my internet surfing ...
> 
> ... it makes people nervous...


Yeah, I know what you mean and understand how you feel. keep in mind, most people who are employees (not contract or union), are "at will". This means an employer can fire you for no reason and you can quit for no reason. If you are fired "for cause", that is something that is hard to clean up.

I (like Kev), think you are pretty lucky to be able to surf at work. I would watch the content of your surfing habits at work in the same way you watch what you say and write. There is no privacy expected for any at-work activity. They look at it this way: You are using their equipment, their bandwidth, and their time. they can read your email, look at your files, whatever....

The company I work for has pretty sophisticated firewalls and internet filters We cannot have access to broad categories of sites; guns; pornography, personal networking; file sharing; streaming media; proxy sites and many others... even if it were required as part of doing something for our customers, they would not be able to justify the IT support to open access selectively. They even meter access to sites so that you can only use 1/2 hr a day on personal surfing! (I still don't know what that is or what trips the meter...)

What I understand from my experience, is that these filters and logs are in place all the time. They only get looked at when someone complains or as part of a random check.

If they didn't come across you in a random check, then someone complained. Perhaps a co-worker was irritated that you were surfing in general, or was somehow intimidated that they saw a gun site on your screen. (people are weird and make crazy assumptions)

In either case, they have the right to limit your access any way they see fit when you are using their equipment or their time.... IMHO- you would be well served to limit the browsing in general and especially stay away from the proxy sites... its just a can of worms you dont need to open.

Think of it this way- you got a friendly warning...  (I am sure it didn't feel that way with "Mr. Security" talking with you.)
Remember, Dilbert, the Office or Better of Ted, wouldn't be so funny without real HR storiesl!!!
-jc


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

jc27310 said:


> Yeah, I know what you mean and understand how you feel. keep in mind, most people who are employees (not contract or union), are "at will". This means an employer can fire you for no reason and you can quit for no reason. If you are fired "for cause", that is something that is hard to clean up.
> 
> I (like Kev), think you are pretty lucky to be able to surf at work. I would watch the content of your surfing habits at work in the same way you watch what you say and write. There is no privacy expected for any at-work activity. They look at it this way: You are using their equipment, their bandwidth, and their time. they can read your email, look at your files, whatever....
> 
> ...


thanx for your reply. yeah i don't even know what proxy websites are lol. i'll just stay off gun sites altogether at work.

as far as i know, no one complained about it, it was just the security monitoring net surfing and noticed i was on gun sites.

it's funny, when "Mr. security" asked me if i liked working there-i said no. i was just being honest. my job sux, and my employers are complete tools. :smt082


----------



## TOF (Sep 7, 2006)

Unfortunately Stupid exists in all parts of the world and all places of employment. Some of it must be tolerated till you reach the point in life where you can tell them what to do with their opinions etc.

It sounds like you still need to be tolerant of stupidity.

Stay safe and hang on to your job. At least till a better one comes along.

tumbleweed


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

still on paid administrative leave while they "investigate" me. lol


my friends are all telling me to call the NRA, and i think i will tomorrow.


----------



## kg333 (May 19, 2008)

I think you need to get a good pro-gun lawyer pronto...that isn't sounding good.

KG


----------



## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

I think you need to get your resume in order and line up some personal and professional references. 

:watching:


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

i called the NRA today, and they gave me contact info on a local attorney.

i am also looking for work elsewhere as well.

still haven't heard back from my employer yet, as far as i know i'm still on admin leave with pay.

i'll let you guys know as soon as i hear something.


----------



## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

Even if this turns out well, I'd still look for a new job. The minute they put me on leave to investigate me would signal the end of all trust. Looking over your shoulder, worrying that you might say or do something that will get you fired this time, is no way to live.


----------



## Sonny Boy (Sep 20, 2009)

*Hmmm....*

In most cases the employer must provide warings in writting, and show a history of problems before someone can be let go, unless it is gross misconduct. It is far more dificult to terminate someone now for misconduct, lack of work is easier.

If the surfing was during luch, before or after hours, you are in a better postion, if it was during work hours and there is a lot of time surfing, they may have good cause. Best not to do so on the company computers.

I do agree looking for another job would be prudent. Good luck and sorry to herar about it.


----------



## bent21606 (Sep 21, 2009)

i dont think telling them you dont like your jobed helped either. i guess if you cared about your job at all u wouldnt have said that tho


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

Todd said:


> Even if this turns out well, I'd still look for a new job. The minute they put me on leave to investigate me would signal the end of all trust. Looking over your shoulder, worrying that you might say or do something that will get you fired this time, is no way to live.


yep, i agree 100%.


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

bent21606 said:


> i dont think telling them you dont like your jobed helped either. i guess if you cared about your job at all u wouldnt have said that tho


well i don't like that job lol. i'm not gonna lie about it, their not paying me to be happy there, their paying me to do my job, which i did.

trust me, they don't give a crap if any of their workers are happy with their jobs or not.

they only asked me that because they were insinuating that i'm some kind of nutcase only because i like guns.


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

just got a letter in the mail a couple days ago from my employer- i got canned.

i'm going to contact that NRA lawyer on monday see what he has to say. not expecting he an do anything, guess it couldn't hurt to try.


----------



## DevilsJohnson (Oct 21, 2007)

Interesting thread. I don't know that I anything I can add that has not already been said but I am really curious to see how this plays out.:watching:


----------



## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

dances with guns said:


> just got a letter in the mail a couple days ago from my employer- i got canned.


A letter? Not even a phone call from your supervisor? Damn, that is one cold employer. Sounds like this may be a blessing in disguise.


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

Todd said:


> A letter? Not even a phone call from your supervisor? Damn, that is one cold employer. Sounds like this may be a blessing in disguise.


you're right, they were not nice people to work for at all.


----------



## tekhead1219 (May 16, 2008)

dances with guns said:


> just got a letter in the mail a couple days ago from my employer- i got canned.


I'm curious as to the reason for the termination. What did they say in the letter justified the action?:watching:


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

tekhead1219 said:


> I'm curious as to the reason for the termination. What did they say in the letter justified the action?:watching:


the letter was vague, just "due to your conduct" you're being terminated.


----------



## kg333 (May 19, 2008)

tekhead1219 said:


> I'm curious as to the reason for the termination. What did they say in the letter justified the action?:watching:


Depending on the state, they may not need to provide a reason. "Due to your conduct" does sound a bit vague to be a solid reason for termination.

KG


----------



## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

Unfortunately, a lot of companies now hire people "at will" (I think that's the term?) and when you sign on, agree that they can terminate you at at time for any reason. Funny how those same companies still expect you to give them 2+ weeks notice when they can give you 2 seconds.


----------



## bigrobwoot (Oct 10, 2009)

Just found this thread. Any updates? What did the lawyer say?


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

well the NRA recommended lawyer referred me to a law firm that handles employment litigation.

this firm advised me to contact the federal labor board and get back to them with the results of the investigation.

only prob is, the federal labor board told me they don't investigate anything unless there is a "clear as day" violation of federal labor laws.

i emailed this info to that employment firm and haven't heard anything back. that was about a week ago.

i think tomorrow i am going to call that NRA lawyer again tomorrow (he was really cool, prob because he's a gun nut like us lol) and ask him for a referral to a different employment litigation specialist.

i'll let you guys know what happens next.


----------



## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

So to review a little bit....

- Your previous employer caught you dicking off on the job (it doesn't matter if it was a gun web site or not).
- Your previous employer gave you a warning not to dick off on the same web sites.
- You got advice from a bunch of people you don't know who told you it would be a good idea to curtail your recreational internet activities at work. You didn't.
- You got fired for continuing to dick off when they advised you not to.

---And now you want to sue your former employer for some kind of discrimination??!?!?! Not only that, but you want someone else to pay for the lawyer so you can sue your former employer for firing you because they got tired of paying your salary for dicking off when they specifically told you not to.

That encapsulates just about everything wrong with this country today - a complete and total inability to take responsibility for your own actions. :smt076 Your employer was a jerk for asking you to stop looking at gun sites at work.... you were treated unfairly for getting fired for continuing to look at gun web sites at work. And now, the NRA, a local lawyer and the "federal labor board" aren't doing enough to punish your former employer. At what point does it stop being someone else's fault? :smt076

So, since you're sure your previous employer did wrong here, why not _*hire*_ a lawyer to sue them for damages and lost wages? I think your time would be better spent looking for a new job.

:watching:


----------



## falchunt (May 8, 2009)

kev,

I see your point on this thread and I would whole heartily agree with you had you read the entire scenario. You have a few key facts skewed and it changes everything.

1. Employees were allowed to browse the internet in their _leisure_ time. In other words, the OP had permission to dick off.

2. After the employer said something to him, he did not go back to the website, out of respect for their wishes. Even though it was against his grain, so to speak.

3. Shortly after, they fired him. A bit too cooncidental having just been approached about frequenting a "gun" website.


----------



## ArmyCop (May 7, 2006)

I'm posting to see how this goes. Good luck - I wish you the best. With all the crap lawsuits I hear about getting awarded for things not worthy - I hope and would like to see you awarded something outta this - to help not only you but others who may be discrimminated against in the future.


----------



## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

falchunt said:


> kev,
> 
> I see your point on this thread and I would whole heartily agree with you had you read the entire scenario. You have a few key facts skewed and it changes everything.
> 
> ...


1. dances with guns never states what the official company policy is in regard to personal internet access at his company. I'd be willing to bet that his former company has some kind of policy regulating personal use of their computers which they may or may not choose to enforce. If he has some kind of documentation stating anything otherwise, I'd love to see it and would apologize at that time.

2. His first post was on 9/17 at 11:52 am. His next post in this thread was on 9/18 at 1:42 pm - The day after he was spoken to and during regular working hours. I'm sure his employer was paying close enough attention to his internet usage that this didn't escape their attention. I've also seen this same issue posted on another gun related forum with a different user name, but almost word for word first post.

3. Shortly thereafter they fired him - after he continued to do what they suggested he stop doing the next day. What should they have done, give him a time out? This is a business not a day care.


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

kev74 said:


> 1. dances with guns never states what the official company policy is in regard to personal internet access at his company. I'd be willing to bet that his former company has some kind of policy regulating personal use of their computers which they may or may not choose to enforce. If he has some kind of documentation stating anything otherwise, I'd love to see it and would apologize at that time.
> 
> 2. His first post was on 9/17 at 11:52 am. His next post in this thread was on 9/18 at 1:42 pm - The day after he was spoken to and during regular working hours. I'm sure his employer was paying close enough attention to his internet usage that this didn't escape their attention. I've also seen this same issue posted on another gun related forum with a different user name, but almost word for word first post.
> 
> 3. Shortly thereafter they fired him - after he continued to do what they suggested he stop doing the next day. What should they have done, give him a time out? This is a business not a day care.


read my original post-my former employer allowed net surfing, with no specific prohibition of firearms sites. as i already sad, they never mentioned any issues with net surfing affecting my work and sites they didn't want you on were blocked by a firewall.

can't remember if i put this on a different forum, so what if i did? what's your prob with that?

i don't appreciate you nonsensical replies to my thread concerning my employment termination....


----------



## kev74 (Mar 22, 2008)

dances with guns said:


> can't remember if i put this on a different forum, so what if i did? what's your prob with that?


So, you posted on at least 2 gun related forums after you were told not to... but its not your fault you got canned. 



dances with guns said:


> i don't appreciate you nonsensical replies to my thread concerning my employment termination....


And yet you posted your sob story all over the internet. 

I don't appreciate that you're trying to use the NRA's resources (my dues) and the "federal labor board"'s (whatever that is) resources (my taxes) to try and get back at your former employer after they fired you for dicking off - i.e. using their resources to look at gun sites after they told you not to.

Man-up and take responsibility for your actions.


----------



## dosborn (Apr 17, 2009)

I am all about being fair but I think Kev74 pretty much nailed it.

Put yourself in the managers shoes. It only takes one person to tell the manager what you were doing and that manager is forced to take action. 

I am at work right now BTW.:mrgreen:


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

kev74 said:


> So, you posted on at least 2 gun related forums after you were told not to... but its not your fault you got canned.
> 
> And yet you posted your sob story all over the internet.


i posted those while at home, sitting on my comfy bed. everything i posted after being told not to go onto gun sites at work was done at home.......get a clue :buttkick:


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

ArmyCop said:


> I'm posting to see how this goes. Good luck - I wish you the best. With all the crap lawsuits I hear about getting awarded for things not worthy - I hope and would like to see you awarded something outta this - to help not only you but others who may be discrimminated against in the future.


thank you, appreciate it :smt033


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

kev74 said:


> And yet you posted your sob story all over the internet.


----------



## dances with guns (Sep 10, 2009)

kev74 said:


> :
> 
> I don't appreciate that you're trying to use the NRA's resources (my dues) and the "federal labor board"'s (whatever that is) resources (my taxes) to try and get back at your former employer after they fired you for dicking off - i.e. using their resources to look at gun sites after they told you not to.
> 
> Man-up and take responsibility for your actions.


i got the FREE NRA membership offered recently. i bet that just steams you :mrgreen:

i think this pic is also appropriate for you and your whining.....


----------



## dosborn (Apr 17, 2009)

dances with guns said:


>


For what?

:watching:


----------



## Todd (Jul 3, 2006)

*Enough*

Pissing contest over.


----------

